I had been hearing about Crocker Park as part of the next generation of "lifestyle center," beyond Easton. I had even seen pictures of it on Urban Ohio and thought it looked pretty interesting. When I found myself recently in Westlake at a regional Ohio Planning Conference meeting, I followed the advice of the breakfast speaker, Westlake Mayor Dennis Clough, and visited Crocker Park after my presentation.

 

Pretty Crocker Boulevard streetscape

 

Handsome buildings, retro lightposts, Christmas tree

 

 

Wow! It even has a Barnes & Noble

 

Looking to the south, out of "town"

 

Long shot of the same street

 

It even has pedestrians -- almost like a real place

 

Crocker Park, in context

 

Backstreets deadend into parking garages

 

From across Crocker Road, it looks typically suburban sprawly

 

Set back from Crocker Road, it turns inward -- mooning passing motorists with parking garages

 

The main entrance to Crocker Park is at Crocker Blvd., which is accessible only to southbound traffic on Crocker Road -- where there is not even a crosswalk (note the woman jaywalking).

 

Planners understand urban vistas. Roads that have a distant endpoint (from a bend or angle in the road, or a dead end) typically have something distinctive there: a city hall, or courthouse, or church, or park and monument. At Crocker Park, the endpoint is: Dick's sporting goods.

 

Soon after I took this picture, as I made my way back to my car, I decided to stop in a Barnes and Noble. As I approached the door, I noticed a big SUV labeled "Crocker Park Security." As I entered, the uniformed guard asked me about my camera and said there had been reports of someone taking pictures. That is forbidden without permission, he said. I pointed out the window to the crowd of people, some wielding cameras, who had gotten off a tour bus and explained that they were coming from the same conference as me, but that I was unable to sign up for the tour. He seemed uncomfortable about enforcing a stupid rule, but our exchange was interrupted by another bookstore patron who overheard. He said he was a Westlake resident and was outraged that people were being stopped for taking pictures on (quasi?) public streets and demanded to talk to Crocker Park management. I continued on my way, and the security guard showed the guy to the management office. I don't know who that man was, but I wanted to thank him.

 

That little vignette makes this last picture an appropriate finale (note the signs):

 

Crocker Park: "Welcome to the neighborhood."

"Keep moving"

 

Pretty soon they'll outlaw cameras.

Crockerhell

Waiting for the pope's response...

*vomits*

Maybe they don't like photos because they know people will be making fun of them on message boards.

i went to crocker park the day after thanksgiving with some friends and I was surprised at how dead it was.  perhaps the cache has already worn off.  i also wonder just how many people live at crocker park.  at night i don't see too many windows lit up above the stores. why anyone would want to live there is beyond me...

I dont understand the attraction, especially if its just like Legacy Village.  :?

 

I'd still go to beachwood before going either of those places!

I still say that all these will turn out like the Continent.

I dont understand the attraction, especially if its just like Legacy Village.  :?

 

I'd still go to beachwood before going either of those places!

 

I guess because until Crocker Park west siders had to drive all the way to Legacy/Beachwood if they wanted stuff from the stores only available at those two east side locations. This saves them a 45 minute -1 hour long drive.

... i also wonder just how many people live at crocker park.  at night i don't see too many windows lit up above the stores. why anyone would want to live there is beyond me...

 

Probably safer than a trailer park, but less interesting, too.

If it's gonna be fake anyway, malls at least keep you warm in the winter.

My take, being that there was/is demand for retail in Westlake, Avon, Avon Lake area, they did it right.  Would everyone have rather seen big box retailers here?  Simple fact is, there are always suburbs around an American big city that demand retail and office space.  I must say, Crocker Park is a great example of how retail in the suburbs should be.  I would have never imagined a strip mall/retail area looking like this back in the 90's.  It is a move in the right direction.  Don't get me wrong, I would also love to see Euclid Ave with all of this retail, but that time will come. 

While the development looks nice, it is unfortunate that it could not have been developed more along the main artery or perhaps closer in town. It's a start, but we need more of this with a more intriguing center point and a bit closer.

Crocker Park has an exciting mix of retail and lifestyle options.  The scale and style of the architecture and streetscapes is reminiscient of the classic American hometown.

Crocker Park has an exciting mix of retail and lifestyle options.  The scale and style of the architecture and streetscapes is reminiscient of the classic American hometown.

 

Uhhhhhh....

 

Really?!?!

Crocker Park has an exciting mix of retail and lifestyle options.  The scale and style of the architecture and streetscapes is reminiscient of the classic American hometown.

