Can I ask a dumb question? What is the difference between something going before the planning commission, and being on the landmarks agenda?

landmarks is only related to historic properties and districts or developments proposed within those districts. planning commission is more generally related to all development proposals.

Can I ask a dumb question? What is the difference between something going before the planning commission, and being on the landmarks agenda?

 

If there is any proposal to alter a designated city landmark, or to change and area within a designated landmark district, it must go through the Landmarks Commission. The purpose is so said development does not adversely alter the historic landmark. 

 

Edit: CbusTransit[/member] beat me to it. But if you're ever bored, here's some fun reading about it: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B16RJdSArUFacEZfYmVkaXp3T1U/view?usp=sharing

It's titled Master Plan and Phase 1.  Does it need renderings, or is it more so a study for feasibility or economic impact?  Phase 1 may imply a Ph 1 Environmental Site Assessment.  Do we know who brought this in front of the planning commission?

 

A master plan suggests a site plan and phase 1 suggests an elevation and/or massing of one component of that master plan. I would expect renderings of some kind for the concept, or at least a massing much like what nuCLEus provided to Landmarks in its conceptual plans for the Gateway District. The purpose of this is to get guidance from Landmarks before spending more money on architectural fees for detailed plans.

I'm confused. So no one knows what's happening on this site?

I'm confused. So no one knows what's happening on this site?

 

Someone knows! I just don't know who and what.

 

EDIT: I suggest that when details emerge, we create a thread "Cleveland: Warehouse District Superblock development" or something like that.

Did anyone attend the meeting today? 

Not that I've seen on Twitter from media or by googling articles. Nothing. Glad to see our Cleveland media is on top of things.

Not that I've seen on Twitter from media or by googling articles. Nothing. Glad to see our Cleveland media is on top of things.

 

Thus the reason for my question about a dedicated "Urban Cleveland" site

 

Edit: I'm also surprised how Cimperman knows nothing about it

It was pulled at the last minute.  There was no presentation today at the Landmarks Commission.

Not that I've seen on Twitter from media or by googling articles. Nothing. Glad to see our Cleveland media is on top of things.

 

Thus the reason for my question about a dedicated "Urban Cleveland" site

 

Edit: I'm also surprised how Cimperman knows nothing about it

I'm sure he does, as do others, as KJP said up thread.  People know what's going on here.  I go back to what I said about a month ago.  A reliable source had told me that a developer wants something out of the ground by years end, but he couldn't say anything else.  All he did say was this particular developer is starting to become more active downtown, and it's not Geis. 

Hey all -

 

I received a copy of the Landmarks Commission agenda via email on Tuesday evening, and that item wasn't on it. The agenda online is incorrect. (Interesting, but incorrect.) Stay tuned.

 

Michelle

It's titled Master Plan and Phase 1.  Does it need renderings, or is it more so a study for feasibility or economic impact?  Phase 1 may imply a Ph 1 Environmental Site Assessment.  Do we know who brought this in front of the planning commission?

 

A master plan suggests a site plan and phase 1 suggests an elevation and/or massing of one component of that master plan. I would expect renderings of some kind for the concept, or at least a massing much like what nuCLEus provided to Landmarks in its conceptual plans for the Gateway District. The purpose of this is to get guidance from Landmarks before spending more money on architectural fees for detailed plans.

 

There is something out there.  Your comment about the massing in regards to another project is correct.

Not that I've seen on Twitter from media or by googling articles. Nothing. Glad to see our Cleveland media is on top of things.

 

Thus the reason for my question about a dedicated "Urban Cleveland" site

 

Edit: I'm also surprised how Cimperman knows nothing about it

I'm sure he does, as do others, as KJP said up thread.  People know what's going on here.  I go back to what I said about a month ago.  A reliable source had told me that a developer wants something out of the ground by years end, but he couldn't say anything else.  All he did say was this particular developer is starting to become more active downtown, and it's not Geis.

Could it be K&D?

