^^Looking at loopnet for industrial properties over 30k sq ft in the Pittsburgh area and there really aren't any above 100k except for pure distribution warehouses. So unlikely this is going to PA.

 

True, but the Ford #2 engine plant isn't on loopnet either.

^Why would it be if it is just being touted by the city and the owner of the property(Ford) isn't interested in leasing or selling. 

  This group needs a turnkey facility. Again there are many that meet the requirements all over NEO and in Cleveland.  It doesn't matter to me where this plant goes as long as its in Northeast Ohio. They said they would announce in June their choice.

^Why would it be if it is just being touted by the city and the owner of the property(Ford) isn't interested in leasing or selling. 

  This group needs a turnkey facility. Again there are many that meet the requirements all over NEO and in Cleveland.  It doesn't matter to me where this plant goes as long as its in Northeast Ohio. They said they would announce in June their choice.

 

My point is that, just because a Pittsburgh facility isn't on the market, doesn't preclude an off-market deal like what APEG wants to do in Brook Park.

 

I don't care where in NE Ohio it goes either, although I would prefer it be in Cleveland or an inner-ring suburb. I'd hate to see a corn field succumb to this factory.

I felt this was more of a play for tax credits to see what states could bring to the table to juice up a deal especially since the Ford plant was a bit of a dud.  I don't know that they had a building in mind anywhere. It really comes down to the right type of building and if there is a good amount of workers to choose from that are nearby as they will need a variety of skillsets to create all their departments. 

  With the time-frame, no cornfields will be damaged for this project.

More than likely. Which is why the addition to their board of advisors of former Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Ridge and the CEO of the company that bears his name has caught my attention.

^I noticed that as well. I think his role will be as an advisor on the government aspect for the company in how they pursue military and or homeland security vehicles sales. This could include seeking further R&D funding from the government.  So I feel he should be government-facing not a business-focused advisor so should not have much say in plant location decisions.

^I noticed that as well. I think his role will be as an advisor on the government aspect for the company in how they pursue military and or homeland security vehicles sales. This could include seeking further R&D funding from the government.  So I feel he should be government-facing not a business-focused advisor so should not have much say in plant location decisions.

 

Good point.

Public benefit overrides private benefit. Municipalities commonly seize blighted/unproductive properties to benefit the public good.

 

Yeah, unless Ford can demonstrate a concrete need or plan for future use, this would be the textbook case for use of eminent domain. The only issue would be that the City would likely have to take title to the land first, meaning there would have to be a transfer to the plant. This means that there would likely be an issue of proceeds over the land which could turn into a LONG chain of litigation.

 

Unfortunately, Ford has the upper-hand in this situation, at least on its face. However, I do believe Calfee represents (at least they have in the past) the city of Brook Park; there is no more capable municipal law department in the Midwest. Additionally, Brook Park has a very much authoritarian mayor - some hate him some love him; but it is situations like this where strong arming and "asking for forgiveness not permission" might turn out to benefit the city.

 

I don't recall Calfee Halter ever representing the City.  Its current Law Director is Carol Horvath and it uses the firm of Walter Haverfield on most issues requiring outside counsel. 

 

As for the use of eminent domain, I don't know that "quick take" proceedings can be used.  And its not a textbook case for use of eminent domain.  A textbook case would be where a city takes your property to build something for public use, like a highway.  Taking property for private use is much more difficult. 

Ford better not screw up the chance of Greater Cleveland getting the American Plasma plant:

 

Mayor considers suing Ford Motor Company to get access to 250 acres of unused land in Brook Park

http://s.cleveland.com/IGXoHxH

 

Ford may prefer to give them Walton Hills, especially if these guys are about to up the demand for aluminum engines.  Which lower operating temperatures would.

Ford may prefer to give them Walton Hills, especially if these guys are about to up the demand for aluminum engines.  Which lower operating temperatures would.

 

Is Ford using any part of Walton Hills? And I thought proximity to the airport was a big selling part of Ford Brook Park?

 

I realize that APEG wanted a 100,000 sf production facility, but this one is pretty is close to that and it's near Hopkins Airport...