 

Uhhhhhh....

 

Really?!?!

 

He's being sarcastic.

they make'm so easy to goof on.

Crocker Park has an exciting mix of retail and lifestyle options.  The scale and style of the architecture and streetscapes is reminiscient of the classic American hometown.

 

Thank you... Mr. Commercial Real Estate Developer.

Crocker Park has an exciting mix of retail and lifestyle options.  The scale and style of the architecture and streetscapes is reminiscient of the classic American hometown.

 

Thank you... Mr. Commercial Real Estate Developer.

 

someone got it ;) 

Looks like a great place to Live, Work and Play.

...it is unfortunate that it could not have been developed more along the main artery...

 

That's why for me, it's really not so different from a big concrete indoor mall.  I guess maybe it looks a little better from the public street, but that's speaks more to the design of the parking deck than anything else.  Now if Stark had actually been able to narrow and slow Crocker Road and throw this stuff on either side, lure a public library branch etc., and came up with a design idiom slightly less cloying...

 

I'd be curious to see how "lifestyle" centers stack up to enclosed malls re. energy consumption.  I'm assuming it's less because there isn't a big common space to heat and cool, but then again, there are a lot more doors and windows letting conditioned air out...

How does Crocker Park compare to Steelyard Commons?  Steelyard at least is in the city of Cleveland.. and seems to have a much more "essential" retail mix (Giant Eagle, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target)

aw come on...any place with a Trader Joe's can't be too bad. Despite its contrived, pseudo-cheery "California" vibe it's not a bad place to shop and won't break the bank like Whole Foods. At least the lines at this location can't be as bad as the ones in Manhattan!!

Waiting for the pope's response...

 

you looking for something related to cracker park?

 

the place is not a place to live. You need a car to get over the giant eagle in the order portion of the facility (1970s strip mall)

It would be nice if Crocker Park would have integrated better with the Promenade - like breaking up that wall of stores from the theater to OfficeMax with a couple of arcades that connected back to Crocker Park, and filling in the Promenade's vast parking lot with more ground level retail and a central garage.  As it is, the Promenade is just standard suburban strip mall crap.  Living at Crocker Park would be a better deal if daily conveniences such as a 7-11, dry cleaner, coffee shop, pharmacy, post office, and bank were walkable - I don't think the average Crocker Park resident visits Z Gallerie or Chico's nearly as often as they do "necessity shopping" like Drug Mart etc., so what's the benefit of living near/above these stores except for the "prestige" factor?  At least authentic neighborhoods like Clifton, Coventry, Shaker Square, and Cedar Fairmount have some/all of these necessity destinations.

The only thing that might make Crocker Park better then Legacy Village, Steelyard, ect. is the fact that people actually live there.

Looks like an ideal place to Live, Work, Shop, and Play.

A lot of good food for thought here. Crocker Park is a big improvement on standard suburban development, but a long way from what is needed. It's not a neighborhood, but a destination shopping center that includes housing. It needs businesses that relate to the housing. It should have been developed flanking Crocker Road, which would have done two things: 1) integrated it into the real world and 2) made at least part of it a real public place, where citizens couldn't be hassled for taking pictures.

^i'm no constitution attorney, but doesn't this qualify as "private property intended as a public space?

 

Are the sidewalks private? or westlake's?

I have never been to Crocker Park, but from pictures I've seen, CP is much less gross than Legacy Village.  CP seems to have less land area devoted to surface parking since they have garages while I don't think Legacy has any.  Legacy is surrounded by a sea of surface parking and all but one of the "roads" is designed specifically for cars to get to whatever parking area they need to get to.

 

Crocker Park is larger than Legacy but Steelyard takes up more space than both of them.

A lot of good food for thought here. Crocker Park is a big improvement on standard suburban development, but a long way from what is needed. It's not a neighborhood, but a destination shopping center that includes housing. It needs businesses that relate to the housing. It should have been developed flanking Crocker Road, which would have done two things: 1) integrated it into the real world and 2) made at least part of it a real public place, where citizens couldn't be hassled for taking pictures.

 

Agree 100%.

Set back from Crocker Road, it turns inward -- mooning passing motorists with parking garages

 

Outstanding observation of Crocker Park and its relation to its surroundings. I think Crocker Park would have felt more genuine if it also had a street presence along Crocker Road.

