July 13, 201311 yr So homicides are up 63% this year so far, but only up a little but compared to 2011. Should also be noted virtually every victim (except 2 that I was able to figure out and leaving out a few juveniles) had a moderate to lengthy rap sheet. Additionally, this year is turning out to be extremely tilted African American. Even more than usual. While there were about 4 of the roughy 40 homicides I couldn't determine race on, the rest have been all African American except 1 (Owner of Hartwell Pizza place).
July 13, 201311 yr So homicides are up 63% this year so far, but only up a little but compared to 2011. Should also be noted virtually every victim (except 2 that I was able to figure out and leaving out a few juveniles) had a moderate to lengthy rap sheet. Additionally, this year is turning out to be extremely tilted African American. Even more than usual. While there were about 4 of the roughy 40 homicides I couldn't determine race on, the rest have been all African American except 1 (Owner of Hartwell Pizza place). 40 homicides in a city with 290,000?! That's horrible numbers.
July 13, 201311 yr So homicides are up 63% this year so far, but only up a little but compared to 2011. Should also be noted virtually every victim (except 2 that I was able to figure out and leaving out a few juveniles) had a moderate to lengthy rap sheet. Additionally, this year is turning out to be extremely tilted African American. Even more than usual. While there were about 4 of the roughy 40 homicides I couldn't determine race on, the rest have been all African American except 1 (Owner of Hartwell Pizza place). 40 homicides in a city with 290,000?! That's horrible numbers. The number of residence is meaningless when the metro is over 2.2 million.
July 13, 201311 yr Is it 40 homicides for Hamilton county, Warren, Butler, etc? Or are the 40 just in Cincinnati? If it is just cincinnati, those numbers don't speak well for the city. Several shootings in OTR and one in Washington Park recently... I could say the same for Detroit, a metro area of some 5 million, but the city itself is out of control when I comes to homicides.
July 13, 201311 yr Is it 40 homicides for Hamilton county, Warren, Butler, etc? Or are the 40 just in Cincinnati? If it is just cincinnati, those numbers don't speak well for the city. Several shootings in OTR and one in Washington Park recently... I could say the same for Detroit, a metro area of some 5 million, but the city itself is out of control when I comes to homicides. That's the number for the city proper. If you include the entire MSA, it's probably under 45. For comparison, the YTD for 2011 was 38 (city proper).
July 14, 201311 yr You're underestimating the homicides in Fairfield (had 6 past year alone) Colerain, etc. if bet its closer to 10-12 more outside of city year-to-date and 50 for the whole metro. Also, since the vast majority of homicides in the city are just a couple neighborhoods and are virtually entirely among people with records and with victims who know their killer, it's hardly a statistic to determine how safe you are of how dangerous a city is. Also, Cleveland is around 50 or the year (though obviously larger). There have been almost 230% more rapes in Cleveland than in Cincy year-to-date for 2013 yet the population is only 33% more. What that means is taking one specific crime's one year number and implying a level of crime isn't a good metric. (Not starting a city vs city battle).
