Yeah, well, what can I say?

 

 

 

 

 

I have to admit, I really like the entrance to Dick's, its like an old conservatory

 

Architectural chaos

 

 

 

 

 

 

What is that?  :roll:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's like a more urban Warehouse District!

lol @ the title...

Could be worse

I hope that doesn't fall on his head.

 

I always wondered about that - I mean, okay they're going with that look, but the ridiculously oversized corner "tower"?

I don't support the concept, but the actual development looks nice I think.

I like it and support it.

If I had never lived in Cleveland, I would be ok with living there.

I hope that doesn't fall on his head.

 

It looks like a tumor!

 

It looks like a failed cupcake trying to escape from Martha Stewart's K-Mart Collection.

Nice pictures. My favorite...

 

I saw a little EIFS in there.

Could be worse

 

LOL.  I think that's on their brochures.

Boy, they even have a view skywalks :)  How very, urban.

 

From the pics, I actually think I like this better than Easton.  At least it looks like a little "town".

and don't forget the landscaping on steroids!  Those planters are enormous!

This photo set has given me the most favorable impression of Crocker Park I've had to date.

good work ink.

 

postives: it has the most density of ohio's lifestyle mall campuses. seemed like a decent mix of consumer stuff too, if not the breadth of easton.

 

downsides: the mishmash. the throwback retro parts look awful, but the parts that are more modern architecture are fine and more fitting for this kind of a development (ie., the firstwatch building or buildings in the pic kjp liked above).

 

al-in-all a decent warm-up project for stark, i'm sure he learned a lot doing cp that he can put to use in redeveloping downtown.

I hope that doesn't fall on his head.

 

There's a chance of it! There's probably a raging teen dance party going on above the Abercrombie.

"Select you favorite EIFS medallion!"

Shoot me now.

This does look quite nice, although one of the residential streets shown looks quite... bland. The only qualm I have about it is the main street has no varying setbacks, but it does have many architectural styles to make up for it.

 

Where is this located at, spefically?

In beautiful *retch* Westlake, Ohio - an outer-ring 'burb about 12 miles west of downtown Cleveland.

I quite enjoyed my visit to Crocker Park... I even dined at the Cheesecake Factory.  This is a brilliant example of new urbanism. 

lol @ the title...

 

I disagree.  We could certainly make up some snappy little names for Randall Park Mall, for example, but we wouldn't because it would be considered racist and mean.  That should go both ways.

 

 

The only qualm I have about it is the main street has no varying setbacks,

 

Why would we want that?  Consistent setbacks make the street into a more cohesive space.

 

al-in-all a decent warm-up project for stark, i'm sure he learned a lot doing cp that he can put to use in redeveloping downtown.

 

I agree.  I also think it is a warm up for the market, to reintroduce them to at least some of the concepts of urbanity in anticipation of "True Urbanist" redevelopments Downtown and in the neighborhoods.

 

And nice pictures, Ink!

This is a brilliant example of new urbanism. 

 

Perhaps in design. Its context is complete sprawl, however.

True, but it doesn't hurt that 2,000 residents live there and is within a short commuting distance to Cleveland. If it helps promote change, the more the better.

Define "short" - bad weather or heavy traffic easily makes it a 30-45 minute trip. Also, there aren't anywhere near 2,000 people living there - not yet at least and consider that those people are coming from somewhere likely within the region - aka building growth without population growth. In a bubble, it has its merits but that's about it.

I disagree.  We could certainly make up some snappy little names for Randall Park Mall, for example, but we wouldn't because it would be considered racist and mean.  That should go both ways.

 

True, but the difference is that the thread creator is white, thus an attempt to make this a reverse discrimination example is illogical, unless you're trying to prove that inkaelin is...well...racist (?)

I went ahead and changed the title regardless; it will be beneficial when searching for this thread.

I disagree.  We could certainly make up some snappy little names for Randall Park Mall, for example, but we wouldn't because it would be considered racist and mean.  That should go both ways.

 

True, but the difference is that the thread creator is white, thus an attempt to make this a reverse discrimination example is illogical, unless you're trying to prove that inkaelin is...well...racist (?)

