March 19, 20196 yr Correct. I also mentioned it here: It also reportedly involves partnering with the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame and the Great Lakes Science Center on proposed museum expansions that would, among other things, connect their buildings with an enclosed, climate-controlled walkway. https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/02/downtown-lakefront-land-bridge-has.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
March 19, 20196 yr Bad news ... that awful, dumbed-down North Coast Harbor bridge has been awarded. I had hoped that they'd just kill it. Sigh ...
March 20, 20196 yr With the lakefront and Norrh Coast Harbor being so vital for the future, it’s really disconcerting that after all these years there still not a comprehensive plan or set of criteria to legally ensure that our waterfront is accessible and well-designed. We are basically at the mercy of whatever developer that manages to secure financing. [edit: grammer] Edited March 20, 20196 yr by surfohio
March 20, 20196 yr I’ve always had a vision of Burke being carved up into a series of canals, a neighborhood of canal homes with their own docks. It could be done a phase at at time. Chunk by chunk as demand sees fit. Drive in piles in the outline of the canals, dig it out, then let the water in. I imagine lots would sell quick. Be like a little Dubai type project. We could even shape it how we wanted. A beach all along the north edge. Just dreaming over here. Edited March 20, 20196 yr by marty15
March 20, 20196 yr 1 hour ago, marty15 said: I’ve always had a vision of Burke being carved up into a serious of canals, a neighborhood of canal homes with their own docks. It could be done a phase at at time. Chunk by chunk as demand sees fit. Drive in piles in the outline of the canals, dig it out, then let the water in. I imagine lots would sell quick. Be like a little Dubai type project. We could even shape it how we wanted. A beach all along the north edge. Just dreaming over here. WHY? Does Cleveland still have that airport on the lake? Is there any way it can be gotten rid of like how Chicago got rid of theirs? It just seems like a waste- an airport serving a small clientele that does not need to really be there and all of that lakefront property tied up like that that could be used for other uses-including much needed public recreation areas/parks right on the lake. This would drive me nuts if I lived in Cleveland. So much potential access to the lake denied. And it may not be the nicest lake or warmest lake, but it is still a huge body of water and is a great asset and should be used to the best of the community at large. JMHO. Edited March 20, 20196 yr by Toddguy
March 20, 20196 yr Of the Great Lakes it's actually the best to swim in. The others are too cold for my liking. Even Lake Michigan in early August when the air temp is 95 degrees i can only stand the water for a little bit. The water at Edgewater is very enjoyable bath water temp in late July/August. Burk, airport or not I always thought it would be nice if they put in a beach on the north side, with a bike/pedestrian path to get out there. It could serve the growing downtown population. Probably too expensive of an investment without a development though.
March 20, 20196 yr 2 hours ago, Toddguy said: WHY? Does Cleveland still have that airport on the lake? Is there any way it can be gotten rid of like how Chicago got rid of theirs? It just seems like a waste- an airport serving a small clientele that does not need to really be there and all of that lakefront property tied up like that that could be used for other uses-including much needed public recreation areas/parks right on the lake. This would drive me nuts if I lived in Cleveland. So much potential access to the lake denied. And it may not be the nicest lake or warmest lake, but it is still a huge body of water and is a great asset and should be used to the best of the community at large. JMHO. Oh good. Let's start going round and round with this one again. Maybe the mods can make a new rule and limit it to 5 pages of everybody repeating themselves again.
March 20, 20196 yr 25 minutes ago, Htsguy said: Oh good. Let's start going round and round with this one again. Maybe the mods can make a new rule and limit it to 5 pages of everybody repeating themselves again. I am not from Cleveland and I just occasionally check into Cleveland threads, mainly to see the new developments(congrats for NuCLEus btw)but I have not read through the 79 pages of this thread, so please don't give me any grief about bringing up this subject, especially since apparently it is a topic that is important or it would not come up all the time. Ok? If you would like to summarize the discussions, then do that. That would be the decent thing to do for a fellow forumer who may not know all the ins and outs of this particular topic and the 79 pages of discussion since I am not from Cleveland. *Has a consensus been reached about the airport, or is there very divided opinion? Anyone? Thanks. Edited March 20, 20196 yr by Toddguy
March 20, 20196 yr 13 minutes ago, Toddguy said: I am not from Cleveland and I just occasionally check into Cleveland threads, mainly to see the new developments(congrats for NuCLEus btw)but I have not read through the 79 pages of this thread, so please don't give me any grief about bringing up this subject, especially since apparently it is a topic that is important or it would not come up all the time. Ok? If you would like to summarize the discussions, then do that. That would be the decent thing to do for a fellow forumer who may not know all the ins and outs of this particular topic and the 79 pages of discussion since I am not from Cleveland. *Has a consensus been reached about the airport, or is there very divided opinion? Anyone? Thanks. Sorry I hurt your feelings but after 15 years on this board I get very frustrated when I click onto a thread hoping for new updates or new ideas and have to hash through the same old same old. Here is my summary. Shit soil, FAA, ten of millions that could be spent better elsewhere including on other parts of the lakefront. Unfortunately, even with that brief summary I am sure I have just opened the flood gates. Can't wait. Edited March 20, 20196 yr by Htsguy
March 20, 20196 yr We also have a thread (much shorter) on Burke Lakefront Airport in the Transportation section where some similar discussions about its future have been posted. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
March 20, 20196 yr 7 hours ago, marty15 said: I’ve always had a vision of Burke being carved up into a serious of canals, a neighborhood of canal homes with their own docks. It could be done a phase at at time. Chunk by chunk as demand sees fit. Drive in piles in the outline of the canals, dig it out, then let the water in. I imagine lots would sell quick. Be like a little Dubai type project. We could even shape it how we wanted. A beach all along the north edge. Just dreaming over here. I don’t know if others have posted before about this idea - but maybe Marty’s vision could be a great direction for the downtown waterfront post- Burke. The existing and potential affinity with the lake is part of what makes the “Northcoast” so much more interesting than other landlocked midwestern cities. I think of the charm of a community like Vermillion and wonder if some of that charm and dynamic could be brought downtown. Perhaps the industrial past of the city once precluded that thinking but we’ve begun to remake Cleveland into a multi dimensional city that is redefining itself . Assuming that Burke’s retirement is not relegated to the distant future, could a community of canal homes be viable? im sure it’s wishful thinking, but a waterfront community of homes would expand the city’s charm greatly.
March 20, 20196 yr Htsguy's summary was good -- Burke is not going anywhere. What can we do to maximize use of the land around Burke? What can we do to induce more commercial use at Burke? A boater's-haven development would be nice -- let's think about where you could build it east or west.
March 20, 20196 yr ^I agree Burke isn't going anywhere, but is there any non expensive way to shift the runways a little east with all of the new land there? Then the hight restrictions around North Coast Harbor can be relaxed?
March 20, 20196 yr 20 minutes ago, Foraker said: Htsguy's summary was good -- Burke is not going anywhere. What can we do to maximize use of the land around Burke? What can we do to induce more commercial use at Burke? A boater's-haven development would be nice -- let's think about where you could build it east or west. With a greenway bike path and pedestrian walkway around the outer edge of the airport property.
March 20, 20196 yr 9 hours ago, Htsguy said: Oh good. Let's start going round and round with this one again. Maybe the mods can make a new rule and limit it to 5 pages of everybody repeating themselves again. My thoughts exactly.
April 12, 20196 yr Big news from the Rock Hall and NCH. Also news from Cumberland about a proposed hotel North of the Science Ctr. A preliminary design by DLR Group / Westlake Reed Leskosky of Cleveland shows that the Rock Hall expansion would be a curvy, earth-hugging structure built into the hillside between the Rock Hall and Science Center. https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/04/rock-hall-seeks-to-expand-at-north-coast-harbor-link-to-great-lakes-science-center.html Edited April 12, 20196 yr by freethink
April 13, 20196 yr Cautiously optimistic. I need to see more. What is the outdoor pedestrian flow going to be like? Is this merely going to be a ground floor gerbil tube for winter use? We need to see more asap!!
April 13, 20196 yr 58 minutes ago, surfohio said: Cautiously optimistic. I need to see more. What is the outdoor pedestrian flow going to be like? Is this merely going to be a ground floor gerbil tube for winter use? We need to see more asap!! If I read correctly it sounds like the Rock Hall will be using it as exhibit space. But what does that mean? Just a hallway of stuff as you transfer to the science center?
April 13, 20196 yr 1 hour ago, KFM44107 said: If I read correctly it sounds like the Rock Hall will be using it as exhibit space. But what does that mean? Just a hallway of stuff as you transfer to the science center? Right. I’d like to see some idea that they’re going to properly address the clumsy separation between buildings. That is one aspect of Baltimore’s Inner Harbor - the sensible pedestrian flow - that I wish we could just blatantly steal.
April 13, 20196 yr It's kind of hard to make out, but in the middle right of second picture there's a curvilinear form jutting upward to the right, with grass on the roof. Could this be a tie in to the possible land bridge extension of the mall over the rail tracks and shoreway? As I remember, one of the designs for the pedestrian bridge had its northern terminus around this spot. Or is the land bridge further to the west closer to FES? Either way, I hope all of the entities involved with this project and the land bridge are taking a holistic view of the pedestrian traffic flow and possibilities with multiple projects potentially in play.
April 13, 20196 yr Channel 5 Story.https://www.wkyc.com/article/entertainment/music/rock-hall/rock-and-roll-hall-of-fame-plans-expansion-that-would-link-it-with-great-lakes-science-center/95-c4d233aa-c41f-46a1-8019-a00f3887b5ba
April 16, 20196 yr I'm not really feeling those renderings. I still think there needs to be a branded hotel and more media company's than just siriusXM at the Rock Hall.
April 16, 20196 yr Whales along Cleveland’s East Shoreway set to get a splash of new paint Updated Apr 15, 9:30 PM; Posted Apr 15, 5:58 PM By Robert Higgs, cleveland.com CLEVELAND, Ohio – The whales adorning the mural on the Cleveland Public Power building along Lake Erie will be getting a refreshing splash of paint. City Council voted unanimously Monday evening to accept a gift from the Wyland Foundation to restore the mural, “The Song of Whales,” which the artist simply known as Wyland completed in 1997. The mural was part of an enormous arts-in-public-places project that included 100 life-size marine murals created in a 30-year span in 17 countries. https://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/2019/04/whales-along-clevelands-east-shoreway-set-to-get-a-splash-of-new-paint.html
April 19, 20196 yr Cool! For background: When ships sail into Cleveland, Seamen's Service knows how to shout 'Ahoy!' https://www.cleveland.com/business/2014/09/when_a_ship_sails_into_clevela.html http://planning.city.cleveland.oh.us/designreview/brd/detailDR.php?ID=3192&CASE=DF 2019-037 SEAMEN'S SERVICES BUILDING RENOVATION Return to Case List | Start Over | Print Report (PDF format) Project Information Downtown/Flats Case # DF 2019-037 Address:600 Erieside Avenue Company:Greydon Petznick, Architect Architect:Greydon Petznick Description: Renovation of the existing Seamen's Services Building and porch and accessiblity additions for a seasonal cruise ship terminal. Notes: Committee Actions/Submissions Date:January 17, 2019 Committee:Staff Action Type:Initial Plan Submission Conditions/Notes: Date:January 17, 2019 Committee:Staff Action Type:Administrative Approval I'm not sure, but the building appears to be this one -- a double-wide off West 3rd near the port's vehicular entrance: Edited April 19, 20196 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
April 19, 20196 yr On 4/12/2019 at 11:09 PM, KFM44107 said: If I read correctly it sounds like the Rock Hall will be using it as exhibit space. But what does that mean? Just a hallway of stuff as you transfer to the science center? Perfect spot for a display concerning the technology behind rock and roll.
April 30, 20196 yr Why do we have to wait 2 1/2 years before there is a shovel in the ground? This is a small project. https://www.wkyc.com/article/entertainment/music/rock-hall/rock-and-roll-hall-of-fames-50000-square-foot-expansion-plans-approved-construction-to-begin-in-2021/95-ebd41917-e565-42b7-9ce3-8f0462de18df
May 1, 20196 yr So when Richard Pace/Cumberland gave up control of the space between the RH and the GLSC just recently he indicated his next move would be to explore the development of a hotel just north of the GLSC. So I only post this image from a feasibility study by https://sbfriedman.com who seem to still be involved in some respect with either the city/port/cumberland...not really sure. But Pace said the hotel would be about 100 ' tall which from this image looks about right. I like the site and the scale of it if this is what he is thinking about.
May 2, 20196 yr Cross posted in the Cleveland TOD thread. I think these kids have come up with better ideas than I've seen from many of the high-paid planners and architects out there.... I especially like this lakefront walkway/development idea... Edited May 2, 20196 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 2, 20196 yr 3 hours ago, KJP said: Cross posted in the Cleveland TOD thread. I think these kids have come up with better ideas than I've seen from many of the high-paid planners and architects out there.... I especially like this lakefront walkway/development idea... I loved being in this program when I was in high school! That bridge proposal is pretty good!
May 2, 20196 yr 13 hours ago, KJP said: Cross posted in the Cleveland TOD thread. I think these kids have come up with better ideas than I've seen from many of the high-paid planners and architects out there.... I especially like this lakefront walkway/development idea... Little off-topic, but we undervalue the opinions of children in many aspects of life, especially in planning and developing our cities. Here's a great Ted Talk from Mara Mintzer out of Boulder Co discussing this: Edited May 2, 20196 yr by imjustinjk
May 10, 20196 yr Don’t know that I had seen the Port’s rfp and conceptual renders for the customs building. http://www.portofcleveland.com/media/1323/port-of-cleveland-cruise-terminal-conceptual-exterior-renderings-public.pdf
May 10, 20196 yr It's already there, at 100 West 3rd St. It's proposed to be modified and slightly expanded.... I'd love to post a screenshot but this site doesn't allow me to post photos larger than 102K anymore for some reason. Edited May 10, 20196 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 11, 20196 yr Yup, that's it. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 11, 20196 yr You saying its going to replace that little building with the green roof? What is that little building? Actually---looking at the drawings, looks like they are going to use that existing building. Looks tiny though--too small to process a Great Lakes Cruise ship. Edited May 11, 20196 yr by Pugu
May 11, 20196 yr Like I said, it's proposed to be modified and expanded. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 12, 20196 yr Anyone know how many units? How many floors? Can't find a rendering yet. It's the same architect and builder who did Shoreline phase one, AKA Quay 55.... http://planning.city.cleveland.oh.us/designreview/brd/detailDR.php?ID=3235&CASE=DF 2019-057 SHORELINE PHASE II Return to Case List | Start Over | Print Report (PDF format) Project Information Downtown/Flats Case # DF 2019-057 Address:5455 N. Marginal Road Company:Vocon Design Inc. Architect:Vocon | Pride One Construction Description: The proposed construction of a new residential apartment building on vacant land. Notes: Committee Actions/Submissions Date:May 9, 2019 Committee:Staff Action Type:Initial Plan Submission "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 15, 20196 yr WEDNESDAY, MAY 15, 2019 Gordon Park lakefront housing - the sequel The Gordon Park area on the East Side isn't to be confused with the Gordon Square area on the West Side. Gordon Square is a populous, fast-growing, historic neighborhood. But the lakefront lands along and near Gordon Park could soon add "fast-growing" to its descriptions too, as first reported in a February NEOtrans article. Now, there's more happening -- a 212-unit, five-story apartment building called The Shoreline Phase II is proposed to be built at 5455 North Marginal Road, according to documents filed with the Cleveland Planning Commission. The four-acre site is on the northwest quadrant of the Interstate 90-East 55th Street interchange. It is located next to the 167-unit The Shoreline apartment building, currently the only housing in the Gordon Park area. MORE: https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/05/gordon-park-lakefront-housing-sequel.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 16, 20196 yr ^ Nice proposal. The only issue that I see-and it probably doesn't matter as much to others-as that the area seems fairly secluded/isolated and completely car-oriented.