July 14, 201311 yr So homicides are up 63% this year so far, but only up a little but compared to 2011. Should also be noted virtually every victim (except 2 that I was able to figure out and leaving out a few juveniles) had a moderate to lengthy rap sheet. Additionally, this year is turning out to be extremely tilted African American. Even more than usual. While there were about 4 of the roughy 40 homicides I couldn't determine race on, the rest have been all African American except 1 (Owner of Hartwell Pizza place). Committing a crime and being convicted of it does not mean you deserve to die. That misconception of urban homicide needs to dissolve. People in suburban communities commit crimes, they just aren't targeted the same way as urban, black youth are by law enforcement nor are they prosecuted as diligently. Many urban offenders wouldn't have an offense on their record if they had proper legal representation. Within every city in the industrialized world there are pockets of violence, and large areas where there isn't. Writing homicide off as black criminals killing other black criminals is ignorance of the plague right in front of us. Black males are born into communities where the homicide rate for people that share the same race and gender are above 60 per 100,000. I calculated homicide rates for black males in a few cities. This is taking into account that 90% of almost any American city's homicides are black people and 90% of those or more are males. Blacks in almost every city are mostly clustered into a few areas, so the concept at large of communities suffering through epidemic is maintained. I also considered that within the crumbling areas of inner cities, there are many more women than men on average, so I used a breakdown of 54% female, 46% male. I used a 10-year average on homicides, but only the most current population figures. I realize that population is a flexible figure, but part of the reason some of these cities have declined in population is because of homicide, so I wouldn't consider using 2012 population estimates as artificial inflation of the statistic. For Chicago and it's unique demographic, I used different metrics. 75% of Chicago homicides are committed against black males instead of the standard 90% in more monochromatic cities like the other four. Keep in mind that this includes infants and the elderly, so for males from ages 11-55, the numbers would be much higher. Detroit: 110 black males murdered per 100,000 black male residents Baltimore: 112 per 100,000 Cleveland: 70 per 100,000 Cincinnati: 92 per 100,000 Chicago: 81 per 100,00 black male residents Are these acceptable environments to raise a family? Is it not likely that a black male may find himself in trouble based on the circumstances he was born into?
July 14, 201311 yr ^ I don't understand the numbers. Cincinnati never had over 90 murders. If Cincinnati had 100,000 black males, that's how many of them would be murdered.
July 14, 201311 yr How so? haven't you heard of diminishing returns? Of course. I explained how I calculated the figures in the big post above. I did the legwork to show that the "criminals vs. criminals" argument correlating to urban homicide is much more complex than that. I would never say that black males that commit crimes shouldn't be prosecuted. I'm saying that the environment that many were raised in is even more violent than most think because the standard for calculating homicide rate does not really analyze demographic data outside of total population. Off the top of my head, here are the round figures for total black male population of all ages in those five cities: Cleveland: 98,000 Baltimore: 180,000 Detroit: 270,000 Chicago: 410,000 Cincinnati: 62,000
July 14, 201311 yr ^ I don't understand the numbers. Cincinnati never had over 90 murders. 93 in 1883 http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2003/03/27/editorial_painterguest.html The population was roughly the same (250-290K) City footprint was roughly the same Police complement around 350
July 14, 201311 yr These are fascinating statistics, City Blights. They really help to show how difficult it must be to lift oneself out of such sh!tty life circumstances. Who wouldn't be overloaded with stress at a way-too-early age when people are dying all around you, and you might be next? How hard it must be to see past that blunt reality, to find school success more worthy of aspiration than mere street survival skills. To even imagine what the alternative would be like, or that there is an alternative at all. Still, I think OCtoCincy has a good point that if you don't fall into the poor black male with a rap sheet (inflated as it may be) demographic, then you have little to fear in the way of being murdered in Cincinnati. That doesn't mean anyone deserves to be murdered. It just means the fears, of those from more privileged demographics, of living in or venturing into the city are bogus.
July 14, 201311 yr You're underestimating the homicides in Fairfield (had 6 past year alone) Colerain, etc. if bet its closer to 10-12 more outside of city year-to-date and 50 for the whole metro. Also, since the vast majority of homicides in the city are just a couple neighborhoods and are virtually entirely among people with records and with victims who know their killer, it's hardly a statistic to determine how safe you are of how dangerous a city is. Also, Cleveland is around 50 or the year (though obviously larger). There have been almost 230% more rapes in Cleveland than in Cincy year-to-date for 2013 yet the population is only 33% more. What that means is taking one specific crime's one year number and implying a level of crime isn't a good metric. (Not starting a city vs city battle). This isn't the Cleveland crime thread. The point of the matter is Cincinnati has had a dramatic increase in homicides, and some are not just limited to bad neighborhoods, but popular sections of OTR. Cincinnati better get its crime figured out quick. The numbers that are coming out of the city are sad for a city of under 300,000.
