Maybe I"m wrong but I'm pretty sure that the tear down rate in OTR will likely increase.  Has anyone heard of any new inflill projects nothing definitive but for example on Vine  there are a few lots that I noticed.

Trinity flats will be at 14th and Vine.  Much of the boarded up buildings south of Liberty are already owned by 3CDC and it is just a matter of time.  I actually think that the tear down rate south of liberty will slow but north of Liberty is at risk.

^

I am probably thinking more of the North of Liberty area

my issue is 2 many buildings are held buy people who don't want to sell, because of the section 8 crap.

If i wanted to buy a building to convert into my house, (I want one of those 3 story buildings)  but their is no way i can

afford to buy a building even a commended one that i could turn into a hidden gem.

 

To many people are holding onto property waiting for this gentrification, while collecting section 8 checks.

thats what I think is holding the neighborhood back. IMHO

If i wanted to buy a building to convert into my house, (I want one of those 3 story buildings)  but their is no way i can

afford to buy a building even a commended one that i could turn into a hidden gem.

 

I know of many that are available.  Where are you looking and how much?

^

Michael you are probably the person to ask. I'm looking to move to OTR after I graduate in May (provided i can find a job in Cincy). On average what is an abandoned building going to sell for (3-Story single family, preferably near the proposed streetcar), and how much in investment am i going to be looking at to get it to living conditions?

That is a bit of a loaded question.  Generally speaking, the less you pay on the acquisition the more you pay on the improvements.  You could spend anywhere from 30,000 to 130,000 depending on the condition and the area plus the situation that the seller is in.  I can point you to some buidlings in particular if you narrow it down a bit.  The streetcar line will also run through Schwartz Point and I know there are some great deals there and I think this is also one of the most unique places in OTR.  But on the other hand it may be a while before others make an investment in the area but if you can wait it out, I would at least look at it.

 

 

Yeah i agree Schwartz point is probably my favorite area except for the Wash Park area, but I would like to be a little further south. If the price was right i would defiantly live around Schwartz Point. Unfortunately because I'm still in school i don't really have the cash to make a purchase right now, but could probably get approved for a loan of around 150k. I wouldnt want to strap myself with that kind of mortgage payment and not be able to afford renovations. Just trying to get an idea of how much cash i will need, and make the best decision for myself.

Is there anywhere to find listings on these type of buildings? I use the Enquirer's link, but they don't really have a whole lot listed on there.

The problem with Wash park as you go up especially Elm is that they are primarily larger buildings.  Not to say there isn't something in the mix, especially on a cross street.  Would you consider Sycamore?  There are two very cool buildings over there....and I can not think of the cross st....perhaps 13th and Sycamore.  One is smaller and has a mansard roof.  I do not know if they will seperate the buildings or not, I kinda think they will at this point, but I would look at them.  I haven't pulled the listing in a while and I do not know what the list is but I will look for you tonight.

go to mycityliving.com, this is the Comey City Offices site and gives you access to the MLS.  And remember, just because it isn't listed does not necessarily mean it is not for sale.  If a building catches your eye, let me know and I may know something about it.

Yeah i would definitely do Sycamore St. Nice and close to Main St.

I would drive by it, see what you think.  I believe it is 13th and Sycamore.

Just an observation I made while i was in OTR today, but i often notice homeless people picking up cans. Wouldn't it be a worth while program to give these guys some uniforms and have them pick up trash around the city and OTR. This will help give them a greater sense of self worth and they can earn money doing pretty much the same thing that they were doing before, and people wouldn't be as condescending towards them. This could also be run through a welfare type organization where they get their check plus more money by doing this. THe city wins by getting cleaner streets and they win by getting more money a sense of self worth. Not a real refined thought at this point but its a starting point. Any other thoughts on something like this? Has it been tried?

It was being done with the prisoners and I do know that individual property owners of especially low income properties will pay or otherwise incentivise a tenant to do this.  When OTR was its cleanest was when Brantley Services had crews cleaning OTR and hopefully we can get them back.  Its a good idea and if an existing, not a new, social service mobilized some of their people then I would be all for it.

