Are they expecting everyone to park in the Playhouse Square garage?  That's the only adjacent parking.  There is a small lot across Chester, but Chester is too wide for pedestrians to cross easily.  How many will walk down to the crosswalk at 17th?

 

I hope to see additional plans for this area soon (between the 13th and 17th from Chester north to Payne).  Other than the Greyhound station, there isn't a ton of activity, mostly a sea of parking lots.

 

I think this might help. It'll definitely liven up the dead zone. It's like downtown just drops off after 12th and then reappears at CSU. Would be nice to keep this moving north and really bring 9/12, Playhouse Sq, and CSU together

From a Playhouse Square/potentially livening dead area standpoint, this location is great news. However, wonder how this deal came together, which side approached which first and how they chose to look past dead area to see what could be vs hotter/more established area? In the long run, they may be very sorry they chose this spot vs. new construction of old building conversion in FEB, WHD, Gateway or elsewhere. I hope not, but customers are going to have to find this place vs running across it in more visible area.

I don't know if will be enough, but I'm guessing they see the CSU residential population as a core customer base and, just as importantly, a proxy marketing force to get their friends to come down.

This article seems to clarify the exact location:

 

Hofbräuhaus brewery, restaurant planned for PlayhouseSquare land wrapping the Hermit Club

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2013/07/hofbrauhaus_brewery_restaurant.html#incart_river_default

 

No street facing parking!  YES!

 

:clap:

Another plus....this plan does not demolish an existing building and replaces a surface parking lot.

 

 

Are they expecting everyone to park in the Playhouse Square garage?  That's the only adjacent parking.  There is a small lot across Chester, but Chester is too wide for pedestrians to cross easily.  How many will walk down to the crosswalk at 17th?

 

I hope to see additional plans for this area soon (between the 13th and 17th from Chester north to Payne).  Other than the Greyhound station, there isn't a ton of activity, mostly a sea of parking lots.

 

I think this might help. It'll definitely liven up the dead zone. It's like downtown just drops off after 12th and then reappears at CSU. Would be nice to keep this moving north and really bring 9/12, Playhouse Sq, and CSU together

 

One thing I was going to mention (someone said it up thread I think) is that this is a total destination spot. Everyone I know even if they don't visit downtown often are super excited that were getting one of these, and will visit no matter the location. Also i would imagine playhouse Square is one of the top places people who don't live in or frequent downtown often visit. So I don't think we need to worry about its success

I am shocked at the pure volume of positive comments on Cleveland.bomb at the end of this article.  I've never witnessed that before.

Are they expecting everyone to park in the Playhouse Square garage?  That's the only adjacent parking.  There is a small lot across Chester, but Chester is too wide for pedestrians to cross easily.  How many will walk down to the crosswalk at 17th?

 

 

 

Maybe they can build a skywalk. :wink:

I am shocked at the pure volume of positive comments on Cleveland.bomb at the end of this article.  I've never witnessed that before.

 

All the regular .bombers must be commenting on the atrocious CNN article about Cleveland.....

The comment sections there are not as bad as they're made out to be.  There are a handful of overt racists who comment a heck of a lot, but otherwise it's pretty reasonable.

 

I absolutely love this project.  I love the location too, it's an area that should be built up a lot more than it is.  That said, I pass by there a lot and my presence is rarely ignored, shall we say.  And there appears to be at least one guy who resides on that stretch of sidewalk.  I would suggest a strong DCA presence in the early going.

When you're investing $8MM, you want a sure thing. This location is not a sure thing... so it makes it all the more interesting. Even one block up on Euclid would have been much surer... Hoping it's a huge success.

^ I remember hearing from either here on the UO forum or from a radio interview with Art Falco that Playhouse Square also has its eye toward acquiring and redeveloping the Greyhound Station. Of course, speculating on where Greyhound could end up isn't appropriate for this thread, but there are potential oppurtunities for Greyhound to relocate soon, with everything going on downtown. We shall see.

It really gives you the impression that the square is looking to develop north

Very interesting location. To the east you have a parking lot, and then East 17th(lifeless sides of buildings/parking garage). To the north you have parking lots as far as the eye can see and the greyhound station. To the west you have dodge court and a parking garage and to the south is the back of buildings. This location will have TERRIBLE pedestrian access IMO. Well at least a lack of attractive pedestrian routes. This city really focused too much on main streets and let the side street(more pedestrian scale) connecting streets go to hell.

