February 10, 20205 yr Wow.... I don't hate it, for Franklinton or portions of Weinland Park, but wow.... and all that talk about bit trusting Kaufman for material selections and this is clearly nothing but thos cheap panels. When YIMBY turn into NIMBYs... my favorite plot twist... Its exposes the real YITBYs....
February 10, 20205 yr Yikes. You get what you ask for. High quality on this lot requires high density. You take away the density, and you get low quality like this. Pick your poison.
February 10, 20205 yr On 2/8/2020 at 5:21 PM, wpcc88 said: I’m really curious as to where most live that were in favor. Prime example is the comments on these type of announcements on Facebook via CU or other media outlets. Most of the people opposed to development live in Newark or Dublin and truly don’t get what you’re saying. 2nd and Highland here - fully supported the initial project and, while not excited about these renderings, do support a high density project at this location. Edited February 10, 20205 yr by Tiger57
February 10, 20205 yr Wow -- need some info on the materials. Kinda reminded of the paneling used on "rustic" looking northern corner of the Gay and High project (name escapes me). Overall, such a downgrade and I do hope this is a spite project. Edit: Overall* not Overally Edited February 10, 20205 yr by NightNectar
February 10, 20205 yr New Plan for IBEW Site Heading to Victorian Village Commission Kaufman Development is returning to the Victorian Village Commission this week with a new plan for the former International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW) site at 23 W. Second Ave. The site – which also encompasses a large parking lot and an empty field – sits just west of High Street, between Second and Price avenues. The project’s return to the commission marks a continuation of a two-year saga in which the local developer tried to get a workable plan for the site approved. Kaufman purchased the land in 2016 and returned several times with different design iterations, responding to concerns raised by some neighbors and commissioners about its size. More below: https://www.columbusunderground.com/new-plan-for-ibew-site-heading-to-victorian-village-commission-bw1 "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
February 10, 20205 yr Ooofff (actual sound I made when I saw these). This is pretty bad, but they couldn't get their nicer/denser project passed, they couldn't sell the lot, so they brought in the cost cutters and here you are. You can't really blame them, they need to get something out of the site.
February 11, 20205 yr Kaufman pitches new plan for long-debated Short North project After walking away in 2018, the developer is once again trying to redevelop the former International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers site at 23 W. 2nd Ave. Kaufman Development wants to build an eight-story mix of condos, offices and storefronts at High Street and West Second Avenue in the Short North. Here's an aerial view of the site. More below: https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2020/02/10/kaufman-pitches-new-development-plan-for-long.html "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
February 11, 20205 yr If VV doesnt take this, think I can convince Kaufman to buy the big lot behind Hound Dogs and put it up in old north by me? ?
February 11, 20205 yr It looks like their Gramercy project in New Albany grew up and married a Home2Suites or an Aloft. Do the commenters on CU work for Kaufman? "Stunning" and "unique" would be the last two words out of my mouth to describe this. Also, I get that Kaufman wants to keep a good rep, but sometimes you should just call it as it is. Your pandering remarks ring hollow. You're not working with the neighborhood to build something meaningful. All that stuff you list is exactly the same as every other development you have. Funny you didn't have to sell your original site plan on developer speak. The quality of the design and details sold themselves. It's as 17th State said. This is their last ditch effort to make anything out of this site. Incredibly sad what is happening to the Short North. The hottest neighborhood with arguably the hottest developer in mixed use was offered a stunning piece to almost finish the puzzle, and instead he's just throwing in the towel. Glad you guys "won" your battle. The Pizzuti project being shot down for the 12 story condos wasn't as bad, because the offices instead built are actually more dense, and the quality is top notch. This IBEW plan is neither more dense nor top notch quality.
February 11, 20205 yr This is a huge downgrade to the original proposal, which I thought looked stunning. This looks blegh.
February 11, 20205 yr To think that the NIMBYs killed like a dozen versions of a significantly better project only to get that POS in the end. I hope they build it exactly like that, as cheaply as possible. You reap what you sow.
February 11, 20205 yr ^The last thing most NIMBYS know about is that kind of stuff. They only know what they like: setbacks, low-rise, grass, single-use, the '60s.
