@Clefan98The truth l was referring to was in reference to comments that some think our problems are due to our leadership while others think the problems are because of selfish infighting among citizens. I maintain the truth is it's all of us. And your statement that most of us don't have a clue what the problem is is exactly my point. Larkin may or may not know what the solutions are but dismissing his concerns lS part of the problem.

 

And l agree that regionalism would be a great start in stopping selfishness. When the subject has come up in the past on this forum have been one if its proponents. 

 

Regarding your stats about Cleveland outpacing Columbus in jobs...don't those numbers show the opposite?

 

Over the last couple of decades Columbus has slowly been outpacing us but recently that pace has picked up and l think with the new Intel plant that will only increase exponentially. We're already reading about discussions between Columbus and outside tech companies negotiating to open facilities at a rate that dwarfs Cleveland. Their economy is beginning to expand at a much faster clip and l think it's only th beginning. 

32 minutes ago, cadmen said:

Regarding your stats about Cleveland outpacing Columbus in jobs...don't those numbers show the opposite?

 

Over the last couple of decades Columbus has slowly been outpacing us but recently that pace has picked up and l think with the new Intel plant that will only increase exponentially. We're already reading about discussions between Columbus and outside tech companies negotiating to open facilities at a rate that dwarfs Cleveland. Their economy is beginning to expand at a much faster clip and l think it's only th beginning. 

Columbus is down 2k jobs yoy, while Cleveland is up almost 20k. 
 

It’s a fallacy to say they’re expanding at a faster clip than we are. This is media driven nonsense. What happens to all those tech jobs once AI takes over? Gone. 

Edited September 18, 20231 yr by Clefan98

Do we know what the jobs we are adding vs them and the pay? Based on a quick Google Search, the Columbus MSA’s GDP is growing a lot faster than ours. 
 

I think worrying about peers like Columbus isn’t super productive. The main issue is the economy in the USA has congregated a ton of jobs and wealth in major metros like DC. Major HQs locate in these cities, drawing workers and then growing new businesses. The major metros create a network effect amongst themselves, making it hard for the smaller regions like ours to compete. This to me is the real story and you can see it talking to young people of all backgrounds who feel they need to move to truly advance in their careers. Then once they advance in those locations, they can’t afford to buy housing. A Mayor Bibb or pick your favorite regional non-profit can’t fix that. 

 

@Clefan98 lf you can't see how Columbus on so many levels (population, percapita income are just a few) is passing us

by then no point in continuing with this subject. I'm more interested in what WE can do as a region anyway. 

 

So again, the answers to our problems can be found in any number of studies of successful regions. That's not the hard part. The hard part is getting us to agree on several of those answers and begin to implement them. First thing is to admit we have a problem and second begin to work on it as a region. As long as we fight among ourselves we'll never improve. 

 

 

8 minutes ago, cadmen said:

@Clefan98 lf you can't see how Columbus on so many levels (population, percapita income are just a few) is passing us

by then no point in continuing with this subject. I'm more interested in what WE can do as a region anyway. 

They’re not passing us in any meaningful ways. Your posts are word salads with no substance. 
 

Columbus has lost more jobs than they’ve gained this year. Cleveland has gained more than 20k jobs this year. These are facts. The Columbus vs Cleveland GDP is essentially the same, despite Columbus having a larger metro population. When you factor GDP per capita, Cleveland is outpacing Columbus.
 

My suggestion is stop listening to MSM headlines and start doing your own research. 

Columbus has hemorrhaged white-collar jobs since COVID but keeps adding blue-collar jobs. It's a narrative people aren't used to hearing.

Also per capita income is very useful in determining growth in affluence and Columbus lags both Cleveland and Cincinnati…..

I kept seeing this thread pop-up (without clicking it) and thinking some big job news happened in Cleveland.  Instead, it's the predictable...Columbus...talk.  I mean, seriously people.

 

Seriously.

 

This is a thread about Cleveland: General Business and Economic News.  Not Columbus.  Not Cincinnati.  Not even Akron.

 

Please stick with Cleveland business news or I'll have to shut this thing down and I really don't want to.

