May 12, 20169 yr I wonder if we will ever see a Mill Creek Expressway-style project for I-71. We have seen a number of investments along I-71, such as the new MLK interchange and the Kennedy Connector, but I-71 itself still has a number of odd features, especially the I-71/Norwood Lateral interchange.
May 12, 20169 yr taestell[/member] other than the Norwood lateral interchange (which creates a "pinch point" on northbound where it drops down to 2 lanes)... what else could you see being changed? The rest of I-71 has 3 continuous lanes which seems sufficient, unless they wanted to increase capacity to 4 lanes in each direction, which would require a TON of work. EDITED - to update number of lanes. I was off by a lane. Here is the pinch point where it drops to just 2 northbound lanes: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1632218,-84.4342837,3a,75y,66.95h,87.4t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s0jA70V6OJonyXZRnlbqWiQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
May 12, 20169 yr I could definitely see a situation where they would want to rework that entire area so that there are 3 continuous through lanes, no left lane onramp like there is now, and only one exit which would then be used by all three exits going northbound at that point to reduce the amount of traffic switching lanes quickly.
May 12, 20169 yr I do believe they plan to add a lane northbound between Kennedy and Red Bank to try to ease the pinch point.
May 12, 20169 yr I was looking through some old aerials and can't find anything on I-71 NB ever being three continuous lanes through the Norwood Lateral interchange.
May 12, 20169 yr I was looking through some old aerials and can't find anything on I-71 NB ever being three continuous lanes through the Norwood Lateral interchange. Yeah - you're right. I updated my post to reflect the correct number of lanes.
May 12, 20169 yr I seem to remember some trick where if you start in the farthest left lane on I-71N downtown, you will be in the farthest right lane by the time you hit I-275. I am hardly ever in the area on weekdays, but I just was around lunch, and the amount of traffic creeping along on Burnett to Reading, then to either I-71 or I-471 is pretty amazing. All of that is going to go away when the new interchange opens.
May 12, 20169 yr I've always kind of wondered if the Victory Parkway interchange was scuttled not for the stated reasons but rather because plans to build MLK as it now exists were formulated after construction had begun on I-71. The interstate in that area opened around 1966 but MLK was not completed until the early 1980s, so about 15 years later. But when 71 was planned in the early 1960s, University Ave. still traveled directly through UC's campus and was the main cross-town street between UC and Walnut Hills. From what I understand --- the Victory Parkway i/c was ash-canned because it would have removed a ton of trees, so it got push back from the Cinti Park Board I do believe they plan to add a lane northbound between Kennedy and Red Bank to try to ease the pinch point. You are correct. The right lane will no longer drop at the Ridge Road NB off-ramp and will now be extended to drop at the Red Bank Road Exit. In addition they are relocating the Ridge Road NB off-ramp to intersect Kennedy Ave adjacent a slightly relocated On-ramp to NB I-71 from Kennedy.
May 12, 20169 yr Do you have a link to these plans? When I talked to someone at the Cincinnati DOTE, the said that ODOT refused to make any improvements to the I-71/Norwood Lateral interchange and that was the main reason for building the Kennedy Connector.
May 12, 20169 yr Here's a link to the full project documents. It's a 71MB PDF: ftp://ftp.dot.state.oh.us/pub/Districts/D08/HAM-71-8.42%20PID%2091826/71%20AER/HAM-71-6.86%20Final%20AER%20%209-19-14%3B%20PID%2094741.pdf Supposedly construction was supposed to start last year, so I assume there's been funding issues or other objections.
May 12, 20169 yr It's so good to hear that this pinch point is being addressed. It is probably the single biggest cause of traffic in the region, or maybe second biggest behind the BSB and cut in the hill.
May 12, 20169 yr The thing is that pinch points act as relief valves for the system farther downstream. Before the new southbound auxiliary lane was added between Pfeiffer and Cross County it would cause a big jamb back up to Fields Ertel. In a way it acted like ramp meters, restricting the number of vehicles that could enter the highway or proceed through the interchange in general, allowing for freer flow beyond it. Now the whole highway jambs up from I-275 through Montgomery because of all the vehicles being barfed onto the highway. So what this new Ridge/Red Bank lane will likely do is just shift the jamb up the Kenwood cut. Besides, it's not like it clears out after there even in today's evening rush. It's solid through I-275.
May 12, 20169 yr ^ That's true. Hadn't really thought about it that way before. But people do line up in the two furthest left lanes for a mile or two before Ridge, leaving the 2 right lanes virtually unused. Hopefully this project will help keep traffic flowing better from Dana to Ridge. Beyond that, traffic will probably continue to be a mess. I also think the elevation gain at the Kenwood cut is a cause of traffic, because truck traffic slows way down going up the hill. Not much can be done about that.