 

Planners understand urban vistas. Roads that have a distant endpoint (from a bend or angle in the road, or a dead end) typically have something distinctive there: a city hall, or courthouse, or church, or park and monument. At Crocker Park, the endpoint is: Dick's sporting goods.

 

Stark originally wanted to have Westlake build its new City Hall there, but city officials didn't want to appear to be beholded to a private developer. Stark also wanted to build a community center at the south end of Main Street but it hasn't happened yet. It got canned when Stark was courting a luxury hotelier. That plan also fell through. Instead, Stark sought and got land rezoned at the corner of Crocker and Detroit roads for a different hotel. Depending on how the hotel is built, it could provide the street presence on the major, through roads in the area that Crocker Park lacks.

 

I noticed a big SUV labeled "Crocker Park Security." As I entered, the uniformed guard asked me about my camera and said there had been reports of someone taking pictures. That is forbidden without permission, he said.

 

I seem to recall that these are city streets and I've seen Westlake police patrol them on foot. But I don't know if these are police officers hired and working off-duty for Crocker Park.

 

How does Crocker Park compare to Steelyard Commons?   Steelyard at least is in the city of Cleveland.. and seems to have a much more "essential" retail mix (Giant Eagle, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target)

 

Sadly, the more urban development (Crocker Park) is in the exurb and the more suburban development (Steelyard Commons) is near downtown Cleveland. Sometimes I just don't understand real estate developers.

 

the place is not a place to live. You need a car to get over the giant eagle in the order [older] portion of the facility (1970s strip mall)

 

Once fully built-out, Crocker Park could have as many as 2,000 residents. And the Promenade (built in 1990) has an attractive courtyard area for pedestrians to walk between Crocker Park and the Promenade. And, at the opposite end of Crocker Park where most of the residences are and will be is Trader Joe's. It's a pretty decent-sized store. The Trader Joe's appears to be about as large as the Giant Eagle store near me at West 117th and Clifton.

In the Crocker image, I can see infill being developed along Crocker Road at one point (don't hold your breath). From the photos provided, retail stores can be implemented, along with on-street parking, in front of the parking structures. Such fantasies do happen: we have a parking structure designed in a similar fashion with planned shops in front, so it could be done here at one point.

 

Redevelopment of the 1970s era shopping center above Crocker can later include more pedestrian-friendly environments that Crockerland to the south demonstrates.

 

The exterior parking lots can become other uses down the road. The great thing with vast parking lots, especially in urban areas, is that they provide developers ample room to construct a money-making development, whether it is residential or commercial units.

Unless there were a massive curb cut, I doubt there will ever be on street parking on Crocker.

what about this?

 

one of the most dissapointing things about it is how crocker park is not only set back from, but completely turns its back to crocker road. is there any way that can be addressed in the future?

 

it seems like there is room between crocker rd and the buildings to add a line of street facing shops, offices, etc., no? do you think if the hotel gets built on the corner of crocker and detroit it could help that kind of development along?

 

its just depressing to drive up crocker rd like off the highway, you almost wouldn't even know crocker park is there.

The problem is that Crocker Park is in a bubble - across Crocker Road you have a string of the garden-variety office building/sea of asphalt crap from Detroit going south. Then you have the Crocker-Stearns extension to I-480 which is going to pour a sh!tload of traffic onto Crocker. As much as I'm for traffic calming, I don't see much benefit for the area by locating shops along Crocker.

^All to say, Westlake is a lost cause, and Crocker Park is really just another suburban shopping mall that just happens to be more pleasant to walk around in, once you've driven in and parked.

 

Beachwood place has apartment towers in its parking lots- housing at the mall is not new.  The difference to me is purely cosmetic.

hmm i didn't think of it for traffic calming, just to make it more inviting and useful. the main benefit would be mostly for crocker park residents, so i am talking only about the westside of crocker between the road and the setbacks of the cp buildings.

 

looking over that particular stretch i immediately thought of a stripmall string of small shops. nothing fancy. those could be small enough to have your little dry cleaner, convenience store/deli, copyshop, etc. in other words a place for that kind of practical stuff that crocker park lacks and i guess wouldn't want.

 

not a very attractive idea to stark i guess.

 

 

Oh God, my retna's have been burned!

 

I dont understand the attraction, especially if its just like Legacy Village.  :?

 

I'd still go to beachwood before going either of those places!

 

Anyone with sense and good taste would do the same!

 

Looks like an ideal place to Live, Work, Shop, and Play.

Yeah, to the blind!

 

 

 

 

That was sarcasm!!!