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/20264605/19801-Holland-Rd-Brook-Park-OH/

 

Then there's the old Graf-Tech HQ and attached 100,000 sf manufacturing plant just a little farther away...

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/20312554/12900-Snow-Rd-Parma-OH/

Ford may prefer to give them Walton Hills, especially if these guys are about to up the demand for aluminum engines.  Which lower operating temperatures would.

 

Is Ford using any part of Walton Hills? And I thought proximity to the airport was a big selling part of Ford Brook Park?

 

I realize that APEG wanted a 100,000 sf production facility, but this one is pretty is close to that and it's near Hopkins Airport...

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/20264605/19801-Holland-Rd-Brook-Park-OH/

 

It's basically abandoned.  There may be up to ten cars in the lot on a weekday afternnoon, no more than that.

 

I'm not seeing how the airport would help an industrial facility as much as freeway and rail access do, both of which WH has.  Though the freeway access there can be screwy, IIRC this is also true at Brookpark.

Public benefit overrides private benefit. Municipalities commonly seize blighted/unproductive properties to benefit the public good.

 

Yeah, unless Ford can demonstrate a concrete need or plan for future use, this would be the textbook case for use of eminent domain. The only issue would be that the City would likely have to take title to the land first, meaning there would have to be a transfer to the plant. This means that there would likely be an issue of proceeds over the land which could turn into a LONG chain of litigation.

 

Unfortunately, Ford has the upper-hand in this situation, at least on its face. However, I do believe Calfee represents (at least they have in the past) the city of Brook Park; there is no more capable municipal law department in the Midwest. Additionally, Brook Park has a very much authoritarian mayor - some hate him some love him; but it is situations like this where strong arming and "asking for forgiveness not permission" might turn out to benefit the city.

 

I don't recall Calfee Halter ever representing the City.  Its current Law Director is Carol Horvath and it uses the firm of Walter Haverfield on most issues requiring outside counsel. 

 

As for the use of eminent domain, I don't know that "quick take" proceedings can be used.  And its not a textbook case for use of eminent domain.  A textbook case would be where a city takes your property to build something for public use, like a highway.  Taking property for private use is much more difficult. 

 

Especially if the taxes are up to date.  It's close to impossible at that point, and if a company the size of Ford chooses to fight it the "close to" can be omitted.

The State tightened up its eminent domain law significantly in 2008 after the SCOTUS Kelo decision, specifically to limit this kind of economic development condemnation.

What about the IX center?  I think a third of it is used by Ford for storage?  Kick them out and they can take their stored items to Brookpark.

I'm not seeing how the airport would help an industrial facility as much as freeway and rail access do, both of which WH has.  Though the freeway access there can be screwy, IIRC this is also true at Brookpark.

 

Thanks for the info on WH.

 

I got the impression from Audidave, who also seems to have a good handle on this project as you do, that airport access is important to APEG:

 

The whole business advisory team are all Cleveland guys.  They are moving very fast to get this to market in a mass scale. They want production by end of year.  They pinpointed the Ford engine plant as where they would like to go or would be appropriate. I expect that is where it will go. The advantage is that it is right by the airport. Since they are making a fairly small component it would seem likely that air freight to Japan, Korea, and Germany would be the best method.

  They are talking about a potential redesign of vehicles because of this invention. The heat of the engine from this would be much less, so engines can be aluminum. There will be less need for emissions equipment as the fuel will burn at a much lower temperature. So it isn't just better gas mileage it is also greater horsepower being created allowing for smaller much more efficient engines which therefore reduces the weight further.

Interesting charts showing which metro areas justify new construction of offices, apartments, industrial, retail, hotels, etc.:

 

http://dividendcapital.com/uploaded-files/financial-advisors/ipt/sales-tools/reports/17Q1_Cycle_Forecast_FINAL_BD_ONLY.pdf

^^^I don't have any special insight on the APEG decision making. They have all their articles about the company on their website. I look at it as they are about to create the biggest killer app for the world's automakers. I think there will be some competitors to them from reading the science paper going over each country's similar technology.  But at this point it is first mover level, which is why speed to market wins.  Knowing that, the most important aspects are being able to find good engineers, plentiful location options, people with experience in the automotive industry and an airport nearby absolutely helps. I don't think they need to be 3 min away but anywhere up to 30 minutes is probably fine.  i think all those boxes are checked pretty strongly in the Cleveland area.

