Harbor Verandas in the lower left

 

 

Harbor Verandas at left (obviously!) and Nuevo in the background  (picture is from Valentines Day last year -- Neuvo was the only restaurant we could get into that night without a reservation)

 

^Thanks. For a moment I was thinking it was the same bldg.  Harbor Verandas are apartments.  Is the bldg with Neuvo also apartments or are they offices?

4 minutes ago, Pugu said:

^Thanks. For a moment I was thinking it was the same bldg.  Harbor Verandas are apartments.  Is the bldg with Neuvo also apartments or are they offices?

 

Just part of the restaurant. Include a party/banquet room upstairs.

^Wait---that whole bldg is Neuvo (and related)?

30 minutes ago, Pugu said:

^Wait---that whole bldg is Neuvo (and related)?

 

The one in the background? Yes.

Really like those apartments. One of the few lakefront options in the city.

Thanks. Seems strange to have bldg downtown that is for one and only restaurant. very suburban.... seems like it could have easily have had an upstairs with a least some offices/housing units.

Maybe a height restriction due to airport.

^maybe. but I thought the planned new buildings are much taller, granted they are slightly west of E9, they are further north so in direct alignment with BKL's main runway.

10 minutes ago, Ruken said:

Really like those apartments. One of the few lakefront options in the city.

 

A rare instance where the the result looks far better than the renderings! 

My buddy sent me this tonight. Flying over the Rams new stadium. I think we can do a roof of similar capacity.

I don't see the current stadium being altered with a new roof. The only time I see a roof being put on Browns Stadium is when a new is built. Unfortunately our current FES was rushed to completion, and the vocal "football should be played outside crowd" won out. 

 

Frankly Im waiting for something to actually be done with the parking lot north of the stadium. Pitt and Cinci have tons of bars next to their stadium. How do we have a barren wasteland? Because tailgating 10 times a year in a parking lot is the only viable use for downtown land?

4 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

I don't see the current stadium being altered with a new roof. The only time I see a roof being put on Browns Stadium is when a new is built. Unfortunately our current FES was rushed to completion, and the vocal "football should be played outside crowd" won out. 

 

Frankly Im waiting for something to actually be done with the parking lot north of the stadium. Pitt and Cinci have tons of bars next to their stadium. How do we have a barren wasteland? Because tailgating 10 times a year in a parking lot is the only viable use for downtown land?

What are you smoking this wonderful Friday evening?

 

Pittsburgh:

Cincy:

Edited February 1, 20205 yr by marty15

If by “bars”, you meant parking and water, then yes, you’re 100% correct. ?

1 minute ago, marty15 said:

What are you smoking this wonderful Friday evening?

 

Pittsburgh:

Cincy:

When was the last time you were at a Bengals or Steelers game? 

 

There is a Bar Louie, Jerome Bettis Bar, Tequila Cowboy literally right outside Heinz Field

 

There is also a Yardhouse and other bars along the Ohio River in the vicinity of Great American Ball park and Paul Brown Stadium.  I don't need to look at Google Satellite, I've been to those places in person. 

I'm afraid the proximity of FEB to the stadium dooms the probability of any bar-hopping next to FES. 

Yeah it’s not like there is a Lakefront development plan moving forward or anything by FES ?

While close, they aren't quite close enough. If the stadium is staying in it's current location, there needs to be a plan to better connect FEB to the stadium. Now you have to take the Lakefront line from FEB to FES or hike up W. 3rd to the stadium; not too convenient, especially after a few beers.

Edited February 1, 20205 yr by Frmr CLEder

1 hour ago, Frmr CLEder said:

While close, they aren't quite close enough. If the stadium is staying in it's current location, there needs to be a plan to better connect FEB to the stadium. Now you have to take the Lakefront line from FEB to FES or hike up W. 3rd to the stadium; not too convenient, especially after a few beers.

Wait the waterfront line carries you from the FEB to West 3rd station which is right across the street from the Browns Stadium. Maybe because I'm not a drinker but that's not far at all.

10 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

I don't see the current stadium being altered with a new roof. The only time I see a roof being put on Browns Stadium is when a new is built. Unfortunately our current FES was rushed to completion, and the vocal "football should be played outside crowd" won out. 

 

Frankly Im waiting for something to actually be done with the parking lot north of the stadium. Pitt and Cinci have tons of bars next to their stadium. How do we have a barren wasteland? Because tailgating 10 times a year in a parking lot is the only viable use for downtown land?

 

Yeah, we did.   Because the bulk of us fighting to keep the identity were on that side.  Probably 80% of the active crowd.

