I was a little concerned that this project might stall, but if they are adding more floors to the tower then it is a good bet that things are progressing nicely.

 

I cant wait to see all of these projects completed.  Between One River Plaza, South Shore, QSII, the Banks, the Edge and a half a dozen smaller projects on boths sides of the river things are really going to change downtown after a stagnant couple of decades. 

I'm sure some of my neighbors on the river side of Park Place will be less than excited about those additional three two floors.

^Well the tower is getting more slender...so it really isn't that bad.

^ Not really.  From the perspective of Park Place, it's only becoming more slender in depth, not width.

^Ah yes...there is that curve in the river.  So the angle would be different than a simple N/S orientation.

One River Plaza, Cincinnati Condo Project Heads For Construction

Posted Nov 13th 2007 8:02AM by Deidre Woollard

 

For a while the Cincinnati, Ohio market was hot, with projects by several name architects being created. Then, in 2006 as condo developments faced problems, we heard news of a slowdown. But perhaps things are set to look up with the imminent construction of One River Plaza, a nearly $150 million project. The Enquirer reports that preconstruction sales on the project have been strong with 28 condos of the potential 150 available already having been sold. The condos sell in the $550,000 to $2 million range.

 

The project will be built in two phases, a 14-story tower with at least 80 condos and a nine or 10-story condo with 70 condos. The first tower was originally only set to be 12 stories but demands for the penthouses with river and city views prompted an expansion. The towers will include two riverview restaurants, a shared outdoor terrace and amenities that include guest suites, a party room, a doorman and a fitness center. Construction will take 18 months and will start once the project meets a pre-sell mark of $35 million to $36 million.

 

http://www.luxist.com/2007/11/13/one-river-plaza/

One River Plaza Developers want time to sell more units

Business Courier of Cincinnati

 

"Miller-Valentine Group and the Gregory family have requested a 1-year extension to submit a final development plan for their $143 million One River Plaza condominium project, pending the expiration of a preliminary agreement Jan. 11, 2008.

 

Click on link for article.

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2007/12/03/daily51.html?jst=b_ln_hl

 

^ This brings to mind something that I've always wondered.  Just who are these people that buy condos this far in advance, before construction commences?  Are they in apartments somewhere, and saving for an eventual purchase?  Do they own homes that they dislike enough to leave, yet satisfied enough with to wait 2+ years to actually do it?  Are they from out of town, and looking to move to Cincinnati "eventually"?  I only ask because I can't imagine saying, "yes, I want a new place, and I want it exactly 18 months from now".  I'd be pissed if I agreed to purchase, and then found out that the developer was inserting an extra 12 month delay into the plan.  That said, I hope they get this thing built, because it looks cool.

^ This brings to mind something that I've always wondered.  Just who are these people that buy condos this far in advance, before construction commences?  Are they in apartments somewhere, and saving for an eventual purchase?  Do they own homes that they dislike enough to leave, yet satisfied enough with to wait 2+ years to actually do it?  Are they from out of town, and looking to move to Cincinnati "eventually"?  I only ask because I can't imagine saying, "yes, I want a new place, and I want it exactly 18 months from now".  I'd be pissed if I agreed to purchase, and then found out that the developer was inserting an extra 12 month delay into the plan.  That said, I hope they get this thing built, because it looks cool.

 

Most of them have not bought, they have place a deposit on a unit, but not closed on it yet.

essentially they are buying an option contract

darnit

I've got $5 on it that says Ragerunner won't post the 'construction start' article when it comes out ... as long as no one has posted it here yet.

bumer

I've got $5 on it that says Ragerunner won't post the 'construction start' article when it comes out ... as long as no one has posted it here yet.

 

Glad to see you are still such a professional in your posts.

I've got $5 on it that says Ragerunner won't post the 'construction start' article when it comes out ... as long as no one has posted it here yet.

 

Glad to see you are still such a professional in your posts.

 

Unlike other people on here, I will call you out. Not a professional thing, just a candor thing.

Call me out on what? That I have an opinion that doesn't agree with yours on somethings, and that some of the things I have mentioned about the economy and downturn in the RE industry is starting to happen. I am just as big of a supporter in urban development as anyone else (its my job), I just try to look at trends and stats to make judgements on were things may be headed over the next few years. Apparently we have different opinions on were things are headed over the next few years. That what makes these types of boards have some value, people with different opinions and backgrounds discussing topics. 

I've got $5 on it that says Ragerunner won't post the 'construction start' article when it comes out ... as long as no one has posted it here yet.

 

I'll see your $5 & raise you $10!  NO!... NO!!... Your probably right...

