$100 million shopping center proposed in Twinsburg

Thursday, March 20, 2008April McClellan-Copeland

Plain Dealer Reporter

Twinsburg- A developer has proposed a $100 million fashion-only shopping center that, if built, would likely be sandwiched between upscale developments in Hudson and Solon.

 

The lawyer representing the landowner said Twinsburg Fashion Place will stand out because of its unique design and its only competition will be Beachwood Place.

 

...

 

More sprawl!!  Yay!!!!

This is ridiculous.  What kind of stores do these people expect to open in their little community.  It certainly won't be a retailer unique to the area!

 

What crap!

This is ridiculous. What kind of stores do these people expect to open in their little community. It certainly won't be a retailer unique to the area!

 

What crap!

 

They live in Twinsburg. I doubt they would even consider a "unique retailer" as something to be valued.

This is ridiculous.  What kind of stores do these people expect to open in their little community.  It certainly won't be a retailer unique to the area!

 

What crap!

 

They live in Twinsburg. I doubt they would even consider a "unique retailer" as something to be valued.

 

Then let them drive to some of the currently standing crap that populates the coutryside. :roll: :roll:

Personally, I'd rather this go in T-burg than alongside Rt. 8.  This will hopefully slow Wolstein's and other developers jets along that corridor.  This new development is a mere 5 miles away and potentially biting off a good chunk of whoever they think would be wanting to drive over to Macedonia.  I mean seriously Streetsboro is saturated with retail, now Twinsburg will be.  There's Aurora outlet mall over there.  Hudson has their lifestyle center and other unique shops.  Everyone knows Macedonia is already packed with retail.  They just built a large new building called "great escape" in macedonia to compete with litehouse i guess..  Who in this area is underserved by a lack of retail opportunities close at hand?  Because developers still wish to add 3-4 giant new retail/office complexes alongside rt. 8 going into Boston Heights..

Hudson has their lifestyle center and other unique shops.  Everyone knows Macedonia is already packed with retail.  They just built a large new building called "great escape" in macedonia to compete with litehouse i guess..  Who in this area is underserved by a lack of retail opportunities close at hand?  Because developers still wish to add 3-4 giant new retail/office complexes alongside rt. 8 going into Boston Heights..

 

Heinen's and Chico's is hardly "unique".  What is your defintion of "unique retail"?

 

There's Aurora outlet mall over there.  Hudson has their lifestyle center and other unique shops.  Everyone knows Macedonia is already packed with retail. 

Aurora farms is decent.  What type of retail does Macedonia have?  Apparently I'm not in "the know"!

 

 

^Hudson has unique shops outside of the lifestyle center is what I was referring to.  They have an amazing bakery Great Lake Baking Co south of the square.  There are various artsy stores and shops that seem to do well that are not chains.  Plus there are other shops over in the main plaza by Acme.  There's an excellent wine and beer bar/store called Northend on 91 thats pretty unique and they have frequent sampling events.  Last week they had all the Hoppin Frog beers matched to a 4 course gourmet dinner.

 

As far as Macedonia, its big box store paradise: Target, Walmart, Kohls, Lowes, Home Depot, Giant Eagle, Best Buy, Burlington.. Add in the typical mix of stores  and restaurants that like to hang in those places.  There are plenty of vacancies in the main plaza due to Tops pulling out and some other stores closing.

We'll yeah...I see why i'm "not in the know". 

As Archie Bunker would say: "Whooptdy damn doo."  Sure'd be nice if downtown could get a wiff of some of the $$(100)Ms retail fanning farther and farther from Cleveland's core.

As Archie Bunker would say: "Whooptdy damn doo."  Sure'd be nice if downtown could get a wiff of some of this retail fanning farther and farther from Cleveland's core.

AMEN!

Despite the image of this region w/ its pockets hanging out, there's tons of money around here... somewhere.  One would think with all the good things going on downtown, some major retailer/developer would, like, stick her/his neck out and take a chance... someone.

There are some sick, delusional minds out there!  Really, if this is what having money does to people, then I don't want any!  (well a little perhaps but you know what I mean! :wink:)  I don't know if I'd feel more guilty building this or committing a bad crime!!! Synonymous if you ask me! 

at some point in the not so distant future they will release the lower euclid avenue retail study (this thing cost a lot of money), with reccomendations on what type of retail go where, etc.  I've seen the study, I think it's a good concept.  Obviously people weren't thinking of spending 250+ million dollars on a street without thinking of some way to bring retail back.  Patience.