July 14, 201311 yr These are fascinating statistics, City Blights. They really help to show how difficult it must be to lift oneself out of such sh!tty life circumstances. Who wouldn't be overloaded with stress at a way-too-early age when people are dying all around you, and you might be next? How hard it must be to see past that blunt reality, to find school success more worthy of aspiration than mere street survival skills. To even imagine what the alternative would be like, or that there is an alternative at all. Still, I think OCtoCincy has a good point that if you don't fall into the poor black male with a rap sheet (inflated as it may be) demographic, then you have little to fear in the way of being murdered in Cincinnati. That doesn't mean anyone deserves to be murdered. It just means the fears, of those from more privileged demographics, of living in or venturing into the city are bogus. Race shouldn't matter. I see where people are going with the African American male homicides, but if I were a young professional moving into the city and I heard about all the shootings in OTR or was enjoying Washington Park and heard gunshots, you bet I would think twice about that area. I love the city, but there are certain aspects of people who live in the suburbs who wouldn't dream of this thing on a more "regular" basis.
July 15, 201311 yr large chunks of OTR were considered some of the most dangerous places to be for decades. In 2010 there were 71 homicides in Cincinnati In 2011 there were 11 homicides in OTR and 67 in the entire City. Last year there were something like 2 in OTR and 53 in the entire City. This year we are virtually on par with the YTD of 2011 so the year will probably end up right around 70 again for the whole city, but OTR is only at 3 so far. Perhaps it will end up around 6 or 7 for the year. if you think the City and developers in OTR don't know that they need to "get it's crime figured out quick" and haven't been working on that I'm not sure what the point of this conversation is. Gentrification doesn't just magically happen over night. It takes decades to truly take hold in a way that can't be flipped back easily. That is happening, but everyone needs to remember, this neighborhood was much more dangerous and much crappier for several decades. 200 new apartments and condos in 5 years won't change it. years of resilient work that never lets up, several thousand new residents, several thousand new housing units and hundreds of businesses over the next 15 years will change it into something that does not resemble OTR of the late 70's and early 80's. Prospect Hill in the 1970's was a quarter vacant, a quarter falling down, and very dangerous. decades worth of work later and now it's Mt. Adams lite. There will be ups and downs. years where there are 11 homicides, and years where there are two. but because one year goes back up to 3 homicides by July, doesn't mean things are falling apart. the trends are clear, while there is a blip every once in awhile this neighborhood is nothing like it's old self already and there's so much more work to do.
July 15, 201311 yr Not to be a jerk, but I know that if I went into the Cleveland crime thread and said the same stuff about East 4th or Playhouse Square that you just did about OTR, you guys would all have the pitchforks out. If you don't really know about crime in Cincy/OTR, perhaps you should not be commenting on it. Last year Cleveland had twice as many murders as Cincinnati but not 2x the population--I didn't see a bunch of Cincy folks over there telling you what a dangerous city CLE is and how you need to get your act together.
July 15, 201311 yr He's right about everything except that the number is increasing. You can't make that judgment on year-to-year data. But it's a real problem, it's higher than it realistically should be (it should be zero, but you know what I mean), and it absolutely needs to be worked on. And by worked on, I mean from all angles, addressing poverty and education and not just police work.
July 16, 201311 yr Quit it with the Cleveland vs. Cincy crime statistics. This isn't the forum to start an intrastate city vs. city pissing match. Thanks. “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
July 22, 201311 yr Woman found unconcious after Downtown attack From the Enquirer An assault Friday night in which a woman was beaten unconscious at Sixth and Vine streets started with an argument between two groups of women, according to Cincinnati police reports. A companion of the 21-year-old victim told officers the argument started on Fountain Square. Then, the report says, “for no reason the group of girls started kicking and punching” the victim. Sounds like a pretty serious attack. I have to wonder why police found her, and not one of her friends... The initial story read that a "gang" of 8-10 people (it may have read men, but I don't remember) attacked her without reason. Then everyone on the Enquirer's website was screaming for the race of those who attacked the girl and saying "I thought downtown was safe" and something about choo choos. Glad this wasn't a random act of violence. Sad it happened though.
