Hey all, according to the ParkWorks website, http://www.parkworks.org/dgreen.html, the reconstruction of Perk Park at 12th and Chester was supposed to begin in December of 2004.  I was there in March, 2005 and this is what it looked like:

 

 

 

Does anyone have any news on the project?

so, according to the Downtown Cleveland Partnership (http://www.downtownclevelandpartnership.com/development.html), this project is "on hold."  What gives???

 

No updates on the ParkWorks site...

 

I see this as the potential "Bryant Park" of Downtown Cleveland...let's get moving!

I heard that the City & ParkWorks will make a big push to get this done in 2007.  The budget is $ 3 million of which most is already raised.  They hired a landscape architect from out of town.

my understanding is that this is a cash problem.  but, heard that limited $$ had been raised to do some remedial work (not full plan) in near term.  not sure what this means.  but, this area could certainly use a renovated park. 

 

either way, websites should be updated to show status.

Bump... In case anyone wants to restart the discussion that was going on in the avenue district thread

Thanks McCleveland. In all seriousness, I'm not digging the retail kiosk. It will be closed and boarded up within a year after it opens. I love the rest of the park though.

I really can't remember what that thing is... but i tend to agree with you.  It'll end up like the thing on star plaza. 

Can someone repost the article that got deleted? It said it was a "retail kiosk."

I would love to know what's going on with the status of these renovations. I'm digging the proposed photos. Would be amazing to have a park like that in that area, let alone downtown Cleveland.

Perk Park/Chester Commons

 

Perk Park, formerly Chester Commons, has perhaps the greatest potential to truly revitalize a critical corner of downtown Cleveland. Located at East 12th and Chester Avenue, the park sits in the middle of downtown’s highest concentration of residents.

 

Perk Park is currently in a blighted, virtually abandoned state and tops the list of ParkWorks’ most critical green spaces in need of renovation. The revitalized park will serve as an anchor supporting this pivotal corner in downtown. With millions of dollars in development in the surrounding blocks this is the most significant project that ParkWorks can undertake in support of downtown's development as an economic and residential neighborhood.

 

A rebuilt and revitalized Perk Park will serve as an anchor for this corner of downtown, with a sloping great lawn, a variety of benches and seating options, a retail kiosk and a water feature that can be turned off and doubles as a small stage.

 

In an article published October 28, 2003, Plain Dealer architecture critic Steve Litt was effusive in his praise for the proposed park design and saluted ParkWorks for leading the effort.

 

"Now - finally! - foundations and nonprofit organizations have realized that big buildings aren’t enough; the city needs beautiful parks and greenspaces if it hopes to compete with its own suburbs for jobs and residents…The best is yet to come. ParkWorks a nonprofit organization devoted to the betterment of public spaces in the city, has completed an excellent design for the renovation of Perk Plaza…The plan for the park is simple, logical and filled with potential to make one corner of downtown more desirable as a place to live and work."

 

http://www.parkworks.org/perkpark.html

 

 

I would love to know what's going on with the status of these renovations. I'm digging the proposed photos. Would be amazing to have a park like that in that area, let alone downtown Cleveland.

like i said in the other thread.  it was a funding issue... and from what i have heard they are VERY close to having this a go.

Man, I hope so. It would be fantastic!

Personally I think lost in the talk of some really exciting projects (FEB / Avenue / 668 / Ameritrust / Etc) is the East 12th street scape and Perk Park project.  These two together have the potential to completely transform this entire area... and I really think that it is integral to the success of the avenue district.  I don't think I would be nearly as upbeat about avenue if this wasn't taking place.

I think public spaces are hugely integral to a "neighborhood" project like this. The Avenue, when fully realized, wants to become a neighborhood type of area. You can't have a neighborhood without great, public meeting/hang out spaces.

 

I agree. I'm very excited about this project, too. I just didn't know about it until now. :)

a water feature that can be turned off and doubles as a small stage.

 

Hmmm....that gives me a great idea for a juvenile prank.

 

Anyway, I'm another one excited by this project.  And I'll be real excited when I see some construction underway.

