^well somebody should have written more precise zoning laws.

^^They do because our society is not made up of (and most certainly not run by) overgrown frat boys.

I was the one who mentioned the ownership of property by the Red Light District in Amsterdam and I actually own property in the Riverbend Condo on West 10th.  Of course, I'm no overgrown frat boy (I was a frat boy, but that was...ouch...14 years ago) and I have an almost four year old daughter. 

 

First, if I was in Cleveland (currently in Fort Lauderdale) I would not move from the Riverbend because of the strip district.

 

Second, I guarantee you that having this strip district will do nothing to bring up or down our property values.  At least nothing compared to the positive that will happen with the development of the East Bank and Stonebridge and the new condos on the bend.

 

The guys that spend their nights burning rubber under the Detroit-Superior bridge or honking their horns in front of the RTA station by our building are much more of a nuisance than some "overgrown frat boys" heading for a harmless night of fun to a strip club.

 

Face it and Accept it:

 

Sex sells and it sells alot.

 

And, regardless of your Puritan believes an overabundance of sex does not a society destroy...Amsterdam is 1000 times more urban, international, progressive and successful than Cleveland and just one or two years ago those sickos were thinking about legalizing underage sex...I don't agree with everything they do, but I certainly wish our city was as crowded, popular and economically viable as theirs.

 

 

 

the hustler club opened in manhattan in 2004....on the far west side & away from anything, but near the westside highway, which i am sure is better for them than near residential as its easy to see. the building is predictably gaudy with ads:

 

http://media.nowpublic.com/images/59/d/59dd4acce6101c179fef19243422d195.jpg

 

^ classy huh? something to look forward to    :roll: 

Yes it is awful.  but lets paint a more accurate picture of the residencies and businesses that are there today.

http://www.plainpress.org/html/stories/2007-08/newlegislationallowsentertainmentdistricts.htm

(Plain Press v38 n8)

New legislation allows creation of Entertainment Overlay Districts

by Chuck Hoven

(Plain Press, August 2007) Changes made by City Council in Cleveland's zoning law to accommodate development in the Flats could spell trouble for residents battling nightclubs adjoining residential neighborhoods.

A new Entertainment Overlay District is now part of the City's Zoning Code. Among other things, the legislation allows for new districts to be created to overlay existing General Retail Business Districts and Industrial Districts. The new district would allow everything the old district allowed, plus it would waive the current zoning requirement that requires uses such as nightclubs be located a prescribed distance from churches, parks, schools and residential areas.

 

Yeah, Plain Press... clearly an objective news source.

yes, just like the PD

I'm not saying the PD is great, but at least they list their editorials in the Editorial section. The article you posted (regardless of anyone's opinion on the issue) was fine until the "However, this is little solace...". I'm not saying I disagree with opposition to the legislation, but that kind of flagrant editorializing is exactly why people think Channel 19 is sensationalist tripe.

yea I know..the plain press does does mix it all together. I do think the beginning analysis/explanation is quite good (and richer in detail than what the pd offered), but  the end should indicate editoral. While the pd puts editorials in their own section, it is still clear they have an agenda and bias even if they try to pretend they do not which in some way can be even more egregious.

Last call for illegal bars

Thursday, August 02, 2007

By Ken Prendergast

West Side Sun News

 

 

Article removed for lack of link

"As this (entertainment district) law is written and approved, if savvy legislation and districting was put forth you could legalize these (Ward 14 establishments) in a heartbeat," Senyak said.

 

All should know that Joe Cimperman says this quote by Henry Senyak is inaccurate. Cimperman points out that the entertainment district zoning overlay doesn't cancel out existing zoning. Rather it allows a certain number of such entertainment businesses (including adult) within the boundaries of a district.

In <a href="http://www.cleveland.com/editorials/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/opinion/1186735224295500.xml&coll=2">today's PD "Cheers and Jeers"</a>:<blockquote>CHEERS . . .

 

to the Hustler Club and Cleveland city leaders for agreeing to a stripped-down strip club district of two clubs, not three, to occupy less space in the Flats. Other changes include more discreet signs and building facades, beefed up security and parking. <b>As an added twist, tax-increment financing will allow revenue from the district to pay for programs and maintenance to dress up nearby Canal Basin Park.</b></blockquote>Had anybody heard about this previously?