February 11, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, GCrites80s said: ^The last thing most NIMBYS know about is that kind of stuff. They only know what they like: setbacks, low-rise, grass, single-use, the '60s. Which is ironic, peak period and logic for all the historic demolitions. Gotta love those parking lots. Yeah, these surrounding neighbors kind of deserve this proposal at this point. I don't actually think the commission will let this rendition happen (I still think this may be a ploy), but if it does I sure hope the neighbors enjoy their "we won" project. Edited February 11, 20205 yr by DevolsDance
February 11, 20205 yr On 2/7/2020 at 3:23 PM, NightNectar said: Personally, I absolutely adored one of the first iterations of this project. Its a real shame the commission forgot that they lived in a booming urban neighborhood. Didn't the commission actually approve this version? I know that at one point during this whole process, they actually got an approval on one of the designs. Kauffman could have moved forward at that point but then came back with the 14 story version citing increased costs and then all hell broke loose after that. NIMBYs are definitely annoying here, but I wish Kauffman would have just moved forward when they got that approval. This could be finishing up soon.
February 11, 20205 yr 2 hours ago, TH3BUDDHA said: Didn't the commission actually approve this version? I know that at one point during this whole process, they actually got an approval on one of the designs. Kauffman could have moved forward at that point but then came back with the 14 story version citing increased costs and then all hell broke loose after that. NIMBYs are definitely annoying here, but I wish Kauffman would have just moved forward when they got that approval. This could be finishing up soon. I don't know if that proposal was ever really serious. It seemed more of a "concept" rendering than anything, and then they came back with the real one and that's what triggered the neighborhood outrage. That early one really was the best, even at the shorter height.
February 11, 20205 yr 2 hours ago, TH3BUDDHA said: Didn't the commission actually approve this version? I know that at one point during this whole process, they actually got an approval on one of the designs. Kauffman could have moved forward at that point but then came back with the 14 story version citing increased costs and then all hell broke loose after that. NIMBYs are definitely annoying here, but I wish Kauffman would have just moved forward when they got that approval. This could be finishing up soon. I believe you’re correct, but this was the one that was heavier on the back end of the development. My biggest issue was the Price side, they tried to play it off as if Price were a two way street. Also the details on that side and the ability of Kaufman to execute on the finished product. SN is not a place that you can cut corners; it’s our cities premier neighborhood and I’m not sure if Kaufman gets that(despite their offices being here). Again, not anti-development or anti-density. Kaufman tried to pull a fast one and many opposed it. That being said, I highly doubt this new submission gets approved either. Kaufman is again being petty, but all most people want them to do is develop the site appropriately for all parties.
February 11, 20205 yr 1 minute ago, wpcc88 said: I believe you’re correct, but this was the one that was heavier on the back end of the development. My biggest issue was the Price side, they tried to play it off as if Price were a two way street. Also the details on that side and the ability of Kaufman to execute on the finished product. SN is not a place that you can cut corners; it’s our cities premier neighborhood and I’m not sure if Kaufman gets that(despite their offices being here). Again, not anti-development or anti-density. Kaufman tried to pull a fast one and many opposed it. That being said, I highly doubt this new submission gets approved either. Kaufman is again being petty, but all most people want them to do is develop the site appropriately for all parties. Sorry, but you're still trying to sell a narrative that's impossible to believe. None of the commission meetings featured those types of arguments about material quality and worry about cutting corners. It was always about "It will destroy the historic fabric of VV" or "It will cause too much traffic in the neighborhood" or "It will cause shadows". The VAST majority of the arguments were in opposition to the project altogether. And we'll see those exact same arguments rise with the latest proposal.
February 17, 20205 yr On 1/15/2020 at 7:29 AM, Zyrokai said: Anyone know what's going on behind the old Cafe Apropos? I answered a while back, but there's a little more info now. Saucy announced that they will be including coffee for a brewery/coffeehouse concept. I'm pretty excited about that. Also, this is actually Harrison West if a mod wants to move this to the correct thread. Edit: Actually this was mentioned in the restaurant thread. But, it's behind the Columbus Business First paywall so it might be worth moving the link to the direct Saucy announcement there as well. SAUCY BREW WORKS EXPANDS TO COLUMBUS BREWERY AND COFFEEHOUSE CONCEPT TO OPEN IN HARRISON WEST THIS APRIL Saucy Brew Works announces the opening of its first location in Columbus, Ohio, located at 443 West Third Avenue, the original location of Caffe Apropos. The 190-seat space features a brewpub and coffeehouse with both indoor and outdoor seating. Saucy Brew Works in Harrison West will celebrate its grand opening in early April 2020. More here: https://www.saucybrewworks.com/events/saucy-brew-works-expands-to-columbus/ Edited February 17, 20205 yr by TH3BUDDHA
February 26, 20205 yr 6 minutes ago, Zyrokai said: From Reddit: The Goodale Park fountain is operating again! I would have rather saved $500,000 in taxpayer funds and just said 'thanks for the donation, but your fountain is more trouble than it's worth' and just removed it after the first round of significant public spending to rectify the issue from a privately funded fountain. It's the gift that kept sucking up resources that should have been spent elsewhere.
