3 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

 

Yes, they released a press statement saying they were looking at all options. I'll flip it, what have they done that would lead one to believe they aren't considering a move? 

They haven't really done anything at all besides that statement. I think just moving the whole company and execs would be something.

8 minutes ago, B767PILOT said:

I've lived in Manhattan for decades and I've never really paid it much mind

Before moving to MIA, I also lived on the Upper West Side of Manhattan. Except for trips on NJ Turnpike, flights into LGA or EWR or driving in from LI, you don't notice the skyline. It's so much and it's not the most important aspect of living there. Sooner or later however, the negatives; bureaucracy, COL, taxes and weather overwhelm the positives.

 

I don't think SW is going anywhere but 26 PS.

1 minute ago, WindyBuckeye said:

They haven't really done anything at all besides that statement. I think just moving the whole company and execs would be something.

Well if they have already decided to leave, there's nothing preventing them from announcing that now...and provide details later

5 minutes ago, B767PILOT said:

Well if they have already decided to leave, there's nothing preventing them from announcing that now...and provide details later

We shall see, but this timing seems odd.

it's true the HQ could move out to nyc or charlotte (yarrrrgh!) or wherever and R&D stay put, or something like that, but really that makes no sense. especially for such an old, well established company. isn't the whole point here to both expand and consolidate as much as possible? i just don't see that happening. it would be quite a shocker. just a guess of course.

5 minutes ago, urbanmyth said:

I hate seeing articles like these popping up around the country. SW should not add extra stress to the people of Cleveland if they already know what their plans are. We have been disappointed too many times over the years. My biggest concern is always the airport. Loosing the hub with direct flights to so many large and midsize cities is a real concern for big corporations. This is a massive turning point for Cleveland, SW stays downtown and we keep the momentum going and then some, they leave and we are set back in a big way. 

 

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/real-estate/2019/09/17/sherwin-williams-is-hunting-a-new-headquarters-so-of-course-dallas-gets-a-mention/

 

http://www.wbap.com/2019/09/17/d-fw-could-be-considered-for-a-new-global-sherwin-williams-hq-and-rd-center/

 

 

 

Yikes. 

 

I hate to be a Debbie downer but I sort of understand the Outlook of SW. Especially if they are strategizing their growth forecast and profit forecast for the long term..

 

Cities like Dallas, Atlanta, Charlotte really make so much sense, especially if they can get the incentives their seeking. 

^ yeah, but there is something to said for, to quote seinfeld, being master of your own domain too.

If Sherwin moved to Texas I would become physically ill. That state is a completely unsustainable sprawling disaster

 

4 minutes ago, troeros said:

Cities like Dallas, Atlanta, Charlotte really make so much sense, especially if they can get the incentives their seeking. 

 

The fact these cities have huge international airline hubs is often decisive in location choices; lack of a hub was the stated reason Luxottica and Chiquita left Cincinnati.

3 minutes ago, YO to the CLE said:

If Sherwin moved to Texas I would become physically ill. That state is a completely unsustainable sprawling disaster

 

Besides Austin, I can't stand much of traveling to that state.

7 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

Yikes. 

 

I hate to be a Debbie downer but I sort of understand the Outlook of SW. Especially if they are strategizing their growth forecast and profit forecast for the long term..

 

Cities like Dallas, Atlanta, Charlotte really make so much sense, especially if they can get the incentives their seeking. 

We shall see. I know Hopkins isn't currently a hub, but finally has a very positive outlook for the future. It isn't the size of the other airports, but SW would be king in Cleveland but not in these other cities. Wait and see i guess.

9 minutes ago, Dougal said:

 

The fact these cities have huge international airline hubs is often decisive in location choices; lack of a hub was the stated reason Luxottica and Chiquita left Cincinnati.

Also, citing a lack of a hub is an easy excuse to relocate because the city in which they are leaving cant replicate it. It's easier to justify leaving because of no hub than it is because the new city gave great ax breaks and lax zoning

34 minutes ago, WindyBuckeye said:

Dallas is such a meh city. Lame choice.

I could not agree with you more. For a city the size of Dallas and with as much money is in the area, it is indeed meh. That said, companies continue to relocate there such as Toyota, which moved their entire operation there from beautiful SoCal to the sprawling mess that is the Northern Dallas suburbs. 

