Posted July 30, 200420 yr From crainscleveland.com: Exploring space By JAY MILLER ... The CDIA is the privately funded group that is leading the effort to make sure the federal Defense Finance and Accounting Service in downtown Cleveland survives next year’s round of Defense Department downsizing. Mr. Nance told the county commissioners that his group seeks office space for the DFAS operation — as much as 800,000 square feet — to make Cleveland a more appealing location. ... http://www.crainscleveland.com/ ................... This could be a wonderful thing for downtown - 800K sq. ft. is slightly more floorspace than is in the Federal Courthouse Tower. I highly doubt we'd see any kind of new construction but anything to get the vacancy rate down would be great. Here's a link showing the proposed sites in question - I'd love to see them get the former Ameritrust complex involved: http://www.cleveland.com/news/agate.ssf?/news/county_plan.html clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
July 30, 200420 yr They'll relocate to Cincinnati and fill up all 800K sq. ft. of Queen City Square!!! Hey, I can dream can't I? :crazy:
May 13, 200520 yr So DFAS, Charter One, and NASA ... the word "catastrophic" comes to mind :-( clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
May 13, 200520 yr Where are all of our moronic leaders? Columbus made out like bandits (congrats). Man talk about a week of highs and lows.
May 13, 200520 yr We just need a break. I don't know who this falls on. But man it just does not seem like anyone cares. Sure, Cleveland had some good development news this week (flats and e.12th), but does any of this mean anything if the region keeps bleeding jobs. I saw that the main reason the Cleveland office is closing is due to the high rent. Can't this be changed? Or is this just another cheap excuse, so people can sit and point fingers. I really think our local govt needs to be shaken up, I do not care if they are R's or D's, I just want to see someone in there who gives a damn, someone who cares so much about Cleveland, Toledo and Ohio, that they are willing to spend all of their waking hours promoting our region and our state. I am a republican, but I can not wait until the door smacks Bob Taft on his ass on the way out of office. I honestly think he believes that all of Ohio is contained within the the Columbus city limits. Hat's off to Columbus I am glad to see someone in Ohio is going to get jobs. I have one question to all of the Columbus members: Are you guys happy with your local government? I always hear people on this board bitching about Cleveland and Toledo governments, but never anyone from Columbus. I think the changes need to start with Taft, then it Mayor Janie needs to be shown the door, and then we have to get Tubby and Kucinich out of office. Those two fools are an absolute embarrassment to the city of Cleveland. Sorry I am ranting but I am one pissed off person right now. :whip:
May 13, 200520 yr DAMMIT does anybody have a number count of how many jobs were lost in this region in the past week? This is just depressing. We gotta get ALL of the politicians out of office who could have stopped these government jobs from leaving/comming.
May 13, 200520 yr It has got to be around 2,258. 1078 Federal, 500 NASA (not lost, just not coming here), and 680 Charter 1(although 400 were known last fall). This doesn't take into account the 700 NASA jobs that are on the chopping block.
May 13, 200520 yr its called political payback folks. ohio and cols kept the man in office, clevo tried to get him out. one more instance of the old industrial culture that is still dominant and biting the region in the neck like a vampire. or something. ugh its terrrible. not to diminish, but others around the usa are getting hit hard by brac closings too. i am happy for columbus, some good news there at least. im not sure how wise it is for too much military consolidation in the event of biiiig trouble.
May 13, 200520 yr Actually all the DFAS stuff nationwide is being consolidated as alot of payroll activity is being automated, so don't take it as a political slight... Dayton is loosing a DFAS activity, too... The DLA site at Columbus had an advantage as it has a fairly new (underutilized?) facility supporting a purple suit activity so dovetailed nicely into the emphasis on jointness in this BRAC.....and to move stuff out of DC and out of leased facilities....
May 13, 200520 yr Guess what's the real kick in the balls about this- the reason forwarded for the DFAS closing is the high cost of rent. Guess who sets the rent. The GAO! That's right, the Federal Government sets the rent, then the Federal Government closes the office because the rent is too high. Fucking brilliant!
May 13, 200520 yr I was going to ask that question. They are in the federal building, so who else would be responsible for the price?!