21 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

I kept seeing this thread pop-up (without clicking it) and thinking some big job news happened in Cleveland.  Instead, it's the predictable...Columbus...talk.  I mean, seriously people.

 

Seriously.

 

This is a thread about Cleveland: General Business and Economic News.  Not Columbus.  Not Cincinnati.  Not even Akron.

 

Please stick with Cleveland business news or I'll have to shut this thing down and I really don't want to.

In all fairness to the people engaging in this topic and current discussion, the discussion did not begin due to "predictable....Columbus...talk".  It began due to the posting of an opinion piece by a well known columnist who was comparing  Cleveland economic development to the supposed dynamic economic growth of Columbus.  Given that background, it is a bit difficult to argue the pros and cons of said opinion piece without mentioning Columbus.

Edited September 19, 20231 yr by Htsguy

I 

21 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

I kept seeing this thread pop-up (without clicking it) and thinking some big job news happened in Cleveland.  Instead, it's the predictable...Columbus...talk.  I mean, seriously people.

 

Seriously.

 

This is a thread about Cleveland: General Business and Economic News.  Not Columbus.  Not Cincinnati.  Not even Akron.

 

Please stick with Cleveland business news or I'll have to shut this thing down and I really don't want to.

Where is the best place to post the columns I shares? They focused on economic develop and compare Cleveland Columbus as well as Pittsburgh, which were substantive. It's hard to know what is ok to post on this website sometimes.

16 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

In all fairness to the people engaging in this topic and current discussion, the discussion did not begin due to "predictable....Columbus...talk".  It began due to the posting of an opinion piece by a well known columnist who was comparing  Cleveland economic development to the supposed dynamic economic growth of Columbus.  Given that background, it is a bit difficult to argue the pros and cons of said opinion piece without mentioning Columbus.

 

Agreed on the fairness, but then the "predictable Columbus talk" comes into play with GDP measuring and job stats. That's really what I'm addressing.  It goes down the predictable rabbit hole and inevitably gets off-subject.  You've seen it, I've seen it, Ray Charles has seen it.

 

12 minutes ago, coneflower said:

I 

Where is the best place to post the columns I shares? They focused on economic develop and compare Cleveland Columbus as well as Pittsburgh, which were substantive. It's hard to know what is ok to post on this website sometimes.

 

If it's Cleveland-centric, I'm fine with it here.  If it's more so about Ohio City-A and Ohio City-B (which I will say, for the record, I don't like and usually shut them down), that's likely more an Ohio: General Business & Economic News.  if an article is about what peer cities Cleveland is shadowing/comparing/whatever'ing, then really the discussion should be how Cleveland can improve (or is doing right) itself, not why City A has a Huge University or City B has a Tourism Base and Cleveland doesn't blah blah.  That goes down the wrong path, almost always.

Cleveland's problems aren't really unique to Cleveland.  They're the exact same problems that peer cities such as Detroit, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, St. Louis, Milwaukee as well as countless smaller industrial cities that peaked with 19th/20th century industrial bases.  That says to me that it isn't particularly edifying to complain about Cleveland's leadership, or political subdivisions, or institutional structures.  The problem is obviously bigger- national and international economic structures and policy decisions and cultural shifts.  The same ones that Detroit or Milwaukee are suffering under are what causes Cleveland's distress.

why you guys making the mods work? come on maaan. stick to the clev.

 

 

speaking of, hows about some good news?

 

well, even if its just rearranging the bean counting it's still a good thing:

 

 

 

 

 

September 19, 2023 05:50 AM UPDATED 3 HOURS AGO

 

Cleveland's new, bigger Metropolitan Statistical Area is a win for business

KIM PALMER 

 

 

In July, the federal government published new definitions and borders expanding the Cleveland Metropolitan Statistical Area (MSA) and the Cleveland-Akron-Canton Combined Statistical Area (CSA) with little fanfare.

 

 

more (paywalled, can someone ...you know?):

https://www.crainscleveland.com/politics-policy/cleveland-has-new-bigger-metropolitan-statistical-area

 

 

maybe you knew this already, but if no apparantly below is the jist, welcome your new friend ashtabula county into the fold ... 

 

The new Cleveland MSA (formerly the Cleveland-Elyria MSA) added Ashtabula County, and about 97,000 people, to the existing grouping of Cuyahoga, Lake, Geauga, Medina and Lorain counties.

 

 

15 minutes ago, mrnyc said:

why you guys making the mods work? come on maaan.

 

They've got to earn their massive UO salaries somehow!

1 minute ago, GISguy said:

 

They've got to earn their massive UO salaries somehow!

Those VIP lounges aren't cheap

When l talk about the problems that Cleveland is facing l didn't mean to imply that they are unique to Cleveland because they aren't. They are the same issues most of the Rust Belt cities are dealing with. And because they are regional issues of very long standing duration that makes them even harder to solve.

 

But my focus is on what WE can do as a city. I think it starts with the economy. We love talking about some new development but really that's just the cheery on the sundae. The sundae is the economy and without a growing economy we'll see less and less of those. 

 

As l've said before, there are a lot of things we can do to improve our economy. We still have a lot of strengths. We just have to be smart about it and get to work. We start by realizing that we need to work together and make decisions that are best for the region and not our little suburb. A bunch of nothing towns in North Carolina came together and created the Research Triangle. The key was recognizing they had a problem and then coming together to solve it. 

 

Rather than castigating people like Larkin we need to admit he is correct. We need to accept it and then get to work. All of my comments boil down to that one thought. Admit we have a problem and then work on solutions

 

TOGETHER.

i do think a strong push to build the msa and csa is very important though.

 

its gives a good, united look to ne ohio.

 

and frankly, a more honest look.

 

that is, its better than infighting about it with akron-canton and youngstown or whatever as i believe counties have some say in the matter with the feds.

 

anyway, yay for ashtabula county jumping on the train, all in!

Apparently the United Nations is more optimistic about Cleveland's population than the United States is. (I think the UN is using Cleveland MSA + Akron MSA as their base.)

160,000 people growth by 2035.

 

https://www.macrotrends.net/cities/22959/cleveland/population

 

Regionalize or die needs to be the metro's motto.

11 minutes ago, cadmen said:

But my focus is on what WE can do as a city. I think it starts with the economy. We love talking about some new development but really that's just the cheery on the sundae. The sundae is the economy and without a growing economy we'll see less and less of those. 

 

 

The issue isn't that the local economy is not growing, it is. Workers, especially blue collar, don't have the means to get themselves to where the jobs of today are located ---> https://neo-trans.blog/2023/05/23/greater-cleveland-poverty-amid-plenty/

 

Nothing will change until we reduce the number of fiefdoms in the metro, and significantly invest in new public transit routes. 

 

@cadmenhttps://www.crainscleveland.com/crains-forum-transportation/impact-suburban-sprawl-northeast-ohios-workforce

Here's another excellent article that contains a lot of good data and studies about the workforce struggles in NEO. Let me know if you don't have a Crain's subscription and I will DM you my login info.

I've never said this before in my life - but I think we need an autocratic executive at either the county or city level to go in one term and blow up all bureaucratic red tape and streamline efficiency (i.e. put suburbs feet to the fire over regionalization).

1 hour ago, YABO713 said:

I've never said this before in my life - but I think we need an autocratic executive at either the county or city level to go in one term and blow up all bureaucratic red tape and streamline efficiency (i.e. put suburbs feet to the fire over regionalization).

 

Or get a majority on council to push for systematically streamlining every department's processes and procedures.

 

I wish the state legislature would work on that as well -- reducing the number of laws and improving the readability of the state code, PLUS pushing for better processes in each department.

I totally agree that converting all of our cities into a regional government would be a great step in moving us forward. But getting all the suburbs to give up what local control (read: power) they have will be like building the pyramids. Nevertheless, l'd love to see our leaders make another attempt. It will take a ton of Public meetings with data to show the benefits but l think it's worth trying.

5 hours ago, cadmen said:

I totally agree that converting all of our cities into a regional government would be a great step in moving us forward. But getting all the suburbs to give up what local control (read: power) they have will be like building the pyramids. Nevertheless, l'd love to see our leaders make another attempt. It will take a ton of Public meetings with data to show the benefits but l think it's worth trying.