We've often discussed the large physical area that the city of Columbus encompasses -- and enjoys. Many folks here complain about it, that it makes Columbus appear artificially larger in population. But the large municipal geographic area is a clear advantage over Cleveland in a more tangible way when it comes to economic development: It helps Columbus redistribute wealth and community infrastructure investment to ensure that the low-income pockets don't become areas of concentrated poverty and crime.

 

A few of us here would maintain that "redistributing wealth" by the public sector is a strong negative and another point against the annexation model.

I don't know that it is necessarily a distribution of wealth as opposed to being more efficient in government. Not having replicating government services and school districts every mile of Cuyahoga county plus ensuing zoning regulations and taxing regimes can make it a lot simpler for expanding companies to deal with just one local government.

 

It does in the way that when a low-income neighborhood needs a shot in the arm (new rec center, rebuilt sewers, cleared/cleaned abandoned industrial site, etc) that the city will have the resources to do it. It will have those resources because the city is not so physically small that its tax base isn't comprised entirely of that struggling area. Every struggling person, business, neighborhood, city, etc. needs a helping hand at some point in their lives. And that helping hand is ultimately a redistribution be it monetary, spiritual, kindness/humanity, etc.

I just worry about the phrase redistribution of wealth as that makes conservatives go herky jerky.

  Its more that a Solon has plenty of tax base to do with what they want in their city and they can reinvest in their infrastructure as they see fit and keep the good times rolling. Cleveland missed the bus on that somehow in the 1950-1970s as the highways were being built out to the Solons.

^ funny, because democratic run cities are the economic engine of the country.  Blue counties account for 66% of the national GDP.  But don't let facts cloud your opinion.  Facts are like kryptonite to Trumpies.

The real answer is to invest in education and promote innovation.  Attracting venture capital and working to bring a good industry mix into the region.

 

I feel that new economy jobs are growing in Cleveland and I think there is data which reflect that.  Old economy jobs continue to decline due to automation.  At some point the new economy jobs increase faster than the decrease of old economy jobs. 

^ funny, because democratic run cities are the economic engine of the country.  Blue counties account for 66% of the national GDP.  But don't let facts cloud your opinion.  Facts are like kryptonite to Trumpies.

 

I don't think - at least the way I read it - that his comment was pejorative. I do think the city would benefit from an infusion of Republicans. I'm not disagreeing with your statistics, just saying that "iron sharpens iron"

We can elect all republicans tomorrow and nothing will change.  The issue isn't as simple as what letter is after the elected officials name. 

We can elect all republicans tomorrow and nothing will change.  The issue isn't as simple as what letter is after the elected officials name.

 

I think you are missing my point. I am not advocating electing officials from either party. I am merely suggesting that diversity of political thought and thereby philosophies for economic growth will only promote better, more battle tested ideas in the end.

I feel that new economy jobs are growing in Cleveland and I think there is data which reflect that.  Old economy jobs continue to decline due to automation.  At some point the new economy jobs increase faster than the decrease of old economy jobs.

 

I believe this, too. Was it 2014 when the Cleveland MSA number declined by a mere 14 people? It's discouraging that even the Ohio estimates show continuing declines for future years.

The real answer is to invest in education and promote innovation.  Attracting venture capital and working to bring a good industry mix into the region.

 

I feel that new economy jobs are growing in Cleveland and I think there is data which reflect that.  Old economy jobs continue to decline due to automation.  At some point the new economy jobs increase faster than the decrease of old economy jobs.

 

I don't think we can continue to wait for the new economy to take root naturally in our city. I feel like we need to pursue policies that encourage that growth more rapidly. That's the problem with Cleveland, in my view. It's not that things are going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction in the city, but it's not happening fast enough. We need to speed it up. And there are policies that we can pursue in order to make that happen

I would argue that we are not waiting for it naturally.  I think we are seeing many of the pieces coming together now.

I don't think we can continue to wait for the new economy to take root naturally in our city. I feel like we need to pursue policies that encourage that growth more rapidly. That's the problem with Cleveland, in my view. It's not that things are going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction in the city, but it's not happening fast enough. We need to speed it up ...

 

Cleveland today reminds me of Washington in the late 90's, when DC was emerging from the crime and corruption of the Marion Barry days.  Lots was happening, but it wasn't falling-ton-of-bricks obvious. I'm not comparing any Cleveland politician to Marion Barry; my point is the city was so used to bad news that it ignored the good, even when there was lots of good.

 

From three hundred miles away, I see lots of good in Cleveland today. Still, I can understand your impatience.

I don't think we can continue to wait for the new economy to take root naturally in our city. I feel like we need to pursue policies that encourage that growth more rapidly. That's the problem with Cleveland, in my view. It's not that things are going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction in the city, but it's not happening fast enough. We need to speed it up ...

 

Cleveland today reminds me of Washington in the late 90's, when DC was emerging from the crime and corruption of the Marion Barry days.  Lots was happening, but it wasn't falling-ton-of-bricks obvious. I'm not comparing any Cleveland politician to Marion Barry; my point is the city was so used to bad news that it ignored the good, even when there was lots of good.

 

From three hundred miles away, I see lots of good in Cleveland today. Still, I can understand your impatience.

 

Very happy to hear you say this, thank you. But, may I ask what in particular you are encouraged by beyond your general feelings?

^ I know it is not directed at me, but I am encouraged by the activity in MidTown.  I'm particularly excited about the startup scene that is emerging from Cleveland Clinic, UH and CWRU.

 

The acquisition of Expolrys by IBM and their new development going up on E. 105 is a testament to the potential of these spinoffs.

I don't think we can continue to wait for the new economy to take root naturally in our city. I feel like we need to pursue policies that encourage that growth more rapidly. That's the problem with Cleveland, in my view. It's not that things are going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction in the city, but it's not happening fast enough. We need to speed it up ...

 

Cleveland today reminds me of Washington in the late 90's, when DC was emerging from the crime and corruption of the Marion Barry days.  Lots was happening, but it wasn't falling-ton-of-bricks obvious. I'm not comparing any Cleveland politician to Marion Barry; my point is the city was so used to bad news that it ignored the good, even when there was lots of good.

 

From three hundred miles away, I see lots of good in Cleveland today. Still, I can understand your impatience.

 

Yes I have compared it the very same way myself.  Although I thought it was very obvious when I came back here from D.C. 

 

I think Jackson, although a better person that Barry, suffers from the same limiting aspirations and perspective.  This will certainly be the defining election. 

 

I think I'm liking Madalone and think he might be just what the city needs now.             

 

 

I'm also encouraged by reports that coastal employers are looking inland to move their back-office workers to save money. Legacy cities like Cleveland, Pittsburgh, Detroit etc. that possess big-city amenities but with lower costs are attractive to them. Toronto got a tremendous boost when corporations in the 1970s moved their headquarters from Montreal (once Canada's biggest city -- was twice as large as Toronto in 1960) to get away from the Liberte Quebec troubles. I don't expect corporate headquarters to relocate, nor do I expect a Toronto-like bump from employers relocating from the East. But I am looking for Cleveland to capitalize on this opportunity.

Very happy to hear you say this, thank you. But, may I ask what in particular you are encouraged by beyond your general feelings?

 

I like the demographic churn the city and area are going through with education, income, and active workforce levels rising. I like the increasing dispersion of construction projects. I like the venture and investment capital commitments. I like the practical approach and attitude of most of the politicians. The manufacturing base seems to have stabilized at a  level that will sustain skills and employment. I like the growing R&D base. Even the weather isn't as bad as people like to think.

 

Basically, things are happening. There were years when they didn't.

 

I think the most basic change is the way the county government is no longer a 3 headed monster of a boys club.  With accountability, no longer is the county working at juxtapositions to the main city.  Perhaps more things( jail, airport, etc) can move to the county in the near future.

I think the most basic change is the way the county government is no longer a 3 headed monster of a boys club.  With accountability, no longer is the county working at juxtapositions to the main city.  Perhaps more things( jail, airport, etc) can move to the county in the near future.

 

????  There's already city and county jails.

^ funny, because democratic run cities are the economic engine of the country.  Blue counties account for 66% of the national GDP.  But don't let facts cloud your opinion.  Facts are like kryptonite to Trumpies.

 

Look where the growth is in Metro Cleveland though.  The red or purple places.  Solon, Strongsville, Mentor, Avon, Medina County.....

 

Much of this isn't the city's fault (CERCLA) but it's what's going on.

 

do those places grow because of republicans or because they have tons of greenfields ready for development.

do those places grow because of republicans or because they have tons of greenfields ready for development.

 

You caught me mid-edit.  It's not "because of" Republicans as much as competition I suspect.  But CERCLA is huge.

I think the most basic change is the way the county government is no longer a 3 headed monster of a boys club.  With accountability, no longer is the county working at juxtapositions to the main city.  Perhaps more things( jail, airport, etc) can move to the county in the near future.

 

????  There's already city and county jails.

^ funny, because democratic run cities are the economic engine of the country.  Blue counties account for 66% of the national GDP.  But don't let facts cloud your opinion.  Facts are like kryptonite to Trumpies.

 

Facts: http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2017/06/cleveland_city_council_to_appr.html

 

Some newspaper education.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20170608/NEWS/170609836/ge-lighting-is-officially-for-sale

 

GE Lighting is on the block.  I wish companies would consider more spin-offs instead of sales. The sales are often to vulture capital funds that slice and dice, extracting as much cash as possible and then move on leaving a debt-ridden hulk behind. It damages everybody involved except the fund.

Indiana in town to steal jobs or future jobs from Cleveland.

 

http://www.washtimesherald.com/news/radius-indiana-shares-region-with-cleveland/article_f60bf181-2bf9-5067-be7b-5c93cbe7f2d2.html

This follows Marcus & Millichap in May forming IPA Midwest-Multifamily and locating it in Cleveland. This all sounds like a big deal to me........

 

California's Bank of the West opens commercial banking hub in Cleveland

June 08, 2017 UPDATED 6 HOURS AGO

By JEREMY NOBILE 

 

Bank of the West, an $83 billion-asset bank based in San Francisco, has opened a new commercial banking office in Cleveland led by managing director and Northeast Ohio market veteran David Dannemiller.

 

The new office at 1375 E. 9th St. is part of an ongoing nationwide expansion for Bank of the West, said Mark Glasky, executive vice president and head of commercial banking coverage, as the institution pushes east from its California base, adding offices from Los Angeles to New York. The last commercial office it opened prior to this was in Atlanta in late 2014. And coinciding with the Cleveland location, another new office is poised to open in Dallas.

 

The Cleveland office will serve Ohio, eastern Michigan, central Indiana and western Pennsylvania markets.

 

MORE:

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20170608/NEWS/170609829/californias-bank-of-the-west-opens-commercial-banking-hub-in

Seems like a big deal to me.  The office will serve surrounding states.  This should bring more lending capital into the region.  Any idea how much space they're leasing.  I didn't see it in the article?

Whatever they do they should not raise the minimum wage past the state's, let alone to $15 an hour, if they want new jobs inside the city limits.

KJP[/member] I agree. Bank of the West moving here certainly is big news. Especially since our region will include Detroit and Pittsburgh. Great news for the finance sector. Hopefully this presence grows beyond commercial banking as well.

Good news indeed and it underscores the fact that Cleveland is an important big city, both in finance and otherwise.

Good news indeed and it underscores the fact that Cleveland is an important big city, both in finance and otherwise.

 

Don't forget all the big law firms that call the city home.

What is the banking hub of the Midwest?  There is NYC on the east coast.  Charlotte in the southeast.  SF and Seattle out west.  I would assume Chicago...

What is the banking hub of the Midwest?  There is NYC on the east coast.  Charlotte in the southeast.  SF and Seattle out west.  I would assume Chicago...

 

Probably Chicago just due to its size. But Minneapolis has US Bank HQ as well as a very large Wells Fargo operation.