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by urbanmyth

1 minute ago, urbanmyth said:

I could not agree with you more. For a city the size of Dallas and with as much money is in the area, it is indeed meh. That said, companies continue to relocate there such a Toyota, which moved their entire operation there from beautiful SoCal to the sprawling mess that is the Northern Dallas suburbs. 

What an awful move that would be if you were a longtime Toyota employee wow

3 minutes ago, WindyBuckeye said:

What an awful move that would be if you were a longtime Toyota employee wow

 

 

yeah but not if you are a bawss. 

 

that's is the problem.

 

any move is for them.

 

lets not forget sw has been doing quite well in cle with hopkins airport for 100yrs.

25 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

Yikes. 

 

I hate to be a Debbie downer but I sort of understand the Outlook of SW. Especially if they are strategizing their growth forecast and profit forecast for the long term..

 

Cities like Dallas, Atlanta, Charlotte really make so much sense, especially if they can get the incentives their seeking. 

 

What?!? nothing about those southern cities "really make so much sense." Tell that to black employees of SW -- 'yeah, you should move to the Carolinas and see how you're treated.'

^ owww, yeah.

 

 i would prefer we not go there.

 

besides, they aren't making the decision based on that.

 

i mean, back to your point, has anyone ever?

 

4 minutes ago, Pugu said:

 

What?!? nothing about those southern cities "really make so much sense." Tell that to black employees of SW -- 'yeah, you should move to the Carolinas and see how you're treated.'

What a silly comment. Charlotte Metro Area is 24% black. 5,000 more blacks total than the Cleveland Metro Area.

 

*Edit. In 2010 that is.

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by aderwent

that said, obviously the decision is not based on just the bottom line either.

 

if that were true, they would move R&D to china, pay the staff half and have the added bonus that they could just throw the bad paint mix and coatings ideas out the back door into the river.

^ probably like they used to do into the cuyahoga!  

7 minutes ago, aderwent said:

What a silly comment. Charlotte Metro Area is 24% black. 5,000 more blacks total than the Cleveland Metro Area.

 

*Edit. In 2010 that is.

 

 

So what? You think that that changes the mindset of non-black people in the Carolinas? Ask people of color how life is for them if they venture 30 or so miles outside of places like Charlotte or Raleigh. And in South Carolina, they have "plantations" everywhere and they proudly call them plantations. I would never ever move to company to place like that no matter what the tax breaks. 

44 minutes ago, Dougal said:

 

The fact these cities have huge international airline hubs is often decisive in location choices; lack of a hub was the stated reason Luxottica and Chiquita left Cincinnati.

 

I'm not sure where you got your information, but I'm skeptical anyone at Luxottica stated the reason they left Cincinnati was because of a lack of a hub. Luxottica's US headquarters is based in Mason, a Cincinnati suburb. Their international headquarters is in Milan, as Luxottica is, and always was, an Italian company.

It they’ve already made a decision and it’s actually a decision to move, it’s the best kept secret ever.  It would be a decision that would be a devestating blow to Cleveland, and I would like to think that SW would at least have some simpático for  the city given its 90 year history and give it a fair chance to match any other cities incentives package. 

Not sure if it’s too late because supposedly a lot of people/operations from Minneapolis have moved to Cleveland but if I were the Twin Cities you can be damn sure I’d be going after SW.

11 minutes ago, BigMacky said:

Not sure if it’s too late because supposedly a lot of people/operations from Minneapolis have moved to Cleveland but if I were the Twin Cities you can be damn sure I’d be going after SW.

This is what I was getting at upthread a bit.  They have moved some ops/people from Twin Cities to Cleveland already. I would think such moves would have been postponed if they were seriously considering leaving for other climes

Hub? SHW execs have basically their own personal airport 5 minutes away. #BKE. ?

1 hour ago, Clefan98 said:

 

No I can't give any hints at all, sorry. There's a lot of new eyes on this forum.

 

Why would SW execs be monitoring this forum if they had already decided that they were moving elsewhere?  In that case, our thoughts / rumors would essentially be meaningless and they'd be spending their "valuable" time checking in on development rumors in X, Y or Z, USA.

18 minutes ago, West153 said:

 

Why would SW execs be monitoring this forum if they had already decided that they were moving elsewhere?  In that case, our thoughts / rumors would essentially be meaningless and they'd be spending their "valuable" time checking in on development rumors in X, Y or Z, USA.