As far as the retail space goes, it's a good idea for a coffee shop, ice cream shop, etc.  Although this may not be a fair comparison, one of the things that makes the Mall feel dead is that lacks any commercial activity (unless you count panhandlers or hot dog vendors).  The mall is beautiful but absent of life.  I don't want Perk Park to end up the same way.  The recently closed Atlanta Bread was the only commercial space on the park and it really added life to its' corner of the park.  I think they hit the nail on the head in terms of identifying the aspects of the park that make it suck such as the low elevation, and concrete bunkers.  Some "do not feed the pigeons, $50 fine" signs like Public Square has might help too.

 

Question: is the city going to do the E 12th Street streetscape project on the west side of 12th by the Diamond Building and this park?  It looks vastly improved across the street at Reserve Square.  Still too much concrete and not enough trees, but much better.

nice to hear they are close to funding it. i would love this redo of chester commons.

 

yeah they can leave off the kiosk for now, but still leave room for a kiosk to be added later on.

 

again later on after the redo it would also be nice to have some kind of open to the street cafe face the park.

I was lucky to be involved in the planning of this park and have to say that when it finally comes to fruition it will be a great win for the city.

Good news ragarcia!!!!

<a href=http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2009/04/clevelands_longstalled_improve.html>Cleveland's long-stalled improvements at Perk Plaza back on the agenda at City Council</a>

by Henry J. Gomez/Plain Dealer Reporter

Wednesday April 22, 2009, 9:13 AM

 

Cleveland officials are moving ahead with a long-stalled proposal to improve Ralph J. Perk Plaza, the downtown park where two young men were shot, one fatally, in February.

 

City Council on Monday night gave a first reading to an ordinance that allows the Department of Public Parks, Properties and Recreation to shop for contractors to begin work at the site, near East 12th Street and Chester Avenue. Plans call for a greener plaza with better sightlines.

 

"The goal is to break ground in May or June or as soon as we can," said Councilman Joe Cimperman, who represents the area. "We're going to have Phase One done by the time the leaves turn."...

awesome.

 

in my opinion.. the design is "meh" as of right now. i'd need to see more views. regardless, the space is in much need of renovation.

 

i would have loved to see a re-use of the materials that are already in the park, or find out about what they are going to do with said materials.

 

some sort of green initiative with this project could really set it off.. wether thats completely off the grid lighting, or something inexpensive and simple like the addition of a large public bike rack (downtown is quite lacking these).

 

i am also looking for some sort of public installation art from this project.

 

whatever happens, it seems like it will end up a better site than it was before. if only they find the funding/designer who could really make some noise.

 

i await to hear more!

Well, according to the article, it sounds like they're scaling back their plans a bit? That doesn't mean it will automatically be terrible, but it probably won't be lavish.

For how many years from now do you think Plain Dealer articles about the park will mention the shooting there at least once (and in this article twice)?

For how many years from now do you think Plain Dealer articles about the park will mention the shooting there at least once (and in this article twice)?

 

Never underestimate the negativity of the Plain Dealer.  So to answer your question, who knows?

While I don't always agree with Cimperman (ahem med mart), he told me he was going to get this thing fast-tracked after the shootings.  He keeps his word pretty well most of the time with the tech center and now with this, so props to him for that.

While I don't always agree with Cimperman (ahem med mart), he told me he was going to get this thing fast-tracked after the shootings.

 

Cough...  "Election year!" Cough, Cough....

I think it's understandable they mention the shootings.  I don't think it's "negativity," as they're not expressing an opinion, just simply stating the main reason this thing has been put in fast forward.  Plus, I don't think many people would know what the Perk Park is.  I had no clue until the execution style shootings by those individuals who deserve public torture.

I don't understand how we can't afford to build a pile of dirt.  How could the new plan be "scaled down" from that?

I think it's understandable they mention the shootings. I don't think it's "negativity," as they're not expressing an opinion, just simply stating the main reason this thing has been put in fast forward. Plus, I don't think many people would know what the Perk Park is. I had no clue until the execution style shootings by those individuals who deserve public torture.

 

I don't have a problem with them mentioning it in the article (although once probably would have done the trick), I am just speculating on whether this will be permanently attached to every mention of the park for years going forward.

I see.  I would say it will be in there for another 3-5 years.

While I don't always agree with Cimperman (ahem med mart), he told me he was going to get this thing fast-tracked after the shootings.

 

Cough... "Election year!" Cough, Cough....

 

I hear he is unopposed at this point.

I don't understand how we can't afford to build a pile of dirt. How could the new plan be "scaled down" from that?