Sorry, but this was too good to pass up...  Ben....

 

http://www.theonion.com/content/news/report_nations_gentrified

Incoming aristocrats are easily spotted by their distinctive dress and taste for chamber music.

There is a Melody Richardson joke in here somewhere.  This proves that everything is relative.

Hi,

 

I am under the impression from what I have read that a significant percentage of homeless people are in need of mental health counseling and/or medications to help control or improve their condition.  I don't believe that that particular segment of society has much of a chance of finding a job or a place to live.  Until large amounts of funding are created to address those problems I don't know how anyone can reasonably expect the homeless situation to improve.

 

Crime will not go away until the drug crisis that our nation is facing has been addressed.  Some day the people of this country will need to face the fact that drug abuse is now a part of our culture and that no matter how much is spent trying to stop the production and importation of drugs that people will find a way to get their high.  This is as true in the OTR as it is in other areas of Cincinnati and the suburbs.  The gentrification of OTR may create a genuinely wonderful community in which to reside.  The people, be they good or bad, who may be displaced from that community will still move on to another neighborhood to live. 

 

The social problems that are a large part of our society are found in Indian Hill; St. Bernard; Newport; Anderson Township; Liberty Township; Norwood; Edgewood; and every other community in this area.  The social services that provide aid to those problems should be in every community too.

 

Down off the soapbox.  Hope everyone has a good night....

Well I agree.  First, you are absolutely correct about the mental health issue facing most of our homeless.  The drug issue, as it relates to the homeless, I believe is a way of self medicating some of these mental issues and then begins a downward spiral.  In many cases, not all, but many, the social services help enable this to some extent.  Whether it is dismissing the problems, both of and associated to the homeless population it in some ways creates an environment where this behavior is accepted and allowed to go on year after year until they just drop off the radar entirely and simply replaced by the next generation of the chronic homeless.

"Just one of the neighborhood's multiple homeless shelters anticipates serving 4,200 people (unduplicated visits) in 2008, and it projects finding homes for only 137 of them".

 

Your last point is one that has been debated for a very long time.  Should each community bare the burden of supporting some portion of our social ills.  Well that depends on the perspective of the one who is responding.  From our perspective here in OTR or the West End who shoulder almost all social services, 108 in OTR alone, we should have a broader distribution of these agencies.  I personally believe this as well as I feel it is our responsibility as a society to help those who can not otherwise take care of themselves and that includes us all, not just one or two communities. (there went my political future) 

"Somewhere between 60 percent and 80 percent of people experiencing homelessness in Hamilton County are filtered through OTR - a neighborhood that only constitutes 0.5 percent of the county".

 

That being said, I understand the reluctance of communities such as Oakley, Amberly, Indian Hill etc to locate such facilities in their communities yet they are the first ones to say that we here in OTR or the West End are the NIMBY's.  The argument that they simply place these facilities in an area where the homeless populations are is a ridiculous one as the homeless populations reside where the facilities are.  By definition, these are not people who have transportation to take them further than a mile or so radius from the facility that they stay at every night.  At the same time they place them in areas that allows for easy access to drugs that enables them to perpetuate an addiction that when mixed with mental issues creates a recipe for disaster and at very least a poor environment for rehabilitation. 

"The [CityLink] coalition consists of 5 ministries and 5 churches, all from outside of the neighborhood.  Described as "a mall for the poor", CityLink Center would include a homeless shelter, temporary housing, a soup kitchen, substance abuse center and a transition area for inmates being released back into society.  The main issue is that this will be placed close to 3 schools (Bloom, Heberle and King Academy) and a residential district".

 

Why not take them out of that environment?  Why not give them the real help they need that will help make them a functioning member of society or if that is not possible, get them the institutional help they need to cope with debilitating mental disease?  My personal feeling is that many of these social services are less about the recipients and more for the providers of the service.  I have no doubt that many of the people who provide the 100 plus services here or those who dump their outdated wardrobes in Washington Park or at the front door of the Freestore feel in their hearts they are doing the right thing.  Unfortunately, this is a problem that requires more thought than feeling at this point to solve the problem.  Feeling has done more to perpetuate it, thought can help solve it.