"Cheers and Jeers"-does TV guide know the PD is stealing their fine writing style? As always rich in depth reporting. Anyway I was not there, but I heard the taxing was NOT committed to in anyway in fact  it was just discussed in a s "wouldn't it be nice" banter. the PD picked it up and ran with at as fact . now I am really hoping someone will post that I am wrong with a commitment from the city to actually follow through on this. As far as the building facade and signage that is supposedly apprived by the Flats Oxbow. But seriously now, do  you think they can control Hustler when the city actually tripped over itself in the rush to change the entire zoning rules of the city to accommodate this California pornographer who is known for contributing to the local community (ha)?   I have no idea where the parking is going to go. Who will enforce any of this? I am sure since the city made such a fuss to make this happen that they are not going to want to hear any complaints from citizens or long time businesses. A lot of flats businesses and nearly all homeowners were really pissed about this but ignored. I also think the PD unlike just about every other source that reported on this, failed to properly explain that a precedence has been set for any neighborhood to designate adult entertainment zones next to housing, parks , etc as long as the gatekeeper to the fiefdom (council person) approves it...which we now know(at least in kingdom 13) if there is enough money it, what he or she will do. That is the really sad story: it is not even about whether people are uptight about red light districts and the problems they bring to neighborhoods  with incompatible interests, it is about politicans for sale.  Someone tell me why again Wolstien is NOT making space next to the upscale steak house and bookstore...

blech.  I don't necessarily mind a strip district, but in the flats???

^agreed.

 

this will be a clearly visible eyesore in, what should be, a showplace waterfront neighborhood.

yes it is too bad. The region is not exactly busting at the seems, and this was the only place to do business. Obviously more appropriate locations could have been explored-even in other parts of the flats other totally industrial areas near downtown . Instead a lot of effort was made to CHANGE zoning for this. I want people to know this community tried, but we failed. We are just dumb ol'  citizens who tried to make a go of it and invest in the city. I get how it goes now

If you ever go down Trinidad

They make you feel so very glad

Calypso sing and make up rhyme

Guarantee you one real good fine time

 

Drinkin' rum and Coca-Cola

Go down Point Koomahnah

Both mother and daughter

Workin' for the Yankee dollar

If you ever go down Trinidad

They make you feel so very glad

Calypso sing and make up rhyme

Guarantee you one real good fine time

 

Drinkin' rum and Coca-Cola

Go down Point Koomahnah

Both mother and daughter

Workin' for the Yankee dollar

 

^The Andrews Sisters claimed that they didn't know that their big hit in 1945 was *actually* about prostitution.

Saw this on the list for this weeks Planning Commission and Design review, and sure to please Peabody :|.

 

New construction of a no doubt quality establishment in the "district".

(not sure if this is in addition to the expected 2 or if there has been a change in original plans)

 

"DF 09-001,  Kahoots Adult Night Club, New Construction, 1101 Center Street (Ward 13)

Chris Vallette, DSA Architects"

 

There's some lovely renderings and a site plan here.  http://planning.city.cleveland.oh.us/designreview/drcagenda/2009/022009/index.php#photo

Ha.  At least it's built up to the sidewalk(!)

Ha. At least it's built up to the sidewalk(!)

thank our fearless leaders for this tacky piece of garbage. Not only no east bank, but this. This could have gone off Hamilton. But no, had to put it in a growing residential area.  This will make nice sight seeing for visitors on the tow path, one positive hope in these tough times. Oh, and I am sure lots of respectful business will want to relocate here. Nice work boys, they ought put a plaque out front thanking you so the next generation will remember the mark you put on Cleveland

Such an awful way to treat what should be an historic showplace for the city.

 

Really, I can't think of a worse place for a tacky strip club district.

 

Way to go Cleveland.

Peabody, wasnt there supposed to be some kind of compromise of limiting it to 2 clubs, or am I off on this?

 

Wasnt sure if anything has been happening with the hustler club, or if the other is still around.     

I <3 when people spell business names wrong with a k.  it's klassy and kountry!

The limit is 2 clubs. Nevertheless, it does not draw a positive element. Take for example the unregulated  members only  "social club"  that had cameras installed by a peep show company. There a lot of things that typically go on  behind the scenes that result in decisions and deals that leave the average citizen scratching their head and wondering when Cleveland will ger it together. As I have mentioned the people in the neighborhood showed up in droves to community meetings, wrote letters etc to voice a negative opinion.

I think more than the earnest dancing girls with a heart of gold have been twirling around a pole  for dollar bills. That's all I am saying

 

 

Here, Ill try this again. 