May 16, 20196 yr It's not as "completely" car-oriented as you might think. RTA's #16 bus runs 20 hours a day and comes up East 55th to Horizon Science Academy on Dick Goddard Way. The #16 goes on East 59th to the new Dave's supermarket and connects with the Healthline at Euclid and all three rail lines at East 55th, then continues on to Slavic Village and to Steelyard Commons. But walking across the Shoreway in winter to/from the nearest bus stop probably isn't too enjoyable. North Marginal Road (aka Lakefront Bikeway -- OK, not the best!) takes you to downtown in one direction and the Harrison Dillard Bikeway takes you to University Circle in the other direction. Sure, it's not a panacea for people looking for freedom from the car, but it's not completely isolated either. Hopefully Knez is able to provide his proposed 8,000 square feet of ground-floor retail which would add "something" to this area. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 16, 20196 yr 4 hours ago, KJP said: It's not as "completely" car-oriented as you might think. RTA's #16 bus runs 20 hours a day and comes up East 55th to Horizon Science Academy on Dick Goddard Way. The #16 goes on East 59th to the new Dave's supermarket and connects with the Healthline at Euclid and all three rail lines at East 55th, then continues on to Slavic Village and to Steelyard Commons. But walking across the Shoreway in winter to/from the nearest bus stop probably isn't too enjoyable. North Marginal Road (aka Lakefront Bikeway -- OK, not the best!) takes you to downtown in one direction and the Harrison Dillard Bikeway takes you to University Circle in the other direction. Sure, it's not a panacea for people looking for freedom from the car, but it's not completely isolated either. Hopefully Knez is able to provide his proposed 8,000 square feet of ground-floor retail which would add "something" to this area. Im familiar with the transit in the area, but it would take 30-40 minutes to get downtown compared to less than 10 by car. Same for UC. Still nice to see the area built up. Retail will help. Hopefully e. 55 can get built up more. I wonder if the area were to get built up more that the 39 could make some stops off the Shoreway on E. 55th (am/pm rush?). Giving the area some express service to downtown would be appealing. I was just thinking of people like my dad who is downsizing and moving to the city. One of his requirements is to be close to one seat service to take to work. Maybe he’s in the minority. I’m not sure. Edited May 16, 20196 yr by imjustinjk
May 16, 20196 yr I've often thought that many RTA express buses on the highways could get off the Interstate at key locations (busy intersecting bus line, big nearby apartment complex etc). If this area develops, having the #39 get off I-90 and make a stop on a pullover area with a lighted bus shelter (given the high winds here) on the exit or entrance ramp might be worth doing. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 16, 20196 yr 33 minutes ago, KJP said: I've often thought that many RTA express buses on the highways could get off the Interstate at key locations (busy intersecting bus line, big nearby apartment complex etc). If this area develops, having the #39 get off I-90 and make a stop on a pullover area with a lighted bus shelter (given the high winds here) on the exit or entrance ramp might be worth doing. Adding strategic stops for express service is an incremental way to increase ridership. I’m not sure if 380 units (500ish residents?) is high enough to warrant a stop, but it wouldn’t be a terrible idea. Buses are allowed to use the shoulder lane during slower rush hour traffic between 55th and downtown.
May 19, 20196 yr So from the Horizon Groups 1st quarter statement regarding The Outlet Shoppes at Cleveland is this: At March 31, 2019 and December 31, 2018, pre-development costs classified as Other Assets included projects in Cleveland, OH and Woodstock, GA totaled $532,000 and $470,000, respectively. Pre development costs can be anything from financial applications, legal fees, architectural fees, and engineering/traffic studies it does not mean the project is a go. But this is the second year in a row monies have been committed...And remember I am just the messenger on this direct all your hate elsewhere ?
May 22, 20196 yr On 3/18/2019 at 2:56 PM, KJP said: Only took the PD a month to catch up to my breaking of this story....... ? https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/02/downtown-lakefront-land-bridge-has.html KJP: Any new updates, momentum on the land bridge & multi=modal transportation center since you blogged a couple of months ago.
May 22, 20196 yr https://www.eventbrite.com/e/possibilities-re-imagining-clevelands-lakefront-dialogue-series-tickets-61594330300?aff=efbevent
May 22, 20196 yr 1 hour ago, simplythis said: KJP: Any new updates, momentum on the land bridge & multi=modal transportation center since you blogged a couple of months ago. No, but the news posted in the convention center thread (in Completed Projects) about the convention center hurting for meeting space and parking is probably going to meet the land bridge and multi-modal center. That's good because it would bring together multiple funding resources. I'm preparing to write about it again. If all of these proposed uses get combined into the same project, it could go into multiple threads or probably require a new thread. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 23, 20196 yr 18 hours ago, KJP said: No, but the news posted in the convention center thread (in Completed Projects) about the convention center hurting for meeting space and parking is probably going to meet the land bridge and multi-modal center. That's good because it would bring together multiple funding resources. I'm preparing to write about it again. If all of these proposed uses get combined into the same project, it could go into multiple threads or probably require a new thread. I'll bring this GIF back out, please let this happen!! I wonder if the ASG's, Draft, etc., will push development into higher gear/get things moving in City Hall...I have my doubts.
May 23, 20196 yr 19 minutes ago, GISguy said: I'll bring this GIF back out, please let this happen!! I wonder if the ASG's, Draft, etc., will push development into higher gear/get things moving in City Hall...I have my doubts. The mayor is not to be disturbed during a nap....
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