HUH???

 

Pretty ambitious. . .doubt it'll happen. A hotel in Dayton that's taller than 73 stories? riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight  :laugh:

 

Kudos if they can pull it off, but it better be downtown and not in the gutter of Riverside. In fact, If the museum does move forward, I'd like to see them seek out the arcade as a possible place to have such a museum.

 

http://dayton.bizjournals.com/dayton/stories/2007/12/03/story6.html

I would think a hotel that large is a city the size of Dayton would drain off business from the existing hotels...not a good situation for them. 

^---Yea, but wouldn't that be freakin awesome!!!  :-D

 

This is actually an idea that's been around for quite sometime. A friend of mine showed me this plan about 3 years ago from someone that had inside eyes. I actually posted something about it here in the forums to see if anyone else knew or heard of it. Not many responses. But anyway, the original plan was to use a vacant warehouse somewhere in Dayton, but I can't remember which one or where. The hotel was not part of it at the time. Ever since, I thought this was a dead project. Maybe not?

 

As for the hotel tower, I would imagine this will not be anywhere near downtown...most likely by the museum? Hotel rooms are in short supply in that area and something of this magnitude could really bring in some more tourism I would think. So maybe it is doable without stepping on the backs of others?

HUH???

 

Pretty ambitious. . .doubt it'll happen. A hotel in Dayton that's taller than 73 stories? riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight  :laugh:

 

Kudos if they can pull it off, but it better be downtown and not in the gutter of Riverside. In fact, If the museum does move forward, I'd like to see them seek out the arcade as a possible place to have such a museum.

 

http://dayton.bizjournals.com/dayton/stories/2007/12/03/story6.html

 

 

Oh that would an awesome reuse of the Arcade Square, but I just can't see a hotel this size in downtown. The existing hotels would definitely lobby against it I'm sure, especially Doubletree.

A hotel taller than 73 stories in Dayton?

 

Please put the crack pipe down...

So how many Urban Ohio posts will I need in order to get this new Dayton hotel under my UO username?  :mrgreen:

I doubt that this tower will ever be built...but if they do move forward I sure as heck hope that they DON'T plop down some 73 story monstrocity.  It would look completely out of place in a city like Dayton (or most cities for that matter).  The land value just simply isn't high enough to warrant that kind of building height...a few towers in the 20-25 story range would be much more beneficial for Dayton, plus you could build them in phases as per demand.

 

If this were to be built in the 'burbs it would just look totally ridiculous...hopefully that never comes to fruition.  Put it Downtown if you're going to do it.

I would think for security reasons alone, it couldn't be built anywhere near WPAFB!?!?!

This is the dumbest idea ever.. Dayton, let alone Ohio, does NOT need the tallest hotel in the US..

^--- I guess it really wouldn't be any more outlandish looking as say the Signature Tower in Nashville, which would be almost twice as tall than anything they currently have. Or maybe the Jenga building in Louisville which is just....ugly.

 

But heck, I'm a skyscraper nut, if they think they can do it, I say bring it!  :weird:

I would think for security reasons alone, it couldn't be built anywhere near WPAFB!?!?!

 

That is a good point. Didn't think about that, not too mention they probably would have a height restriction nonetheless. Rando's idea would be much better. A 2 or 3 20-25 story complex would look fantastic for Dayton,

^--- I guess it really wouldn't be any more outlandish looking as say the Signature Tower in Nashville, which would be almost twice as tall than anything they currently have. Or maybe the Jenga building in Louisville which is just....ugly.

 

But heck, I'm a skyscraper nut, if they think they can do it, I say bring it!  :weird:

 

Heck, if they think they can make it work, then I say build it, but I just can't figure out geographically where they could place it?

 

The idea of 3 25 story buildings make sense, but I don't think their intent is that. . .I really think they just want the tallest hotel, thus will never build 3 mid sized buildings. . . .they are looking for a ploy for people to stay there, a marketing schtick. That would be my guess. . .if they build it, it will be tall, I don't forsee a compromise....but I don't forsee it happening either.

The key phrase seems to be "if they can make it work"

 

Have you been in downtown Dayton?  They can't make what they have now work, let alone a new building.

^Have you been to downtown Cleveland?  They put like three buildings in their downtown and it looks like Steelyard Common's little pylon things on steroids, lit up with gigantic keys and netting.