"Ribbon Cutting at "Nannie Hinkston House" on East McMicken Street. The transitional housing project will create a new home for a dozen people who graduate from the substance abuse program at the Drop Inn Center". WCPO Channel 9 3/27

 

Thought did not go into placing a homeless/drug rehab center within a block of drug corners.  Thought did not go into placing a homeless/drug rehab center within a block of a school.  Thought did not go into placing a homeless/drug rehab center into a community that has served as a revolving door for those people who are trying to get help to break a drug dependency or a chronic mental illness.  This took no thought and when you see the same people here year after year, it took little heart, only a blind eye.

 

 

It is nice to see some progress being made in OTR finally.  When I first was introduced to it in the early 1980's, I was blown away, and fell in love immediately.  It was a turbulent time in OTR.  Downtown business interests, preservationists via the then named Miami Purchase Association, and some city planners had hopes to somehow save our architectural and cultural blessings in OTR that were still standing.  The almost incomprehensible loss of tens of thousands of housing units in the west end the previous four decades showed them that we really were staring a critical moment in the face.  Massive areas of old Cincinnati were wiped out and all but erased from our memory.  OTR represented a little peek at what once was.  I know I am oversimplifying this, but in my opinion, the war between business/preservation and so called social service and to some extent religious groups to obtain "control" of OTR was unfortunately won by the latter.  People like Buddy Gray and Reverend McCracken (sp?), although well intentioned, were part of the forces that wrestled for control of the neighborhood, and were never able to bring about the changes needed to turn it around.  It was always well known that Buddy ran a shelter for street alcoholics that never truly provided rehabilitation, which seems like nothing more than a recipe for enabling to me.  I don't say these things to come down on individuals, as these people were certainly well intentioned, and meant only to better society as they saw it.  I say it to illustrate the political and social climate at that time, and how preservation took a back seat so as not to "upset" anyone, so things didn't have the appearance of poor people being thrown out by the rich.  Understandable on the surface of things I guess, but certainly this must look ridiculous and regrettable today.

OTR once housed about 45,000 people, and I am sure these must have been quite crowded living conditions.  When I found OTR in the 80's, about 12,000 people lived there, and even then I found the argument of displacecment meritless.  How can we be talking about pushing out poor people just because someone with more money wants to live there when there is clearly more than enough room for everyone?  I know, I know, someone is gonna flame me for not understanding displacement, and rising rents, yadda, yadda.  I know all about it....took my planning classes in college.  I still am adamant about the fact that there is more than enough space for new residents, especially since in the last 20 years, OTR has lost ANOTHER 6,000 or so.  We are talking about an area that now has lost nearly 90% of its' population, and with it, we continue to lose all those awesome buildings!  OTR was much more intact when I first saw it.  Race street in particular has been hit hard, and the hill streets up Sycamore and especially Mulberry were similarly razed en mass.  I remember seeing so many bombed-out looking buildings that I couldn't imagine much of the area surviving another 20 years.  Main street has seen quite a bit of rehab and success, and the emerging Gateway Quarter, hate that name BTW,  has made an impressive mark in a short period of time.  Overall however, I am frightened by the lack of OTR-wide progress, and absolutely crushed by the number of structures I have seen come down in the last twenty years....Empire Theater being just one.  Infill obviously can help replace the street scene and building massing, but it is often done improperly, and seems to reveal itself in unflattering ways that I sometimes wish they would have left a vacant lot...gasp.    I wont even get into a discussion about how much I hate The Banks project, and how it could potentially negatively affect the struggling vitality in other areas like OTR.  Man, how the city/county investment in The Banks could have really boosted the future of OTR instead.

Discussions like these is evidence that OTR has more deeply commited full time residents that have both sweat and financial equity at stake, and will fight to see it blossom.  But the question always comes back to me though.  Can it survive another 20 years at the current pace?

