And as for the rail transit convenience of TC and its theaters, I've all but given up on this town and it's planners to think or act intelligently toward rail transit.  Planners here are too quick to genuflect to the almighty automobile.  To them, transit is for the poor and minorities; it's a stubborn and pernicious mentality that even infects the transit agency itself. 

It's easy to see how a modern, frills attached movie complex would integrate with PS. It's a good fit. Yet I don't want to give up on Tower City just yet. Having the CIFF there every year has been by and large a really great experience.

 

I don't think anyone believes downtown could support two complexes.

 

Perhaps if it was food/drinking centric?  Like one of those new chains popping up that serve food and booze in your seats?

 

Was thinking of a place like this:  http://www.flixbrewhouse.com

I just don't see arts movies pulling in the dollars that would offset the likely high cost of a theater complex, within a significant mixed-use development. Instead, I think it needs to offer something more unique for Greater Cleveland -- IMAX, including with laser technology and the ability to upgrade technology in the future. There is only one commercial IMAX movie theater in Greater Cleveland -- Regal at Crocker Park. The IMAX theater at the Great Lakes Science Center is for educational movies. Downtown always had the biggest and best of things, so make this theater the biggest and best commercial IMAX theater not only in Greater Cleveland or in Ohio, but in the country. And put it on Euclid Avenue on the ground floor of an entertainment complex with places to enjoy drinks, dancing, live music, late-night snacks and meals, etc after seeing a movie or visiting one of the other theaters on Playhouse Square. Too many people head straight for their cars and the suburbs after a show. Keep 'em downtown spending money!

 

I love it. I think I've been pretty consistent saying that I believe nothing should be offered in the suburbs that you can't get in the city, for one. Second, I LOVE the idea of making it the biggest and best IMAX theater in Ohio. I think that would be great for us and could also lead to more premieres here, especially films that are filmed here. I think TC can compete if they focus more on the artsy aspect of their theater, like a downtown Capitol Theatre. I don't think TC serves that modern movie market. (I have some experience with this, as through my work I once tried to get an independent movie premiered in Cleveland. I deliberately targeted the theaters in the city but our partners at the time said that none of the theaters in the city would work because their film delivery system was antiquated. They said we would have to go to Cinemark. They were very difficult to negotiate with so the market ended up losing out altogether on this movie so I know for a fact that we have lost film premieres in the city because of the theaters in the city.)

What will the future of this building be, what with all the RFPs and talk of development in this untapped section of downtown? Greyhound station, Chester Avenue. Built 1948. At its peak in the 1960s, 200 buses a day stopped here. Today, it's down to about 30 daily. Buses were the "gateway drug" for people transitioning from trains to cars....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please tell me why we are so desperate to

 

1) Turn Cleveland's awesomely cool vintage bus station into something that isn't a cool vintage bus station

2) Probably do everything we can to make it still look like a cool vintage bus station.

3) Create a memorial to now extinct cool vintage bus stations - while we actively chase the buses to a different part of town.

 

Does many other US cities still operate one of these old stations?  What would be so awful about developing around the dang thing as it stands instead of re purposing it?

The only argument I can make for moving the Greyhound Station would be to place it inside Tower City so it can be situated at the nexus of Cleveland's transit system.

WTF with a lakefront multi-modal center.  Put the danged transit where the people and activity are.  Are people riding Greyhound to go fishing off the E 9th Street Pier?

 

 

I'm at the Greyhound station twice a month. Folks, it isn't that grand or vintage or cool.

Please tell me why we are so desperate to

 

1) Turn Cleveland's awesomely cool vintage bus station into something that isn't a cool vintage bus station

2) Probably do everything we can to make it still look like a cool vintage bus station.

3) Create a memorial to now extinct cool vintage bus stations - while we actively chase the buses to a different part of town.

 

Does many other US cities still operate one of these old stations?  What would be so awful about developing around the dang thing as it stands instead of re purposing it?

The only argument I can make for moving the Greyhound Station would be to place it inside Tower City so it can be situated at the nexus of Cleveland's transit system.

WTF with a lakefront multi-modal center.  Put the danged transit where the people and activity are.  Are people riding Greyhound to go fishing off the E 9th Street Pier?