 

I say, why not.  Dayton would be like Pyongyang with a gigantic, vacant 70+ story hotel in the distant.  How awesome...yet seicer.

The key phrase seems to be "if they can make it work"

 

Have you been in downtown Dayton?  They can't make what they have now work, let alone a new building.

 

Well yea, I only live and work here :-)

 

But as I recall, there was a time when downtown Cleveland was derelict along with the whole city for that matter. Look how that's turned around.

 

Now let's also keep in mind that Peachtree Plaza may be the tallest hotel in the world, but it's not THAT big. At 723 feet, it is taller than Kettering Tower only by 319 feet which is roughly 20 stories. That's really not all that bad. I can think of many other cities with a much more sizable difference between highrises and were quite successful with it.

 

But all this is moot. I doubt it will even happen anyway. Dayton can't even get a shopping plaza built.

HUH???

 

Pretty ambitious. . .doubt it'll happen. A hotel in Dayton that's taller than 73 stories? riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight  :laugh:

 

Kudos if they can pull it off, but it better be downtown and not in the gutter of Riverside. In fact, If the museum does move forward, I'd like to see them seek out the arcade as a possible place to have such a museum.

 

http://dayton.bizjournals.com/dayton/stories/2007/12/03/story6.html

 

Hey!  I grew up in Riverside and it's not all bad!

WOW!!! No wonder american cities are ever falling behind, Shortsighted visions like our fellow urban Ohioans, I'm ashamed!!!

The theme park/musuem sounds like a someone working on some commercial tourist spin-offs from the Air Force Museum trade ('bout time that happened). 

 

The hotel tower sounds ridiculous, but I can see somehthing lower, like the Opryland Hotel. 

 

Personally none of this floats my boat as Im not an aviation buff. 

WOW!!! No wonder american cities are ever falling behind, Shortsighted visions like our fellow urban Ohioans, I'm ashamed!!!

 

No, it's called realism.. you can't just build build build and profits will follow.  It's Dayton, Ohio.. not New York City or LA.  Get with reality, not fantasyland.

WOW!!! No wonder american cities are ever falling behind, Shortsighted visions like our fellow urban Ohioans, I'm ashamed!!!

 

No, it's called realism.. you can't just build build build and profits will follow.  It's Dayton, Ohio.. not New York City or LA.  Get with reality, not fantasyland.

 

You should get with reality!!! If you don't think it can be done, Your the one living in "fantasyland". lol  You should never assume everyone else shares your opinion!

I may be living it, but you're mayor of the town buddy.  Hell, I'll book the first room in the place the day it opens.

i just don't understand why people are against it.  if it happens, good for dayton.  it will be an icon.  i just don't get the "it wont fit in the skyline argument."  how often does an opportunity for the us's tallest hotel come around in a city not named las vegas, new york city, or chicago.

I think sometimes people forget even though Dayton is not NY or LA, it is however still around a 1 mill metropolitan region with one of the largest downtowns for a city with only 160,000 residents anywhere. It's not like they want to build this in Lima.

 

There was a time in the 70's when downtown was booming. Highrises were getting built left and right, shoppers were everywhere and downtown was just a busy place in general. If Dayton can get everything going with Caresoure, Riverscape, Ballpark Village, Deed's Point, Heritage Trail, the Condo Tower and Tech Town, then why not add this to the mix? I would imagine that if Dayton can pull off all these projects, it will no longer be a dead town. It will have achieved a full about face and be busy place again.

 

But I do have mixed feelings. Part of me says build a 73+ story building. The other part of me says build 3 25 story buildings. I'm happy either way to see this development get built, Anything built is a plus.

 

The minds behind this must have had their vision of this for some time. As I said, I knew about this project years ago. They've just added the hotel portion. They've had to do some research during that time. I mean what is this amusement park going to be exactly? Are we talking something like Star trek, the Experience in Vegas? Or more like COSI in Columbus? I think we just need to know more about what this is going to be exactly and the location before trashing the idea.