 

^Well stated

 

some city planners had hopes to somehow save our architectural and cultural blessings in OTR that were still standing

 

The problem that they had lies right there in the above statement, "somehow".  They had no plan beyond just saving the structure, I give you Kaufman Brewery but on a massive scale.  Todays redevelopment focus more on the use than the structure.  A plan needed to be in place first that would have allowed for more than just avoiding the razing of a building and then keeping it vacant for years until someone could find a use.  This lent to 500 vacant buildings as when you have one vacant building, it hurts the others around it as it attracts blight, crime, and a sense of a community on the way down.  Today there is a plan and the results will be realized long before the 20 years as the year over year gains will be exponential.  3 years ago, would you have thought we would have Jean Robert?  A crime rate that has in some quarters dipped below all other Dist? A residential project that is outselling almost every other project in the city?  If you did not think we would have any of this 3 years ago, wait till three years from now.

 

 

^  FOR SURE!!  It is truley amazing progress when I see all of the the progress that hasn't been made in my lifetime (41 yrs).

 

At the end of the day, I guess that this progress has been made possible by the fact that area became nearly depopulated.  The people that were part of the roadblock to progress are literally gone.  Maybe now, as the neighborhood moves toward a more healthy balance with additional residents with more stable lives, those who are in need of assistance can become more inspired by their example and escape the problems that plague them.  Maybe now, Cincinnati can save what remains of what I think can be the best, most liveable, and socially/economically integrated neighborhoods in this country.  All the while, an irreplaceable collection of architecture gets saved for future generations.

^Well put!

this progress has been made possible by the fact that area became nearly depopulated

The greatest change occurs at the edge of chaos and chaos was where we were at the beginning of the decade.  To that extent, even the riots helped wake people up to the fact that something had to be done with "downtown" less it become the next Detroit.  The bankruptcy of Denhart, the exodus of people with the HUD changes and the political will to enact change all came together to create the perfect storm.  OTR is turning around and will continue to at a faster and faster pace.  It takes a special person to pioneer an area and be the first, but we are moving beyond the pioneer stage now and moving towards a tipping point where OTR and CBD does not get a gasp when a new resident says they just purchased a home there.  The more people that do move here, the more that will move here.

the city/county investment in The Banks could have really boosted the future of OTR instead

As for the Banks project not helping OTR I disagree.  First, OTR can only advance so fast otherwise our supply/demand curve be reversed.  Second, one of the biggest issues for us is perception and to the average suburbanite there isn't a lick of difference between OTR and the CBD (some do not even know what those letters stand for) and when either of the two have positive development news, both benefit.  We are joined at the hip and Central Pkwy. isn't enough to distinguish the difference in the two communities to the average person.  If OTR fails, so does the CBD and the inverse is also true.  We can have a successful Fountain Square, Gateway Quarter, Banks Project and even streetcar as each lends itself to the success of the other and none can succesfully act exclusive of the others.

 

Let's help individuals, not just corporations, play role in OTR revival

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2008/06/09/editorial4.html

Let's help individuals, not just corporations, play role in OTR revival

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2008/06/09/editorial4.html

 

I'll beat thomasbw to the punch:

 

A streetcar will help all businesses, developers, and property owners instead of just one or two developers (which since I can't see the whole editorial Mike probably said in the piece).

Dear lord I just cringe every time I read this stuff.  Mike, are ya kiddin me?  To the average reader who looks at this article who does not live, work or know too terribly much about OTR, what do they take away from this?  Those condos are selling so fast in the Q that it would make your head spin, trust me, I know.  We do not know how to have success down here.  Everything good must be bad and everything bad must have some good. 

 

3CDC is the only organization that has made a noticeable dent in OTR from not just development, but safety and improvements in perception as well.  TELL ME I AM WRONG.  Ok, ok, little perterved now....for the Foundation to sit back and put into print that the "corportations" are the greedy one's here while the Foundation made a profit off of 101 and 105 Peete and 100 E. Clifton and 14 th and Race which they begged 3CDC to take when it was discovered that the Foundation was slum lords PROFITING off of 4 buildings that even Dist. 1 declared the most problematic in the area is inexcusably hypocritical! 

 

3CDC doesn't "make" the neighborhood, Holly Redmond does, Jim Moll does, who 3CDC was smart enough to bring in to not just sell the units but to help foster a neighborhood type feel because they are the neighborhood, they walk the walk and work everyday to bring people together through social events.  How has the Foundation done this?  I can list for you how Holly and Jim has but I would like to hear how the Foundation has reached out to the new residents of the Q to help avoid the "social vacuum".

 

We need to rally behind corporations that want to spend money in this community-because we sure berated them when they didn't! We need to rally behind people that make this community work, and we need to stop this constant, "it's not me that is doing this so it must be bad" mentality that has plagued this neighborhood for years.  Do you realize how many other developers are beginning to inquire about urban development now because they see the success of 3CDC?  I am proud of what they have done and the way they have done it and they are creating a community, because it is my wife and my friends who they have brought in to help do this (real life OTR residents themeselves) and where in the hell is the Foundation while this is happening?  The Foundation needs to focus on what positives they can do as opposed to simply trying to find fault in the others because the Foundation's faults have been glaring. 

I'll beat thomasbw to the punch:

 

A streetcar will help all businesses, developers, and property owners instead of just one or two developers (which since I can't see the whole editorial Mike probably said in the piece).

 

There was no direct or even indirect reference to the streetcar in the article.

No, but the streetcar levels the playing field for developers big and small.  The hardest part about multi unit developments in the downtown and otr is that you need the political clout to get a few million dollars in tax breaks/incentives to finance the parking, or you need the capital to buy enough land to make a surface lot.  The streetcar allows you to buy one the the row houses on the line and convert it into condos if you are a small developer, rather than have to rely on the government or a specially chosen development corporation of the government's choosing to redevelop an area.

 

3cdc is doing great work in the area, and they will benefit the most from the streetcar.  But it will also give the little guy a much better chance as well.

I doubt you'll see parking requirements change very quickly, but the streetcar will make your case for a variance to the parking requirements much more legit.  You'll probably see variance after variance granted until the code is actually changed to lower parking requirements for properties on/around the streetcar line.

CMC 1410-09

 

Special Exception to Off-Street Parking and Loading Requirements.  The Zoning Hearing Examiner pursuant to Section 1445-13 and 1445-19 may grant a special exception for reduced parking requirements.

(1)  The applicant must provide documentation to Zoning Hearing Examiner to support the reduction of the required number of parking spaces. This documentation may include but is not limited to shared parking agreements, availability of on-street parking, provision of bicycle parking, proximity to public transit, and pedestrian orientation development which demonstrates:

(a)  The required number of parking spaces are not necessary for the effective operation of the proposed use, and

(b)  The reduction of the required number of parking spaces will not infringe or detract from the parking needs of adjacent property owners and uses.

With disproportionate number of social services, Over-The-Rhine also grapples with concentration of crimes

 

There’s no doubt John Walter’s map tells a story. The question is what story it tells.

 

The map shows hundreds of dots converged at 217 W. 12th St., the address for the Drop Inn Center in Over-the-Rhine. Each dot represents the home address given by someone arrested for a Part 2 crime in the neighborhood. Those are offenses such as simple assault, panhandling, having an open flask or even urinating in public. And of the roughly 2,000 people with Over-the-Rhine addresses arrested for such crimes through Aug. 12, more than 1,100 gave 217 W. 12th St. as home, with the location of the crimes stretching as far as half a mile from the shelter itself.

 

Walter, an Over-the-Rhine resident and developer, has circulated the map – created using police data with the help of Hamilton County’s C.A.G.I.S. – as evidence that the concentration of social services has led to a concentration of crime in the fragile neighborhood where he lives and works.

 

...

 

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2008/09/22/story2.html

Relocate social services to Hyde Park and Mt. Lookout, using eminent domain if we have to (it serves a public use in my book) :)

 

And the fact that I cant walk to the courthouse from my office without being panhandled seven times, thats a problem.

 

Main Street is particularly bad! 7 times sounds about right.