 

Maybe you would understand if you took the time to educate yourself about the plan.

???  I'm looking at a picture of it.  It looks like the cheapest park imaginable.  You can't get more simplistic than a grassy knoll surrounded by sidewalk.  I'd call it a treelawn, except there aren't enough trees.  There are a few small structures of indeterminate nature.  Get rid of those, and we don't have to buy much besides fill dirt and grass seed.

 

What would I do instead, you ask?  Something more like a garden or a grove.  And if sight lines are a problem, I'd tell the CPD to get out of their cars and defend any citizens who wish to enjoy their new garden.  I do not want any more blank prairie installed within city limits.  The idea that we need empty barren parks because there's no other way to be safe is borderline psychotic.  Build properly landscaped parks and defend them with pride.

???  I'm looking at a picture of it.  It looks like the cheapest park imaginable.  You can't get more simplistic than a grassy knoll surrounded by sidewalk.  I'd call it a treelawn, except there aren't enough trees.  There are a few small structures of indeterminate nature.  Get rid of those, and we don't have to buy much besides fill dirt and grass seed.

 

What would I do instead, you ask?  Something more like a garden or a grove.  And if sight lines are a problem, I'd tell the CPD to get out of their cars and defend any citizens who wish to enjoy their new garden.  I do not want any more blank prairie installed within city limits.  The idea that we need empty barren parks because there's no other way to be safe is borderline psychotic.  Build properly landscaped parks and defend them with pride.

 

The cops are too busy gunning speeders at Superior and W. 9th.  (Seriously not kidding - I was so pissed last Thursday night when I saw that)

I don't understand how we can't afford to build a pile of dirt. How could the new plan be "scaled down" from that?

 

Get rid of the pile.  Welcome to our new Downtown dirt patch!

I don't understand how we can't afford to build a pile of dirt.  How could the new plan be "scaled down" from that?

 

why this project is more expensive than it looks:

there is a lot of material to remove

expensive location to build on (any downtown location is going to be trickier than some empty lot.. its not like you can just drive dump trucks up and drop dirt, there has to be a system in place)

 

on a whole no its not an expensive project, its just a park, however anything that costs money is expensive these days.

 

 

I know it's kinda cliche, but why don't they do small donations for pavers or something like that?

When I wrote about this project a few months ago, Cimperman said the price tag is so high because there are pipes underground that need to come up. Tearing up concrete and pipes isn't cheap, he said. And they have been soliciting donations. Doug Price kicked in some cash.

 

As for mentioning the shootings, I'm not trying to be negative at all. But the incident illustrated a key concern about the park (poor sight lines), a concern that the renovation set out to address several years ago. I wrote two months ago, after the shooting, that the plans had been stalled because of financial issues but that the ball was rolling again.

 

 

 

 

^I'd guess most people here (me, certainly) thought mentioning the shootings in the article was entirely appropriate for the reasons you mention, so I wouldn't sweat it.

^I'd guess most people here (me, certainly) thought mentioning the shootings in the article was entirely appropriate for the reasons you mention, so I wouldn't sweat it.

 

I agree. I didn't feel it was sensationally added, and it was relevant to the overall article.

Like I already said, I think a lot of people would not know what Perk Park was if you didn't connect it with the tragic shootings. 

And like I said, I didn't think it was inappropriate.  I just foresee it becoming a permanent association (I hope I'm wrong) years down the road.

My problem with this is that they show all these people laying in the park. *sigh* please don't try to get our hopes up! That's doubtful.. If they want to show a real park scene, then the drawing should show 5-10 people smoking outside of the office building on the edge of the park and 2 fat people eating lunch on a bench at high noon. I walk by this park daily and a 3 million dollar improvement removing cement and adding grass won't magically make it an attraction.

 

The real aesthetics that are missing (which I hope will be implemented): preservation of any mature trees and the planting of new ones, squirrels, dog walkers, street vendors, thick brush/heavy landscaping on the entry path, a cafe, wi-fi access, and public artwork/murals. The residents and office workers are there and this is the case of "if you build it RIGHT they will come!" Just please, please, please, don't plant a patch of grass and expect people to lay in it. My fear, which is probably not a fear, but a reality, is that the scaled down version removes all enhancements to the park EXCEPT the patch of grass. If I want a patch of grass, I'll go to the suburbs or Mall A, B, and C.