I'm all for this kind of thing too, but I've learned after living in this town for a few years now and hearing about all of the proposed "ideas" that never seem to materialize, not to get too excited.  Ideas without funding are just that - ideas.  I am amused by how the local media never fails to feature these "ideas" no matter how far they are from actual implementation.  Anybody remember the guy who wanted to build a theme park in Dayton that is "bigger than Cedar Point and King's Island combined"?  That made the front page of the DDN for Christ's sake!(gee, is could this be the same guy?)  Folks, I lived in the tourist capital of the country (Florida) and Dayton simply ain't a tourist destination, and it ain't gonna be.  That isn't to say that it can't be a successful city (if I didn't think it could be I'd be outta here tomorrow), but let's be realisitic - there won't be a 73 story hotel in Dayton. 

 

That said, I do think the aviation theme park idea is intriguing and certainly has potential.  It all comes down to finding the deep pockets.  Very deep pockets.  And that person (or people) with the very deep pockets need to also have an undying love for this little city called Dayton, Ohio - because it will take both to get something like this actually built.

 

But while we're dreaming - why not turn Sandy Mendelson's buildings into a theme park + hotel all-in-one?  Over one million square feet, plenty of room!  I know Brixx sure could use the business!

I had the same thought about Mendelson's when I was driving around today. Could this be the proposed location? The building is up for sale, is it not?

 

As for Dayton being a tourist destination, no it's not. But really no city in Ohio is. But Cleveland does do very with the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame, Columbus with COSI, and the Air Force Museum here in Dayton even does pretty decent. I also don't think mass tourism is what this is about. More like to something for Dayton to have that's unique only to Dayton. Almost every mid-size city is doing something like this to try and revive their CBD.

 

I read up on the company that wants to develop this and they are the ones responsible for the new hotel and future entertainment complex being developed over in Riverside by the museum entrance. That is progressing very slowly, so I really don't see this project taking shape anyway.

Ohio1221, the generalized pokes and jabs can stop.

 

This will be a difficult, if not impossible venture. In comparison, Louisville's Museum Plaza project is not only a Westin Hotel, but a museum, office tower, residential condominium and loft structure and is home to a major college program. For it to even proceed, it had to achieve consensus from adjoining hotel lobbying and tourism groups in the state and metro region, who were opposed to the project's hotel because they feared it would suck away all of their revenues. They also had other fears, including the project using TIF which abates certain taxes for a defined number of years so that the massive project can pay for itself and allow for adjoining public infrastructure improvements.

 

Before this fantasy can even get off of the ground, we must ask, is it realistic? When the tallest building in the city is only 30 stories and only one other over 20, can downtown support this type of development? What about the other hotels in the city? IS there enough tourism in the city to support it?

 

And why a 77-story tower? Why not invest that same amount of money in infill elsewhere? Dayton has lost a lot of building stock and vibrancy it once had, and consolidating all of that into one project isn't going to do that much good when the surrounding envrions is just as depressing. Several smaller 10-20 story towers would add a more fulfilled streetscape, IMO.

Im less interested in this high rise than the indoor theme park, which actually might work. 

 

Dayton is not a conventional tourist attraction, but it does have the Air Force Museum which is a major regional tourist attraction, with rare and one-of-a-kind artificats. 

 

Though I am a railfan rather than an aviation buff, I can see how the Air Force Museum would be be perhaps equivilant to major railroad collections, like Steamtown HSP in Scranton, and definetly on par with the California State Railway Museum in Sacramento, as a major collection of aviation artifacts.

 

So this museum is going to be bringing in a certain type of tourist that wouldn't ordinarily have reason to come to Dayton.

 

 

 

 

^ True, but what other major attractions -- culture, entertainment/amusement, etc. -- does it have in comparison to say, Cincinnati or Columbus which are within easy driving distance? And can the population of Dayton support such a massive project if (when) TIF is used? And can the city's attractions support this?

 

There are so many unanswered questions that it is speculative at best that this is a done deal.

It's my understanding this would primarily be a privately funded project. Not sure though.

Nothing on that scale is privately funded.

True...true. It's late  :drunk:

Ohio1221, the generalized pokes and jabs can stop.

 

 

 

WTF Are you talking about!?

"Shortsighted visions like our fellow urban Ohioans"

"You should get with reality!!!"

 

Come on, there are more constructive ways than to generalize all forum members against this project, or to call them "shortsighted" or stuck in the past.

Please stop the pointless bickering and stay on topic.

I was looking at this article again in the biz, but I don't think I'm seeing it all as I'm not a paid subscriber. :?