Relocate social services to Hyde Park and Mt. Lookout, using eminent domain if we have to (it serves a public use in my book) :)

 

And the fact that I cant walk to the courthouse from my office without being panhandled seven times, thats a problem.

 

Main Street is particularly bad! 7 times sounds about right.

 

Why ruin Hyde Park? It's one of the nicest neighborhoods in the city limits, and is one of the few places in the city limits that generally the whole region views as being "nice" or cool to live, along with Mt. Adams, and Mt. Lookout too ( and maybe Oakley?).

Relocate social services to Hyde Park and Mt. Lookout, using eminent domain if we have to (it serves a public use in my book) :)

 

And the fact that I cant walk to the courthouse from my office without being panhandled seven times, thats a problem.

 

Main Street is particularly bad! 7 times sounds about right.

 

Why ruin Hyde Park? It's one of the nicest neighborhoods in the city limits, and is one of the few places in the city limits that generally the whole region views as being "nice" or cool to live, along with Mt. Adams, and Mt. Lookout too ( and maybe Oakley?).

 

Why ruin over-the-rhine? I mean, it has major historical value, its unique, the largest, most dense collection of 2-5 story 19th century Italianates around. Oh wait, we already did by centralizing all of the city's social services there. You know Avondale isn't much different than Hyde Park in terms of housing stock itself.

The solution is to set a up a citywide social services system where EVERY neighborhood has social services locations and every neighbhorhood has section 8 housing, on a very limited scale. Folks worry about section 8 killing home values; I dont think that would be the case if we talk about it being very spread out accros the city.

Relocate social services to Hyde Park and Mt. Lookout, using eminent domain if we have to (it serves a public use in my book) :)

 

And the fact that I cant walk to the courthouse from my office without being panhandled seven times, thats a problem.

 

Main Street is particularly bad! 7 times sounds about right.

 

Hmm...I was in Chicago yesterday and I'm trying to remember how many times I was panhandled.  Maybe...50?  I really don't think panhandling is a MAJOR problem.  And actually, I really like the cultured panhandlers.  I have a homeless guy in my neighborhood who finally picked up a harmonica a few weeks ago.  At first he was BAD at playing it, but I've heard his improvement and now I pay him $2-3 every time I see him.  I love the atmosphere it added to the neighborhood.  I noticed some of this near Findlay Market last time I was there in February.  It really helped the atmosphere.

^Panhandling doesn't pull you down when you've got other things like enjoying the great atmosphere of a neighborhood, to do.  My favorites though are people who do creative things like art and music on the street.  Street performers really add lifeblood to a neighborhood.

Try D.C.! the panhandling is out of control. You cant turn the corner without being panhandled

Relocate social services to Hyde Park and Mt. Lookout, using eminent domain if we have to (it serves a public use in my book) :)

 

And the fact that I can’t walk to the courthouse from my office without being panhandled seven times, that’s a problem.”

 

Main Street is particularly bad! 7 times sounds about right.

 

Hmm...I was in Chicago yesterday and I'm trying to remember how many times I was panhandled.  Maybe...50?  I really don't think panhandling is a MAJOR problem.  And actually, I really like the cultured panhandlers.  I have a homeless guy in my neighborhood who finally picked up a harmonica a few weeks ago.  At first he was BAD at playing it, but I've heard his improvement and now I pay him $2-3 every time I see him.  I love the atmosphere it added to the neighborhood.  I noticed some of this near Findlay Market last time I was there in February.  It really helped the atmosphere.

 

It's aggressive panhandling though. I'm used to it but it scares a lot of people. It gets to the point where you see the same people standing at the same corner and you know they're about to hassel you for change again. The only time I've ever seen any kind of street performer was at Main and like 13th; he had me and my friend listen to a poem he apparently made up and it did nothing but waste a few minutes of our time lol. If they're not trying to talk to you and give you their life story, they're just hasseling you for handouts.  I'm just speaking from experience though, I don't know how it's been the past few months.