No, it's definitely not K&D.  The already have their hands full with Leader & Halle plus office renovations at Reserve Square.

I've heard talks about Weston developing one of those lots. Not sure how reliable my source is though, so I can't really confirm the rumors.

I've heard talks about Weston developing one of those lots. Not sure how reliable my source is though, so I can't really confirm the rumors.

 

Weston owns most of the property involved (see my property ownership maps on the prior page) under the name West 3rd & Superior Ltd, so they are a party to the development. The question is, are they the lead developer? I tend to doubt it, otherwise why acquire two properties under a name (550 Superior LLC) that's different from the one that they've used to acquire other properties in the Superblock? And a third property was acquired by company with a name that's a combination of the buyers "550 Superior LLC & West 3rd & Superior Ltd".

 

Considering Stark's headquarters is at the Northeast corner of the Superblock, I'm going to take a wild guess that Stark is the mystery company behind 550 Superior.

I just find it hard to believe that Stark is involved in this as well. He's got wayyyy too much going on already between 515 Euclid and NuCLEus

Yeah I agree that it seems like Stark already has way too much going on. But I can't think of any other developers if it's not K&D. I've heard that Clayco might be interested in investing more in Cleveland (they're the ones building that student housing across from the Levin College). However, I doubt they've moved this quickly.

I just find it hard to believe that Stark is involved in this as well. He's got wayyyy too much going on already between 515 Euclid and NuCLEus

 

And the new development in Chicago. And there's something going on with his parking lot properties at West 9th and St. Clair, but I think he's just playing landlord there.

I saw the proposal for this mega project in the PD this morning, and must say I am very impressed.  Can't load here from my phone.  Funny, I just talked with Dan Walsh last night, and he said, stay tuned, he has a big development in the works.  Then less then 8 hours, I see this article.

 

We'll see if they really do move this quick, by early 2016.  Seems extremely ambitious. 

Weston, Citymark plan apartments for Warehouse District parking lots: First Look

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio – Apartment buildings could start climbing early next year at the edge of a Warehouse District parking lot, forming the first corner of a project that eventually might grow to 1,200 residences spanning two city blocks.

 

Members of the Asher family have owned a sea of parking lots just northwest of Public Square for years. Now their family-run real estate company, Weston, Inc., is teaming up with Daniel Walsh, a well-known local banking executive who launched an apartment-investment business last year, to pursue a residential vision for one of the center city's largest blank spots.

 

 

Outstanding!!

Game. Changer.

 

Now if we can just get this and Nucleus beyond concept art...

I've been waiting for this news for years. I almost want to cry

Those renderings look fantastic!

There goes my diagonal shortcut across the parking lot walking to Heinen's... Just kidding, fantastic news from a national developer with reputable financing! Turns out there was more to the bore sample trucks this summer than previously thought. As usual, Michelle with the scoop!

This is some seriously great news. This scheme looks like it has a nice mix of the human scale which the Warehouse District is good for and some highrise construction which will increase density and fill in some skyline gaps.

 

Also, unrelated, but I'm liking this trend of showing Cleveland projects in the winter in renderings. Not every day is going to be sunny, 80, with blue skies like many renderings suggest. This, nuCLEus, and Public Square have all released winter renderings which show hints of how the projects can transition into the season while still being usable spaces.

I love waking up on a Friday morning to a bad@$$ development proposal AND a park renovation on the riverfront. Amazing.

i can't even. this is certainly the article we have all been waiting to read for decades. and the renders are exactly want anyone could have ever wanted or hoped for. make it so!

Have we finally hooked our white whale?

Excited for the project because those parking lots made my eyes bleed! I like that it's built to the street with what seems like parking that is hidden behind the buildings well. I do feel the building design can be done better to tie in better with the historical neighborhood. I do like that the heights of the buildings match or are close to the ones across the street from them. It allows the heights to vary while not looking out of place. Also I'm pumped about the 23 story building! Overall I'm excited about this project I just want the design to tie in better with their surroundings.