 

 

 

You clearly have not been to this bus station.

Well that's just plan wrong (and presumptuous.)

I've greeted several friends who arrived here on their first visit to Cleveland.  So what have you got against the place?

The photo images directly above are quite accurate. 

 

Are you expecting an Ann Taylor Loft to open up inside there once the people you perceive as hobos are sent packing?

I'm trying to get my head around the negativity that surrounds bus passengers.

Redevelopment of the station with a different user could spur spin off developments around the block and to the north. 

The Greyhound station may not be "grand" but it's at least unique for the region. Are there any other examples of streamline moderne architecture in the greater Cleveland area? I can't think of any.

Please tell me why we are so desperate to

 

1) Turn Cleveland's awesomely cool vintage bus station into something that isn't a cool vintage bus station

2) Probably do everything we can to make it still look like a cool vintage bus station.

3) Create a memorial to now extinct cool vintage bus stations - while we actively chase the buses to a different part of town.

 

Does many other US cities still operate one of these old stations?  What would be so awful about developing around the dang thing as it stands instead of re purposing it?

The only argument I can make for moving the Greyhound Station would be to place it inside Tower City so it can be situated at the nexus of Cleveland's transit system.

WTF with a lakefront multi-modal center.  Put the danged transit where the people and activity are.  Are people riding Greyhound to go fishing off the E 9th Street Pier?

 

 

 

Arrasmith designed 50 Greyhound terminals. Only 11 are still standing. Of those 11, only 3 are still used by buses. The Cleveland terminal is by far the largest to remain let alone to still be in use. It's worth noting that when the Cleveland terminal was built, it was considered the grandest bus terminal in the world. It's no Grand Central, but it's still in very good condition today. Greyhound could've gutted the place years ago but didn't. Instead they kept virtually all the Arrasmith touches in tact including the terrazzo floor design. It's a significant building and in terms of bus transportation, it's a very historical place. More historic than most people realize.

 

If I had to guess as to why there's not more talk about this building's future, I would say it's because people don't have an affinity for buses and bus terminals. People see them as dingy and dirty places that attract degenerates. If this were one of the last still in use Amtrak stations of a certain design era, I think people would be much more concerned about its future. Currently, it seems like most people could care less what happens to the vintage interior style of this terminal. I get why people want Greyhound moved but people need to realize how historic this place is and how important it is in relation to bus transit in this country. Anyone who takes over this building needs to respect its history.  A full gutting of it would be destroying an important part of our history that can't ever be replicated.

Well said. Part of the reason why I took those pictures and shared them here is to show the bus terminal's design and that it is kept in good condition. It is not a place to fear, dismiss or demolish.

A draw like that should be on Euclid not on Chester.

 

Placing it on Chester kills any hope for this not being so auto centric.

 

This is the perfect catalyst for growth on Chester!  Not everything can be nor should be on Euclid.

Playhouse Square is interested in getting a large movie theater complex built, with an residential/office/ and or retail component, likely on the site of the current Greyhound Station and its surrounding parking lots.

 

From Reddit:

 

 

Huh.  I guess that would be great for Playhouse Square, but it would undoubtedly kill off Tower City Cinemas, which have a fantastic indoor transit connection and are probably the biggest driver of traffic to the mall.

I doubt that. Just as we have more than one "entertainment" area in downtown, I believe we can support more than one more movie complex.  Is there a specific reason why you believe more theaters would "kill off" TCCs?

I'm at the Greyhound station twice a month. Folks, it isn't that grand or vintage or cool.

 

I completely disagree!  That building is architecturally amazing!

 

As with the Washington DC Greyhound station [Google street view New York Ave. between 11 & 12 sts.], it was abandoned, all services were moved to Union station and the existing Greyhound station was incorporated into a new building.

 

I would hope something can be done with the building that includes, retail, entertainment, offices & hotel.

Let's hear it for a non-food retail opening!

 

Play, a Color Nation Salon, to open shop in Playhouse Square.

http://www.downtowncleveland.com/media/2015/may/citizens-bank-foundation-and-downtown-cleveland-alliance-announce-small-business-grant-winner.aspx

Is the sidewalk closed to pedestrian traffic?