July 22, 201311 yr It's been updated. Sounds like a friend did call police and when they arrived the woman was "found" unconscious. But I'm reading between the lines.
July 22, 201311 yr ^ So far, "nobody seen nothing"--maybe all the perps were cloaked in hoodies and the woman was hooded by an hijab... :roll:
July 22, 201311 yr I hate that this happened, but am also kind of happy that once details were revealed all the 'downtown isn't safe! You're dumb for thinking it is' crowd were proven to be basing a lot of their reasoning on B.S. It was an isolated incident between two groups of women (although nobody mentioned it being men, it was pretty obvious many of the comments immediately assumed it was a large 'gang' of 'thugs' that attacked an innocent bystander) that could have happened anywhere. Hell, they may not even be from the city. The report said it started at a concert on Fountain Square so it could've been people from out of town for all anybody knows. Then of course in comes COAST with its typical "enjoy your bloody streetcar boondoggle" line it uses when anything bad (or good...their reasoning is sometimes confusing) is reported anywhere in the vicinity of Downtown or OTR. My brain hurts from reading those comments.
July 22, 201311 yr Downtown and OTR are crowded as is, I'm glad some people still live in a bubble and think they'll die if they come visit. Hopefully this will keep the 60+ minute waits for a table at most of the restaurants from getting even longer.
July 22, 201311 yr Report makes it sound a lot less like a beating and a lot more like a punch that knocked a girl out.
July 22, 201311 yr ^^Well that's a silly mentality. There is so much empty space left Downtown and in OTR that anything that could potentially lessen the popularity/'crowdedness' will have negative longterm repercussions when speaking of redeveloping/rehabbing/expanding/etc.
July 22, 201311 yr This just sounds like a common barroom brawl that happened on the street instead. People can get knocked out by one lucky punch. People can die from one punch, too, in fact I think that happened in NKY a couple years ago. Usually by getting knocked out, then falling and hitting the head on the ground pretty hard. This type of incident happens all the time, everywhere. It just happened to be in public in a high-profile location.
July 22, 201311 yr Downtown and OTR are crowded as is, I'm glad some people still live in a bubble and think they'll die if they come visit. Hopefully this will keep the 60+ minute waits for a table at most of the restaurants from getting even longer. The answer to that is more restaurants, not less people.
July 24, 201311 yr An arrest has been made - the attacker has a decent history of assault, disorderly conduct, obstruction, etc..... And the story is a lot clearer. The attacker seems psychotic. http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130724/NEWS0107/307240140/Arrest-made-assault-woman-Downtown
July 25, 201311 yr The Fishwarp claims, "Police slow to release critical info" No information from Friday to Monday & the info obtained Friday was wrong. http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130725/EDIT01/307240162/EDITORIAL-Police-slow-release-critical-info Meanwhile the flow of info from a police shooting in Clifton has been tortuous to say the least.
July 25, 201311 yr Fishwrap is a British term for a crappy newspaper (the American equivalent would be rag). Traditionally, I guess at cheap fish & chips places, fish would be sold wrapped in newspaper. Warp, I think, refers to what the Enquirer does to the truth.