February 26, 20205 yr 1 hour ago, DTCL11 said: I would have rather saved $500,000 in taxpayer funds and just said 'thanks for the donation, but your fountain is more trouble than it's worth' and just removed it after the first round of significant public spending to rectify the issue from a privately funded fountain. It's the gift that kept sucking up resources that should have been spent elsewhere. IMO, taxpayer money spent on improving parks is money well spent. From somebody that lives right by there, I think the pond in Goodale Park is much more enjoyable with that fountain operating. With the fountain running, it's nice to sit there and read a book or something and relax. Without it, the water is pretty stagnant and the pond is actually pretty gross looking. That's just me, though. The only reason the fix was so expensive was because the location of the pumps made it hard to access. So they drained the pond and moved them. Future fixes should be much more manageable now. Edited February 26, 20205 yr by TH3BUDDHA
February 26, 20205 yr 51 minutes ago, TH3BUDDHA said: IMO, taxpayer money spent on improving parks is money well spent. From somebody that lives right by there, I think the pond in Goodale Park is much more enjoyable with that fountain operating. Without it, the water is pretty stagnant and the pond is actually pretty gross looking. That's just me, though. The only reason the fix was so expensive was because the location of the pumps made it hard to access. So they drained the pond and moved them. Future fixes should be much more manageable. My counterargument would be that a regular aerating fountain (or two) that were present prior and in many other similar ponds would be sufficient. The sculpture could have even stayed. The price tag is really quite significant. The lack of foresight makes it more frustrating in that it has taken 3 tries to find the right solution. I definitely won't argue against public investment in parks and will gladly support any park funding but I will question the value of particular investments. I like the fountain and appreciate it more after I learned its meaning beyond a 'republican birthday cake' but I still cringe at the price tag to fix a luxury in one of Columbus's top parks whether or not the fountain was present while others would dream of a portion of that. And while there is always the 'it could be spent elsewhere' argument, IMO, the value wasn't worth it. Even as a member of Franklin Park, I'm not sold on the $2.7million (including the engineering study) spent to get the cascades working again. The repair of the fountain without a significant effort to raise private capital is alot of dog parks the city lacks, new accessible playground equipment, better lighting for safety, sidewalks or court surfaces in the parks, new pavilions etc. But we all have our preferences on where money is spent. I'm certain to be in a minority on this project I'm sure. Edited February 26, 20205 yr by DTCL11
February 26, 20205 yr 8 minutes ago, DTCL11 said: The lack of foresight makes it more frustrating in that it has taken 3 tries to find the right solution. I will definitely agree with you there. I like the fountain, and even though I'm glad they put in the money to fix it, I definitely wish it would have been more efficient. Government, though, amirite? ?♂️ Edited February 26, 20205 yr by TH3BUDDHA
March 11, 20205 yr On 2/10/2020 at 1:35 PM, DevolsDance said: Drumroll... The 2nd/Price & High renders have arrived. More info at https://www.columbusunderground.com/new-plan-for-ibew-site-heading-to-victorian-village-commission-bw1 Looks like we may have Columbus' second spite project everyone. Honestly, I think Kaufman may be pulling a King & High on the commission but this is the lower density they demanded. Oh man, I'm going to go grab some popcorn. LOL! What a POS! This has to be spite-no way this gets approval. Soooo inappropriate for that site.
April 26, 20205 yr On 2/26/2020 at 12:30 PM, Zyrokai said: From Reddit: The Goodale Park fountain is operating again! The last several times I've been to Goodale Park, the fountain has been off. I noticed several weeks ago that the cascading water along the side had stopped and it was just the elephant trunks shooting water. Then, a bit later the water out of the trunks was very weak. Now, it's off entirely. Is it already broken again?
May 5, 20205 yr On 4/26/2020 at 10:12 AM, TH3BUDDHA said: The last several times I've been to Goodale Park, the fountain has been off. I noticed several weeks ago that the cascading water along the side had stopped and it was just the elephant trunks shooting water. Then, a bit later the water out of the trunks was very weak. Now, it's off entirely. Is it already broken again? Ive noticed this as well. There was a period of about two weeks where it was operating at full capacity until the performance started degrading until it was shut off completely.