 

According to a previous article, it says it would only allow 2 clubs to operate, one being the current Diamond Mens Club, and the other the relocated Larry Flyn's.  So unless one of those fell through or closed, why is this (3rd one) allowed?

ahh sorry. I see you are not up to date on all adult entertainment news.  Hustler co. sold or changed the name to cahoots. So Cahoots is the second and hopefully last club until someoone comes along to stuff someones pockets and change the zoning again.

huh.  am I weird for preferring the name hustler to the name kahoots?

ahh sorry. I see you are not up to date on all adult entertainment news.  Hustler co. sold or changed the name to cahoots. So Cahoots is the second and hopefully last club until someoone comes along to stuff someones pockets and change the zoning again.

 

Yes indeed I guess I have fallen behind on my adult entertainment news...  :-)

 

Somehow I missed that.  I would be especially pissed if they had ended up selling, since they were the reason they established the classy strip district in the first place. 

 

well it looks like this is a go! yeah. design review passed it without reservation. Oh, maybe cover the dumpster better or plant a few bushes, but otherwise 2 thumbs up . Stucco Greek revival at the swing bridge apparently is good thing. No matter that residents were promised something tasteful to fit into the neighborhood. 

 

Does the community care? why yes. Some residents attended and voiced their strong opinions- presented a letter signed by dozens more homeowners who swallowed the I believe in Cleveland living line and wanted to  make the neighborhood better rather than worse.  Humorously Diamonds men club seemed to set the standard of design.  It must have been brought up 10 times.

 

Tim Donovan helpfully said this wonder would not impact the towpath at all. No problemo! Once again, so helpful.

 

head back to work....walk home after work. I am excited to stroll my still sweet, resilient flats which suffers these fools day after day, and contemplate why I bother. I love walking along the river home.

 

Why are there cops everywhere?

 

walked upon man wielding a knife 2 feet in front of me. Oh $hit. I never should have said what would make this day worse.  never do that. I stare at him worried. For him more than me. He puts the knife to his own throat and tell me he will slit his throat if the cops -who are just about to find him- come near him. My heart sinks  and I move forward dreading what could happen next. To him.  I see a gun drawn. nausea sets in.  I am sick with worry they will shoot him. 

 

The flats looked as sad as I have ever seen it today. But there is always tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OMG you poor thing.  are you ok?  is the guy ok??

^^ Jesus, Peabody ... what the hell, was this guy crazy or what?

Wow.  On the good side, I think you can count on that never ever happening again.  I really do.

hey thanks for the kind words. Today I felt worse  than yesterday. Not for me but for how bad some people have it. It breaks my heart someone would put a blade to their throat like that. I don't think the cops hurt the guy and thank goodness they did not get hurt either. Ironically minutes before I had just left the jail on professional business, the mental health unit no less. I felt so grateful to be away from that and into the light of day...and there I was again facing this.  I debriefed with my boss today and she said Cleveland PD has a ton of training deescalating these situations. Surly this could have ended tragically but thank goodness it did not based on good judgment and training of CPD .

 

 

Anyhow...back to Kahoots. Apparently City planning got the drift today a lot pf people don't want the flats uglier and the material of the building was rejected. This is good news.  I do not have the details yet, but I am hoping it won't be so butt ugly. time will tell. Again going to any city meeting in Cleveland is truly surreal, especially of you are a citizen and not someones tool.

 

I am still trying to decide what made yesterday worse-suffering the impact of fools of this city  or distraught man with mental health issues brandishing knife 2 feet away. who does the most harm...?

the fence has gone up around the kahoots site, and a construction trailer has been dropped as well.  is this horrible thing a go?

 

it is very much a go. Many residents gave input about the original design and some minor consessions were made. I am sure most will find it very disappointing and out of scale. Sadly the residents and many business owners begged for this to go somewhere else-ie off Hamilton just east of downtown where it would not impact residents and businesses, but Cimperman (especially) and Siliman push this through like they were welcoming the second coming of Christ. All the eggs went in the  Wolstien basket, even when there were whispers even then it might not be a go. I recall us saying how short sighted it was to to do this.....sad.

 

One day it will be interesting to find out what other city resources were spent to make this happen. So now a downtown neighborhood that is struggling to attract more diverse businesses will only get one that will turn off potential businesses that would havel served its RESIDENTS. I suspect maybe massage parlors and lord knows what else might find the locale appealing. Think a cafe of coffee shop will want to go in now?

 

At least we have our urban garden coming in down the street.

Don't worry too much Peabody, the Flats won't be as crowded with strip club D-bags when they finally open Kahoots II on Euclid Ave.