Call me out on what? That I have an opinion that doesn't agree with yours on somethings, and that some of the things I have mentioned about the economy and downturn in the RE industry is starting to happen. I am just as big of a supporter in urban development as anyone else (its my job), I just try to look at trends and stats to make judgements on were things may be headed over the next few years. Apparently we have different opinions on were things are headed over the next few years. That what makes these types of boards have some value, people with different opinions and backgrounds discussing topics.

 

That's fine...I think his point was that you only seem to post the negative about pretty much anything on here.  Others (like myself) post both the flattering and not so flattering articles.  Fair and balanced, just like FOX News.

Call me out on what? That I have an opinion that doesn't agree with yours on somethings, and that some of the things I have mentioned about the economy and downturn in the RE industry is starting to happen. I am just as big of a supporter in urban development as anyone else (its my job), I just try to look at trends and stats to make judgements on were things may be headed over the next few years. Apparently we have different opinions on were things are headed over the next few years. That what makes these types of boards have some value, people with different opinions and backgrounds discussing topics.

 

That's fine...I think his point was that you only seem to post the negative about pretty much anything on here.  Others (like myself) post both the flattering and not so flattering articles.  Fair and balanced, just like FOX News.

 

Rando, that's exactly the point I was making.

 

You obviously read the news online (hence the article you posted) ... However if an article was released stating that groundbreaking was taking place that day, and you happen to see it and no one else on here did (which is impossible) ... there is no way in hell that you'd post the article. It would sit for weeks, even though it was an important article pertaining to the thread. You are very biased and the Cincy/Indy threads I think is where all of this spawned from.

 

Just on a side note ... Indy and Cincy are two totally different cities. There is no comparison, so any bitterness that you may carry from previous conversations should be dropped.

 

... It is not just me that sees your "fair and balanced" reporting (obviously), you can do what you want, but it's just silly. Let it go.

 

By the way, RE is also my job. ;)

Back to ORP,      (Question):    If they sell their 50%, say by April.  Then they could possibly start construction in May, right?

 

Are these guys really wanting to wait till next Dec. or is that the absolute max. safety net and they could start next month if they were to pre sell half the units by then?

That Business Courier article reads a lot like the one I published 12 hours earlier:

 

 

One River Plaza seeks extension for final plan

 

Developers of the One River Plaza project are seeking a one-year extension to allow them more time to complete a final development plan.

 

The extension is necessary because their concept plan for the site and the creation of its planned development district (PD-41) are set to expire on January 11, 2008, two years after they were approved.

 

Developers Miller-Valentine Group and the Gregory family announced in early November that they planned to add two more floors to each tower, making them both 15 stories high.

 

If the agreements are not extended, the zoning for the site would revert back to Downtown Development Subdistrict C, throwing the compatibility of the portion of the site north of Pete Rose Way into doubt and making the developers' vision of pedestrian connectivity much more difficult to achieve.

 

The $143 million One River Plaza project will include 150 condominiums, two restaurants, a parking garage and a public plaza on the former site of the Montgomery Inn Banquet Center.

 

Units within the two condo towers, which are already well into pre-sales, will range from $400,000 to several million dollars.

 

The City Planning Commission will consider an extension to January 11, 2009 at their meeting today.

 

A final development plan must be approved by the City Planning Commission and City Council before construction can begin.

 

http://www.building-cincinnati.com/2007/12/one-river-plaza-seeks-extension-for.html

 

Developers Miller-Valentine Group and the Gregory family announced in early November that they planned to add two more floors to each tower, making them both 15 stories high.

 

Both towers are planned to be 15 stories high?  I must have missed that somewhere along the line.  I thought it was just one tower going up to 15.

^ same here  :?

^ Yeah, my bad.  Misinformation on my part.

Anything new going on with One River Plaza?

Anything new going on with One River Plaza?

 

I was just thinking the same thing the other day.

You may have noticed it was the "featured place to live" in the first issue of soapbox this week.

 

If you don't know about soapbox, check it out at soapboxmedia.net

God do I wish these buildings were taller only 15 stories.  I wish they were at least 20, preferably 30.

God do I wish these buildings were taller only 15 stories.  I wish they were at least 20, preferably 30.

 

When you have price points such as the one's at ORP, you immediately eliminate a large fraction of would-be buyers out there that are currently in the market. The demand isn't there. Now, if these were in the $150K-$200K range ...

If you had a little more volume that could bring down the price but units wouldn't be as nice. 

I was at Sawyer Point today and noticed that there is nothing going on at this site.  I am really excited about this project.  It will really finish off the look of the riverfront East of GAPB and help to make the incredibly ugly One Lyle Place less prominent.  It will also be awesome at street level and make Sawyer Point feel a little more upscale. When they tore down the MR building to make room for this I thought that construction wouldnt be far behind.  Silly me.