May 5, 20205 yr 3 minutes ago, NightNectar said: Ive noticed this as well. There was a period of about two weeks where it was operating at full capacity until the performance started degrading until it was shut off completely. Yea, it's incredibly disappointing. On 2/26/2020 at 12:46 PM, DTCL11 said: but your fountain is more trouble than it's worth' Looks like you were right
June 8, 20205 yr About time! "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
June 8, 20205 yr On 5/5/2020 at 10:58 AM, NightNectar said: Ive noticed this as well. There was a period of about two weeks where it was operating at full capacity until the performance started degrading until it was shut off completely. I have an update on this, long story short is Parks & Rec has shut off the fountain due to "essential staffing reductions". It seems that while the fountain pumps were working as designed, the pond/fountain pump filters still require weekly cleaning. With reductions in staffing due to COVID related budget concerns, they temporarily paused many auxiliary tasks associated with the parks. No updates on when it could be flipped back on.
June 8, 20205 yr 5 minutes ago, DevolsDance said: I have an update on this, long story short is Parks & Rec has shut off the fountain due to "essential staffing reductions". It seems that while the fountain pumps were working as designed, the pond/fountain pump filters still require weekly cleaning. With reductions in staffing due to COVID related budget concerns, they temporarily paused many auxiliary tasks associated with the parks. No updates on when it could be flipped back on. This likely explains why the cascades at Franklin Park have been off as well. Perhaps we don't have a lemon this time afterall!
June 9, 20205 yr Kaufman plans to return to the VVC tomorrow with an updated design for Price /2nd Ave Project. Overall the meeting notes from March show support for the project from the commissioners, much more support than the previous tower options. The only pushback was that the building seemed heavy and muddled by too many dark materials, commissioners requested lighter materials like the Moxy or White Castle buildings. Additionally, the commission asked for more living/green walls, was pleased with massing and scale. Updated renders below.
June 9, 20205 yr So.... the commission is buying into THIS design rather than the previous designs that had far more details and blended some of the historic elements with modern touches beautifully..... the commission was so concerned with density they gave up on a higher quality development for.... this?
June 9, 20205 yr "the commission asked for more living/green walls" So... they want to cover the building in ivy? Exterior greenwalls are not a terribly common or successful thing. That's such a weird ask. How about you just plant some properly supported street trees and mandate a green roof?
June 9, 20205 yr I hope that somehow someone with power, money, and connections manages to get a 30 story tower built right next door on the site of the mini-mall. Just. for. spite.
June 15, 20204 yr Kaufman Moving Forward With IBEW Project Despite an uncertain economic climate, Kaufman Development is continuing to pursue the redevelopment of the former International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers site at 23 W. Second Ave. Representatives of the developer presented the latest design for the project to the Victorian Village Commission yesterday. The meeting was held virtually, using the WebEx platform, and streamed live on the city’s YouTube page. The overall concept hasn’t changed drastically since the project was first retooled and brought before the board in February – a seven-story building, topping out at 89 feet, that would hold 166 residential units, a two-level parking garage and about 8,000 square feet of commercial space. More below: https://www.columbusunderground.com/kaufman-moving-forward-with-ibew-project-bw1 & https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2020/06/15/kaufman-submits-new-plan-for-ibew-site-in-the-shor.html "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
June 17, 20204 yr Not a fan of the design at all. There were like 30 previous designs for the site that were better. That said, at least something's going there.
June 18, 20204 yr I know several forumers have commented that they don't care for the design, but I like it quite a bit. Especially after they lightened the upper portion. It's got clean lines and a nice modernity.
June 18, 20204 yr 30 minutes ago, jeremyck01 said: I know several forumers have commented that they don't care for the design, but I like it quite a bit. Especially after they lightened the upper portion. It's got clean lines and a nice modernity. I don't hate the design totally. Just not for the location. It could be seen as being Not in Their Backyard-ish but I'd gladly welcome it in my backyard to replace a strip mall or two in Old North or I think it would look great in Franklinton or on Summit or 4th in IV or downtown but for some reason, and perhaps it's because we saw much better proposals, I'm just not feeling this for this particular location.
July 25, 20204 yr https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2020/07/24/ibew-development.html 'This, sir, is intolerable': Impasse continues over Kaufman Development's plans for IBEW site in the Short North Who believes this gets built?