Is the sidewalk closed to pedestrian traffic?

 

Not that I've seen

We have threads for speculative retail discussion - please use them.

 

Not really a "development" but this event will showcase to nationwide visitors recent and ongoing developments in the Square....

 

Playhouse Square is the draw as 1,000 converge on Cleveland for Theatre Communications Group national conference

By Andrea Simakis, The Plain Dealer

on June 13, 2015 at 9:00 AM, updated June 15, 2015 at 11:24 AM

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio – The nation's largest theater conference heads to Playhouse Square next week, bringing an estimated 1,000 actors, directors, choreographers, scenic designers and other theater professionals from around the country – and a good number from around the globe – to work and party in the second-largest performing arts complex in the United States.

 

And here's another number to consider: the nearly $1 million in revenue the three-day Theatre Communications Group conference is excepted to bring to the region, according to David Gilbert, president and CEO of Destination Cleveland, one of the groups that partnered with area theaters to sell Cleveland and its environs to the national organization beginning in November 2013.

 

Heavy-hitting speakers coming to town include Jane Chu, chair of the National Endowment for the Arts, and Oskar Eustis, artistic director of The Public Theater in New York.

 

MORE:

http://www.cleveland.com/onstage/index.ssf/2015/06/playhouse_square_is_the_draw_a.html

This was very interesting:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/architecture/index.ssf/2015/07/ornament_is_king_not_a_crime_i.html#incart_river

 

I had no idea the State Theater and Lobby were being renovated as well! Should be beautiful when finished.

Exclusive first look: the Creswell apartments downtown: http://t.co/2v6busxYrf

Cinema at the Square to show classic films @clevelanddotcom  http://t.co/c9v2LHi24y #breakfastclub #cabaret

Apparently the desire to move Greyhound is intense, so much so that a temporary station for them on the lakefront may be needed just to get them out of the way of an "imminent" development. Still not sure who or what it is but my money is on Geis, based on recent statements he's made.

God, I hope not. The walk from the Greyhound station to Tower City isn't great as it is (E13 to Euclid or Chester to E9 have a very desolate feel at night/early in the morning -- and the panhandlers have been getting more aggressive my last few trips). But it's significantly better than walking from the Amtrak station to TC, which is twice the distance - and W3 isn't the most pleasant walk at those hours either.

If a large project goes there, consider the total transformation of chester between 90 and E13th.  hofbrauhaus, the new CSU engineering building, the Langston Appartments, and this?

God, I hope not. The walk from the Greyhound station to Tower City isn't great as it is (E13 to Euclid or Chester to E9 have a very desolate feel at night/early in the morning -- and the panhandlers have been getting more aggressive my last few trips). But it's significantly better than walking from the Amtrak station to TC, which is twice the distance - and W3 isn't the most pleasant walk at those hours either.

 

I responded to the station situation at the North Coast Transportation Center thread to keep this thread focused on the development at/near the Greyhound station....

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,17673.msg768696.html#msg768696

My sources say that The Chester GH site was set to be redeveloped this summer, until a certain woman at the City got involved.  She required a few new studies (NOACCA, etc), nixed a specific multi-million dollar re-development proposal, and instead wants to issue a "RFP for developers in 2016 or 2017".  So, due to the City's inertia, this may not happen for a long time.

I will never understand the RFP process for developers on private projects.  If a piece of property is for sale or lease, and the two parties reach an agreement, then what's the hang up. The city has a design review committee to steer the design in the direction that they would like to see the development take place and how they would like it to incorporate in to the city.  This is asking developers to pony up funds to develop plans for a private project that they may not get to do.  Certain developers develop certain relationships with city officials that leave other developers saying "we don't stand a chance against xyz company.  Don't waste the time or money."  You end up with monopolistic development within the city, and right now I feel like anything that is private has Geis' name on it.  Just doesn't seem fair and welcoming.  Partly the reason Intesa has taken so damn long.  Rant over!