It really gives you the impression that the square is looking to develop north

 

Yeah. It really does.

 

Echoing other posters, the location does seem like an odd choice. But, these are the kind of "pioneer" developments we need to spur downtown's growth between CSU, PS, and the Avenue District. Sure, there are quite a few Euclid Avenue locations that probably could have suited this establishment well, but at least we're getting something that finally breaks the mold of Euclid having to be the entertainment Main Street. There are a ton of surface lots in this area that will now be that much more attractive to develop in the near term (~5 years or so) especially with CSU's growth.

It isn't totally barren. new apts four blocks east, a university one block east, reserve square within sight, hanna apts two blocks south.

Also, a theater district that draws a million people a year.  we complain that people don't go to restaurants on euclid because they park in the back.  Well, this is in the back.

Someone posted on Cleveland.com and I like the idea that East 14th and Prospect would have been a good location. This would have added life to the district. I feel like the chosen location kind of tucks it away.

When you're investing $8MM, you want a sure thing. This location is not a sure thing... so it makes it all the more interesting. Even one block up on Euclid would have been much surer... Hoping it's a huge success.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if this area filled in fairly quickly thanks to aforementioned CSU and PS northward expansion. I think what's concerning is that, correct me if I'm wrong, the lack of a cohesive, consistent master plan for the area. No reason why it cannot be a shining example of pedestrian friendly development.

Brand new park a block away, lots of residential already, in many ways it's a great site.  Repurposing of the Grayhound station is almost a must though.

While I think location had something to do with this, as it always does with anything, I think the building itself is the real driver of the location.  Had this been an old surface lot, or a dilapitated old building, I don't think they would have ever considered this spot. 

Agreed. Don't overlook the fact that consolidation in a few areas (i.e W25th, Flats, etc.) is not necessarily more beneficial than the growth of other areas.. I think there is far to much critique of the location.

CLE was on the Hofbrau radar 14 years ago... Good things come to those who wait...

 

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/1999/09/27/tidbits.html?page=all

 

 

While I think location had something to do with this, as it always does with anything, I think the building itself is the real driver of the location.  Had this been an old surface lot, or a dilapitated old building, I don't think they would have ever considered this spot. 

 

What do you mean by old surface lot?  It is to be built on an old surface parking lot.

^That confused me at first too, but I think there is a fairly significant tie in to the existing Hermit Club building.  Per the Cleveland.com article posted above:

 

The club owns its Tudor-style building, a city landmark, but rents the land underneath from a PlayhouseSquare affiliate. That ground lease expires next year, and PlayhouseSquare plans to lease the property, and the parking lot to the north, to Brauhaus Cleveland LLC.

 

In turn, the Hermit Club will lease its private spaces from the Hofbräuhaus. Members will keep their private bar but, for the first time, will share their performance stage and other areas of the building.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2013/07/hofbrauhaus_brewery_restaurant.html#incart_river_default

New rendering of the Hofbrauhaus from Playhouse Square's facebook.  What is that hulking white thing in the back?  Am I just forgetting whats already there?  :lol: Guess I need to take a walk...

 

 

That's the State Theater, and the brick box is the Ohio Theater.

Nice Drive-it/EIFS.

That's the State Theater, and the brick box is the Ohio Theater.

 

Thank you

Imagine the impact this building/business would have made in the parking lot across Euclid from the Palace Theatre...

 

But does look good, and hopefully livens this area/serves as a catalyst

^I would hope that some day that parking lot on Euclid is development with something more substantial than a one story restaurant.

I think we need something significantly larger on that Euclid lot.  Like if this thing had 20 stories of residential above it.  If Euclid Avenue across from the theaters doesn't merit that, I don't know what does. 

^I would hope that some day that parking lot on Euclid is development with something more substantial than a one story restaurant.

 

...that looks like a taco bell.  I hope this place does well (even if it doesn't appeal to me so much personally), but a big part of me is happy it's not visible from Euclid.

Apart form the scrolling, I see southern European revival all over this building more than Germany.