May 12, 20169 yr Are they being designed for rush hour relief? If so, that will ultimately fail (as Jeffrey noted above). In off-peak times, it offers more cushion and additional safety. On the Kennedy loop ramp to NB I-71, the speeds of the drivers merging in were always quite slow due to the loop ramp itself - and the lack of a long acceleration lane. Fixing those instances will help - but I'm not sure installing complete collector-distributor lanes will help in the long-term. Look at Texas, which has extensive uses of collector-distributor lanes - and crazy traffic queues.
May 12, 20169 yr Do you have a link to these plans? When I talked to someone at the Cincinnati DOTE, the said that ODOT refused to make any improvements to the I-71/Norwood Lateral interchange and that was the main reason for building the Kennedy Connector. They may have refused to address improvements to the Lateral i/c in reference to how it tie into Ridge SB and from Ridge NB as it related to the center of Cinti Development (or whatever its called). ODOT really does not want to address any capacity issues on surface streets, only Mainline Are they being designed for rush hour relief? If so, that will ultimately fail (as Jeffrey noted above). In off-peak times, it offers more cushion and additional safety. Probably a little of each. it does queue prior to the bulk of the rush hour, and there is probably a safety issue with lane switches and sideswipe accidents.
May 12, 20169 yr Here's a link to the full project documents. It's a 71MB PDF: ftp://ftp.dot.state.oh.us/pub/Districts/D08/HAM-71-8.42%20PID%2091826/71%20AER/HAM-71-6.86%20Final%20AER%20%209-19-14%3B%20PID%2094741.pdf Supposedly construction was supposed to start last year, so I assume there's been funding issues or other objections. That shows the 71NB offramp to Ridge north being eliminated, and traffic directed to the Ridge south offramp (where they can make a left onto Ridge north). The previous comment mentioned a realignment of the Ridge north offramp to dump onto Kennedy. Either way that would free up a lot of land on Ridge for development.
May 13, 20169 yr Would the land become available though? Or would ODOT just sit on it and cover it with grass?
May 17, 20169 yr Apparently the "drab gray" paint on the railroad bridge was just a primer. It's now white. Bright glossy white! If that's the final color then it's pretty sharp looking, but I doubt it will age well, and it looks a bit out of place with all of the weathered tan concrete around it.
May 17, 20169 yr ODOT has been using white along I-71 north of Columbus for over a year now. It beats out "neon green" that was used in the 2000's, "baby blue" in the 1990's, "hospital green" in the 1980's, "generic steel" in the 1970's. I'm not sure how white fades - it can't be that much worse than purple.
May 17, 20169 yr I'm not worried so much about fading as it getting dirty and grungy over time. I hate that they paint so much concrete white because it always looks worse after a few years than just bare weathered concrete. It gets all streaky and blotchy, and it peels too. I wish they'd use more of the "bridge orange" or whatever it's called that's already on the other bridges around there.
May 17, 20169 yr I like the bright orange + bare concrete that is used on the pedestrian bridge over I-71 in Evanston. Streeview: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1429667,-84.4629352,3a,75y,86.09h,86.51t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYlBYO5D3kV_ReTL4MVcX6A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
May 17, 20169 yr Correct. Here's ODOT's original drawing for the Victory Parkway exit. You'll notice the modifications made to Gilbert Avenue which were made anyway, as well as to Victory Parkway itself. Also note the old Deer Creek railroad tunnel just to the west of the new Blair Avenue overpass. http://www.jjakucyk.com/urbanohio2/i71mlkvictory.pdf Is there online access to ODOTs drawing archive?
May 17, 20169 yr Correct. Here's ODOT's original drawing for the Victory Parkway exit. You'll notice the modifications made to Gilbert Avenue which were made anyway, as well as to Victory Parkway itself. Also note the old Deer Creek railroad tunnel just to the west of the new Blair Avenue overpass. http://www.jjakucyk.com/urbanohio2/i71mlkvictory.pdf Is there online access to ODOTs drawing archive? They always have a bunch of stuff posted on their FTP site ftp://dot.state.oh.us just go to /pub/districts/d08 to get to southwest Ohio. Folders associated with particular projects usually start with the 3-letter county name then the route number, and project ID. This isn't an archive though. It's generally for drawings and documents for current projects or that have been requested by people that are too big to e-mail. Since these are all public records you can also just e-mail them and ask for something if you know what you're looking for.
May 20, 20169 yr ^That's too bad, though it'll probably age more gracefully than white. I noticed a bulldozer on the south side of 71 in between Ridge and Red Bank where they're talking about adding an additional lane. I think the bulldozer was clearing the area of honeysuckle in preparation for the lane addition.
May 21, 20169 yr They painted over the white, it's that boring pale green you see all over I-71. Remember "Colin Powell = Vanilla Ice"?