Despite the image of this region w/ its pockets hanging out, there's tons of money around here... somewhere.  One would think with all the good things going on downtown, some major retailer/developer would, like, stick her/his neck out and take a chance... someone.

 

Stark?  Wolstein?  K&D?  Zaremba?  CSU?

so you're a developer and want to build a new retail center.  among many choices, you can:

 

build a new development in Twinsburg with support from the city, available property for your development and plenty of suburbanites to spend money in your stores.  your vision could be up and running in 2-3 years.

 

or

 

you could try to push your proposal downtown, get resistance from portions of the local government, overcome other hurdles such as infrastructure, and get into costly legal battles with other landoweners over small parcels of land that are keeping you from moving forward.  maybe if all goes well, you'll break ground 3 years after your initial proposal, but most likely it will take you 4-5 years before you even dig a hole in the ground.  and once you do build it, hope the government doesn't change a policy that kills your business (like bussing kids across town using tower city as the central station).

 

which one are you taking? 

In all fairness, local gov't can make dumb policy decisions or oppose developments in the suburbs as well.

^I hear you shs96.  Tower City's sitting on top of the central Rapid station at the major bus-rapid transfer point in the county is both a blessing and a curse... But all this sprawling development's got to be a zero sum game at some point.  Even in the late 80s when downtown had both Higbees and Mays, with the malls that existed (sans such newbies like Steelyards, Southpark, Cracker Park and Legacy), this area was deemed ‘over-stored.’  So how, in this down econ climate, can developers to put together viable financing packages when these titans are body-slamming each other for a diminishing buck?

build a new development in Twinsburg with support from the city, available property for your development and plenty of suburbanites to spend money in your stores.

 

Maybe the government needs to make it harder to build in the suburbs then.  Plowing over more farms needlessly is quite harmful to the country, but the companies don't see any cost in it.  I equate it to pollution, it would be a heck of a lot easier on companies if we allowed them to pollute, but we have laws and fines prohibiting this destructive behavior.  When will we realize sprawl is just as destructive (if not more so, as extra pollution is but one of the many ill effects is has)?

Excuse me for butting in! Just some of my thoughts.

 

 

It all comes down to money and risk. If I wanted to build a retail development, I'd ask myself:

 

1. Where will it cost me the least to build? The following would be taken into consideration:

 

    A. Cost of land and infrastructure

    b. Resistance, which costs time and money to fight.

    c. Land availability: Do I have to fight with Eminent Domain hearings that will run up costs?

    d. Parking issues: Do I have to use bricks and mortar for parking or relatively inexpensive asphalt? 

    E. Etc...

 

2. Where can I build that will be the least risky? The following would be taken into consideration:

 

    A. The burbs:

 

        1. Greater Population of higher paid residents

        2. Easier access and less hassle for patrons: Easier access to parking that is free

        3. Closer to patrons' homes: On nights and weekends, it is more convenient for patrons, who already live out there, to take the short drive rather than all the way downtown just to get irritated over where to park.

        4. Etc...

 

  B. Downtown:

 

        1. A lack of residents to support retail on nights and weekends.

        2. An absence of available and hassle free parking. Parking is also expensive.

        3. The old "You go first" philosophy, which; although not in the entrepreneur spirit, can be smart. Everyone wants to see if someone else can make it first. The Galleria's lack luster appeal isn't helping this attitude.

        5. Etc...

 

Possible Solutions: Downtown must become more attractive than it's burbs.

 

    A. Trying to discourage this development in the burbs will not work and will cause resentment and fighting between the core and the outer rings. This is not healthy

    B. Trying to encourage this development in downtown is more favorable

    c. Land must, first, be available complete with good infrastructure, available and low cost parking (Preferably free for patrons). Preferably parking lots to save developer on construction costs. In some cases the city should pay for the parking deck, if necessary and if employer is creating jobs, etc.

    D. Great access from the freeway for suburbanites

    E. Cleveland must continue and step up it's efforts to make downtown an urban residential community so that people can just come outside and shop.

    F. The city needs to use it's economic might to offer programs and incentives specifically for downtown economic development.

    G. Cleveland should focus more of it's resources on job retention and job attraction and less on supplying huge incentives for pork projects that don't help every day people or their neighborhoods. This will improve Cleveland's economy, which is lagging behind the economies of it's suburbs. This is not the fault of the suburbs. They are the reason people who left Cleveland Proper have not left the region completely.

 

In closing: Cleveland has the ability to attract this development, it just needs a marketing strategy and in the end, it needs to make itself more competitive than it's suburbs. Don't blame the burbs but beat the burbs.

