July 18, 201212 yr Two shot, one possibly dead in OTR OVER-THE-RHINE — Cincinnati Police homicide detectives are investigating a noon-hour shooting in the 1600 block of Walnut Street that has left two men in critical condition at University Hospital. The men, who know each other, were rushed to University Hospital following the shooting, which took place in an apartment. The first 911 call came in at 12:28 p.m., police said, and reported a man bleeding from an apparent gunshot wound on the steps of a nearby church, later identified as Christ Image Church. Calls to the church were not returned. The other victim was found inside the apartment at 1626 Walnut St., according to police. Homicide detectives remain on the scene. The area around the scene is shutdown. Shortly after 4 p.m., an unsourced broadcast report said that one of the shooting victims had died at the hospital. Confirmation was unavailable. The Enquirer will update this story.
July 18, 201212 yr Also: Police: Anderson teens tried to kidnap 8-year-old The incident unfolded around 4:45 p.m. Monday at Ayer Elementary on Forest Road as the boy played Wiffle ball with older friends on the school playground. The two 16-year-olds, who attend Anderson High School, walked by and returned about 10 minutes later in a four-door sedan. One suspect got out of the car and walked up to the children. He allegedly offered them candy, and then later grabbed the 8-year-old by the waist. He picked him up and started carrying him toward the waiting car, Barnett said. Friends of the victim, including a freshman at Anderson High School, ran after the suspect and forced him to drop the 8-year-old. The teen then ran toward the car and, along with his alleged accomplice, sped off, police said. The children went home and told their parents what happened. Their parents grew alarmed and called the sheriff’s office. A witness told authorities he thought one of the teens attended Anderson High, so the suspects were easily identified through school yearbook photos and arrested Monday night, Barnett said.
July 19, 201212 yr This is the rap sheet of a 30 year old Theodore Palmer, likely to be the same gentlemen who was killed today. PALMER THEODORE /00/CRA/47808 B 0008757 PALMER THEODORE /00/TRD/53998 75/3300964 PALMER THEODORE /01/CRA/20635 B 0104364 PALMER THEODORE /01/CRA/20635 B 0104563 PALMER THEODORE /01/CRB/33536 PALMER THEODORE /02/CRA/7775 B 0202197 PALMER THEODORE /03/CRA/14189 B 0304065 PALMER THEODORE /03/CRA/9231 B 0302851 PALMER THEODORE /04/CRA/15272 B 0404580 PALMER THEODORE /04/CRB/15146 PALMER THEODORE /05/CRA/10394 B 0503056 PALMER THEODORE /05/CRA/31311 B 0508219 PALMER THEODORE /05/CRA/31311 B 0508438 PALMER THEODORE /05/CRB/22104 PALMER THEODORE /05/CRB/23904 PALMER THEODORE /05/TRD/16319 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /05/TRD/30790 75/3475002 PALMER THEODORE /05/TRD/33928 75/3509966 PALMER THEODORE /06/TRD/5802 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /08/CRA/40409 B 0810025 PALMER THEODORE /08/CRB/22294 PALMER THEODORE /08/CRB/28563 PALMER THEODORE /09/TRD/25370 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /10/CRA/11139 B 1002502 PALMER THEODORE /10/TRD/18925 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /10/TRD/21540 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /10/TRD/32541 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /11/TRD/52642 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE /12/CRB/19672 PALMER THEODORE 08CV05614 PALMER THEODORE 08CV05614 PALMER THEODORE 08CV05614 PALMER THEODORE 08CV05614 PALMER THEODORE C/03/CRB/12380 B 0303128 PALMER THEODORE C/07/CRA/34857 B 0707875 PALMER THEODORE C/09/CRB/23391 B 0904805 Charges include: Aggravated Trespassing Driving under suspended license receiving stolen property carrying a concealed weapon aggravated robbery having weapons while under disability possession of cocaine The list goes on. It kind of blows my mind, if Ohio had a 3 strikes law for violent crime this guy would have been put in jail for life in 2005 (by mid 2005 he had been convicted of three violent crimes, aggravated assault, aggravated burglary, domestic violence). Instead, he committed 22 more crimes after that time in which he was charged (surely countless others he was not charged for) and ultimately was killed. The FBI has estimated that each murder costs a community $3 million in police, hospital, and other resources used throughout an entire investigation, attempts to revive the individual, coroners work, etc. Then think of what the cost has been of this gentlemen's actions against the already clogged court system? Against public safety? Had be been put away in 2005 he may have still been alive today. I know that a 3 strikes law isn't without its major flaws, but when you look at this guys 37 court cases on his rap sheet, some including multiple charges per case, it's pretty clear that he wasn't going to "get better" any time soon and only would have continued to drain the system. sad.