My sources say that The Chester GH site was set to be redeveloped this summer, until a certain woman at the City got involved.  She required a few new studies (NOACCA, etc), nixed a specific multi-million dollar re-development proposal, and instead wants to issue a "RFP for developers in 2016 or 2017".  So, due to the City's inertia, this may not happen for a long time.

 

In addition to the RFP for the city-owned lots west of the Greyhound station?

I will never understand the RFP process for developers on private projects.  If a piece of property is for sale or lease, and the two parties reach an agreement, then what's the hang up. The city has a design review committee to steer the design in the direction that they would like to see the development take place and how they would like it to incorporate in to the city.  This is asking developers to pony up funds to develop plans for a private project that they may not get to do.  Certain developers develop certain relationships with city officials that leave other developers saying "we don't stand a chance against xyz company.  Don't waste the time or money."  You end up with monopolistic development within the city, and right now I feel like anything that is private has Geis' name on it.  Just doesn't seem fair and welcoming.  Partly the reason Intesa has taken so damn long.  Rant over!

 

Not really the thread for this, but there is no required RFP process for purely private projects, so not sure what you have in mind here.

 

For the Greyhound project, the the whole thing is conditioned on a land swap for publicly owned land. Greyhound would otherwise be free to sell its station to any developer it wanted it it so chose.

 

But like KJP, I wonder if this rumor is somehow conflated with or tied to the publicly owned parking lots for which there definitely was an RFP.

I heard that the E. 13th parking lot was a separate RFP.  Not related to Greyhound.

^That's been true so far, but the city could choose to tie them together.

 

Your info may be totally correct, it's just hard to know what's going on without something concrete. I doubt the city would turn this into an RFP process just for kicks.  Sounded like there was a lot of pressure from PHS to get this site moving.

Spotted in the parking lot of E. 17th and Euclid this morning:

 

 

 

Something is certainly going on...

First tenants moving into The Creswell. All units will be complete by end of year. Looks like a great building.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20150908/BLOGS14/150909885/the-creswell-adds-apartments-to-clevelands-theater-district

Just wanted to say I was in the State Theater tonight and it looks AMAZING. The paint looks light, bright and refreshed, the gold leaf sparkles, it's really beautiful. They're still finishing up some of the walls but overall it really POPPED. I'll attach a picture of the ceiling but you need to see it for yourself. The detail in the dome is really crisp and clean and the chandelier had some extra sparkle. Great work.

Another boring rig spotted in the parking lot of E. 17th and Euclid today.  This rig is a good deal larger than the last one posted and in a different spot.

I hope they strike oil. Soon.

Hardcore drilling action going on right now. No oil yet...

 

EDIT: thanks for the pic fix!

 

 

 

fixed

Hmmm... So this surface lot has been resurfaced and repainted over the weekend...

Was it resurfaced or did they just re-tar it?

 

 

Was it resurfaced or did they just re-tar it?

 

Just re-tarred I guess.

 

Ok, so just a few thousand dollars, if that.

But that means nothing is imminent. Probably nothing will happen before the GOP convention.

Not necessarily. Resurfacing is such a small amount of money that even if they planned on starting something in a month or two it might be worth it financially to continue operating it as a parking lot until that point. I've seen multiple projects down here in Cincy that were built on surface lots that had very recently been repaved.

I recall reading an article in the past four weeks or so (probably posted on this site but not necessarily in this thread...I think it was more of a general downtown development article discussing various potential projects) that quoted a PS principal.  If I recall, it implied that they were going slow developing this site (while working on it) and I got the impression that nothing was that imminent.

Not necessarily. Resurfacing is such a small amount of money that even if they planned on starting something in a month or two it might be worth it financially to continue operating it as a parking lot until that point. I've seen multiple projects down here in Cincy that were built on surface lots that had very recently been repaved.

 

Unless there were potholes galore in the parking lot, there's no reason to resurface/retar/repaint it with a development project imminent unless setting money on fire is a hobby.

It could be a contract term in the contract with the lot operator-- repave and re-stripe every xx years. 

So despite the retarring/painting, the rig is still set up in the lot.  Now drilling in the northeast corner:

The rig was from a company called DLZ.  Here is their site: https://dlz.com/

 

 

Here is a closer pic of the surface: