February 5, 200817 yr My first thought was arson as well...but the whole steeples only thing makes it really hard to believe that. If jmeck's theory is indeed correct then this is a case of probably one of the worst attempts at arson of all time. If you're going to try to burn down a building - or at least make it structurally unstable - why burn off pieces of flair at the very top. Truly odd.
February 5, 200817 yr When I first heard the news before I walked up to the site I imagined bulldozers sweeping the whole place up Saturday morning and a new Walgreen's by April. Until we hear what vestigial electric appliance might have set the west steeple on fire due to the place being powered-up on Friday afternoon, I'm assuming that someone was trying to steal the copper and a blow torch or something else set the wood on fire. The wind was unusually strong that night and I don't trust that someone was clever enough to set fire to the west steeple knowing the east one would likely catch fire. That said we're very lucky the wind wasn't blowing north (which it almost never does), or else it would have made the task of saving the main roof much more difficult. As I understand it arson cases are usually marked by use of an accelerant but the old wood in the steeple probably didn't need much help. A fire in the back of the church away from the street would not have turned the church into an eyesore, which some could argue that it now is. An eyesore demands decisive action, a way that an arson conspiracy could have moved things along toward the whole church's demolition.
February 6, 200817 yr I am very concerned as to what is going to become of this beauty now. "Oh, Batman where are you now!"
February 6, 200817 yr Damn Jake, I was wanting to call you to see if you were in the area when I cruised on by. Great photos!
February 20, 200817 yr I attended the CUF meeting tonight, it was announced that the insurance companies are on site, and they are looking into how to get the steeples back to their original appearance. They noted that the insurance on the building was actually really good. (To much applause) Also, damage to the building was stated to be limited to the steeples. Good news for the rest of the building.
February 20, 200817 yr ^Also, more of the west steeple was removed this past weekend and the tower capped with a tarp. Earlier in the week I saw a truck for a service specializing in water damage parked in front so hopefully there aren't too many problems inside. The church needs more work than just the steeples to look its best. Mainy of the deails on lower levels of the building are in mild disrepair and the brick needs to be cleaned or even painted. Also, they really need to invest in some high-quality lighting which could do much to raise its profile.
February 20, 200817 yr ^If anyone finds out about an official group that is taking donations for restoration, please post it on this thread. An aside about lighting- recently Mayor Bloomberg brought over the guy who is in charge of lighting all the public buildings in Paris to do a total revue of the landscape lighting for New York City.
February 20, 200817 yr Please cool it with the nightclub talk, the last thing this world needs is more techno. Also, I'd bet no patrons or staff of the staff of BoMa know jack about contemporary art, let alone modern art. Spured by the new stained glass in the Calogne Cathedral by Gerhard Richter, a few active Catholic churches have commissioned contemporary artists to create new works of art for their buildings: http://www.wired.com/culture/art/magazine/15-08/pl_arts This article is pretty 2nd grade, many are calling this the most important new artwork of 2007. There was an excellent article on it in the end of 2007 issue of Art Forum. I just looked at the picture of that pixelated window, and it looks awful. What an uninspired design. Two far better examples of non-representative stained glass windows: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nasirolmolk.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Paris_S_Denis_Fleur_de_Lys_window_1986_crypt_1353_a_a.JPG I guess I understand the desire to make the windows abstract, but I don't see the point of making them non-narrative. Here are some other great modern stained glass windows from the Rockefeller family church in Pocantico Hills, New York (though clearly not everyone can commission Henri Matisse or Marc Chagall): http://www.hudsonvalley.org/content/view/80/145/
February 20, 200817 yr I live on Ohio Ave., my power went out around 7:15pm or so, and was off for about two hours. Actually, everything lost power west of Vine and I do not know how far north it was off. I can't remember if Siddal and Calhoun dorms were off, but that wouldn't matter because of UC's own powerplant. That being said, I'm thinking it was electrical. Some interesting theories about the cause though.
February 20, 200817 yr I lived on Ohio Ave in 1999 and worked at Baba Budan's, while my girlfriend worked at Myra's. Two good friends of mine got married at Old St. George in 2003 and it was remarkable. They were devastated when the fire hit, but are optimistic that this resilient and beautiful structure will endure!
February 21, 200817 yr I live on Ohio Ave., my power went out around 7:15pm or so, and was off for about two hours. Actually, everything lost power west of Vine and I do not know how far north it was off. I can't remember if Siddal and Calhoun dorms were off, but that wouldn't matter because of UC's own powerplant. That being said, I'm thinking it was electrical. Some interesting theories about the cause though. Yeah I live right around the corner on Warner; I saw the fire. It was funny seeing people come out of their houses like "dude wtf the power is out!". Everyone was pissed off. Ours didn't go out for some reason.