July 19, 201212 yr ^If your argument is to tighten the justice system for predicates, you would have to tighten the system for first-timers. The system is already engineered to discriminate against the poor and/or minorities. How about addressing entrenched poverty so society has less offenders? Prison is a problem, not a solution.
July 19, 201212 yr ^^ Good thing is that one "Theodore Palmer" is no longer an offender nor a problem.
July 19, 201212 yr ^^ Good thing is that one "Theodore Palmer" is no longer an offender nor a problem. We've sunk so low that we're glad people are dead? Are you from a low-income, highly violent community? Are you aware what it's like to have a significant chunk of your family living in cyclical poverty in the inner city? Poverty and social apartheid manufacture violence in Cincinnati. Many individuals are influenced and quasi-forced into undesirable lifestyles because of these things. His family failed him as well as the justice system that makes you a slave to crime once you acquire that first felony. That's why you see guys with long rap sheets. What are they legally allowed to engage in other than illicit activity after their initial felony conviction? Let's not blame Theodore Palmer for the city's ills, because that's what you do when you celebrate his murder. That's what the United States did when the public heard word of Bin Laden's death. It could and has been argued that the U.S. criminal justice system creates as many homicides as would naturally occur in a vacuum by crushing the ability for convicted felons to re-integrate into free society.
July 19, 201212 yr I think you are overreacting. I wouldn't say glad either, but it's good to know he will no longer be a chronic offender. This has nothing to do with him being low income or from a "violent" community - this has to do with him making bad personal choices - choices that he made. He had no one to blame other than himself, and this was the end result.
July 19, 201212 yr I think you are overreacting. I wouldn't say glad either, but it's good to know he will no longer be a chronic offender. This has nothing to do with him being low income or from a "violent" community - this has to do with him making bad personal choices - choices that he made. He had no one to blame other than himself, and this was the end result. I've made some adjustments to my post since you made yours, so I'd request you to reread my words. Theodore made bad decisions, that's why he's dead and that's why he went to prison. One could argue that he had no choice but to live a life of crime after his initial felony conviction. A life of crime leads to an early grave, unless you work for the government or a major corporation. A convicted felon is going to have a hard time finding employment at McDonalds.
July 19, 201212 yr ^If your argument is to tighten the justice system for predicates, you would have to tighten the system for first-timers. The system is already engineered to discriminate against the poor and/or minorities. How about addressing entrenched poverty so society has less offenders? Prison is a problem, not a solution. ok so explain white collar crime
July 19, 201212 yr This is the rap sheet of a 30 year old Theodore Palmer, likely to be the same gentlemen who was killed today. ... His middle name is "Eugene," so you didn't capture all of his charges. Append these to your list: PALMER THEODORE E /02/CRB/7776 B 0202731 PALMER THEODORE E /02/CRB/8946 PALMER THEODORE E /03/CRB/17942 PALMER THEODORE E /03/CRB/36729 PALMER THEODORE E /05/TRD/17961 75/3489236 PALMER THEODORE E /10/TRD/21821 75/3699392 PALMER THEODORE E /10/TRD/26359 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE E /10/TRD/26402 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE E /10/TRD/32611 SEE TICKETS PALMER THEODORE E C/08/TRD/17279 00/978378 PALMER THEODORE E 75/3317260 PALMER THEODORE E 00/754053 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /04/CRA/15272 B 0404349 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /05/CRA/31311 B 0508219 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /05/CRA/31311 B 0508438 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /05/CRB/22104 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /05/CRB/23904 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /08/CRA/40409 B 0810025 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /08/CRB/22294 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /08/CRB/28563 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /09/TRD/44841 75/3701549 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /10/CRA/11139 B 1002502 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE /10/CRB/13048 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/01/CRB/5288 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/05/TRD/17613 34/20071 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/07/CRA/34857 B 0707875 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/07/TRD/68134 34/32049 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/08/TRD/29668 44/63110 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/09/CRB/23391 B 0904805 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/09/CRB/23391 B 0904805 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/09/CRB/23392 B 0904805 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/09/CRB/23392 B 0904805 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE C/10/TRD/25680 34/45664 PALMER THEODORE EUGENE 34/13011 I too check Cincymugshots.com and the Clerk of Court whenever there is a crime in the news in OTR, and this many charges is typical of those involved. It's an exception when the victim is innocent. A block from where this crime occurred is a halfway house full of ex cons who are on the right track and making the right decisions. It's a shame this guy didn't make the same good choices as the men who live a block away.