^^^HAHAHA, I had a guy who'd come by me about once a week when I was waiting at a bus stop.  He'd tell me the SAME sob story every time.  So one day I pulled out a $20 bill and told him, "See this, I'll give you the whole thing IF the next time I see you, you tell me a different story."  Sure enough, one week later he walked up to me and told me the same sob story. 

 

Sad.

Hehe. Heres what you do - if he ever tries to tell you his story again, interrupt him and start talking about your own life. He'll get sick of you because no one likes a conversation hi-jacker.

Panhandling in Cincinnati is tame compared to places like DC, Atlanta, and most other places for that matter.

I just spent a week in Boston.  I was panhandled exactly ZERO times.  This is how it should be.

I just spent a week in Boston. I was panhandled exactly ZERO times. This is how it should be.

 

I wonder what Boston does to discourage panhandling? 

Boston is actually one of the few places I've ever paid a panhandler, because I couldn't find the T station and he helped me find it.  So, I thought he earned the $5 I gave him. 

Five dollars?! I guess it makes sense when you consider Boston's cost of living  :lol:

I just spent a week in Boston.  I was panhandled exactly ZERO times.  This is how it should be.

 

I wonder what Boston does to discourage panhandling? 

 

winter

I have a theory.

 

OTR was already experiencing a mass exodus since 2000 due in large part to the Section 8 change from project base to vouchers. This meant that a voucher recipient could now go to another, less blighted neighborhood and exercise that voucher anywhere it was accepted. I have always looked at it from the recipient side until now.

 

With recent problems in housing, does our current economic situation actually speed this process up more? We were already seeing places, especially in the West Side depreciating in value. I would say that this depreciation started with a cultural change that no longer saw the next generation of Westsiders choosing to live, not just on the same side of town, but sometimes on the same street as they grew up on. Property values begin to fall due to lack of demand and ever increasing market rate supply throughout the rest of Cincinnati. Crime begins to rise, schools begin to decline (just yesterday an armed, non student, roamed the halls of West High) and this puts more downward pressure on value until you hit the tipping point.

 

Now we are left with small, post WWII homes with an aging population that is not being replaced as it once was. Today lending is tight and many homeowners find themeselves both upside down on their home and unable to sell as buyers are more and more unable to buy. What option is left? Rental. But coupled with a declining neighborhood even rental prices at market rate may be lower than what a property owner may now get by accepting a voucher. Guaranteed money primarily paid by the Government at a higher amount vs the shakiness of a non recipient at a lower amount. To me the math seems easy but should be even easier to a desperate homeowner who is left with few, if any, options. So then what of the neighbor? Is his house value helped or hurt by the already rising foreclosure rates coupled with an increasing subsidized housing market? Would he or she be willing to take a hit on sale price if they had no mortgage (or try and do a short sale if they did and were already in distress) and sell at a loss? Some may as they see their only remaining asset with any value is there home so why not limit the loss and move into the rental market themselves? This would only further drive down value, and value translates into assessed value for property taxes that could put even a heavier burden on schools and safety as raising taxes to offset decreased assessed values wouldn't help short term demand one bit.

 

If things continue in that direction, higher crime, lowering property value, tightening lending standards, then this process that I believe already has begun, will simply become exponential in its speed. This is bad for the westside property values but what does that equation mean for OTR? Once again, the trend that was already established also speeds up exponentially from lowering crime, rising property values whereas market rate value exceeds subsidized value, and the weakening economy forcing many in the suburbs to downsize as they go into retirement.  Choosing an appreciating area near the core with a relatively low effective cost due to tax abatement may be the best option for many.

 

Will the new West Side be the old OTR? Just a theory but we as a society seem to like well defined boundaries. "wrong side of the railroad tracks" now becomes "wrong side of 75". I believe if you look at crime maps and value charts ranging from '00 through today, that they will support the trend. What will be most interesting is that same data from today through the next decade.

If that happens too much across the entire west side, you can kiss the city goodbye. Those are some of the biggest neighborhoods in the city. That isn't simply a question of a neighborhood turning point, it would signal the Detroit-izing of Cincinnati.

This is what's going on on Columbus' east side right now.