^Don't forget it will still include 327's pile of dirt.  Ha.

My problem with this is that they show all these people laying in the park. *sigh* please don't try to get our hopes up! That's doubtful.. If they want to show a real park scene, then the drawing should show 5-10 people smoking outside of the office building on the edge of the park and 2 fat people eating lunch on a bench at high noon. I walk by this park daily and a 3 million dollar improvement removing cement and adding grass won't magically make it an attraction.

The real aesthetics that are missing (which I hope will be implemented): preservation of any mature trees and the planting of new ones, squirrels, dog walkers, street vendors, thick brush/heavy landscaping on the entry path, a cafe, wi-fi access, and public artwork/murals. The residents and office workers are there and this is the case of "if you build it RIGHT they will come!" Just please, please, please, don't plant a patch of grass and expect people to lay in it.

 

Whyis it so hard to believe or think that this could turn out to be a great park??

 

What is there now, should not be used to so quickly determine the future parks sucess.

 

PP could be turn out to be a very nice oasis, like this:

 

 

We'd have to tear down about 3 buildings to be able to put a park that big there.

We'd have to tear down about 3 buildings to be able to put a park that big there.

 

jam, i'm not talking about size, but look and feel, minus the mature trees.

I too am a little shocked at how down on this space people are.  I love urban parks.  They are one of the first things I want to check out in any city I am visiting. And they are HUGE ammenities for downtown residents.  Perk Park is one of the worst parks I have ever come across.  It is a concrete bowl.  With Huge trees.  That's it.  It feels cold.  It's forboding.  It's incredibly dark.  As a downtown dog owner... I would never take my dog here.  He can take a leak on a sidewalk without descending in a concrete pit to do it.

 

I really like the design of this space.  Yes it has a large greenspace.  Ummm... it's a park.  When I take my dog out as a downtown resident... I WANT to find some grass to play with him in.  Should we ever develop to the point of children living downtown people are going to WANT to have an area of greenspace.  The mound gives it some variety and ungulation that doesn't exist at other spots in our city.  I see a variety of trees, I see thick shrubbery lining the exterior as well as what appears to be tables and congretating areas for people to sit down relax or eat.  And judging from that first rendering I think the back mounded area with a significant amount of trees looks like a really, really cool space to me.  I see a lot of different types of vegitation.  It's on different levels.  It appears to be well lit.  I mean, I'm not exactly sure what's not to like? This to me looks like it will be the best park in downtown.  Actually the only real public park in downtown.  I would kill to live next to this place.  This along with the E. 12th streetscape is going to give a totally different feel to the area.  Narrowing this street is the best thing they could possibly do to make this park feel like an asset to the residents.  Currently it feels like you have to walk across an 8 lane highway to get to it.  And there's not much to get to once you're there.  I think calling this space a dirt patch or mound is doing it a tremendous disservice.

 

From what I hear the main "scaling down" has to do with some sort of water / fountain system, that you can kind of see in the first rendering... and some ornamental metal work throughout which they are hoping to add at a later date (Though I don't know it will be possible to add any sort of fountain element later on).

 

But since so many people seem to be belittling this space... I'm sincerely curious:  What urban parks about this size in the country have you been to, and what would you rather see in a park at this space.  What do you really think it is missing?

 

 

But since so many people seem to be belittling this space... I'm sincerely curious: What urban parks about this size in the country have you been to, and what would you rather see in a park at this space. What do you really think it is missing?

 

I think you are missing the point.  People are dubious about the finished project resembling what was originally intended.  Call it Cleveland negativity or what you will, I would say it stems from the fact the project is being "scaled down (which never sounds like a good thing)."

 

BizBiz said what s/he wanted to see.

Pali, That's why I tried to explain what I heard the scaled down elements are.  From what I gather, what we see to our naked eye in those renderings is what we're getting, we're basically losing some of the "ooohs and aaahhhhsss" stuff we aren't really aware of in the picture.  Though I'm not sure about that kiosk type thing whatever it was.  Wi-Fi would be enormous.  I don't know if they plan on saving any mature trees... for some reason i doubt it.  But that doesn't seem to be a scaled down issue.  To me it seemed most of what biz biz wants are things that come about because of a good park (i.e. dog walkers, street vendors, squirrels).

 

I guess my question is more physically speaking, since everyone keeps describing this as a pile of dirt, or dirt patch...