July 19, 201212 yr Let's not blame Theodore Palmer for the city's ills With such a long rap sheet, I think we can safely blame him for at least some of the city's ills.
July 19, 201212 yr I'll agree that we need some major changes to first time & juvenile offender sentences & treatments. All first time offenders should have to meet with a therapist and/or engage in other sociable programs. The main point should be rehab, not punishment. But when we have 14 year olds shooting pregnant women (happened in OTR last year) you think that person can be turned around to a productive member of society? Their community is only hurting them- especially when his mom said, he's a good kid. The hell he is! there has to be a point where we say, sorry, your family, your community & the system failed you, but you're too dangerous and a drain on resources, you need to be removed. Its part situation & part personal choices. There are reasons juvenile records are sealed, so that someone still has a chance, but it also is about choice. One of my best friends grew up poor in Avondale, saw violence all the time but hated it. He got in fights as a kid, but moved out, ended up going to Cincy state, then UC and by the time he was around 27 he had a degree, and is starting a career. Sadly, I don't have any other friends I know of who grew up in Avondale, so his situation is probably uncommon, but is it my job as a taxpayer to save every kid in Avondale? Especially when the community gets pissed at white adoption or white churches coming into the neighborhood and providing services (CityLink took huge hits from developers, white residents & black churches).
July 19, 201212 yr "Eddie" is back panhandling to fuel his heroin addiction. Apparently, his wealthy parents from Hyde Park both died, he's squandered his inheritance, and his girlfriend has finally given up on him due to his addiction. The worst bit about this guy is his con/story he is using to get money from people. He says he is a UC student who was abandoned by his friends downtown. He's asking for cab fare ($5-$10) to get back to campus. He further goes on to say he needs to take a cab since Cincinnati is a very scary/dangerous place. If you see him harassing people (or yourself) CALL THE POLICE @ 765-1212. We really need to get this guy off the street and the first step is to make sure he hits rock bottom in jail before he hits rock bottom in a body bag in an alley. Description: White male, 6'2", approximately 35 years old, brown hair and usually decently dressed. "Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago." - Warren Buffett
July 19, 201212 yr Dammit... he had a similar story, except that his friend and her date broke up at dinner and left him stranded in downtown. Asked for cab fare back to Hyde Park (I gave him $2).
July 19, 201212 yr ^ Pretty sure this guy hit me up for cash about a month or 2 ago outside of the clifton skyline. Said he locked his keys in the car and was waiting on someone who would "only accept cash" to open the car. Gave me a story about working at one of the hospitals and offered to show me his ID badge. I felt kind of bad but I told him there is an atm in the skyline and I kept walking. He had a cold look in his eyes that raised a red flag. Description definitely matches.