Any ideas what the glassy low rise thing along Superior would be?

This is awesome news, and overall looks quite good! However, I hate to be that guy, but I do have some issues with the design:

 

1) Why the heck is there a slight setback with the buildings facing W. 6th St? That area in particular should have no setbacks.

2) I'd prefer more variance in design between the 3 towers. They're all practically the same except for their general size and massing.

3) They could do a better job with the interaction with Superior. I think it'd be better if the tallest tower was along Superior instead of W. 3rd.

 

I liked Stark's previous Warehouse District plan better, but I'm glad this one at least has a chance of happening!

Excited for the project because those parking lots made my eyes bleed! I like that it's built to the street with what seems like parking that is hidden behind the buildings well. I do feel the building design can be done better to tie in better with the historical neighborhood. I do like that the heights of the buildings match or are close to the ones across the street from them. It allows the heights to vary while not looking out of place. Also I'm pumped about the 23 story building! Overall I'm excited about this project I just want the design to tie in better with their surroundings.

 

These are buildings of their time.  They don't have to tie in with the historic fabric.

My only complaint is that this was the perfect site for a new Justice Center complex.  If this development actually comes to fruition, my crystal ball would point to Dan Gilbert selling off the Phase 2 casino land, and new Justice Center finding a home next to the Federal Courts.

 

This is awesome news, and overall looks quite good! However, I hate to be that guy, but I do have some issues with the design:

 

1) Why the heck is there a slight setback with the buildings facing W. 6th St? That area in particular should have no setbacks.

2) I'd prefer more variance in design between the 3 towers. They're all practically the same except for their general size and massing.

3) They could do a better job with the interaction with Superior. I think it'd be better if the tallest tower was along Superior instead of W. 3rd.

 

I liked Stark's previous Warehouse District plan better, but I'm glad this one at least has a chance of happening!

I believe that the tower is that tall because if I'm not mistaken that is the Jacobs lot in front of it in one of the renderings. Which I think was done so that when something gets built it doesn't look out of place. I may be wrong but that's how I saw it. I do agree that the design could use some variation.

 

These are buildings of their time.  They don't have to tie in with the historic fabric.

Excited for the project because those parking lots made my eyes bleed! I like that it's built to the street with what seems like parking that is hidden behind the buildings well. I do feel the building design can be done better to tie in better with the historical neighborhood. I do like that the heights of the buildings match or are close to the ones across the street from them. It allows the heights to vary while not looking out of place. Also I'm pumped about the 23 story building! Overall I'm excited about this project I just want the design to tie in better with their surroundings.

If they don't have to match then the design could vary a bit as urbanophile mentioned. The design looks too stale due to all the buildings having all the same/very similar design. I just personally like buildings that incorporate a mixture of materials they just look more interesting imo everything else about the site layout I enjoy.

Also was retail at the bottom mentioned?

EDIT: Nevermind I see they mention patios lining the first floor. This sounds like restaurants going in here though. I wouldn't be opposed to them but would prefer a mix of shopping here with this brand new development. I believe it's time to take that plunge. I would much rather spend my time downtown shopping then searching through various suburban malls.

I really like that Dan Walsh, and his group Citigroup is behind this.  Dan spent a number of years developing the real estate group at Key bank throughout the 90's.  He then moved over to Huntington, and took that expertise with him there.  He understands the real estate lending environment, possibly better than anyone in Ohio.  He also has the banking relationships.  I know he has raised a lot of money through his PE, and I know, this is not something he would announce, and put out there without knowing the lenders where there for him. 

Also was retail at the bottom mentioned?

EDIT: Nevermind I see they mention patios lining the first floor. This sounds like restaurants going in here though. I wouldn't be opposed to them but would prefer a mix of shopping here with this brand new development. I believe it's time to take that plunge. I would much rather spend my time downtown shopping then searching through various suburban malls.