 

Any idea what the hold up is?  When can we expect construction to start?

I think its safe to say that nobody really knows.  Im going to take a stab and assume that given the current housing market they have yet to reach their presales mark.  That is my guess. 

It's a safe bet.  I know that's the reason the Edge project hasn't started construction yet.

As a realtor, I am getting various updates from them regarding construction, they are being very aggressive with realtor bonuses/perks and send something out about once a month.  So, yes they are still trying to hit their presale mark.

^ Elaborate on "updates from the regarding construction".  I would image they are most likely a vague reference to what we already know...it will begin when they have sold enough.

 

I do hope that this project makes some progress in the near future.  I think these buildings will be a great addition that that end of town.  Anchoring the bridge and giving that section of the park a substantial boost in "big city" urban feel.

 

Sort of on topic - Have they moved the banquet center operations to another location?  I know that was in discussion but i dont know they ever come to a decision.

 

There's one more thing they mentioned for the reason of the hold up.  Aside from presales, they planned on adding a few floors to the taller tower making it 15 stories from the original 12.  I have no clue if this was agreed on but I can't wait until they build these things.  That One Lytle Place is horrific looking...damn near as bad as Crosley Tower at UC( oh God did I just compare something to Crosley?) hahaha.

I do hope that this project makes some progress in the near future.  I think these buildings will be a great addition that that end of town.  Anchoring the bridge and giving that section of the park a substantial boost in "big city" urban feel.

 

I totally agree with that.  Visually, that bridge appears to connect Newport on the Levee with nothingness.  It would be great to see these built on the other side to tie it all together. 

^ Elaborate on "updates from the regarding construction".  I would image they are most likely a vague reference to what we already know...it will begin when they have sold enough.

 

You are correct, mostly fluff and filler to maintain interest in the project and promote sales.

One River Plaza developers ask for second extension

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2008/06/30/daily50.html

Atleast only 5 more units need to be sold before construction starts.  They should have that by years end easy.

Riverfront condo project will wait

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080704/BIZ01/807040341/1076/NEWS

Ugh.  They're delaying for a whole year?  Maybe they need to reexamine their model for One River Plaza.  Yes, it looks amazing.  And yes, each unit will be unbelievable.  But if you pre-sell under 40% of your units in an amazing downtown location with gasoline prices rising, baby boomers retiring to the city, just as everything seems to be trending inward back to the urban core... then you're doing something wrong.  The housing market is rough right now, but the market is also saturated with luxury condos.  If they altered their goal to have units between $150k and $300k, I think they'd be seeing a lot more interest.

Ugh.  They're delaying for a whole year?

 

They're asking for an extension, to their TIF agreement, for 1-year.  That does not necessarily mean that they are delaying the project for an entire year.  Heck their first agreement doesn't run up for several months...it just looks like they're being proactive.  If they were to sell the 5 more units they need to hit 40%, then I bet you'll see them start moving forward.

 

If they altered their goal to have units between $150k and $300k, I think they'd be seeing a lot more interest.

 

I couldn't agree with you more...however this location would struggle getting permission (I've heard of some complaints from people up on Mt. Adams about this possibly blocking views of the river and what not) for any more density.  Density that would be needed to help offset the revenues for the lower price tags.  That is why 5th & Race seems perfect for condos in that price range.

the thougt that boomers are flocking back to the urban core is true but delayed to to the housing crisis. I am willing to bet a large percentage of boomers thinking about downsizing and selling their suburban homes are waiting for the housing market to recover. T/f I wouldn't say the model they are using is necessarily flawed; its more a victim of the market, moreso than some other developments.

Good points, both Rando and Lester.  But I still think that there's a saturation component to this that the developer should consider.  Their prices start at $400k for a one bedroom condo.  Even if the market was healthy, how many $400k+ condos can the area sustain?  It seems like there are a fair amount of luxury condo complexes going up around the river already, so I think if they were offering something different, they might stand out a little more.

^Very true.    I know I will never consider a 400k+ condo, but 1-150k would be worth considering.

Or maybe not have all the condos going up around the river be luxury.  Mix it up a little.  I'm not saying make it shabby oh no.  But hey, put a very nice tower with apartments in the mix or several of them.

One River Plaza on hold

By Lisa Bernard-Kuhn, Cincinnati Enquirer, December 15, 2008

 

The national credit crunch and slipping economy has forced Miller Valentine Group to put on hold its riverfront condominium development, One River Plaza, for up to two years, the Dayton-based company said Monday.

 

Click on link for article.

One River Plaza, let me introduce you to Nordstrom.  You both disgust me.  Thank you for another unneeded pile of dirt/surface lot in the CBD.

Keep the faith.  Condos is that spot are the answer and will get done.