May 13, 200520 yr The state government in Ohio grew by 80% in 1990's, even though the population only went up by 4-5%. Most of that growth was funneled into creating public sector jobs in Columbus. Taxes screw the rest of the state, and then create employment in Columbus. That's how it is in Ohio. Also many state legislators spend most of their time in Columbus. Of course, Columbus's welfare becomes more important to them their own constituency's welfare, which they become distant from.
May 14, 200520 yr The state government in Ohio grew by 80% in 1990's Where did you find that information?
May 14, 200520 yr Dammit locutus...this is a Federal issue and you kibbitz on state budgetary policy! You are like a chatty cathy doll...the Locutus Doll, pull the string in the back and he says "Taxes! Taxes!"
May 14, 200520 yr Read this: http://www.defenselink.mil/brac/pdf/Appendix_C_FinalUpdated.pdf Some states are making out like bandits in this "base closing" plan, like Texas, Georgia, Florida, Colorado, Tennessee, Indiana.
May 14, 200520 yr I'm really starting to wonder how the hell C-Bus keeps pulling this shit off. Is there something magical about this place that I'm missing? As far as the DSCC and the BRAC go, when rumors surfaced roughly a year ago that the complex was in line to be included in this year's round of closings, everyone immediately took action. The Dispatch provided status reports regularly on how the DSCC was working to distinguish itself among other similar operations and often printed special segments about the complex. The city of Whitehall, where the DSCC is actually based, depends on the complex for 47% of its annual budget, so city officials quickly got together to formulate a plan to keep the complex open. The Columbus Chamber of Commerce, local and federal officials, and Whitehall teamed up to found "Team DSCC" which collectively lobbied over $1 million in support of the center. The work paid off, and 6,100 jobs at the DSCC are safe, and another 1,600 are on the way. My question is, with the BRAC close at hand, what did the city of Cleveland, DFAS, and other local sources do to prepare for the possibility of the facility closing? It seems that only now that the closing is imminant that local leaders are getting together to address the situation. Was there any foreward thinking and creative planning for the unforseen?
May 14, 200520 yr Cleveland also put a lot of effort into trying to keep the jobs. It may have been that the Columbus office had what the govt wanted regardless of any lobbbying effort.
May 14, 200520 yr sorry to hear about the bad news cleveland, i'll drink some great lakes this weekend to help
May 14, 200520 yr http://www.cleveland.com/images/news/ceconomy.gif heres a 'great' graphic on the 1000 lost jobs and how it affects the region
May 14, 200520 yr http://www.cleveland.com/business/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/business/1116063372191140.xml&coll=2&thispage=1 News is another blow to struggling Galleria Saturday, May 14, 2005 Henry J. Gomez Plain Dealer Reporter Just two months ago, selling his successful New York City restaurant and moving to Cleveland seemed like a great idea to Moha Orchid, who fell in love with Lake Erie while visiting friends. But now the chef, who owns and operates Soup and Stew in the food court at the Galleria at Erieview, looks around the quiet mall and wonders if he made a smart investment. ... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 14, 200520 yr ^well hopefully the new residential stuff gets going across the street from there. even tho stonebridge isnt fully completed yet it still has completely transformed that area of the flats.
May 14, 200520 yr Does anyone else who read KJP's article find it funny that the guy selling hot dogs is the only person in Cleveland who seemed to be prepared for the loss of DFAS. Maybe we should elect him as one of our representatives instead of the moron's we have in office now.
May 17, 200520 yr Flats home for DFAS proposed By ALLISON WOOD The Wolstein Group today proposed constructing a mid-rise office building to house threatened defense department jobs in Cleveland as part of a redevelopment plan on the East Bank of the Flats. The proposed 450,000 square-foot stand-alone building will be submitted to the Defense Department as a lower-cost alternative to continuing to house the jobs in the Federal Office Building. It would be on land adjacent to land owned by the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority. It would be no more than 10 stories in size. continued below ... www.crainscleveland.com
May 17, 200520 yr My question is, with the BRAC close at hand, what did the city of Cleveland, DFAS, and other local sources do to prepare for the possibility of the facility closing? here's what they did, the very next the community leader 'reactions' were duly noted in the media--lol! i got no impression anyone was prepared for this. ugh. the wolstein proposal is nice, but i doubt it will work. from reading the national stories about the brac closings, it seems the military wants to consolidate. a brand new building, even if free, does not seem to have anything to do with it. i'd love to be wrong, but i heard 85% of these recs actually are approved and happen in the end. you never know with the politics involved, but sad to say it looks like the jobs are gone. are we at rock bottom with all the job loss yet???? i hope so.
May 17, 200520 yr ^ mrnyc, as I pointed out above if you read KJP's article the hot dog vendor was prepared for these job losses. LOL. Hopefully we are at rock bottom now, however I have a bad feeling that National City maybe a prime target to get bought out. (Although I have no info regarding this)
May 17, 200520 yr according to the plain dealer, there was nothing to be done during the evaluation period....now is when the schmoozing starts. I agree it's an uphill battle, but glad to have SOMETHING to offer them. If , in fact economics is the bottom line, we still have a chance. me thinks the problem is politics.
June 13, 200520 yr I know I shouldn't be too optimistic, but there is a real effort being made to retain the DFAS jobs. Rep Latourette rightly pointed out that there was NOT an economic benefit to moving these jobs...and that was before the city began offering ways to cut costs. there will be politics in the decision making, but it's hard to ignore real numbers when the goal is to save money. I believe that this week there is going to be some serious meetings with defense dept folks. Let's hope that our local reps don't let us down.
June 14, 200520 yr The problem is that the main goal isn't saving money, it's force protection issues. We need to offer a site that would have enough land for a security perimeter. There aren't many places like that in-city. The best one I can think of is the Steelyard Commons site. It has the space, and few routes of entry. But that's already taken. Other options would be to put it out in the countryside somewhere (Ravenna Arsenal, maybe), or to find some other land on the old steelmill site, or perhaps somewhere in Kingsbury Run. If we don't understand and address this fundamental concern, then we don't have a chance of saving the DFAS.
June 14, 200520 yr I wonder why the site Wolstein proposed wouldn't work. Putting it inside the loop of the Waterfront Line offers some measure of limited access, since it can only be accessed from the north by driving under the elevated portion of the rail line. I would think that site offers comparable security to what was built for the FBI/DEA/ATF on Lakeside. KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 14, 200520 yr I believe that it was because of the rail line itself. Of course, how much explosive could a person carry onto a train? Hard to say, security people are somewhat paranoid. Like the guy who was bitching about the fact that there is street parking in front of the Justice Center a few months back.
June 24, 200519 yr The AP picked up on this story, 6/24/05: PHOTO: Rep. Dennis Kucinich and Cleveland Mayor Jane Campbell (left) put on T-shirts at a rally Thursday to save Defense Department jobs. The Associated Press/Mark Duncan Cleveland fighting for Pentagon agency By Thomas Sheeran The Associated Press CLEVELAND - A member of the Pentagon's base-closing commission got a firsthand look at the city's military payroll office on Thursday and offered a sliver of hope to civic leaders and employees trying to save its 1,000 jobs. Retired Air Force Gen. Lloyd Newton toured the skyscraper home of the Defense Finance and Accounting Service, with Gov. Bob Taft and hometown members of Congress. He said he would forward what he had learned to fellow commission members. ... http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050624/NEWS01/506240383/1056/rss02
July 12, 200519 yr An architect of the law creating the Pentagon's base closure process contends that one of the measures used to give a poor ranking to a huge Cleveland office was illegal. Sen. John Warner of Virgnia says that the Pentagon incorrectly took points from facilities that lease their space. The Cleveland office of the Defense Finance and Accounting Service, where 1,200 people work, leases its offices at East. 9th Street and Lakeside Avenue . The issue is crucial for Cleveland DFAS supporters because the best way to get an office off the Pentagon's hit list is to show that the Defense Department deviated significantly from the law. Warner was one of the drafters of the legislation that created the Base Realignment and Closure Committee. Rep. Steve LaTourette says that the Pentagon further erred regarding the lease because it overstated the rent costs by 50 percent. LaTourette and other supporters of Cleveland's DFAS office say that new information shows that Cleveland's DFAS office ranks higher in some areas than the three DFAS sites that will take workers from Cleveland.
July 12, 200519 yr The more I see about the study that underlied the decision to move the DFAS, the more I think that maybe it was manipulated for partisan reasons (I had honestly rejected the notion at first). Why? 1. While the study done after the announcement that looked at voting patterns vs closures or gains showed no correlation between the two at a state level, it seems to me that when you look at metro patterns it begins to show up-i.e. Cleveland's jobs were mostly going to Columbus and Indianapolis, both significantly more Republican than Cleveland. 2. They seem to have fudged numbers, calculations, and even the law to arrive at #1. Not to mention that many of the criteria left out would have been the ones that helped Cleveland. Granted I haven't seen much beyond what's happening re Cleveland's DFAS, and I would be interested to know what other city's experience has been.