 

It's doomed to failure and would backfire, poisoning limited and lower level regionalization programs while dooming new ones.   The more affluent suburbs (and the ones who see themselves as such) are not going to willingly merge with Cleveland proper, even under a county structure.   They would go to the state and both parties would back them.   The Republicans would on general principles.   The Democrats would to maintain their status as a viable party.  Losing what influence they retain in the suburbs would render them a permanent minority.\

 

I'm not sure some urbanists understand the intensity of anti-annexation sentiment in the suburbs or how easily overambitious regionalization can be portrayed as a move in that direction.   

Ha! Oh l absolutely understand that converting our system of balkanized form of government to a regional one is dead on arrival. 

 

But that ties into a previous point l've made. One of the best ways to move the region forward is to stop our selfish ways and do what is best for the whole. Unfortunately, we're not going to do what we need to do, which is make the tough decisions.

 

 

Is there a local study on how much duplication there is within the County which would show one of the advantages to regionalism is getting rid of duplication and the associated costs with it?  

 

Regarding the local economy, local job growth is at +1% yoy for the month of August.  In comparison

 

Columbus is at 0.8% yoy for the month.

Cincinnati is at 2.6% yoy for the month.

Detroit is at 0.4% yoy for the month.

Indianapolis is at 2.3% yoy for the month.

Pittsburgh is at 2.5% yoy for the month.    

 

Within a 6 hour drive... and of course we're not in competition with them but just to look...

 

Chicago is at 0.9% yoy for the month.

D.C. is at 1.6% you for the month.

 

The following are sectors which have had three or more consecutive months of decline within the Cleveland Region:

 

-Trade, Transportation and Utilities (August -3.8% yoy)

-Information (August -1.2% yoy)

-Financial Activities (August -1.6% yoy)

-Professional and Business Services (August -0.9% yoy)

 

What's the main driver keeping the region afloat? Education and Health Services, which employs more people within the sector now than at any other time in the Cleveland Region's history, at close to 210,000 people (August +5.3 yoy).  The sector is close to employing 100,000 MORE people than Manufacturing (August +1.3% yoy), in Cleveland. 

 

It's statistics like these that tell me the region has turned a corner.  However, the statistics don't account for why the region isn't growing in population.  Growth will follow jobs- and Cleveland is STILL years behind at the current job growth rate of coming back to where it was pre-NAFTA regarding employment.  

 

If we're going to compare the strengths and weaknesses of the Cleveland Region with other peer regions around the state and other parts of the country, those comparisons are warranted if they can point the business community and the elected officials here towards avenues which would create job growth.    

 

 

Edited September 20, 20231 yr by Oldmanladyluck

1 minute ago, Oldmanladyluck said:

What's the main driver keeping the region afloat? Education and Health Services

 

Eds and Meds are what propelled PGH to a diversified economy and that pivot's gotten them a lot of attention nationally. Hopefully this transition continues.

The one thing I worry about regarding health care is how much of that growth is weighted toward service-providing roles that reflect the needs of caring for our aging population vs. economy-growing roles in innovative industries like life sciences/pharma, etc. 

 

I'm happy healthcare employs so many people, but based on what I've read we're not attracting research or investor dollars at the same level as our peers. 

 

 

 

 

 

21 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

It's doomed to failure and would backfire, poisoning limited and lower level regionalization programs while dooming new ones.   The more affluent suburbs (and the ones who see themselves as such) are not going to willingly merge with Cleveland proper, even under a county structure.   They would go to the state and both parties would back them.   The Republicans would on general principles.   The Democrats would to maintain their status as a viable party.  Losing what influence they retain in the suburbs would render them a permanent minority.\

 

I'm not sure some urbanists understand the intensity of anti-annexation sentiment in the suburbs or how easily overambitious regionalization can be portrayed as a move in that direction.   

 

 

nonsense. a true old school republican is a fiscal conservative who would be all for decreasing wasteful government, getting rid of ridiculous duplication of services and thus saving an enormous amount of money. not to mention they tend favor all powerful godlike leadership. if not true today you can thank trump for leading them astray from core values to fractious ruin.

