Remember the Little Rascals bit where the doctor told a patient to turn his head upward to relieve the pain in his neck. So the guy walks out of the doctor's office onto the city streets and everyone else around him starts looking upward, too, wondering what the hell he's looking at...

 

The photo above reminded me of that.

 

P.S., welcome aboard BelievelandD!

^^

 

By the way... I'd HATE to be a guest of the Mariott residence Inn right now.

 

 

That reminds me of that hotel commercial where the couple is staying at a place with jackhammering going on.  "It's going to be great"

Yeah its nice to be in here.  I enjoy talking about the development and projects instead of listening to everyone whine and complain about out city on cleveland.com.  They have no idea what is even transpiring.  So what exactly are the plans for 668?  Apartments?  any news on when a new facade will be or when they will begin on the inside?

Welcome to the forum BelievelandD...  I think you can find all the information you are looking for if you start at the first page of this thread.  About half way down the first page you'll find information pertaining to what's happening now (the first few posts were for proposals for the building that didn't happen).  You'll find descriptions, renderings, pretty much everything you want to know.

Sweet- when do they plan on getting going with the units?  I work in Univeristy Circle and I want to move downtown.  I like watching all of the units go up, but I am waiting for the right one and the right price.

She's putting up a fight but not much longer.

 

 

Wednesday I saw a truck unloading the mast-climb work platform (construction elevator) on the prospect side of the building... I'd imagine they'll be assembling this out front to do the facade work... must be starting soon.

It didn't dawn on me that the building on Prospect will have apartments on the upper levels.  Am I correct in assuming this?

As far as I know... mind you I've only seen the plans and model once, and it was quite awhile ago... but I'm 99% sure the answer is yes.

Is the Prospect facade going to stay the same?

No.  But I'm not sure exactly what they are going to do with it.  There was a historic facade on the building, but it was ruined when they put the stucco up.  You can see where they did some test holes in it to check the condition of what was underneath, but I heard it was damaged beyond repair.  Sandvick was the original architect who worked with Goldberg and got all the tax credit application together.  But K&D switched architects when they bought the building... not sure what direction they want to go with that side of the building.  I'll also be interested to see if they keep the penthouse level that Sandvick designed on the front (which I liked a lot) or do something else...

That would be an interesting facade study to put togerher.  Very Giuseppe Terragni.

I don't mind the stucco on the Prospect side.  I say this, not having any idea what it covered up.  The scale is what's important to me, though, and the Prospect side is very nice in that regard.

A few updates from 668.  The first pic shows the eastern side of the building where the large tower that housed some sort of HVAC systems or something with steel trusses everywhere... it's all been disassembled.  The next pic shows all thats left of dollar bank (not much)... and finally a rear shot of the "ruins".

 

I have a set of pics from the prospect facade to show how it was altered... i'll try to squeeze them in tomorrow around lunch.

True grit!

They just started removing the steel supports from the terra cotta facade...

They just started removing the steel supports from the terra cotta facade...

 

Pictures...pictures...pictures...

they had litterally just started when i walked by.  They've got a couple lulls out front.  They took off 2 or 3 pieces of steel, then brought it down, chatted about it on the roof for a bit and then appeared to go to lunch or something.  I'll stop by after work and see if they've made any progress.

they had litterally just started when i walked by. They've got a couple lulls out front. They took off 2 or 3 pieces of steel, then brought it down, chatted about it on the roof for a bit and then appeared to go to lunch or something. I'll stop by after work and see if they've made any progress.

 

They were still working on it again I walked by (about 10 minutes ago)  I'd guess about two stories down of the third column has had its steel removed.  They literally have just started.

The building now has new "available sign which state...

 

late summer 2009 completion date

236 apartments

600 parking spaces

65,000 square feet of retail

 

This info was probably mentioned throughout the thread but I figured I would put it in one spot.  Also I am kind of disappointed to see the building being marketed as "The Atrium at 668." I was hoping that the name would refer to the old Taylor department store in some way. The atrium at 668 doesn't really sound like an apartment building, I think of a bland suburban office when I hear it.

^Thank you- very interesting.  600 parking spaces and 236 apartments.  I guess the Dollar Bank building had to go because their business model depended on a lot of office worker parking revenue in addition to those apartment rents.

^Thank you- very interesting.  600 parking spaces and 236 apartments.  I guess the Dollar Bank building had to go because their business model depended on a lot of office worker parking revenue in addition to those apartment rents.

 

I'm sick....very sick!  ugh!

Also I am kind of disappointed to see the building being marketed as "The Atrium at 668." I was hoping that the name would refer to the old Taylor department store in some way. The atrium at 668 doesn't really sound like an apartment building, I think of a bland suburban office when I hear it.

 

Eesh, you and me both.  I was hoping for something as simple as the William Taylor & Sons Building.  Or The Taylor Building Condos... I prefer to forget that the place was ever "the atrium".

^Thank you- very interesting. 600 parking spaces and 236 apartments. I guess the Dollar Bank building had to go because their business model depended on a lot of office worker parking revenue in addition to those apartment rents.

 

I'm sick....very sick! ugh!

 

MTS - The parking already exists....they aren't really adding any more then what was there before.

^ I thought they were adding additional parking underneath the Atrium building.

K&D has a knack for concocting horrible names for their Downtown developments.  Wait until you hear what the former Ameritrust Complex will be called...

The price tag for this project was $65million.  A decent chunk of change no doubt.

 

If rent for the 236 apartments is going to be ballpark $1,000 per month, that is $236,000, or $2.8million a year, but has a ton of upkeep/maintenance, overhead involved.  Plus, they assuredly won't all be occupied at first either...