May 21, 20169 yr They painted over the white, it's that boring pale green you see all over I-71. Remember "Colin Powell = Vanilla Ice"? Chris Sabo Died For Our Sins
July 11, 20168 yr Over 40 properties coming up for sale around MLK Interchange: http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2016/07/11/exclusive-walnut-hills-church-to-sell-3-acres-near.html Here's the listing: http://www.preferredgrouprealtors.com/Commercial/1116-Lincoln-Avenue-Cincinnati---Walnut-Hills-OH-45206/CNC/1487958/ According to the Auditor's website, here are the 41 properties in the name of "James Temple Church: 1000 FORAKER AVE 1138 FORAKER AVE 1136 FORAKER AVE 1126 FORAKER AVE 1122 FORAKER AVE 1118 FORAKER AVE 2905 ALMS PL 1134 CHAPEL ST 1112 CHAPEL ST 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1121 LINCOLN AVE 1225 LINCOLN AVE 1129 LINCOLN AVE 1131 LINCOLN AVE 2919 ALMS PL 3010 PARK AVE 1108 LINCOLN AVE 1110 LINCOLN AVE 1116 LINCOLN AVE 3022 PARK AVE 1209 WHITLOW ST 1130 CHAPEL ST 1119 LINCOLN AVE 2923 ALMS PL 2913 ALMS PL 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1000 LINCOLN AVE 3008 MONFORT ST 3012 MONFORT ST 1008 LINCOLN AVE 1010 LINCOLN AVE 1014 LINCOLN AVE 1020 LINCOLN AVE 1001 FORAKER AVE 1005 FORAKER AVE 1017 FORAKER AVE 1021 FORAKER AVE 1023 FORAKER AVE 1035 FORAKER AVE 1114 LINCOLN AVE
July 11, 20168 yr Over 40 properties coming up for sale around MLK Interchange: http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2016/07/11/exclusive-walnut-hills-church-to-sell-3-acres-near.html Here's the listing: http://www.preferredgrouprealtors.com/Commercial/1116-Lincoln-Avenue-Cincinnati---Walnut-Hills-OH-45206/CNC/1487958/ According to the Auditor's website, here are the 41 properties in the name of "James Temple Church: 1000 FORAKER AVE 1138 FORAKER AVE 1136 FORAKER AVE 1126 FORAKER AVE 1122 FORAKER AVE 1118 FORAKER AVE 2905 ALMS PL 1134 CHAPEL ST 1112 CHAPEL ST 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1121 LINCOLN AVE 1225 LINCOLN AVE 1129 LINCOLN AVE 1131 LINCOLN AVE 2919 ALMS PL 3010 PARK AVE 1108 LINCOLN AVE 1110 LINCOLN AVE 1116 LINCOLN AVE 3022 PARK AVE 1209 WHITLOW ST 1130 CHAPEL ST 1119 LINCOLN AVE 2923 ALMS PL 2913 ALMS PL 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1119 LINCOLN AVE 1000 LINCOLN AVE 3008 MONFORT ST 3012 MONFORT ST 1008 LINCOLN AVE 1010 LINCOLN AVE 1014 LINCOLN AVE 1020 LINCOLN AVE 1001 FORAKER AVE 1005 FORAKER AVE 1017 FORAKER AVE 1021 FORAKER AVE 1023 FORAKER AVE 1035 FORAKER AVE 1114 LINCOLN AVE Is that enough space to build an arc?
July 12, 20168 yr How can non profit organization have 40 properties worth $5.5 million and sale to the state for i'm sure a profit???? I hope they are paying property taxes on all those lots.
July 12, 20168 yr How can non profit organization have 40 properties worth $5.5 million and sale to the state for i'm sure a profit???? I hope they are paying property taxes on all those lots. Old ladies will their estates to churches all the time. Jesus is big business.
July 12, 20168 yr ^ There was just a really good episode of the Slate Money podcast on that very topic.