 

I didn't mean it's reverse racism, just that the tone is counterproductive.  And I wasn't trying to make a big issue out of it, I'm sure Ink meant no harm- it was just an observation on my part.

The day when one of these is built with a main road running through it, rather than off to the side and separated from one (in this case Crocker Road, or in the case of Legacy Village being off of Cedar Road), then it will feel more genuine. If this were built surrounding Detroit Avenue in Lakewood or Cleveland, or another main drag like, then it would probably do more for urban sustainability.

I love it. When can I leave Ohio City and move to Crocker Park?? ;)

I HATE the term "reverse" discrimination, that would actually suggest that there is no discrimination happening..........discrimination IS discrimination, no matter WHERE or WHO it comes from!

The day when one of these is built with a main road running through it, rather than off to the side and separated from one (in this case Crocker Road, or in the case of Legacy Village being off of Cedar Road), then it will feel more genuine. If this were built surrounding Detroit Avenue in Lakewood or Cleveland, or another main drag like, then it would probably do more for urban sustainability.

 

Precisely the point I was going to make, Ken. There are a couple of nice streetscape shots, but this state and this country need those kinds of streetscapes -- thoroughfares lined with two- and three-story mixed-use buildings -- on main drags.

 

Oh sorry, it says "approximately 2,000 will live here..." on the web-site; I was wrong in stating that currently.

 

As for its location, I did note it wasn't on the main drag, which is unfortunate.

I disagree.  We could certainly make up some snappy little names for Randall Park Mall, for example, but we wouldn't because it would be considered racist and mean.  That should go both ways.

 

True, but the difference is that the thread creator is white, thus an attempt to make this a reverse discrimination example is illogical, unless you're trying to prove that inkaelin is...well...racist (?)

 

I didn't mean it's reverse racism, just that the tone is counterproductive.  And I wasn't trying to make a big issue out of it, I'm sure Ink meant no harm- it was just an observation on my part.

 

Yeah, bah.  CHEERS! *insert beer smiley here*

The day when one of these is built with a main road running through it, rather than off to the side and separated from one (in this case Crocker Road, or in the case of Legacy Village being off of Cedar Road), then it will feel more genuine. If this were built surrounding Detroit Avenue in Lakewood or Cleveland, or another main drag like, then it would probably do more for urban sustainability.

 

That's why I like the development that was done in Hudson being that there was existing retail along Rt 91 that they basically added to.

If this were built surrounding Detroit Avenue in Lakewood or Cleveland, or another main drag like, then it would probably do more for urban sustainability.

 

... and/or as the core of TOD, on one of the Rapid lines.

Thanks to Westlake's having a thoughtful planning director and planning staff, as well as an enlightened developer, Crocker Park is much, much better than it might have been. Both comprehensively and in detail, the project has gotten a lot of attention, and that is apparent.

 

Still, lifestyle centers chill me, partly because of the monolithic ownership and control and partly because they are so good at simulating and standing in for what they really are not.

 

I will be interested in seeing what comes of Stark's plans for the Warehouse District in Cleveland. The Warehouse District is already very much up and running, and there is no danger of its streets being pulled from the public realm. There will be no choice but to interweave with the existing multifaceted neighborhood and city that surrounds the new development. Westlake, which is multifaceted but in a more limited, use-separated way, didn't have these kinds of connections to work with.

 

I'm glad that Crocker Park is in Cuyahoga County. We have to keep that ship sailing.

You know, the part that's missing for me in these new urbanism developments is the civic part. 

 

Sure you have shopping, entertainment, dining and living, but where are the churches, the post offices, the government agencies, the arts centers.  Without those components, I wouldn't necessarily calls these "liveable."

It wasn't for lack of trying. Stark lobbied to have Westlake's new City Hall located at Crocker Park, but city officials were concerned they would be at the mercy of a private interest. Stark also lobbied to have Beck Center for the Arts relocated from Lakewood to Crocker Park, but Lakewood officials fought to keep it. There is an outdoor, refrigerated skating rink at CP. And Stark is seeking a community center at CP, and possibly a public amphitheater. Since I don't cover Westlake anymore for Sun, I don't know where this effort stands.

Interesting.  I didn't realize that.  There are advantages of having a single property owner/manager.  But there are also disadvantages.