13 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Frankly Im waiting for something to actually be done with the parking lot north of the stadium. Pitt and Cinci have tons of bars next to their stadium. How do we have a barren wasteland? Because tailgating 10 times a year in a parking lot is the only viable use for downtown land?

 

Unless it was built next to an already existing arena district, I can't think of many NFL stadiums that generate these kind of "districts".   Most NFL fans prefer the tailgate culture, then go into the game.   

 

Off the top of my head maybe Minneapolis and Foxboro have some surrounding developments, but the weather in these markets tends to be the worst in the NFL so fans might want to go indoors.  

1 hour ago, Cleburger said:

 

Unless it was built next to an already existing arena district, I can't think of many NFL stadiums that generate these kind of "districts".   Most NFL fans prefer the tailgate culture, then go into the game.   

 

Off the top of my head maybe Minneapolis and Foxboro have some surrounding developments, but the weather in these markets tends to be the worst in the NFL so fans might want to go indoors.  

Maybe this is obvious, but NFL games are predominantly on Sunday afternoons and the stadiums are often removed from any urban life/grid/etc so any bars “next” to said stadiums would probably have a tough go of it outside of the 10 home games each season.

Even in the case of FES, who’s trekking down there now to partake in any hypothetical bar/restaurant scene outside of Browns home games? 

5 minutes ago, CleCaneFan said:

Maybe this is obvious, but NFL games are predominantly on Sunday afternoons and the stadiums are often removed from any urban life/grid/etc so any bars “next” to said stadiums would probably have a tough go of it outside of the 10 home games each season.

Even in the case of FES, who’s trekking down there now to partake in any hypothetical bar/restaurant scene outside of Browns home games? 

 

I think we're kind of saying the same thing....

12 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

Yeah, we did.   Because the bulk of us fighting to keep the identity were on that side.  Probably 80% of the active crowd.

Ok Boomer

He's not a boomer. He's my age...Gen X. But eRocc is a wanna-be boomer.

Stop.

On 10/16/2019 at 11:05 PM, KJP said:

Might be worth a separate thread someday. This could be a huge project for the region....

 

 

WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 16, 2019

Planning starts for cross-county Lake Erie trail, erosion control

 

A large investment in Greater Cleveland's greatest natural asset could result from a multi-jurisdictional planning effort announced on Oct. 17 at the Lakewood Women's Club Pavilion at  Lakewood Park. The investment could result in a transformative economic and quality of life payback for the region.

Cuyahoga County Executive Armond Budish announced $500,000 for conceptual-level planning for the cross-county Lake Erie Trail along more than 30 miles of the county's shoreline.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/10/planning-starts-for-cross-county-lake.html

 

Following up on this. This vision has greater urgency but its assumptions might have to be changed. Note that in Geneva on the Lake that the existing erosion has become submerged and less effective. Clearly, erosion control is needed with our changed reality, but how to build it while still anticipating higher lake levels or, in the long run, potentially lower lake levels?

 

Geneva-on-the-Lake park eroding 3 feet a day, because of high water, lack of ice in Lake Erie

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2020/02/geneva-on-the-lake-park-eroding-3-feet-a-day-because-of-high-water-lack-of-ice-in-lake-erie.html

 

 

29 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

Following up on this. This vision has greater urgency but its assumptions might have to be changed. Note that in Geneva on the Lake that the existing erosion has become submerged and less effective. Clearly, erosion control is needed with our changed reality, but how to build it while still anticipating higher lake levels or, in the long run, potentially lower lake levels?

 

Geneva-on-the-Lake park eroding 3 feet a day, because of high water, lack of ice in Lake Erie

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2020/02/geneva-on-the-lake-park-eroding-3-feet-a-day-because-of-high-water-lack-of-ice-in-lake-erie.html

 

 

 

Parts of the trail aren't precisely on the lake.  For example, likely due to the clout of NEORSD but also perhaps due to some of my more influential neighbors, the trail follows Lakeshore Boulevard instead of the actual lakeshore.   I suspect that is going to be the case in Bratenhal as well.

Can’t they theoretically control the lake level at Niagara Falls/Hydro station?

6 minutes ago, marty15 said:

Can’t they theoretically control the lake level at Niagara Falls/Hydro station?

 

I believe the amount they can divert is minimal.  

On 9/19/2019 at 11:22 AM, Frmr CLEder said:

When I was a kid, the Aquarama used to cruise from Cleveland to Detroit. Sure would be nice to build a cruise ship terminal to initiate Lake Erie summertime cruises.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SsAquarama.jpg

 

I was procrastinating with work today and read up some on the Aquarama.   Also found a Youtube video: 

 

 

 

 

 

^^ The Cleveland--Cuyahoga County Port do has a basic cruise ship port that's been up and running for a few years now.  And they are renovating a building for the US Custom -- Border Patrol.  And they have been working to get a agreement with a Canadian Port for about ten years now BUT they haven't been successful yet.  BUT NO FERRY SERVICE YET...

