February 6, 20232 yr 58 minutes ago, mrnyc said: country had their own video channel. did they play artists of color there? who knows? maybe charlie pride, huh? so yeah, just like mtv if not worse. its funny that mtv never even dipped into country or other genres outside of pop afaik. i mean just like hiphop, country got big in the 1980s too and had popular i guess borderline pop songs. liquid tv was as out there as mtv got. Rock was their target. They were more like a radio station than pre-cable TV.
February 6, 20232 yr Country videos were played on.....TNN? Whatever channel it was, when they started out there were so many music videos shot "in the big city" I guess in an attempt to better assimilate the artists and genre to the mainstream. And re: MTV at least they brought in legit guys for Yo MTV Raps! I'm sure if their first choice would be to have Adam Curry be the host and have him just wear some Adidas breakdancing jump suit.
February 6, 20232 yr 27 minutes ago, E Rocc said: Cable TV was the very beginning of the trend of TV towards focusing on specific audiences, as radio had been doing for decades. It was a rock station, not an “all forms of music” station. Country had a completely different chart. There were no country songs on Casey's Top 40. I think the first I knew of rap was The Fat Boys. People had no way of anticipating that rap was anything more than an extension of break dance music and a passing fad. Unfortunately, rap transitioned from being fun party music in the mid-80s to the clown act it turned into shortly thereafter, and where it has remained.
February 6, 20232 yr 22 minutes ago, surfohio said: Country videos were played on.....TNN? Whatever channel it was, when they started out there were so many music videos shot "in the big city" I guess in an attempt to better assimilate the artists and genre to the mainstream. And re: MTV at least they brought in legit guys for Yo MTV Raps! I'm sure if their first choice would be to have Adam Curry be the host and have him just wear some Adidas breakdancing jump suit. Back then a lot of rock and roll people absolutely hated rap. And country. As for melanin, they were early into Michael Jackson and Living Colour.
February 6, 20232 yr 2 minutes ago, Lazarus said: Country had a completely different chart. There were no country songs on Casey's Top 40. I think the first I knew of rap was The Fat Boys. People had no way of anticipating that rap was anything more than an extension of break dance music and a passing fad. Unfortunately, rap transitioned from being fun party music in the mid-80s to the clown act it turned into shortly thereafter, and where it has remained. Rap is as diverse as rock these days. It's hard to call Tupac Shakur a clown, artistically. He was as brilliant as his life was chaotic.
February 6, 20232 yr 21 minutes ago, E Rocc said: Back then a lot of rock and roll people absolutely hated rap. Punk rock guys liked Public Enemy.
February 6, 20232 yr MTV was called "narrowcasting" and it would have been more applicable in the 500 channel era to have an AOR only station. But since people were used to broadcasting a la CBS, NBC and ABC MTV leaving off Black artists would be considered racist. CBS Records had to threaten to pull their other acts from MTV since they wouldn't play Michael Jackson even after he sold 20 million records and had been successful on broadcast TV. Edited February 6, 20232 yr by GCrites80s
February 6, 20232 yr On 12/5/2022 at 3:26 PM, eastvillagedon said: unfortunately 99.999% of what's commercially successful today is pure garbage. But happily there are still people out there with exceptional talent, like this young woman, but at the same time relegated to niche genres in which they probably won't be heard on a widespread basis-- congratulations to Samara Joy for her Grammy wins. Maybe this signals a new trend for this organization: rewarding people who can actually sing 🙄 http://www.mainstreetpainesville.org/
February 6, 20232 yr 7 minutes ago, eastvillagedon said: congratulations to Samara Joy for her Grammy wins. Maybe this signals a new trend for this organization: rewarding people who can actually sing 🙄 I bought Samara Joy’s Linger Awhile album a month or so ago. I’m relatively confident this is the first time I’ve ever owned an album that won a Grammy before it received the award. Also, it’s great! When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
February 6, 20232 yr 59 minutes ago, E Rocc said: I didn’t even think of that but it’s exactly true. Cable TV was the very beginning of the trend of TV towards focusing on specific audiences, as radio had been doing for decades. It was a rock station, not an “all forms of music” station. Calling it racist is like calling WMMS or WJMO racist at the time. no you didn’t think — country channels, wmms and wjmo were not some proported broad mtv music television, they were playing even more niche styles of music. and yes they all were racist, sure were. totally exclusionary. ie., you didnt get into bad brains on ‘mms. alternately, in those days any am radio pop music station played an often colorblind mix of genres and hits. and also for example if you had ever ventured out of ne ohio wdao the popular station in dayton at that time was doing the same on fm where you got like an allman bros song followed by lakeside, etc., like that.