February 21, 200817 yr I live on Ohio Ave., my power went out around 7:15pm or so, and was off for about two hours. Actually, everything lost power west of Vine and I do not know how far north it was off. I can't remember if Siddal and Calhoun dorms were off, but that wouldn't matter because of UC's own powerplant. That being said, I'm thinking it was electrical. Some interesting theories about the cause though. Yeah I live right around the corner on Warner; I saw the fire. It was funny seeing people come out of their houses like "dude wtf the power is out!". Everyone was pissed off. Ours didn't go out for some reason. haha, I was watching tv, drinking a beer and the power went out. first tought, "damnit we didn't pay the energy bill."
February 29, 200817 yr Light bulb started church fire BY JENNIFER BAKER | [email protected] CLIFTON HEIGHTS – A light bulb that was too close to combustible material sparked the fire at Old St. George Church Feb. 1, a fire official said this morning. The announcement was made by Cincinnati Fire Captain Dan Rottmueller, commander of the city’s fire investigation unit. Most of the damage was contained to the steeples, which crashed to the ground during the fire. The building, no longer regularly used as a church, suffered water damage but is overall repairable, he has said. There were areas of standing water in the basement and wet carpets. Clifton Heights Community Urban Redevelopment Corporation (CHCURC), community group, owns the church and is working to save it.
March 2, 200817 yr so, are they going to rebuild the steeples? BTW, I think there was a similar steeple fire (?) here in Dayton decades ago, at the old Emmanauel Church, and they replaced the steeples with these little stubby roofs. (or maybe there was some structural problem and that is why they were replaced)
March 2, 200817 yr ^The CUF meeting this month certainly implied that they had the insurance to completely replace the steeples to as they were. If that will actually be done is anyone's guess.
March 20, 200817 yr St. George spires may get rebuilt http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080320/NEWS01/803200405/1056/COL02 The Clifton Heights community group that owns the fire-damaged Old St. George church will try to rebuild the twin spires that were destroyed by a fire Feb. 1. The Clifton Heights Community Urban Redevelopment Corp. said Wednesday it doesn't know how much its insurance proceeds will be, but it knows it is possible to rebuild the spires, and it plans to try. Matt Bourgeois, executive director, said the group is working with Chubb Insurance, which insured the property, to value the loss and determine how much work to do on the inside as it tries to find a tenant.
March 28, 200817 yr Boy, I hope they get those spires back. If I hadn't seen this before, I'd say it is impossible. But, several years ago Mother of God Church (Mutter Gottes Kirche) in Covington suffered a similar tragedy, and that was restored successfully. After 20 years, the patina of the dome still doesn't match the spires, but it should eventually. Here's hoping that the same can be done for St. George's!
March 29, 200817 yr YES!!! The Mother of God incident can hopefully serve as an inspiration for a positve outcome for Old St. George. It is a truly amazing story. I saw an old VHS video about the restoration process about 15 years ago. I got it at the Kenton County Library if anyone interested in checking it out. The name unfortunately escapes me, although I am pretty sure that the words "Mother of God" are in the title.
March 30, 200817 yr How sweet it would be if they could do something similar to this: Much better of a use than a nightclub, if you ask me. And a bit more respectful to the original use. http://www.dezeen.com/2007/12/04/a-shop-in-a-church-by-merkx-girod-architecten/
March 30, 200817 yr That is really awesome. It would be great to see something like that materialize.
March 30, 200817 yr I wonder if CHCURC gave border's or barnes and nobel an incredibly cheap lease if they would move in? Has any attempt at this been made? Is there any side access to the building for a possible outdoor reading area?
March 30, 200817 yr How sweet it would be if they could do something similar to this: Much better of a use than a nightclub, if you ask me. And a bit more respectful to the original use. http://www.dezeen.com/2007/12/04/a-shop-in-a-church-by-merkx-girod-architecten/ Wow, that is beautiful
March 31, 200817 yr I"m not really feeling this mega bookstore concept in that space. One of the main benefits of having a Borders or a Barnes would be to sell text books but there are already plenty of little book sellers in the area. I would think though if there is a shop then they can take inspiration from Urban Outfitters up the street.
March 31, 200817 yr As a textbook purchaser, I'd be happy with more variety and someone who could actually manage the ordering between the various bookstores. I mean honestly, I've ALWAYS had to wait for a book over the last 3 years due to the underordering by the various bookstores. Not that B&N could necessarily fix that, but they have managed several University Bookstores that I know of quite well (and they have a MUCH better distribution chain)
March 31, 200817 yr There's some great books on the second level of the student bookstore in Tangeman. Great selection. There's also that used bookstore on McMillan and of course the textbook stores. I wouldn't mind Borders coming in though. I'd prefer a smaller store, maybe one that puts emphasis on the books that are hot at the moment. Not something the size of BW3s. More like Kinkos.