 

The problem is that Toledo actually built a 

cruise ship terminal about ten years ago BUT they was not able to make a success of it.  And so they sold or lease the building to the Great Lakes Museum.   Which by the way I've been to and it's a really nice museum. 

 

It least now we have a growing number of well to do visitors who visit our CITY every summer by cruise ship.

 

^Sounds similar to what happened in Rochester NY

1 hour ago, viscomi said:

^Sounds similar to what happened in Rochester NY

They built a nice one in Erie 15-20 years ago in hopes of it. It might still be empty. Cool looking building. Would love to have it here as our terminal

Edited February 28, 20205 yr by marty15

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cleveland.com/business/2020/03/city-of-cleveland-cumberland-development-cut-ties-on-downtown-lakefront-near-firstenergy-stadium.html%3foutputType=amp

26 minutes ago, Watertiger1962 said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cleveland.com/business/2020/03/city-of-cleveland-cumberland-development-cut-ties-on-downtown-lakefront-near-firstenergy-stadium.html%3foutputType=amp

That is really disappointing. I’m sure the city was tired of no progress. There are many quotes in the article from D Pace. I think the most interesting are the ones about his efforts to partner with or be bought out by the Browns, with no luck. 

 

Hopefully the city already has another partner lined up, otherwise that’s going to continue being dead space for a long time. 

Edited March 12, 20205 yr by Boomerang_Brian
Typo

The Browns were probably waiting for him to give up so they could swoop in and be the savior and get a better deal from the city.

Why did the city block the Dock 30 warehouse renovation proposal? I have no memory of this happening. 
 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wkyc.com/amp/article/life/waterfront-revival-heres-an-exclusive-first-look-at-new-development-plans-for-clevelands-north-coast-harbor/95-119154fd-66f7-4e4a-b7e7-4d03516b3878

3 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Hopefully the city already has another partner lined up, otherwise that’s going to continue being dead space for a long time. 

 

They do. Remember I posted here on Dec. 18 that the city was seeking a new development partner? I wasn't able to say much at the time, but now that Michelle has come out with her article, I will come out with mine.

Sigh....but clearly no surprise.  Pace was definitely in over his head as has been regularly noted.  The real screw up was probably the city going with him in the first place.  So another 6 years of planning and promise down the drain.  Really tacky how the city managed the divorce rather than sitting down with him way back when and saying we have problems with how things are going and need to separate.   So we start again from square one.  Hope the Browns really have a plan, resources and partners and are ready to go.

I truly believe the Browns are the best and only partner to use here.  They have the resources to make this happen and it could tie in nicely with their plan for stadium's future. 

2 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

Sigh....but clearly no surprise.  Pace was definitely in over his head as has been regularly noted.  The real screw up was probably the city going with him in the first place.  So another 6 years of planning and promise down the drain.  Really tacky how the city managed the divorce rather than sitting down with him way back when and saying we have problems with how things are going and need to separate.   So we start again from square one.  Hope the Browns really have a plan, resources and partners and are ready to go.

 

Browns aren't leading this. They are a partner and they've got resources. They have a voice in the plan but this type of real estate project is not the Haslams' expertise.

Turns out my information from December -- that K&D would take over the lakefront development -- is no longer correct. I will attempt to find out who the new developer will be.

On 2/27/2020 at 4:40 PM, Larry1962 said:

 

The problem is that Toledo actually built a cruise ship terminal about ten years ago BUT they was not able to make a success of it.  And so they sold or lease the building to the Great Lakes Museum.   Which by the way I've been to and it's a really nice museum. 

 

 

 

 

booo!   ---  they stole that from vermilion  ?

Its upsetting how the city just ghosted a developer who really put some skin into the game.  Not returning phone calls is crappy

One can only assume that someone with a bigger plan and deeper pockets has come along. While a terrible way to end the relationship, it may turn out to be for the best as DP's partnership dissolved and the project was moving along much too slowly.

To assume there is a better developer with a bigger plan and deeper pockets might be problematic. Just a thought -but does it seem like there is a growing lack of certainty  about where the Browns’ stadium will actually be in the future and isn’t that decision critical to any development moving forward on the lakefront? 

^It is.

Then why would the City ghost Pace?

Reading that article, the city came off so poorly in my eyes. Why would other investors want to come to town and work in this city if that's how they can expect to be treated?

The City screwed Pace over.  He's a great developer.  The city's administration is a problem.