Does anyone have access to the entire article? If so, can u post it here? Thanks.

Firm to raise $1M for local theme park

Dayton Business Journal

 

A newly formed Dayton development firm is seeking $1 million in private investment from business leaders to bring a year-round theme park and iconic hotel to the Dayton area.

 

The plan would dovetail into a larger initiative promoting the region's aviation legacy under a single banner, known as the National Aviation Heritage Area.

 

 

Thanks Billy!

 

Wow, I didn't get all this. They're really serious about this, aren't they? But please...reinvigorate Riverside?? What's there to reinvigorate? It's a suburb...a small one at best. There was never anything there to begin with. Not too mention something of this magnitude in Riverside would be just plain silly looking. If this guy gets the needed funding, Dayton better bust their butt off to get this downtown. I would be very disappointed to see this go up anywhere else.

If this guy gets the needed funding, Dayton better bust their butt off to get this downtown. I would be very disappointed to see this go up anywhere else.

 

I couldn't agree more...Dayton should be setting up preliminary meetings now, just so that they have their chickens in a row so-to-speak.

About time the DDN got a hold of this...

 

 

Is Dayton ready for an aviation-themed park?

A publicist envisions an entertainment attraction, hotel and conference center.

 

By John Nolan

Staff Writer

 

Thursday, December 06, 2007

 

DAYTON — Dave Lightle, a publicist who has helped promote the region's historic aviation sites, has created his own company to promote and raise money to build an aviation-themed entertainment attraction and a similarly themed hotel and conference center.

 

Lightle formed his company Air City Development LLC, based at 23 S. Williams St. across from the historic Wright brothers' bicycle shop, to promote the projects and has spent months pitching the concept to business leaders and others in the Dayton area.

 

 

http://www.daytondailynews.com/b/content/oh/story/business/2007/12/05/ddn120607themepark.html

I'm starting to get convinced this guy has the cahuna's to really pull this off.  :clap:

Again, I say, why not?

 

Interesting in this article there is no mention of the hotel's height. . .unless I missed it! ;-)

Why waste their money ... just build it in Cincinnati instead?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

j/k ;)

Only if they build the Banks in Dayton. is it a deal?  :wave:

I remember Heartland Airlines.  They were trying to generate a bunch of money locally for that.  It was sort of a latter day version of the Dayton, Xenia, & Belpre Railroad (transportation as economic developement), but like that Victorian era scheme, went nowhere  (well, ok, the railroad did make it to Xenia).

 

His consultant, though, is doing some major projects, a lot of them in Asia (including that crazy Ski Dhubai thing), but also a rework of Coney Island.

 

I see he wants 50 acres in the city, near the river.  Any ideas?

 

 

 

Ballpark Village site.

I remember Heartland Airlines.  They were trying to generate a bunch of money locally for that.   It was sort of a latter day version of the Dayton, Xenia, & Belpre Railroad (transportation as economic developement), but like that Victorian era scheme, went nowhere  (well, ok, the railroad did make it to Xenia).

 

But fwiw, Heartland Airlines did end up reincarnated as Skybus Airlines.

Thanks Billy!

 

Wow, I didn't get all this. They're really serious about this, aren't they? But please...reinvigorate Riverside?? What's there to reinvigorate? It's a suburb...a small one at best. There was never anything there to begin with. Not too mention something of this magnitude in Riverside would be just plain silly looking. If this guy gets the needed funding, Dayton better bust their butt off to get this downtown. I would be very disappointed to see this go up anywhere else.

 

Riverside has 23,000 people, so it's not that small.  But you're right there really isn't much there other than suburban development.  Just down the street from the USAF Museum is the "true" Riverside (around Founders Park and Virginia Stevenson Elementary), the rest developed as Mad River Twp. and lacks any sort of CBD.

Riverside should have never merged with Mad River twp to begin with, The city is poorly managed, poor police protection (I have 2 personal experiences to justify that statement) and the city wants to overtax everybody and not return anything, which is why I stated small suburb at best. And yes 23,00 is small considering the Dayton suburb populations of Huber, Centerville, Trotwood, Clayton, Beavercreek, Kettering, Miamisburg and so on.

 

Sorry. Didn't mean to go on a rant. I just have a lot to say about Riverside. You can tell they ruffle my feathers. Back on topic.

Wow. I thought Riverside was City of Dayton.