 

   

   

 

Just like w/ Frank Jackson's compact w/ the burbs over stabilizing water rates in exchange for each not poaching business from the other, perhaps a similar agreement can be made viz retail.  As most people here are saying, despite the land/financial advantages one greedy burb can offer, the region as a whole is harmed by the spiraling sprawl this is creating, not to mention the sheer foolishness for residents as we hit $4+/gallon gas this spring.  Despite the freeway access along I-480 and Rt. 82, the bulk of the population of the region lives many miles from Twinsburg so, despite how 'unique' this place is supposed to be, there's only so much traffic this place can command.

 

^As for your comment re freeway access to downtown.  It's interesting that a very large segment of those who visit Chicago's always booming Magnificent Mile come into town by train; the more affluent from the sprawling outer burbs (where the bulk of the non-city dwellers dwell) use the double-decker Metra trains.  This in a region filed with freeways, toll-roads, tons of malls and, as noted, sprawl.  It's just that downtown Chicago has managed to keep itself relevant and exciting without building more and more freeways.  They let the transit infrastructure do the job.

There is absolutely no comparison between Chicago and Cleveland. Have you ever been to Chicago? Cleveland is a small town compared to Chicago. Chicago is a mega city with transportation options that makes Cleveland look like Toad Suck, Arkansas. I don't mean this as an insult because Cleveland is my home. But there is no comparison to Chicago.

 

And I never said that there needed to be any more expressways built. I meant retail areas should be easily accessed from one of the current expressway exits. This would make it more convenient for patrons. Retail doesn't have to be built right at the exits but should be easily accessed from the exits. This is common sense.

 

Although Cleveland has mass transit, it is not sophisticated enough for people to utilize it to the extent that Chicago area residents do to commute downtown. Cleveland trains do not access all suburbs and it is easier to just hop in your car because Cleveland doesn't have the traffic jams that Chicago does. The majority of the people who live in the suburbs would drive their cars downtown to go shopping. There needs to be adequate and affordable parking or they will stay where they are and shop. More common sense.

 

And fact is fact. The reason that this project is being built in Twinsburg instead of downtown is because that location is more attractive to the investors. Investors will always pick the more attractive location. Downtown Cleveland is not attractive for retail and that is the reason why there is little retail development. Cleveland needs to make downtown more attractive to investors, for retail. I simply offered a few ideas.

 

And I am not an advocate of ridiculous sprawl as you may think. I simply understand why it happens. Cleveland is not competitive for these types of projects. Instead of blaming the burbs for attracting these projects, Cleveland needs to make some changes that will influence investors to choose Cleveland over the burbs. You can't ask a town or city to turnaway development so that you can have it. That's like asking you to turn down a promotion so I can get it. That's not going to happen. I need to convince the boss that I deserve the promotion more than you. And if I don't, how can I blame you for accepting it? You want it just like I do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe the government needs to make it harder to build in the suburbs then. 

 

I think the better (or perhaps more likely, or more controllable) solution would be to have the city of Cleveland make it easier to develop within the city. 

 

Retail can thrive downtown, whether or not you think there are enough people there on nights/weekends or not.  There are enough living DT and people close by that will come (if you build it, they will come - they don't necessarily care where it is). 

 

I'm simply amazed each night (Sun-Thu) at how busy the Powerhouse is.  The places inside there aren't cheap (moderate, I would say) plus throw on $6 for parking each time you're there.  The people are coming from somewhere outside of downtown.  The flats was a zoo in its day.

 

So when you're a business person looking to make money, you're going to take the path of least resistance towards making a profit.  I'm never going to fault anyone for taking advantage of an opportunity, even if it has negative side effects.  We need city leaders to create opportunities for entrepreneurs and major developers; allow the "build downtown" route to be the path of least resistance.

1.  Who really thinks that Twinsburg would contain stores not already existing in NEO?  With gas nearly $4/gallon, who are these "plenty of suburbanites" and where are they coming from?  Maybe they've done "studies" to justify this by I have a hard time believing the validity of another center w/o a truely unique anchor like Ikea or something else with that allure. 

 

2.  Go to Michigan Ave, take off the sunglasses, and really look at who's down there. Yes you have some Europeans and Asians in the city to look at the architecture, museums, and take advantage of a weak $ but there a throngs of middle America who venture to Chicago to experience the "big city", 75% of them decked out in Northface gear from head-to-toe, and then return home acting like they were on some other planet and return to the same lifestyle.  I understand we can't come home after a weekend abroad, snap our fingers and boom-10 more rta lines running throughout the city but the change has to begin somewhere.