July 13, 200519 yr Except that the city of Columbus has been voting Democratic for a while now. Once you get into the outlying areas though, then it gets more Republican. That 50/50 situation may be why Columbus isn't getting many new DFAS jobs, using the partisan argument. Out here, somewhere beyond the Beltway, partisanship doesn't mean a whole hell of a lot. If this was a partisan decision, then it pisses me off. I don't want the childish bullshit that goes on inside the Beltway to affect my community any more than it has to. These political good-for-nothing-elses should be banished to a deserted isle. It would be like having a million Gilligans all relying on one another for survival. They wouldn't last two weeks. KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
July 20, 200519 yr This is only step one in overturning the BRAC recomendation. It is heartening that this comittee has recognised the errors and just plain manipulated data that had been used earlier. I think this decision is huge. Not only is it 1,200 jobs downtown, but there is the potential that future reorganizing could bring more jobs. Curious that the Wolstein building has barely been mentioned in these discussions. Again economics is a major concern and the new building was reported to be at less cost than the current digs. That building seemed like an after thought in the Wolstein project...but it could very easily be the anchor to it all.
July 22, 200519 yr The commission reviewing the BRAC recomendations has unanimously voted to re-visit the pay center reallignment. The chairman of the commission personally visited with the Ohio reps and apparently indicated that Cleveland has a good chance of keeping the existing DFAS jobs. It appears that if Cleveland survives that additional jobs might be possible. There will still be closures and transfers of jobs which would likely go to the surviving centers. Rep. LaTourette said that Cleveland is not home free yet but that there are reasons to be optimistic. Possible very GOOD news for Cleveland
July 22, 200519 yr This is great news. Now if the city/state/federal/county government could come together on more issues. I have to say, Ohio's elected officials came together for this one - now lets keep the ball rolling!
July 22, 200519 yr Can we re-name this thread? DFAS Cleveland for instance?? (I am more style over substance)
July 23, 200519 yr I agree. The thread's name doesn't accurately describe the discussion, or the way things seem to be going. I guess that's the Cleveland way though, assume the worst is going to happen??? I'm just as guilty as anyone.... KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
July 23, 200519 yr ^ MayDay can change it by modifying the first post, which was his. Or, if he doesn't, I can do it for you.
July 24, 200519 yr This is great news. Now if the city/state/federal/county government could come together on more issues. I have to say, Ohio's elected officials came together for this one - now lets keep the ball rolling! Where is Tubbs? Where is Kucinich? Where is Taft (oh wait, C-bus would have gotten the jobs) Campbell, at least, had a rally, and fought when it seemed doomed. not exactly a save the Browns rally, but a rally none the less
July 28, 200519 yr From the 7/28/05 PD: Lawmakers question security as basis for closing local DFAS Other U.S. workers use building, they note Thursday, July 28, 2005 Stephen Koff Plain Dealer Bureau Chief Washington - Spies. Secret military squads. Accountants. It's apparently dangerous work cutting paychecks and doling out benefits in the Cleveland office of the Defense Finance and Accounting Service, requiring extra anti-terrorist security. At least that's what Congress members said, only half-facetiously, Wednesday as they struggled to understand the Pentagon's desire to move DFAS from the Anthony J. Celebrezze Federal Building in Cleveland to more secure facilities, chiefly in Indianapolis. ... http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/news/1122543408121290.xml&coll=2
August 11, 200519 yr From the 8/11/05 PD: Cleveland's rivals argue for more defense jobs Thursday, August 11, 2005 Sabrina Eaton Plain Dealer Bureau Washington - Representatives of two cities that would gain jobs if the Pentagon shutters Cleveland's Defense Finance and Accounting Service office told a federal base closure commission on Wednesday that they'd welcome extra personnel and have ample facilities to accommodate them. Officials from Indianapolis, which would win more than 3,000 military pay and accounting jobs under a Pentagon restructuring proposal, disputed Cleveland civic leaders' claims that their facility lacks space for new workers. ... To reach this Plain Dealer reporter: [email protected], 216-999-4212 http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/news/1123752707290460.xml&coll=2
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