July 25, 20204 yr It seems the commission is requesting full detailed workup before any conceptual and massing approval which would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars on the *hope* of approval. Kaufman is challenging the commission via the city. It is time for the city to reign in the commission IMO Quote City staff has recommended approval for the development, but the project remains controversial even though it's shorter than other Short North developments because it's farther off High Street and closer to two- and three-story homes. Kaufman President Frank Sasso requested a vote on a "concept approval" on the height and massing, intending to come back when there are more detailed drawings. Kaufman noted that would take another four to six months and cost $500,000. Three commissioners moved to approve, but Chairman Jack Decker said the commission could not give this type of approval without final construction drawings. Quote "This commission has consistently refused to issue such approvals as far back as I know," said Decker, a local attorney and a 14-year veteran of the commission. By the end of the meeting, Kaufman and his legal counsel, Mike Shannon, requested the transcript and guidance from the city law department on whether the commission was following the rules. "I believe that you are out of order, sir," Shannon told Decker. "You have taken the same position (in every project review). ... It's an abuse of your power as chairman to exercise your sole opinion on this august body. This, sir, is intolerable." Question. The VV commission has approved some great sizeable projects. Does Decker happen to live in the immediate vicinity of this development which is why he in particular seems to be putting up a strong fight? Edited July 25, 20204 yr by DTCL11
July 25, 20204 yr 11 hours ago, DTCL11 said: It seems the commission is requesting full detailed workup before any conceptual and massing approval which would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars on the *hope* of approval. Kaufman is challenging the commission via the city. It is time for the city to reign in the commission IMO The commissions (as of lately) have gone off the rails in my eyes. While I do believe they are valuable, they should only be able to function as a design/aesthetic review board and not a size/use/density review board. In the past year alone we have seen the GVC stonewall the McGown Hotel project over height, the UARB fight the King & High project over traffic and height, the VVC fight Kaufman over... well, everything. The commissions have a purpose and place but its becoming more and more apparent that they are no longer functioning in a productive way. At this point the city needs to reign in the boards or we're going to see more and more developers start walking away from high profile projects like the McGown or this. 11 hours ago, DTCL11 said: Question. The VV commission has approved some great sizeable projects. Does Decker happen to live in the immediate vicinity of this development which is why he in particular seems to be putting up a strong fight? Not going to doxx the guy so the simple answer is nope, he does not. I really am not sure what his issue is with this project but I am glad Kaufman is calling him out because the VVC truly seems to have gone rouge on this one.
July 25, 20204 yr Couldn’t agree with you more. They have a purpose in keeping things similar and looking good, but they have gotten out of control with trying to control height and size. I think it will eventually be a burden if they keep trying to make things shorter. If the few remaining lots in the short north, could go high, about 10 stories, it would be great.
July 25, 20204 yr The arguments about height and density are always the same hysterics regardless of the neighborhood. The problem is not that these views exist, but that commissions are either fully comprised of these people now, or they allow that vocal minority to dictate a neighborhood's entire development future. So far, virtually no one has been willing to take a stand and push back against the angry mob and tell them flat out when they're being absolutely unreasonable and ridiculous. If commissions won't reign them in, then the answer is that commissions should just not have the kind of power that they have now. I agree with others that their primary focus should be on things like aesthetics and leave density/height to the city. These people are actively holding the city back and making it more expensive for all.
July 25, 20204 yr I also agree with all of the posters above. These commissions(especially the Clintonvillains and German Villains of these commissions) have gone off the deep end and the lunatic fringe has taken control in some cases of what were supposed to be good ideas for neighborhood involvement in development.
July 25, 20204 yr 42 minutes ago, Toddguy said: I also agree with all of the posters above. These commissions(especially the Clintonvillains and German Villains of these commissions) have gone off the deep end and the lunatic fringe has taken control in some cases of what were supposed to be good ideas for neighborhood involvement in development. Yeah, Clintonville is horrible. The garbage at high & n broadway and basically every new building along there being 1 story is awful.
July 27, 20204 yr On 7/25/2020 at 3:02 PM, VintageLife said: Yeah, Clintonville is horrible. The garbage at high & n broadway and basically every new building along there being 1 story is awful. Not too long ago I drove all the way down High from near 270 in Worthington past downtown-and the Clintonville section seemed the very worst of the entire stretch. It is just really...well..an ugly stretch of High street. It could be so much better than it is. Edited July 27, 20204 yr by Toddguy
July 27, 20204 yr 20 minutes ago, Toddguy said: Not too long ago I drove all the way down High from near 270 in Worthington past downtown-and the Clintonville section seemed the very worst of the entire stretch. It is just really...well..an ugly stretch of High street. It could be so much better than it is. What all do you think could make it better?
July 28, 20204 yr On 7/26/2020 at 11:57 PM, 614love said: What all do you think could make it better? Allow people to develop it, replacing parking lots with walkable mixed use.
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