1 hour ago, mrnyc said:

 

 

nonsense. a true old school republican is a fiscal conservative who would be all for decreasing wasteful government, getting rid of ridiculous duplication of services and thus saving an enormous amount of money. not to mention they tend favor all powerful godlike leadership. if not true today you can thank trump for leading them astray from core values to fractious ruin.

When republicans say they want small government, I guess they mean 59 small governments.

Don't turn this into a partisan pissing match.

4 hours ago, X said:

Don't turn this into a partisan pissing match.

 

IMO it's not doing so to say@Enginerdis correct to a point.   I think most of us (on the right) would prefer that those government functions which are essential be done at as low a level as possible.  Multiple governments at a low level are preferable to one large one because they force the governments to compete with each other and make foolish overreach obvious and counterproductive.

 

This is topical to this thread.  If Cleveland makes it difficult to do business within its boundaries and Brecksville or Solon do not, that impacts where places will locate.

Edited September 21, 20231 yr by E Rocc

^ l don't know what you mean by the statement that multiple small governments force them too compete with each other is a reason for not having regional government but regardless, l think by far the best reason is simply reducing the need for each city in the county to have a mayor, a chief of police, a fire chief and any other head of a city department. A regional or county government would by definition eliminate all of those positions. And by eliminating all of those Chiefs you can use the savings to hire more Indians (workers). 

 

Look. I get that there are benefits to being able to get a local official on the phone in a small city vs. a larger one but in the grand scheme of things l think the benefits of one large government pulling in one direction is better than dozens of small governments pulling in different directions.

On 9/18/2023 at 3:56 PM, Henke said:

I’m not saying that Jackson was a failure. But his leadership happened over a 16 year timeline.
 

I think  Bibb deserves (at least) the four years we elected him to serve before we call him a failed leader. 

 

I agree. I wouldn't say Bibb is a failure yet either - its too early to make any kind of general judgement even though he is clearly failing on the crime front and his failed attempt (luckily blocked by City Council) to move $400M out of the police budget to spend on other things rather than spend it on policing shows very poor leadership. My point was that Jackson wasn't a great leader either--and though he had 16 years--he at least got some stuff done and moving as @Whipjacka listed above; Jackson certainly wasn't a failure. We'll see how Bibb fares over his next few years. But I still think Larkin's article was on point--that our current leaders lack great leadership skill and vision. Not just Bibb--but all the civic non-profits as well.

15 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

IMO it's not doing so to say@Enginerdis correct to a point.   I think most of us (on the right) would prefer that those government functions which are essential be done at as low a level as possible.  Multiple governments at a low level are preferable to one large one because they force the governments to compete with each other and make foolish overreach obvious and counterproductive.

 

This is topical to this thread.  If Cleveland makes it difficult to do business within its boundaries and Brecksville or Solon do not, that impacts where places will locate.

 

nope again — thats trumpian era drift.

 

multiple governments is not fiscally responsible whatsoever. plus thats just utter nonsense. government should not be in competition with government, that just makes big government. leave the competition to the people and limit the gov. thats true old school republicanism before this trump era. 

 

if thats too hard to get past, then just continue the push to consolidate ridiculous duplicated services, like sanitation, fire, building inspectors, etc etc.. that will eventually make repetitive city hall little king fiefdoms irrelevant.

Think of all of those mayors, council members, chiefs and directors, from 57 municipalites out of work.  Oh, the humanity!

13 hours ago, mrnyc said:

 

government should not be in competition with government,

 

Local governments absolutely should be in competition with each other.    That's how best practices evolve and practical limitations develop.

4 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

Local governments absolutely should be in competition with each other.    That's how best practices evolve and practical limitations develop.

 

no it isnt. thats how tax dollars are wasted in duplication of services and fiefdoms. and corruption is much easier. the function of government is not the same as the business world. at all. its a socialist institution. so less government is the historic republican way, but trumpism has destroyed old school conservatism. 

 

 

3 hours ago, mrnyc said:

 

no it isnt. thats how tax dollars are wasted in duplication of services and fiefdoms. and corruption is much easier. the function of government is not the same as the business world. at all. its a socialist institution. so less government is the historic republican way, but trumpism has destroyed old school conservatism. 