February 10, 200916 yr Hopefully the building will be put to good use in the future. I went to eat at CRC last year and when I got back to my room in Daniels I noticed an orange glow through the window. I looked out and was in awe as I saw the west steeple on fire. My friends and I quickly ran over to the roof of the garage next to Edwards and watched the entire thing from right before the first steeple collapse until both were gone and the fire was put out. I'm not from the area so I didn't know the extent of the building's history at the time, but knowing what I do now, it would be quite sad to see this building lost. Hopefully the building will be revitalized and used so future generations can enjoy the beautiful architectural quality that this building holds.
February 24, 200916 yr "Either rebuild it or level it, one of the two, it's an eyesore at the moment." Whoever said that has got to be joking that a beautiful old church with truncated steeples is more of an eyesore than a parking lot. That's absurd.
February 24, 200916 yr No kidding. That church is gorgeous, with or without steeples. I am anxious to see what can be done with it, though.
February 25, 200916 yr They had insurance. The insurance paid out enough (I believe) to pay for the repair of the steeples. I'm not sure if they have to use the money for that specific purpose, but to do anything else would be a sin (figuratively and literally?). There are plenty of ideas floating around concerning potential uses, but the steeple stubs don't do the rest of the building justice.
February 25, 200916 yr One of the reason a church had steeples was the symbolic reaching toward God and to make a claim about it's place in the life of the city. I'd figure out what to do with it and then decide if steeples or something else might make sense.
January 30, 201015 yr Grand visions for Old St. George Nearly two years after a three-alarm blaze toppled its iconic spires, the Old St. George Church near the University of Cincinnati remains boarded up and broken. But momentum is slowly growing on a plan to restore the 135-year-old former Catholic Church and ensure that it remains an anchor for the evolving Calhoun Street corridor. If all goes as planned, Old St. George will be transformed into an 80-room boutique hotel by a co-development team of Cleveland-based Paran Management and HineSite Strategic Services. Full story here: http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100129/BIZ01/1300351/1055/NEWS/Restoring+Old+St.+George
January 30, 201015 yr Cincinnati sure is getting a lot of hotels these days Ha, I know that's right. Can someone that's an urban planning expert chime in on this? What are your thoughts about all of these boutique hotels?
January 30, 201015 yr Anyone know where I could get photos of the tilework inside the Old St. George Church? Seems like some of the tiles could be great inspiration for quilt blocks. There was a gallery in the Cincinnati Enquirer today. Saw one photo there, and that triggered the quilt block idea for me. Thanks, Kay Ahr hometown Cincinnati now in Reno/Sparks, Nevada USA
January 31, 201015 yr Cincinnati sure is getting a lot of hotels these days Ha, I know that's right. Can someone that's an urban planning expert chime in on this? What are your thoughts about all of these boutique hotels? What in particular are you asking about?
April 22, 201015 yr This weekend, May April 24-25, the city will be closing down Calhoun Street from Vine to Ohio so that work can be done on the roof of Old St. George. They should be installing what has been described as the "temporary permanent caps" on the steeples. (Those will probably remain in place until the building is redeveloped and the actual steeples are installed.)
April 25, 201015 yr This weekend, April 24-25, the city will be closing down Calhoun Street from Vine to Ohio so that work can be done on the roof of Old St. George. They should be installing what has been described as the "temporary permanent caps" on the steeples. (Those will probably remain in place until the building is redeveloped and the actual steeples are installed.) I drove by around 1 p.m. and Calhoun street was open. Perhaps they delayed the work because of the expected bad weather or the several events going on at UC.
May 22, 201015 yr It looks like they're finally installing those "temporary permanent caps" though I'd rather see them restoring the steeples. Did they just take the insurance money and run? The place is looking pretty pathetic.
August 24, 201014 yr Old St. George hotel proposal needs $65K Monday, August 23, 2010 A partnership of state and local companies wants to redevelop Old St. George Church in Clifton Heights into a boutique hotel, but needs an additional $45,000 in pre-development funding to make it happen. HineSite Strategic Services, LLC principal Douglas Hine presented the proposal for the Saint George House last week before community leaders at the Niehoff Urban Studio on Short Vine in Corryville, saying that his group needs the funding to provide and assessment of the building's architectural and functional suitability, schematic designs, a development budget and sources, construction cost estimates, a market study, operating projections, and a strategic development plan. See more at:http://www.building-cincinnati.com/2010/08/old-st-george-hotel-proposal-needs-65k.html “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
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