 

It has nothing to do with our thoughts. I don't want anything tied back to me or my source, so knock it off. 

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by Clefan98

1 hour ago, dwhershberger said:

 

I'm not sure where you got your information, but I'm skeptical anyone at Luxottica stated the reason they left Cincinnati was because of a lack of a hub. Luxottica's US headquarters is based in Mason, a Cincinnati suburb. Their international headquarters is in Milan, as Luxottica is, and always was, an Italian company.

 

Luxottica USA Inc, formerly of Cincinnati, is headquartered in Port Washington NY, a Nassau County suburb of NYC.  (Sorry for getting way off topic.)

2 hours ago, mrnyc said:

it's true the HQ could move out to nyc or charlotte (yarrrrgh!) or wherever and R&D stay put, or something like that, but really that makes no sense. especially for such an old, well established company. isn't the whole point here to both expand and consolidate as much as possible? i just don't see that happening. it would be quite a shocker. just a guess of course.

LeBron leaves....then imagine SW leaving? 

 

It would be like a like that billboard was cursed. 

11 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

knock it off

If you didnt want it discussed, you probably shouldn't have posted it in the first place.  

 

I know nothing, man. Just speculating like everyone else.

I’m not gonna fear the worst but I fear the worst lol. That would be such an economic blow to the city. And even more than an economic blow, the psychological one that it would give this city is one that can’t be quantified in dollars and cents. It would be another blow to this city and this region, and another black eye to all of us. We can’t lose a company that’s been here for 100 years. We just can’t. That would be horrifying

25 minutes ago, West153 said:

If you didnt want it discussed, you probably shouldn't have posted it in the first place.  

 

I know nothing, man. Just speculating like everyone else.

 

 

Where did I post it's SW execs watching this forum? When did I say they were leaving? What I'm asking that you knock off is putting words in my mouth that were never said. Got it? Can we move on now? 

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by Clefan98

10 minutes ago, inlovewithCLE said:

I’m not gonna fear the worst but I fear the worst lol. That would be such an economic blow to the city. And even more than an economic blow, the psychological one that it would give this city is one that can’t be quantified in dollars and cents. It would be another blow to this city and this region, and another black eye to all of us. We can’t lose a company that’s been here for 100 years. We just can’t. That would be horrifying

It’s all hands on deck to retain SHW and they’ll be incentivized to stay like nobody’s business.  I side with those who say if SHW decides to leave it’s on them.

 

My gut tells me if they planned to leave Cleveland they wouldn’t string us along.  It could just be they’re being thorough in their search.

 

41 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

 

It has nothing to do with our thoughts. I don't want anything tied back to me or my source, so knock it off. 

You could reveal elements of your source without tying anything to you or them.  Do they work at SHW, work in real estate, work in government?

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by Sapper Daddy
Autocorrect typo

@KJP

 

Can you shed some light on the latest rumor?

1 hour ago, marty15 said:

Hub? SHW execs have basically their own personal airport 5 minutes away. #BKE. ?

 

@marty15 - If you're referring to Burke, its code is BKL, not BKE.

 

Edited September 17, 20195 yr by Pugu

Me, every time I open this thread.

59 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

It has nothing to do with our thoughts. I don't want anything tied back to me or my source, so knock it off. 

 

23 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

Where did I post it's SW execs watching this forum? When did I say they were leaving? What I'm asking that you knock off is putting words in my mouth that were never said. Got it? Can we move on now? 

@Clefan98 no offense but you know you can’t just casually toss something so inflammatory into this thread with such ambiguous language and not expect it to cause a big stir. Whether you like it or not, folks are going to press for further detail and clarification. 

A firm on SHW's behalf solicited proposals from the two national construction management firms for more than one downtown Cleveland site, and ONLY for downtown Cleveland sites. Considering these firms are national and that this agent, working on behalf of SHW, was initiating the RFQ, that should tell you something. If SHW or its agent was initiating a search for sites outside Cleveland, I would know it.

 

However.... there is a real possibility that property owners/developers from outside Northeast Ohio have independently reached out to SHW, just as DiGeronimo has for its Brecksville site. The only reason why I knew about DiGeronimo is because one of their executives flat-out told me so over lunch.

 

Unfortunately, I haven't had lunch (or breakfast, or drinks, etc.) with anyone representing a property/development firm from outside of Greater Cleveland so I know if any of them have submitted unsolicited proposals to SHW.