July 19, 201212 yr I'll agree that we need some major changes to first time & juvenile offender sentences & treatments. All first time offenders should have to meet with a therapist and/or engage in other sociable programs. The main point should be rehab, not punishment. But when we have 14 year olds shooting pregnant women (happened in OTR last year) you think that person can be turned around to a productive member of society? Their community is only hurting them- especially when his mom said, he's a good kid. The hell he is! there has to be a point where we say, sorry, your family, your community & the system failed you, but you're too dangerous and a drain on resources, you need to be removed. Its part situation & part personal choices. There are reasons juvenile records are sealed, so that someone still has a chance, but it also is about choice. One of my best friends grew up poor in Avondale, saw violence all the time but hated it. He got in fights as a kid, but moved out, ended up going to Cincy state, then UC and by the time he was around 27 he had a degree, and is starting a career. Sadly, I don't have any other friends I know of who grew up in Avondale, so his situation is probably uncommon, but is it my job as a taxpayer to save every kid in Avondale? Especially when the community gets pissed at white adoption or white churches coming into the neighborhood and providing services (CityLink took huge hits from developers, white residents & black churches). The kid is 14. Do you remember being 14? I'm not willing to send hardly anyone away for life for a crime at age 14, not even the one we're discussing. There's so many variables to his situation specifically anyway. One thing that taxpayers can do is stop with the "me" attitude and start looking at the world as one community. Atrocities that occur in India do indeed affect the United States, and so forth. If the center of Cincinnati (Avondale, Walnut Hills, Evanston) is a disaster area worthy of FEMA funds, taxpayers should be outraged that this exists at all, and particularly in their backyard where they can have an impact that they could tangibly witness. Putting pressure on the City and state to change their tax structures, lobbying for more equal redistricting of schools, and fighting for efficient metropolitan fixed transit that serves disenfranchised communities are all ways taxpayers can do their part.
July 19, 201212 yr Let's not blame Theodore Palmer for the city's ills With such a long rap sheet, I think we can safely blame him for at least some of the city's ills. That was poor phrasing, I agree, he was an arch criminal.
July 19, 201212 yr ^If your argument is to tighten the justice system for predicates, you would have to tighten the system for first-timers. The system is already engineered to discriminate against the poor and/or minorities. How about addressing entrenched poverty so society has less offenders? Prison is a problem, not a solution. ok so explain white collar crime You and I both know that money makes the world go round, and if you're in the business of managing other people's money, you have quite a bit of it to cover up your own transgressions. That and the powerful are just that - above reprieve in many instances where the middle and working classes are held to higher standards of accountability from birth.
July 19, 201212 yr Dammit... he had a similar story, except that his friend and her date broke up at dinner and left him stranded in downtown. Asked for cab fare back to Hyde Park (I gave him $2). This is the reason why it is ALWAYS a bad idea to give anyone money if you don't know them (and sometimes even when you do know them *wink*). I know you meant well, but giving this guy money: 1) helped him buy drugs that fuels a destructive habit that he needs to break, 2) increases drug crime in our neighborhood, 3) emboldens a con artist to continue to feed on individuals in the neighborhood (money that could have been used for better things than purchasing illicit drugs). "Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago." - Warren Buffett
July 19, 201212 yr ^ correct. If you want to really help a homeless person you see on the street, donate to/volunteer with Tender Mercies, the Drop, freestore foodbank, or just buy them food. Do not give them money. And city blights, do you know how much poor people get in subsidies?! How is it good to teach responsibility by just giving away thousands of dollars a month just for existing. I was in the Kroger on vine & the girl infrint of me, probably 28 or 30 had 6 kids in tow and bought $160 in mostly junk food . She paid $9 (for the beer) after she swiped her foodstamp card. The government gives tax breaks and subsidies based on the number of children you have. Remember the lady last year who was arrested for child endangerment and admitted she was having children (had 8) to get more government money? I wasnt saying the 14 year old should go to jail, but at 14 I knew not to kill people, and the point I was making is that if you're 14 and are that screwed up its your parents fault. And what's wrong with school districts? You can go the CPS and get a PERFECT education if your parents and the parents of your colleagues do a moderately decent job at making sure you do your homework. If you put these same struggling kids in a mason school they will do just as bad. It's 100% parental involvement and community support. The only thing CPS could change is class size, but still, without parental support you're immediately disadvantaged. The best thing we can do for these kids is take them away from criminal parents. It's sad to say that, but that's one of the only ways to break the cycle.