 

 

Yea, I'd say regions should be in competition with other regions, but when it's local municipalities competing that's when you get moves like Eaton to Beachwood or American Greetings to Westlake, net neutral for the region, but the tools used to relocate local businesses could've been used to attract new business or investment to the Region!

8 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

Local governments absolutely should be in competition with each other.    That's how best practices evolve and practical limitations develop.

For six years I was an elected councilman of one of the Chevy Chases in Maryland (seven small independent and adjacent villages within Montgomery County).  The county gave us pro-rata money for the services we provided that duplicated what the county provided elsewhere - it was mostly roads, sidewalks, garbage removal, sewers, storm water management, and snow removal.  The services we provided were not only better (twice weekly garbage vs once, snow removal within 6 hours of the end of the storm vs "sometime this week", sidewalks and driveway aprons plowed, etc.) but also cheaper than what the County provided elsewhere.  We made money on the deal every year.  We competed everything commercially; the county used civil servants.  We also had lower real estate taxes and paid our residents' sewage fee tacked onto their tax bill.  We would have done more, but Maryland state law favors counties and limits every municipality not named Baltimore.  

 

Smaller CAN sometimes be better.

 

 

2 hours ago, Dougal said:

For six years I was an elected councilman of one of the Chevy Chases in Maryland (seven small independent and adjacent villages within Montgomery County).  The county gave us pro-rata money for the services we provided that duplicated what the county provided elsewhere - it was mostly roads, sidewalks, garbage removal, sewers, storm water management, and snow removal.  The services we provided were not only better (twice weekly garbage vs once, snow removal within 6 hours of the end of the storm vs "sometime this week", sidewalks and driveway aprons plowed, etc.) but also cheaper than what the County provided elsewhere.  We made money on the deal every year.  We competed everything commercially; the county used civil servants.  We also had lower real estate taxes and paid our residents' sewage fee tacked onto their tax bill.  We would have done more, but Maryland state law favors counties and limits every municipality not named Baltimore.  

 

Smaller CAN sometimes be better.

 

 

 

yes some things done even cheaper and quicker or in addition to city services locally via neighborhood and business district bids, which is basically the level of those. so get together with your neighborhood or high street shops to fund it and it can easily be done w/no duplicative gov baggage.

6 hours ago, Mov2Ohio said:

Yea, I'd say regions should be in competition with other regions, but when it's local municipalities competing that's when you get moves like Eaton to Beachwood or American Greetings to Westlake, net neutral for the region, but the tools used to relocate local businesses could've been used to attract new business or investment to the Region!

 

Exactly.  It's like thinking that an athlete should put his left hamstring in competition with his right pectoral muscle in order to get the best results.  We need to get our whole body pulling together so we can beat the real competition- Wichita, KS.   And maybe some other places, I dunno.

Cool that we get to add more jobs, but more sprawl as well....

 

 

"A plumbing-parts maker plans to set up shop in Portage County, where a manufacturing plant is set to rise on 80 acres at the sprawling Turnpike Commerce Center business park. Viega LLC, the U.S. arm of a German-born business, expects to initially create 68 jobs at its first Ohio facility in Shalersville Township......

 

The company has a North American headquarters in Colorado and other U.S. operations in Georgia, Kansas, Nevada, New Hampshire and Pennsylvania. Ohio was vying against Virginia, Pennsylvania and Kansas for the new manufacturing facility, according to a deal summary from the Ohio Department of Development."

 

Plumbing-parts maker Viega plans Portage County manufacturing plant

 

https://www.crainscleveland.com/manufacturing/pipe-systems-maker-viega-plans-northeast-ohio-manufacturing-plant

35 minutes ago, DinaB said:

Cool that we get to add more jobs, but more sprawl as well....

 

 

"A plumbing-parts maker plans to set up shop in Portage County, where a manufacturing plant is set to rise on 80 acres at the sprawling Turnpike Commerce Center business park. Viega LLC, the U.S. arm of a German-born business, expects to initially create 68 jobs at its first Ohio facility in Shalersville Township......

 

The company has a North American headquarters in Colorado and other U.S. operations in Georgia, Kansas, Nevada, New Hampshire and Pennsylvania. Ohio was vying against Virginia, Pennsylvania and Kansas for the new manufacturing facility, according to a deal summary from the Ohio Department of Development."