August 1, 20168 yr Not sure this is the right thread, so feel free to move this, moderators. ODOT apparently held a meeting where they discussed the idea of closing the exit to Ridge Rd northbound (Exit 8C), which would force anybody travelling to Ridge Rd to use Exit 8A). Columbia Township Administrator Mike Lemon is not happy about this, saying that it will make it harder to access businesses around Ridge/Highland. I'm not super sympathetic because Exit 8A will still provide very direct access. Northbound traffic will just have to stop at 1 light. Getting rid of Exit 8C will - I think - allow northbound Ridge Rd to have 2 lanes where it <a href="https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1655929,-84.4231235,3a,75y,18.02h,78.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHuMVeUzWBMXP6M3bgoxPhg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656">crosses beneath the railroad tracks</a>, so that will allow for pretty steady northbound traffic from Exit 8A. Getting rid of Exit 8C will also allow ODOT to connect the sidewalk which currently ends just before the I-71 bridge. It makes me sad when I see pedestrians try to make their way across bridge, and have to run to cross the traffic coming in off of Exit 8C. So sad how ODOT was completely indifferent to pedestrians when this interchange was built. Lemon does make a good point, though, about how Duck Creek should connect to Ridge northbound. That would make it easier for folks to get around that area. http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/local/hamiltoncounty/2016/07/29/exit-columbia-twp-business-district-close/87700132/
August 1, 20168 yr I went back and looked at the PDF that jjakucyk[/member] posted a while back: ftp://ftp.dot.state.oh.us/pub/Districts/D08/HAM-71-8.42%20PID%2091826/71%20AER/HAM-71-6.86%20Final%20AER%20%209-19-14%3B%20PID%2094741.pdf It appears that ODOT is investigating two alternatives. Alternative 1 (page 38 in PDF) would eliminate Exit 8C entirely. Alternative 2 (page 40 in PDF) would re-configure Exit 8C to exit at Kennedy Ave. Based on the Enquirer article, it seems like ODOT only presented Alternative 2. Can anybody confirm? I like the idea of Alternative 2 plus restoring the Duck Creek access to northbound Ridge. Alternative 1: Alternative 2:
August 1, 20168 yr Alternative 2 is what is under development to final design. Cool. Thanks for the clarification.
August 1, 20168 yr Good to hear. Now that the city has built the Kennedy Connector, it makes sense to shift as much of the highway traffic there as possible. Unfortunately, with the poor planning of that area, they need to figure out a way to deal with a large volume of cars on those streets.
August 1, 20168 yr ^ I just searched and found a few similar numbers. Can't find the source where I originally found the higher figure so I removed it from my above post to prevent confusion.
August 11, 20168 yr The Uptown Consortium now owns or controls almost all of the land bounded by Reading, Whittier, 71, and MLK. That area is roughly 20 acres. http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2016/08/10/exclusive-uptown-consortium-buys-church-properties.html
September 20, 20168 yr Has ODOT published new estimates for when various portions of this project are expected to be finished? Their website still says that most will be finished by Fall 2016, but it appears like there is still a lot of work left (though I could be over-estimating). Three of the four new MLK ramps are supposed to be done by Fall 2016. Only the southbound onramp is estimated to take until Summer 2017 to finish. https://www.dot.state.oh.us/districts/D08/Pages/I-71-MLK-Interchange-Project-Info.aspx
September 20, 20168 yr It's obviously getting pretty close. There are now traffic signals in place for the NB entrance ramp. The SB entrance ramp is obviously well behind the rest of the project.
September 20, 20168 yr Wait, how do you get Southbound on I-71 from MLK? **Edit I see now it is Ramp D
September 20, 20168 yr Wait, how do you get Southbound on I-71 from MLK? **Edit I see now it is Ramp D Yeah it hasn't really taken shape yet because they are still modifying the south side of the old MLK overpass.
September 20, 20168 yr Interesting. I had mis-read the diagram. It looks like all four ramps to MLK are scheduled to open by the end of 2016. Ramp E is the only one that won't open until 2017, and that is the super long ramp from SB71 to Taft. That makes me wonder: will all traffic to Uptown from SB71 have to get off at MLK for the ~6 months until Ramp E is finished? If so, it will be a fascinating little experiment because Taft will so little traffic.
September 20, 20168 yr Interesting. I had mis-read the diagram. It looks like all four ramps to MLK are scheduled to open by the end of 2016. Ramp E is the only one that won't open until 2017, and that is the super long ramp from SB71 to Taft. That makes me wonder: will all traffic to Uptown from SB71 have to get off at MLK for the ~6 months until Ramp E is finished? If so, it will be a fascinating little experiment because Taft will so little traffic. And incidentally Taft is probably the #1 street in the city in real need of a bike lane. The hill from Reading to Eden Ave. is fairly steep and traffic roars up it. They can't do one until a traffic lane is eliminated.
September 20, 20168 yr Interesting. I had mis-read the diagram. It looks like all four ramps to MLK are scheduled to open by the end of 2016. Ramp E is the only one that won't open until 2017, and that is the super long ramp from SB71 to Taft. That makes me wonder: will all traffic to Uptown from SB71 have to get off at MLK for the ~6 months until Ramp E is finished? If so, it will be a fascinating little experiment because Taft will so little traffic. And incidentally Taft is probably the #1 street in the city in real need of a bike lane. The hill from Reading to Eden Ave. is fairly steep and traffic roars up it. They can't do one until a traffic lane is eliminated. Good point. Taft and McMillan will both will have A LOT less traffic after MLK opens. It'd be great to see those converted to 2-way, but short of that, adding bike lanes and 24/7 on-street parking would do a lot to to make that area easier to get around on bike and foot (the parked cars provide an important buffer to make the sidewalks feel safer).
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