 

Really don't understand your quote about retail (that it is time we take the plunge).  You  make it sound as if a central committee is deciding whether or not retail expands downtown rather than market conditions.

I really like that Dan Walsh, and his group Citigroup is behind this.  Dan spent a number of years developing the real estate group at Key bank throughout the 90's.  He then moved over to Huntington, and took that expertise with him there.  He understands the real estate lending environment, possibly better than anyone in Ohio.  He also has the banking relationships.  I know he has raised a lot of money through his PE, and I know, this is not something he would announce, and put out there without knowing the lenders where there for him. 

 

I just heard him speak last night and there were hints of some big apartment project... didn't realize that meant an announcement today!  This is awesome.

Citymark?? I love when someone I've never heard of before but has some juice puts his money back into his city to make it better.

 

Also was retail at the bottom mentioned?

EDIT: Nevermind I see they mention patios lining the first floor. This sounds like restaurants going in here though. I wouldn't be opposed to them but would prefer a mix of shopping here with this brand new development. I believe it's time to take that plunge. I would much rather spend my time downtown shopping then searching through various suburban malls.

 

Really don't understand your quote about retail (that it is time we take the plunge).  You  make it sound as if a central committee is deciding whether or not retail expands downtown rather than market conditions.

I understand market conditions determine it. I'm not saying grab an Armani or Burberry but I'm sure there are local retailers that can be had. I'm not saying lets make this Michigan Ave. because I know that our market can't hold it but I'm sure there are some quality shopping stores that are local stores like a geigers that are willing to test the market as well.

I really like that Dan Walsh, and his group Citigroup is behind this.  Dan spent a number of years developing the real estate group at Key bank throughout the 90's.  He then moved over to Huntington, and took that expertise with him there.  He understands the real estate lending environment, possibly better than anyone in Ohio.  He also has the banking relationships.  I know he has raised a lot of money through his PE, and I know, this is not something he would announce, and put out there without knowing the lenders where there for him. 

 

This is definitely good to hear. No big deal, but to avoid confusion given Walsh's banking backgroud, his new firm is "Citymark."  No connection to Citigroup, the huge NY-based financial conglomerate.

I'm speechless other than to say this is awesome and obviously remedies the most vexing eyesore in downtown Cleveland ... and it came out of the blue... Just goes to show how truly high the demand for apt units is in downtown especially now that the adaptive reuse office building supply is suddenly becoming scarce.  ... and the banks are seriously opening their coffers for new construction at long last. 

I really like that Dan Walsh, and his group Citigroup is behind this.  Dan spent a number of years developing the real estate group at Key bank throughout the 90's.  He then moved over to Huntington, and took that expertise with him there.  He understands the real estate lending environment, possibly better than anyone in Ohio.  He also has the banking relationships.  I know he has raised a lot of money through his PE, and I know, this is not something he would announce, and put out there without knowing the lenders where there for him. 

 

This is definitely good to hear. No big deal, but to avoid confusion given Walsh's banking backgroud, his new firm is "Citymark."  No connection to Citigroup, the huge NY-based financial conglomerate.

LOL, that's what I meant.  Thanks for clarifying for the thread though.

Yawn.  Sorry to be a downer, but I've seen probably 5 renderings on these parking lots in the last 10 years with no action.  Obviously would be a great project, but I will wait until the construction equipment arrives to get excited.

Yawn.  Sorry to be a downer, but I've seen probably 5 renderings on these parking lots in the last 10 years with no action.  Obviously would be a great project, but I will wait until the construction equipment arrives to get excited.

 

Besides Stark's plan, what other serious development had been proposed and brought before City Planning?

Yawn.  Sorry to be a downer, but I've seen probably 5 renderings on these parking lots in the last 10 years with no action.  Obviously would be a great project, but I will wait until the construction equipment arrives to get excited.

5 renderings?  I can only think of the plan from Stark about 9 years ago.  Which other parties are you referring to?  Jacobs was not onthis lot, and was killed in the recession.