July 19, 201212 yr What's makes a person look up a victims past criminal history???? At first I always Googled the person, just to see who they were. I quickly found out that almost every single time I Googled, "Cincymugshots" was the first result. I'm just genuinely curious who the people are that get killed in the neighborhood I live in.
July 19, 201212 yr Also, because I want to see if these are random crimes, or probably crimes against someone by their "friend" or an acquaintance. They are almost always against someone with a huge rapsheet, meaning they likely aren't random crimes.
July 20, 201212 yr There was a murder suicide 3 weeks ago in Pendleton and I don't see that guys arrest record thrown in here.
July 20, 201212 yr So? Are you trying to throw out there that people are racist because they may look up their criminal history every-once-in-a-while?
July 20, 201212 yr No, but who knows. I have not seen the criminal record of a victim posted in here before. Why start now? The guy was a victim period. We were not there to know what he done wrong and why he was shot. Not posted on here but the same thing with the other victim that was mindeing her own business also from OTR was shot and killed. I think that teenagers name was Africa. All people were talking about was her criminal history and not about how she was an innocent bystander. I thought the Enquirer snooped that low. Not this forum.
July 20, 201212 yr ^ Why is it "stooping low" to look up someone's past criminal history? I think it gives a pretty good indication as to what type of person was killed. Obviously he had a violent background with a history of drug possession. Why is it so bad for someone to look up that information after someone was killed a couple blocks from where you live? I fail to see why he/she is at fault for looking up the info.
July 20, 201212 yr ^ Agreed. Indeed, Theodore Palmer may have been the "victim" of a bullet, but years before he had become a scourge to society in almost every way possible. At least one poster has portrayed this man in the hackneyed image of the "eternal victim," thus minimizing this criminal's own culpability and relieving him of any responsibility for his own actions. If anything, society was Palmer's victim and Palmer was a victim of himself.
July 20, 201212 yr Well the guy that killed 12 people in Colorado had no criminal history. People will kill or be killed with a criminal history or not. Care to look up the 50+ victims who were shot criminal history???
July 20, 201212 yr ^ The article I read this morning stated that the identity of the shooter hasn't been released. It seems those types of crimes are typically done by people with very little criminal history but with a history of depression or mental illness. This doesn't really surprise me. EDIT: And why would we look up the criminal history of the victims? This was a random act of violence against a group of people. Their criminal history would provide no background to the story. If two people shoot eachother in OTR, or if someone opens fire in a crowded movie theater I can understand looking up past criminal history.
July 20, 201212 yr Well the guy that killed 12 people in Colorado had no criminal history. People will kill or be killed with a criminal history or not. Care to look up the 50+ victims who were shot criminal history??? You're being obtuse and arrogant, IMHO.
July 20, 201212 yr The guy was a victim period. Loss of life is always tragic, but it's important to understand that people living criminal lives are much, much, much more likely to be killed. There is value in making the distinction between an innocent victim and a criminal victim. In this way people can better gauge whether or not a community/neighborhood/city is really safe for them as well as becomes a lesson for others of the consequences of living a predatory life. "Someone is sitting in the shade today because someone planted a tree a long time ago." - Warren Buffett
July 20, 201212 yr Random violent crimes are very rare (which is why they are newsworthy), but most people don't understand probability & statistics AND allow murders/rapes/kidnappings that they hear about on the news to affect them as if they knew those involved personally.
July 20, 201212 yr I think it's actually pretty naive to think that you aren't going to get killed after committing crimes against people that many times.
July 20, 201212 yr Well the guy that killed 12 people in Colorado had no criminal history. People will kill or be killed with a criminal history or not. Care to look up the 50+ victims who were shot criminal history??? You're being obtuse and arrogant, IMHO. Really? I guess it takes one to know one.