 

Plumbing-parts maker Viega plans Portage County manufacturing plant

 

https://www.crainscleveland.com/manufacturing/pipe-systems-maker-viega-plans-northeast-ohio-manufacturing-plant

Can't see past the paywall, how many jobs is this to produce?

57 minutes ago, DinaB said:

Cool that we get to add more jobs, but more sprawl as well....

 

 

"A plumbing-parts maker plans to set up shop in Portage County, where a manufacturing plant is set to rise on 80 acres at the sprawling Turnpike Commerce Center business park. Viega LLC, the U.S. arm of a German-born business, expects to initially create 68 jobs at its first Ohio facility in Shalersville Township......

 

The company has a North American headquarters in Colorado and other U.S. operations in Georgia, Kansas, Nevada, New Hampshire and Pennsylvania. Ohio was vying against Virginia, Pennsylvania and Kansas for the new manufacturing facility, according to a deal summary from the Ohio Department of Development."

 

Plumbing-parts maker Viega plans Portage County manufacturing plant

 

https://www.crainscleveland.com/manufacturing/pipe-systems-maker-viega-plans-northeast-ohio-manufacturing-plant

 

21 minutes ago, Gnoraa said:

Can't see past the paywall, how many jobs is this to produce?

 

Articles says, "initially create 68 jobs."  Doesn't say any long-term numbers.

That facility is 1 million square feet. I wonder how much space is required to employ 68 people. I definitely support more jobs but that seems like an inefficient use of land. But I just read an article that these developments are one area where there is strength vs. building/owning office buildings, so we'll clearly see more of it. 

 

80 acres is huge. 

Edited September 25, 20231 yr by coneflower

What if the people are really tall?

3 minutes ago, TBideon said:

What if the people are really tall?

We're talking area, so it would really only matter if they're really wide.

 

On 9/22/2023 at 12:51 PM, Dougal said:

For six years I was an elected councilman of one of the Chevy Chases in Maryland (seven small independent and adjacent villages within Montgomery County).  The county gave us pro-rata money for the services we provided that duplicated what the county provided elsewhere - it was mostly roads, sidewalks, garbage removal, sewers, storm water management, and snow removal.  The services we provided were not only better (twice weekly garbage vs once, snow removal within 6 hours of the end of the storm vs "sometime this week", sidewalks and driveway aprons plowed, etc.) but also cheaper than what the County provided elsewhere.  We made money on the deal every year.  We competed everything commercially; the county used civil servants.  We also had lower real estate taxes and paid our residents' sewage fee tacked onto their tax bill.  We would have done more, but Maryland state law favors counties and limits every municipality not named Baltimore.  

 

Smaller CAN sometimes be better.

 

 

 

I've said many times that even when Maple Heights Transit was an autonomous part of GCRTA, it was far better run than the bulk of the system.  

Linking @KJP's article here about the Clinic's research expansion: https://neo-trans.blog/2023/09/28/cleveland-clinic-unveils-next-phase-of-innovation-district/

 

I would be interested to hear from people who watch this industry closely, but growing research/lab space like this is definitely exciting. Could this help create a small version of Boston's Kendal Square here?

I spent 25 years in clinical research working for a private company as well as the Cleveland Clinic. When l started l think the industry was more of a niche market if you can call a multi-billion dollar industry niche. It has only grown both in investment and workforce but it's still not all that large compared to other sectors in the US economy.

 

That being said, the only reason l care about it is because of the Clinic's standing on the national scene. Other than the orchestra and maybe the art museum l can't think of another area where we are in the upper echelon nationally. So any time l read about local investment in medical research l think it's smart. We should leverage our strengths in the field by increasing that investment in facilities and physicians/scientists. Bringing in star researchers adds support staff as well. These are high paying jobs and they contribute to raising our economic bar as we navigate our way in the new knowledge economy of the future.

 

The last piece of this economic puzzle would be having the knowledge created here turn into a Fortune 500 or even 1000 company. That would put us on the map and help create a stronger economy. That's the bottom line for me. The best way for Cleveland to thrive is to create a strong economy. We aren't in the upper echelon in the American economy but medical research is one area we can compete in.