 

^Yep, Taco Bell + Macaroni Grill is what was coming to mind.

The interesting note I take from the rendering is that Geis is involved! They are very involved in the revitilazation of downtown.

 

I have a link which shows the similar look and feel Clevelanders should expect from the build.

http://hungrywanderers.com/blog/2010/09/01/hofbrauhaus-pittsburgh/

 

The interesting note I take from the rendering is that Geis is involved! They are very involved in the revitilazation of downtown.

 

I have a link which shows the similar look and feel Clevelanders should expect from the build.

http://hungrywanderers.com/blog/2010/09/01/hofbrauhaus-pittsburgh/

 

 

For whatever reason the Pitt photographs look far superior to the Cleveland rendering. Just look at the comparison of the roof materials.

I would have preferred more of the building be constructed closer to Chester.  Then place the large patio from the corner of Chester/Dodge heading south along Dodge.

I would have preferred more of the building be constructed closer to Chester.  Then place the large patio from the corner of Chester/Dodge heading south along Dodge.

 

I wonder if they decided to put the patio as far north as they could to give the patio a little sunshine.  The theatres cast a big shadow there.

 

If that decision has even been made.  These renderings could be just preliminary mock-ups.

Cowell and Hubbards burger stand has a name!

Interesting! I love that PHS is FINALLY adding concessions to Star Plaza, but not sure how I feel about the re-do of what used to be an elegant glass pavilion.  I guess it was necessary to make it work.  That original design was beautiful but so poorly thought out.

Interesting! I love that PHS is FINALLY adding concessions to Star Plaza, but not sure how I feel about the re-do of what used to be an elegant glass pavilion.  I guess it was necessary to make it work.  That original design was beautiful but so poorly thought out.

 

I think they made up for it with the cool fire pit just to the right of that pic.

I read in another thread that the Hanna Building conversation to apartments is to be completed in October.

Here are some more details on the Brauhaus project along with a few graphics -- many more are at this link.....

 

http://planning.city.cleveland.oh.us/designreview/drcagenda/2013/08022013/index.php

 

City Planning Commission

Agenda for August 2, 2013

 

DOWNTOWN/FLATS DESIGN REVIEW

 

1. DF2013-044 – Brauhaus Cleveland New Construction

Project Location: SE Corner of Chester Avenue and East 15th Street

Project Representative: Greg Seifert, Geis Construction

 

 

 

 

 

Is it me, or does that seem like Latin tinged architecture on a German themed restaurant?

Is it me, or does that seem like Latin tinged architecture on a German themed restaurant?

 

My first impression was Hacienda, not Hofbrau...

 

Dee Perry discusses how The Hofbräuhaus plans to bring a little bit of Germany to Cleveland's historic Hermit Club.

 

it is the first interview....

 

http://www.ideastream.org/applause/entry/55187

A Bavarian mural would be great on the side of the neighboring building, maybe one of Munich.

I've been to western Germany/holland. The architectural style of this building definitely fits in with that style.

Is it me, or does that seem like Latin tinged architecture on a German themed restaurant?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hofbrauhaus.JPG

Is it me, or does that seem like Latin tinged architecture on a German themed restaurant?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hofbrauhaus.JPG

 

Uh yeah Bumsquare.  I've been there.  Many times.  I usually have recollection on the way in, but not so much on the way out....

 

Maybe it's the rendering above, at the strip-mall height of a Chi-Chis, and overly-red roof that is giving me this thought?  The Chicago one even more-so.  Seriously put the three of them next to each other and tell me what you think.  There is a nod to the original, but the scale is off, so to me they look like a Mexican restaurant at .

 

 

From the Lakefront thread:

 

KJP--thanks for the link. If one scrolls to the bottom they can see the Haufbrau House---it looks horrible--looks like some kind of suburban chain restaurant.

 

Agree. That roof looks ridiculous. Why does Pittsburgh get good architecture and we get Waffle House?

 

Whoa, when you put it that way..  Look how much better Pittsburgh got for theirs: http://hofbrauhauspittsburgh.com/

Also, why is the Cleveland one called "Brauhaus" and every other one that exists is called "Hofbrauhaus"?  It makes me think this is going to be some cheap knock off that will sell Hofbrauhaus beer.