February 6, 20232 yr 56 minutes ago, Lazarus said: Country had a completely different chart. There were no country songs on Casey's Top 40. I think the first I knew of rap was The Fat Boys. People had no way of anticipating that rap was anything more than an extension of break dance music and a passing fad. Unfortunately, rap transitioned from being fun party music in the mid-80s to the clown act it turned into shortly thereafter, and where it has remained. yeah that’s where i thought you were coming from and i can’t even. ok.
February 6, 20232 yr 1 hour ago, mrnyc said: they were playing even more niche styles of music. and yes they all were racist, sure were. totally exclusionary What are you talking about? Any radio station needs to have some sort of focus or else almost nobody will listen to it consistently, just like magazines or anything else.
February 6, 20232 yr 1 hour ago, mrnyc said: yeah that’s where i thought you were coming from and i can’t even. Rap is exclusionary because it's in English and non-English speakers can't understand it.
February 6, 20232 yr 10 minutes ago, Lazarus said: Rap is exclusionary because it's in English and non-English speakers can't understand it. Snow the Product would beg to differ but don't listen to her at work. :0
February 6, 20232 yr 12 minutes ago, Lazarus said: What are you talking about? Any radio station needs to have some sort of focus or else almost nobody will listen to it consistently, just like magazines or anything else. that response should be a lesson to you to read the whole post and not cherry pick.
February 6, 20232 yr 1 hour ago, mrnyc said: that response should be a lesson to you to read the whole post and not cherry pick. People can't listen to two songs at once. Cynically, every person's or business's song selection could me thought of as an act of exclusion. If I wear my dress shoes, am I excluding my tennis shoes? This is the sort of high school philosophy that propels a lot of crap music. This past weekend Blink 182's Greatest Hits appeared on my phone, randomly, as some sort of Apple Music promotion. I gave it a chance and it...sucked. Completely, totally sucked. Post that just about anywhere these days and you're shut down by the Final Boss of Community Standards.
February 6, 20232 yr 5 minutes ago, Lazarus said: People can't listen to two songs at once. Cynically, every person's or business's song selection could me thought of as an act of exclusion. If I wear my dress shoes, am I excluding my tennis shoes? This is the sort of high school philosophy that propels a lot of crap music. This past weekend Blink 182's Greatest Hits appeared on my phone, randomly, as some sort of Apple Music promotion. I gave it a chance and it...sucked. Completely, totally sucked. Post that just about anywhere these days and you're shut down by the Final Boss of Community Standards. That something sucks? You must not have seen my Browns FB group lately....
February 7, 20232 yr 7 hours ago, E Rocc said: That something sucks? You must not have seen my Browns FB group lately.... Did you violate community standards?
February 7, 20232 yr 7 hours ago, Lazarus said: Did you violate community standards? All depends on the meaning of the word "community".
February 8, 20232 yr speaking of blink 182 — nofx does not suck and is calling it quits this year. maybe its easy for some to slough these guys off as silly cali punk, but they actually have been very passionate about what they do over the years and many of their 2 minute punky riffs on political issues of the day are quite on point. i dare say they are the punky pete seegers to an extent. nobody else was doing it. at least with such good sense and humor. anyway, we sure could use them sticking around: https://www.rollingstone.com/music/musi ... 234586045/ nofx 1983-2023 rip
February 8, 20232 yr On 2/7/2023 at 7:52 AM, E Rocc said: All depends on the meaning of the word "community". I cancelled my NY Times subscription awhile back, but still visit the website once or twice each week for validation of my decision. Today, the headline of some op-ed reads "Madonna's new face is a Brilliant Provocation". I can't read it, but I don't want to, either. I'm sure that their censors are working overtime in the comments section to maintain "community standards". Over and over again, we see the NY Times and others broadcast cultural assertions that are objectively untrue and indefensible, then patrol the comments so as to silence dissidence. NPR is just as bad. They gloat over some talentless figure, present their ugly artistic output and contrived persona as a world-historical item, and leave absolutely no space for criticism. Their ogre-of-the-moment is above reproach, and that is self-evident, because they said so!
February 8, 20232 yr 3 hours ago, Lazarus said: I cancelled my NY Times subscription awhile back, but still visit the website once or twice each week for validation of my decision. Today, the headline of some op-ed reads "Madonna's new face is a Brilliant Provocation". I can't read it, but I don't want to, either. I'm sure that their censors are working overtime in the comments section to maintain "community standards". Over and over again, we see the NY Times and others broadcast cultural assertions that are objectively untrue and indefensible, then patrol the comments so as to silence dissidence. NPR is just as bad. They gloat over some talentless figure, present their ugly artistic output and contrived persona as a world-historical item, and leave absolutely no space for criticism. Their ogre-of-the-moment is above reproach, and that is self-evident, because they said so! Every one of us is likely thinking of the same artists, though some of us won't be specific.
February 8, 20232 yr 22 minutes ago, E Rocc said: Every one of us is likely thinking of the same artists, though some of us won't be specific. There is no money in the music industry anymore. Today's and the future's pop stars are doomed to be "super-influencers", and nothing more. Space Balls, but without the humor and self-awareness. There are two big, big differences between rock & roll and rap that explain the decline of the former and the rise and sustained "success" of the latter. With the exception of The Besties Boys, Wu Tang, and a handful of other groups, rap has mostly been solo acts. Record companies have always wanted solo acts, not groups. They don't have to worry about infighting in the studio or a fanbase that stops showing up when the "classic lineup" is fractured. Second, rap from the very beginning (and Russell Simmons might have been the first) has been paired with clothing deals. In the history of rock music, what band had a shoe deal? A whole clothing line? Remember that hi-top sneaker with "AXL" on the tongue that settles on the bottom of the ocean at the end of "Estranged"? You couldn't go out to the store and buy that shoe (or a pair of them). Meanwhile, one rapper after another has made much more money selling clothes than they ever did selling CDs. Dr. Dre made like a billion dollars licensing his name to some mediocre headphones.
February 8, 20232 yr 37 minutes ago, Lazarus said: There is no money in the music industry anymore. Today's and the future's pop stars are doomed to be "super-influencers", and nothing more. Space Balls, but without the humor and self-awareness. There are two big, big differences between rock & roll and rap that explain the decline of the former and the rise and sustained "success" of the latter. With the exception of The Besties Boys, Wu Tang, and a handful of other groups, rap has mostly been solo acts. Record companies have always wanted solo acts, not groups. They don't have to worry about infighting in the studio or a fanbase that stops showing up when the "classic lineup" is fractured. Second, rap from the very beginning (and Russell Simmons might have been the first) has been paired with clothing deals. In the history of rock music, what band had a shoe deal? A whole clothing line? Remember that hi-top sneaker with "AXL" on the tongue that settles on the bottom of the ocean at the end of "Estranged"? You couldn't go out to the store and buy that shoe (or a pair of them). Meanwhile, one rapper after another has made much more money selling clothes than they ever did selling CDs. Dr. Dre made like a billion dollars licensing his name to some mediocre headphones. From what I can see and have heard, very few people are making big money, quite a few are making little money, and there's not as much for non value added middlemen. https://www.theguardian.com/music/2014/nov/17/steve-albini-at-face-the-music-how-the-internet-solved-problem-with-music
February 8, 20232 yr 2 hours ago, Lazarus said: There is no money in the music industry anymore. Today's and the future's pop stars are doomed to be "super-influencers", and nothing more. Space Balls, but without the humor and self-awareness. There are two big, big differences between rock & roll and rap that explain the decline of the former and the rise and sustained "success" of the latter. With the exception of The Besties Boys, Wu Tang, and a handful of other groups, rap has mostly been solo acts. Record companies have always wanted solo acts, not groups. They don't have to worry about infighting in the studio or a fanbase that stops showing up when the "classic lineup" is fractured. Second, rap from the very beginning (and Russell Simmons might have been the first) has been paired with clothing deals. In the history of rock music, what band had a shoe deal? A whole clothing line? Remember that hi-top sneaker with "AXL" on the tongue that settles on the bottom of the ocean at the end of "Estranged"? You couldn't go out to the store and buy that shoe (or a pair of them). Meanwhile, one rapper after another has made much more money selling clothes than they ever did selling CDs. Dr. Dre made like a billion dollars licensing his name to some mediocre headphones. Armored Saint had a Nike deal. Megadeth had to be getting at least free Nikes in the late '80s considering how many pairs they had vs. how much money they made vs. how much they were spending on drugs.
February 8, 20232 yr 16 minutes ago, GCrites80s said: Armored Saint had a Nike deal. Remember the Mighty Mighty Bosstones Converse ad campaign? It and their cameo in Clueless caused them to get dissed by the scene. Like, they were sellouts while still signed to a minor label, then totally dissed when they signed with Mercury (I think). That's two albums BEFORE they had a mainstream hit. That's how sensitive people used to be to selling out. You couldn't do ANYTHING that made money outside of selling records or tickets or typical merch. The second you lent your name & likeness to something else, you were toast. You lost your core fans and you were stuck with the mediocre people who showed up thereafter. Now it's a mad rush to sell out smash that like button, since there is no option to not sell out smash that like button.
February 9, 20232 yr Also a small controversy erupted when a photo surfaced of Alex Skolnik from Testament wearing unreleased sample Nikes on stage in 1988. How did he get them?
February 9, 20232 yr 14 hours ago, GCrites80s said: Also a small controversy erupted when a photo surfaced of Alex Skolnik from Testament wearing unreleased sample Nikes on stage in 1988. How did he get them? We're all Space Balls now.
February 9, 20232 yr Boy, all this talk about 35 year old shoes is my favorite part about my favorite music at the moment.
February 9, 20232 yr Burt Bacharach dies at 94 (I didn't even think he was still living). He was part of the soundtrack of the 60's (with a little help from Dionne Warwick) http://www.mainstreetpainesville.org/
February 9, 20232 yr And the 80s. Though my favorite take on this song was its performance by UK band All Saints (one of my favorites) on a tribute show:
February 9, 20232 yr ^they're good. although since I'm so old I was totally unfamiliar with this group. Out of curiosity I started going over various covers of "San Jose" (including Nancy Sinatra!) to see if there were any that could match or even surpass (?!) Dionne Warwick's and came up mostly empty, but this one by a Dutch singer I've have of course never heard of (bonus points if you can pronounce the name😅) struck me as the most likable. Very interesting, to say the least http://www.mainstreetpainesville.org/
February 11, 20232 yr this one is all the good things about 70s music and detroit. the first remark is “i played this when i got out of vietnam.”
February 14, 20232 yr It was trendy last week to say you cared about Burt Bacharach, because the social media is monkey-see-monkey-do when it comes to saying you care about something. Look at me, I'm acting like a care. I didn't see anyone say they loved this Bacharach song, which in my opinion was the greatest thing The White Stripes did. It's hard to believe that this is now twenty years old. Jack White is really the only guitarist in rock history to get away with leaving clean/overdrive switches on a record.
February 15, 20232 yr On 2/9/2023 at 3:54 PM, eastvillagedon said: ^they're good. although since I'm so old I was totally unfamiliar with this group. Out of curiosity I started going over various covers of "San Jose" (including Nancy Sinatra!) to see if there were any that could match or even surpass (?!) Dionne Warwick's and came up mostly empty, but this one by a Dutch singer I've have of course never heard of (bonus points if you can pronounce the name😅) struck me as the most likable. Very interesting, to say the least this was by far the best burt cover —
February 28, 20232 yr today in rock n roll history, feb 27, back in 1981, the gang from 10,000 maniacs, with natalie merchant still in hs, drove up from jamestown, ny to nearby erie, pa, to play their first show in a live music pub downtown. they were boo’ed off the stage. and the moral is … i guess don’t give up too easily! so here is one of my fav live music videos ever, with the young band and natalie doing all her classic hippy girl moves. i just adored her back then:
March 4, 20232 yr DUECE came on at the bar last night. Myself and a few boomer dudes were the only people who recognized it. I can't help but smirk and laugh to myself whenever I hear this meatball in public. It's a magnificent piece of butt rock that deserves its own exhibit in the Rock Hall. Baby, if you're feeling good And baby if you're feeling nice You know your man is workin' hard He's worth a deuce
March 17, 20232 yr Listening to today: a concert I went to 41 years and a few hours ago (1982 WMMS Coffee Break Concert by Jonah Koslen and the Heroes). I discovered its availability one year ago today. https://music.apple.com/us/album/agora-live/1292966534 Edited March 17, 20232 yr by E Rocc
March 21, 20232 yr speaking of back in the early 80s, take another ride on the nostalgia train courtesy of the internet archive with the very start of and first four hours of mtv, including commercials. if you know any trivia about that you know the first song played was arguably the very best pop music video, video killed the radio star. did you know what was number two and three? its pat benetar and rod stewart. and on and on it went. more trivia? what were the first commercials? very fittingly of the era ones for sure, first for a three ring school binder (!), then for the great movie superman 2, then for dolby noise reduction. ha. ok cable tv viewers, its time to face the future of music and meet the classic mtv vj’s: https://archive.org/details/1981.08.01_MTV_First_Four_Hours_12am_Saturday_August_1st_1981
March 21, 20232 yr Thanks to "Big Mouth", I've been on a Ida Maria run lately. Start with "Oh My God".
March 22, 20232 yr 23 hours ago, mrnyc said: speaking of back in the early 80s, take another ride on the nostalgia train courtesy of the internet archive with the very start of and first four hours of mtv, including commercials. if you know any trivia about that you know the first song played was arguably the very best pop music video, video killed the radio star. did you know what was number two and three? its pat benetar and rod stewart. and on and on it went. more trivia? what were the first commercials? very fittingly of the era ones for sure, first for a three ring school binder (!), then for the great movie superman 2, then for dolby noise reduction. ha. ok cable tv viewers, its time to face the future of music and meet the classic mtv vj’s: https://archive.org/details/1981.08.01_MTV_First_Four_Hours_12am_Saturday_August_1st_1981 And proving that the diametric opposite of an original video can still be great: Kinda crazy that the only one of those VJs to still have a high profile media career is the one they used to ban from the facilities (on full pay) whenever Clinton or Gore would "drop in".
March 22, 20232 yr ^ oh yeah, so crazy and so high profile i have no idea who that is. but thats pretty cool the buggles were still around and did good with that classic song in 2004. yipes even that performance was 20yrs ago!
March 29, 20232 yr On 2/11/2023 at 11:15 AM, mrnyc said: this one is all the good things about 70s music and detroit. the first remark is “i played this when i got out of vietnam.” So the Vietnam comment got me thinking about songs with this type of beat when I hear them on the radio (others include "Slow Ride" and "All Right Now") -- it's not just about cowbells or percussion. It's about the kind of beat that made people move their heads front and back kind of like a headbang except the head doesn't tilt down. It was very prolific at the time but kind of sticks out now as quite outdated in a way that the Stones and Black Sabbath do not. Classic rock radio still plays these types of songs often. I used to wonder why they stuck around on the radio -- in contrast to Pink Floyd, Zeppelin, Aerosmith, Tom Petty etc. where it's obvious how their sound has influenced modern music. But if that beat is a reminder of what music sounded like when all those guys started coming back from Vietnam it is going to be lionized in that manner.
March 29, 20232 yr And we now have enough Early 2020s in the book to start categorizing the music of the time! Summary? Subdivided beats are back AND Emo's back
March 29, 20232 yr In an interivew for the 1991 book Songwriters on Songwriting, Paul Simon said "We're long out of the age of melody. Long out of there and we probably won't be going back into it." Everything became about beats and rhythym, for better or worse (worse, IMHO). Melody isn't totally dead, you just have to go searcing for it.
March 29, 20232 yr Took me a long time to get into the Silver Jews (still working at it lol), but for about a year now I've been listening to the Purple Mountains record every couple weeks or so. Hot damn, this is quite possibly the best saddest album of all time. Reminds me of The Band's self titled album (lots of great tunes on that one, but Jawbone is the best, hands down), but much more suicidal. Edited March 29, 20232 yr by Ineffable_Matt
March 29, 20232 yr 2 hours ago, Ineffable_Matt said: In an interivew for the 1991 book Songwriters on Songwriting, Paul Simon said "We're long out of the age of melody. Long out of there and we probably won't be going back into it." Everything became about beats and rhythym, for better or worse (worse, IMHO). Melody isn't totally dead, you just have to go searching for it. The tyranny of suck is so pervasive that hearing traditional lush arrangements hurts my brain. It's like the pseudo-ice cream headache you get from Gatorade on a hot day.
March 29, 20232 yr You, like most people today of almost all ages, are no longer accustomed to hearing mids. Today you have to seek out equipment and music with mids. Cars don't have them. Computer speakers don't. Headphones don't. The mix doesn't. Music and equipment from 1988 and before does. My home stereo and the aftermarket system in my IROC-Z do and initially listening to music through them creates the effect you describe. Eventually it goes away as your ears and brain adjust. Edited March 29, 20232 yr by GCrites80s
March 29, 20232 yr 12 minutes ago, GCrites80s said: You, like most people today of almost all ages, are no longer accustomed to hearing mids. Today you have to seek out equipment and music with mids. Cars don't have them. Computer speakers don't. Headphones don't. The mix doesn't. Music and equipment from 1988 and before does. My home stereo and the aftermarket system in my IROC-Z do and initially listening to music through them creates the effect you describe. Eventually it goes away as your ears and brain adjust. Digital doesn't have hiss and that is what opened up this no-mids possibility in recorded music. On old records, you can hear when a new instrument is punched in during a quiet intro because some hiss is added. But I am speaking more of the chord voicings and structures of the songs. There used to be a guy called an arranger, who was a mathematical genius, but nobody talks about these guys anymore, so I'm not sure if they even exist.
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