2 minutes ago, KJP said:

Unfortunately, I haven't had lunch (or breakfast, or drinks, etc.) with anyone representing a property/development firm from outside of Greater Cleveland so I know if any of them have submitted unsolicited proposals to SHW.

Nashville. It's gotta be Nashville. They're still sore about "losing" the Medical Mart to CLE. 

5 minutes ago, KJP said:

A firm on SHW's behalf solicited proposals from the two national construction management firms for more than one downtown Cleveland site, and ONLY for downtown Cleveland sites. Considering these firms are national and that this agent, working on behalf of SHW, was initiating the RFQ, that should tell you something. If SHW or its agent was initiating a search for sites outside Cleveland, I would know it.

 

However.... there is a real possibility that property owners/developers from outside Northeast Ohio have independently reached out to SHW, just as DiGeronimo has for its Brecksville site. The only reason why I knew about DiGeronimo is because one of their executives flat-out told me so over lunch.

 

Unfortunately, I haven't had lunch (or breakfast, or drinks, etc.) with anyone representing a property/development firm from outside of Greater Cleveland so I know if any of them have submitted unsolicited proposals to SHW.

 

So, is @Clefan98 insider report of SW being at 50/50 accurate? 

 

Looks like Dallas and SW have had some communication as well according to the latest news reports. 

Here is what I heard....  S-W was planning on building a HQ and R&D complex on Burke Lakefront, but that deal fell through.   S-W would prefer to stay in Downtown Cleveland, but would be willing to move, if they get a much better deal elsewhere... Pittsburgh was recently being evaluated as a potential site as well.

 

3 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

So, is @Clefan98 insider report of SW being at 50/50 accurate? 

 

Looks like Dallas and SW have had some communication as well according to the latest news reports. 

 

How could anyone know the accuracy of odds about something that hasn't happened yet? Even SHW's CEO doesn't know because he hasn't gotten the proposals back yet. Patience, because we have no other choice.

4 minutes ago, Villager said:

Here is what I heard....  S-W was planning on building a HQ and R&D complex on Burke Lakefront, but that deal fell through.   S-W would prefer to stay in Downtown Cleveland, but would be willing to move, if they get a much better deal elsewhere... Pittsburgh was recently being evaluated as a potential site as well.

 

 

Pittsburgh is interesting... But would it not hurt SW that PPG is HQ there? Or maybe it would beneficial in some ways..

5 minutes ago, Villager said:

Here is what I heard....  S-W was planning on building a HQ and R&D complex on Burke Lakefront, but that deal fell through.   S-W would prefer to stay in Downtown Cleveland, but would be willing to move, if they get a much better deal elsewhere... Pittsburgh was recently being evaluated as a potential site as well.

 

Lol what a foolish post. I hope this was sarcasm because otherwise nice try.

Just now, troeros said:

 

Pittsburgh is interesting... But would it not hurt SW that PPG is HQ there? Or maybe it would beneficial in some ways..

Pretty sure that post was just to post nonsense. Burke would be such a dumb choice and an iconic skyscraper could not be built there and especially within a 2023 timeframe. This poster has heard nothing!

I see this wrapping up sooner than later.  Again, the City has every motivation to not let this drag on and have more competition from outside NE Ohio....  60 days or less I'd say something is announced.  but I have no sources to back that up so take it for what it is

Just now, gottaplan said:

I see this wrapping up sooner than later.  Again, the City has every motivation to not let this drag on and have more competition from outside NE Ohio....  60 days or less I'd say something is announced.  but I have no sources to back that up so take it for what it is

 

Yeah, you're right. An announcement will be made before Jan 2020.

2 minutes ago, WindyBuckeye said:

Pretty sure that post was just to post nonsense. Burke would be such a dumb choice and an iconic skyscraper could not be built there and especially within a 2023 timeframe. This poster has heard nothing!

LOL..ok... The people who know, know what I'm talking about.

1 minute ago, Villager said:

LOL..ok... The people who know, know what I'm talking about.

Yeah nonsense. Explain to me how Burke would make any sense financially or strategically especially in their time frame they want for a move? Same question on moving to Pittsburgh where their biggest competitor is already established and would hinder their growth and SW would be the outsider and already be at a disadvantage to start. How does that make sense? You’re probably that Cleveland trust guy.