July 25, 201311 yr An arrest has been made - the attacker has a decent history of assault, disorderly conduct, obstruction, etc..... And the story is a lot clearer. The attacker seems psychotic. http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130724/NEWS0107/307240140/Arrest-made-assault-woman-Downtown -- What a hot mess 8/27/2009 DISORDERLY CONDUCT MMM4 2917-11A ORCN Disposition: 11/10/2009 - CHARGE DISMISSED Filed Date: 5/19/2012 Count : DISORDERLY CONDUCT 2917-11 ORCN Disposition: 06/19/2012 - FINE Filed Date: 5/17/2013 Bond Amount: $ RELEASED ON OWN RECOGNIZANCE Count : ASSAULT 2903-13 ORCN Disposition: 05/18/2013 - JUDGE ASSIGNED Filed Date: 7/4/2013 Count A: OBSTRUCT OFFICIAL BUSINESS 2921-31 ORCN Disposition: 07/05/2013 - JUDGE ASSIGNED Count B: MISCONDCT AT EMERGENCY MTG 2917-13 ORCN Disposition: 07/05/2013 - JUDGE ASSIGNED Filed Date: 7/5/2013 Count : PEDESTRIAN VIOLATION 506-46 CMCN Disposition: 07/05/2013 - JUDGE ASSIGNED From the last incident: Filed Date: 7/22/2013 Count A: ASSAULT 2903-13 ORCN Disposition: 07/22/2013 - WARRANT ONLY Count B: ASSAULT 2903-13 ORCN Disposition: - WARRANT ONLY
July 26, 201311 yr everybody's stealing shampoo and deodorant I guess cleanliness is next to godliness http://www.wcpo.com/dpp/money/consumer/dont_waste_your_money/local-walgreens-now-locking-up-shampoo
July 27, 201311 yr Homicide in Westwood last night. 31 year old Justin Owensby. Insane rap sheet. Multiple assaults, domestic violence charges, robbery, drugs, etc. this guy alone had to have been the direct cause for nearly $1 million in police work, court cases, damages, etc. it's rap sheets like this that make me wonder why Ohio doesn't have a 3 strikes law for violent felonies. Name Municipal Case # Common Pleas Case # Ticket # OWENSBY JUSTIN /02/CRB/19815 OWENSBY JUSTIN /02/CRB/4240 OWENSBY JUSTIN /03/TRD/35239 75/3390798 OWENSBY JUSTIN /04/CRA/36896 B 0409212 OWENSBY JUSTIN /04/CRB/31624 OWENSBY JUSTIN /04/CRB/31993 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRA/42276 B 0510747 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRB/13181 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRB/29661 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRB/29662 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRB/33228 OWENSBY JUSTIN /05/CRB/33230 OWENSBY JUSTIN /06/CRA/6250 B 0601691 OWENSBY JUSTIN /06/TRD/52244 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /07/CRB/25102 OWENSBY JUSTIN /07/CRB/4367 OWENSBY JUSTIN /08/TRD/42314 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /09/CRA/7106 B 0901600 OWENSBY JUSTIN /09/CRB/2745 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN /09/CRB/3465 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN /09/CRB/7105 OWENSBY JUSTIN /09/TRD/59817 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /10/CRB/33246 OWENSBY JUSTIN /10/CRB/3765 OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/CRA/2659 B 1100707 OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/CRA/9373 B 1102207 OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/CRB/2660 OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/CRB/27164 OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/TRD/20716 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/TRD/25302 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /11/TRD/36823 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN /12/CRA/26083 B 1206368-B OWENSBY JUSTIN /13/CRB/5782 OWENSBY JUSTIN 03CV15821 OWENSBY JUSTIN C/07/CRB/8248 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /02/CRB/42802 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /03/TRD/42214 SEE TICKETS OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRA/42276 B 0510747 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRB/13181 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRB/29661 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRB/29662 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRB/33228 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /05/CRB/33230 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /06/CRA/6250 B 0601691 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /07/CRB/25102 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /07/CRB/4367 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRA/7106 B 0901600 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/2745 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/2745 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/32789 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/3465 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/3465 B 0900780 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/CRB/7105 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /09/TRD/49540 75/3641782 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /10/CRB/33246 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /10/CRB/3765 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /11/CRA/2659 B 1100707 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /11/CRA/9373 B 1102207 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /11/CRB/2660 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /11/CRB/27164 OWENSBY JUSTIN R /12/CRA/26083 B 1206368-B OWENSBY JUSTIN R /13/CRB/5782 OWENSBY JUSTIN R C/06/TRD/7916 00/911012 OWENSBY JUSTIN R C/07/CRB/8248 OWENSBY JUSTIN R C/07/TRD/13814 04/108416 OWENSBY JUSTIN R C/08/CRB/2701
July 27, 201311 yr I normally don't like bringing up a person's past who's been killed. But this guy had it coming to him. Lead a life of crime die by crime. He must have had very little prison time if he's been out just about every year.