 

Now I hate parking lots as much as the next guy, but do you guys ever stop to do the math on this?  600 spots x $10 special event parking x 20 events per month or so? = $120k/month, nearly all of which is pure profit once the building is paid for, or almost $1.5million a year.  Plus, there will likely be monthly office/business/parking agreements, that could generate just as much per month.  This puts the total "parking" revenue close to what would be generated from rent. 

 

Now I know that not all 600 spaces will always be filled, and that there may not be that many "events" that need parking, but if I'm a developer, those figures are hard to ignore.  And if I'm a bank, in this financial market, looking to hand out a huge loan, those figures would be even more hard to ignore.  If I am National City/Key/etc, I would want something just short of a sure thing, which I believe parking represents in this market and economic climate.

I just hate parking period.  I realize its been there along and the reasons for financing, I just hate parking, especially parking lots.  Let an man be grumpy. 

well at least it is a parking garage and not a huge open surface lot...

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

 

 

 

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

 

 

 

 

Two different markets and with different amounts of developable space.  I don't think 20 years ago that would fly in chicago either.

 

 

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

 

Two different markets and with different amounts of developable space. I don't think 20 years ago that would fly in chicago either.

 

 

BOO!

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

 

Two different markets and with different amounts of developable space.  I don't think 20 years ago that would fly in chicago either.

 

 

BOO!

 

Seriously, In another 4/5 years when we have no buildings downtown that can be turned into residential and our only option is new build, then we can implement programs things like this. 

 

Sound reasonable/rational?

1.  Here is the first area where the attached steel supports have been removed.  Seriously, if I ever find the person responsible for this, I am doing physical harm to them.

2.  And the afformentioned sign with the worst name in downtown.  Even the font already looks out of date.

I also know I said I'd provide some pics of the Prospect Avenue side...

 

1.  This was a cutaway to check the condition of the historic facade.  As you can see, it no longer exists.

2.  Shown from the side you can see where what appears to be limestone was cut away for the stucco facade to be applied on a skeletal system above.

3.  A little better look at the dividing line.

4.  The original granite base.  I'd imagine at one point all the storefronts had these, but the storefronts have been so bastardized over the years there's almost nothing left.

5-6-7.  They are erecting the mast-climbing platform on this side, my guess is real soon we're going to get an up close and personal look at what they are doing... should be a good few weeks for pictures.

8.  The prospect side.

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

 

Two different markets and with different amounts of developable space. I don't think 20 years ago that would fly in chicago either.

 

 

BOO!

 

Seriously, In another 4/5 years when we have no buildings downtown that can be turned into residential and our only option is new build, then we can implement programs things like this.

 

Sound reasonable/rational?

 

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!! :)

I heard something recently in the City Club form where Chicago charges a high amount on parking to actually discourage this type of thing from happening and to encourage people to use mass transit. I would LOVE something like this enacted in Cleveland, but we all know that's most like not going to fly.

Two different markets and with different amounts of developable space.  I don't think 20 years ago that would fly in chicago either.

 

Cleveland also has ordinances limiting parking / surface parking lot creation in the CBD.  Basically, you "can't" tear down an existing building and create permanent parking, the lot can only be used for "temporary parking" for a certain period.  the idea is that a building owner can't tear down a building to gain a better (in the near term) revenue stream from parking at the long term expense of the neighborhood, density, public transit, etc.

 

but, time and again this isn't enforced.  house of blues bus parking area is one example.  corner of carnegie and e9 is another. 

 

Also I am kind of disappointed to see the building being marketed as "The Atrium at 668." I was hoping that the name would refer to the old Taylor department store in some way. The atrium at 668 doesn't really sound like an apartment building, I think of a bland suburban office when I hear it.

 

Eesh, you and me both.  I was hoping for something as simple as the William Taylor & Sons Building.  Or The Taylor Building Condos... I prefer to forget that the place was ever "the atrium".

 

 

I was kind of hoping they would go with 666 address... just for the hell of it.  ;D

The devil you say!  :evil:

So these are going to be apartments now, not condos?  I thought they were gonna be condos - or was I dreaming?  Eh, we could use more rental units right now anyways.

I think they have always been planned as "rental units".  IIRC, it has somethign to do with the tax credits received.  The units have to stay as rental for X amount of time.

Yeah isn't this the same thing that got the warehouse district going.  Rehab old buildings, start as rental, and as many of my friends down there have been telling me, people are starting to flip the buildings to condo now that it's past the x amount of years.

When you take the monies available for things like this they have to be publicly rentable for 5 years.  After that they can flip.  I wouldn't be surprised to see them do something like the prospect Place apartments who are offering rent equity.  Where, for every $1 you spend in rent something like .25 or .50 goes towards a down payment on your place when they flip should you decide to buy.

these units are being built out to be condos some day (finishes, etc.).  Because of the NMTC (New market tax credits) these have to remain rentals for 7 years at which time the debt can be refinanced and turned to condos or remain rentals. 

 

Hi all,

 

I was kind of hoping they would go with 666 address... just for the hell of it.

 

The devil you say!

 

MAYBE THEY CAN CHAGE ADDRESS TO 333 THEN IT WOULD ONLT BE HALF AS EVIL.  :angel:

wow

:(

 

Although I am a little curious what they're going to do with that newly exposed wall.

:(

 

Although I am a little curious what they're going to do with that newly exposed wall.

 

Well, from the rendering, it looks like they'll be punching in some new windows.  Not sure why it seems as if they'll only be doing the back portion of the wall and not the entire span. :?

 

^I'm guessing it's because of the cost of punching out new windows into the sides of units that already have them facing the front.  I haven't seen the floor plates, but I'd guess the new windows shown will be the only ones for those "back" units.