July 21, 201212 yr This discussion just goes to show how America really has no leftwing. So many "progressives" displaying open hostility to the underclass. I know, I know, it is hostility to criminals, not the underclass. That's fine, personal accountability is important and should not be undermined. Still, we should not pretend our society isn't responsible for cranking criminals out like a Ford factory, with cold indifference and absurd denial of responsibility and accountability.
July 23, 201212 yr On Saturday I was meeting with a friend to go the Reds game. She parked next to the lot above Ziegler Park on Sycamore around 7pm and there were emergency vehicles and caution tape everywhere on 13th/Sycamore. Does anyone know what happened? Someone told her that there was a shooting there, but I haven't heard anything about it from any media or social media. Anyone in the know?
July 24, 201212 yr On Saturday I was meeting with a friend to go the Reds game. She parked next to the lot above Ziegler Park on Sycamore around 7pm and there were emergency vehicles and caution tape everywhere on 13th/Sycamore. Does anyone know what happened? Someone told her that there was a shooting there, but I haven't heard anything about it from any media or social media. Anyone in the know?
July 27, 201212 yr Apparently there was a shootout at 13th and Walnut last night. http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20120727/NEWS/307270041/Police-investigate-OTR-shootout?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|News Walnut feels like it has been completely forgotten in the redevelopment of OTR. I hope that Mercer Commons has a positive impact on the street and gets positive momentum going that way.
July 27, 201212 yr 13th and Walnut is nothing but trouble right now. A friend of mine has been offered heroin at that corner twice. There's some good stuff happening on Walnut actually but that's not on topic.
July 27, 201212 yr I live on Walnut and everything from the Art Academy up to Urban Sites office near 15th is trouble. At night I walk up to Liberty and over to Main or Vine rather than walking down Walnut or any of the side streets off of it, which are even sketchier. Mercer Commons cannot come quickly enough.
July 27, 201212 yr yeah I agree. The momemtum in OTR is kind of like a donut with this area of Walnut right in the middle. A serious problem as these types of events do reflect poorly on the rest of the neighborhood and the new condos that are a block away from this mess.
July 27, 201212 yr I think it is a testament to how many people are coming to the neighborhood (thus creating an environment not conducive to crime) that there haven't been more muggings and car break-ins in the area. I would expect that certain folks on their way to the drug market on Walnut would be looking to score some quick cash. Coming home late at night, I am always most on my guard when the streets are deserted.
July 27, 201212 yr Ya- you know that If there were many muggings they'd be front page news. There was an article in the enquirer titled "Foutain Square Attack Self Inflicted". If that gets to the front page online just imagine how much they'd push a real robbery of a white person in OTR.
July 27, 201212 yr I have not read any source material but I have heard that those buildings on Walnut that were built in the mid-90s have something like a 30-year agreement where they have to be Section 8. So if this information is correct we still have 10 more years of this nonsense.
July 27, 201212 yr They are apartment housing built and operated by Eagle Realty in the 1990's. If they took LIHTC then yes they are required accept vouchers for at least 30 years. “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
July 27, 201212 yr They are apartment housing built and operated by Eagle Realty in the 1990's. If they took LIHTC then yes they are required accept vouchers for at least 30 years. Checking the LIHTC database shows that a huge chunk of those two blocks of Walnut were renovated 1991-1993 using the tax credits, so it may remain a shady spot into the 2020's...
July 27, 201212 yr ^^I don't think the city needs to get involved directly. Once Mercer Commons gets built I think Walnut will be more desireable for private investment. Also, HUD would probably sue the city if they used eminent domain to take a public housing property and remove the low income residents (if that is your suggestion). The more people out in the streets the less likely stuff like this will happen. One thing that does bother me about 13th and Walnut is that the tenants of those buildings sit outside, smoke weed, and throw trash into the street. I witness both activities almost every time I walk past. If cops would actually enforce things like littering and smoking weed (in public) that block would feel a lot better. Every night that intersection is filled with garbage, and the police :police: don't do a thing about it. I have no issue with them sitting outside, but don't let them throw things in the street or smoke weed there.
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