July 27, 201311 yr I can't believe I just heard someone suggest that a Three Strikes law is a solution of any kind.
July 27, 201311 yr I can't believe I just heard someone suggest that a Three Strikes law is a solution of any kind. For violent felonies, absolutely. Can you tell me how the current system helped all if the invidious la this guy beat during felonious assaults, aggravated robberies and domestic violence? What is another option? Hugs? We need to get more serious about diversion programs for youth offenders, but if you're 30 with a rap sheet like that, you are NOT changing and should be removed from society.
July 27, 201311 yr it's rap sheets like this that make me wonder why Ohio doesn't have a 3 strikes law for violent felonies. Or a prison system aimed at rehab vs. punishment, like countries with much better crime rates than ours have.
July 27, 201311 yr Remove all non violent crimes from most prisons. Never house non-violent offenders with violent offenders. Use intense rehab and diversion programs for first time offenders of nearly all offenses, with the knowledge that if you don't correct yourself you will not have many more chances (when it comes to violent crime). Many of the nearly 20 states with 3 strikes laws don't require all 3 to be violent (which leads to the third strike being theft of a loaf of bread) which has led to much of the criticism. That is changing in many states as its unreasonable. Also, states who really want to help prevent recidivism should prevent employees from asking if an applicant is a felon. Discrimination like that leads to the inability for ex offenders to get jobs. But there are always going to be people who are crazy and can't be saved. Read through that guys rap sheet. For the betterment of society an individual with a rap sheet like that should be put away for a long long time. It's the cold hard truth.
July 27, 201311 yr He's incredibly lucky he made it that long. You can't piss off that many people that badly and expect to live.
July 27, 201311 yr This story sums his life up. http://www.wistv.com/story/20118302/police-looking-for-suspect-who-shot-at-victim-got-away-with-30
July 28, 201311 yr I can't believe I just heard someone suggest that a Three Strikes law is a solution of any kind. For violent felonies, absolutely. Can you tell me how the current system helped all if the invidious la this guy beat during felonious assaults, aggravated robberies and domestic violence? What is another option? Hugs? We need to get more serious about diversion programs for youth offenders, but if you're 30 with a rap sheet like that, you are NOT changing and should be removed from society. Your solution is to mold Ohio's crisis into California's system, nationally recognized as THE most dysfunctional of all of America's penal networks. That is not very well thought out, CincyGuy. Does anyone ever ponder why there is so much violence in the United States? I'll take prevention over response every day.
July 28, 201311 yr Sure, but if someone is a repeat violent offender, finally saying "enough is enough" is preventing him from future violent crimes.
July 28, 201311 yr Sure, but if someone is a repeat violent offender, finally saying "enough is enough" is preventing him from future violent crimes. My argument is how to prevent the desire to commit a violent crime is a more proactive and potentially successful measure than a Three Strikes law that has been proven to not deter crime. The amount of violent offenders in the country is incredible considering how controlled American society is. No other nation puts as many resources into law enforcement and surveillance.
July 28, 201311 yr I mentioned a Draconian plan many pages ago. Start stripping Criminal of their citizenship and ship them to Samolia or some other ungoverned entity. Supply them with basic needs and Skype. Watch crime drop like a rock.
Create an account or sign in to comment