 

Chicago is hyper-manicured city.  There's a level of perfection and exuberance downtown that makes you want to limit your stay.  I can honestly say that 80% of the non-Chicagoans with whom I went to school want to or have already left Chicago after graduation.  It looses its luster after a little while--and after a while I mean more than one or two weekend visits a year. 

 

3. master,Downtown Cleveland is affordable and accessible for everyone!  What more do you want?  Free valet parking  and someone in the stalls to assist you?  Seriously! :roll:  And why isn't downtown attractive  for retail?  Centralized, authentic atmosphere-nothing that could ever be recreated in Twinsburg!  oh, you can walk all over too. 

 

There's a site called Cleveland.com--go there.

I have no knowledge, but as others have stated, there is no way that the ECP is built and the stores not being filled. 

 

I would like to know the plans NOW, but like other I must wait.  I would think, that the city/county/cvb/development is marketing those storefronts to major retailers, since we know there are plenty of plans for housing.

shs96- A lot of what you say makes sense, but remember, these people who come downtown; come to visit places and events that they can't find in their neighborhoods. Downtown Cleveland is attractive for entertainment and the burbs don't want it on a large scale. Thefore, people come downtown for entertainment. However, it is difficult  to get people to ride by the target in their neighborhood to go all the way to the Target downtown for the privilege of participating in a traffic jam, paying $6.00 for parking and a long walk.

 

cle2032-Cleveland is accessible, but it could be more accessible. As a former East Clevelander, I can say that there are no highways on the entire east side that will cut straight to downtown. Your options are to ride the streets downtown or ride the streets to I-90 and travel all the way around the edge of the east side to get to downtown. Unfortunately, this issue is too costly to fix. The bus system is good but there aren't enough train routes and they are not far reaching enough.

 

I agree that improved transportation to and from the burbs and Akron needs to start somewhere. Cleveland needs to begin, not just talk about it.

 

I do believe Downtown Cleveland can sustain retail, but it has to attract it first. The fact is, Cleveland is not attracting it. There is a "You go first" attitude with investors. They have seen retail fail downtown and are waiting for someone to prove it will succeed before they risk their own money. Cleveland must make downtown appear to be a low risk place to invest and show that retail investments have a high probability for success.  More downtown residents is one of many strategies to accomplish this. Having people who can come outside and shop is a huge selling point for retail. It helps to eliminate investors' reliance on commuter patrons. Especially on nights and weekends. Patrons are right upstairs or down the street. It's convenience for the patron and made to order Customers for the business. Parking is a huge concern for retail development. Affordable and convenient parking for people who are in a hurry, is essential. Retail developers salivate when a community can guarantee them parking. Cleveland has economic might. They need to use it and offer some incentives and programs to attract these developments. And accessible land must be available without a lot of time and resource wasting drama involved. Hurdles must be eliminated, retail specific incentives must be offered and marketing efforts must be made by the city. In addition, Quality Schools, Job Retention and Job Creation will help to stop the bleeding of people out of Cleveland and help wages and unemployment, which in the long run, will help Cleveland's retail.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1.  Who really thinks that Twinsburg would contain stores not already existing in NEO?  With gas nearly $4/gallon, who are these "plenty of suburbanites" and where are they coming from?  Maybe they've done "studies" to justify this by I have a hard time believing the validity of another center w/o a truely unique anchor like Ikea or something else with that allure. 

 

2.  Go to Michigan Ave, take off the sunglasses, and really look at who's down there. Yes you have some Europeans and Asians in the city to look at the architecture, museums, and take advantage of a weak $ but there a throngs of middle America who venture to Chicago to experience the "big city", 75% of them decked out in Northface gear from head-to-toe, and then return home acting like they were on some other planet and return to the same lifestyle.  I understand we can't come home after a weekend abroad, snap our fingers and boom-10 more rta lines running throughout the city but the change has to begin somewhere.

 

Chicago is hyper-manicured city.  There's a level of perfection and exuberance downtown that makes you want to limit your stay.  I can honestly say that 80% of the non-Chicagoans with whom I went to school want to or have already left Chicago after graduation.  It looses its luster after a little while--and after a while I mean more than one or two weekend visits a year. 

 

3. master,Downtown Cleveland is affordable and accessible for everyone!  What more do you want?  Free valet parking  and someone in the stalls to assist you?  Seriously! :roll:  And why isn't downtown attractive  for retail?  Centralized, authentic atmosphere-nothing that could ever be recreated in Twinsburg!  oh, you can walk all over too. 

 

There's a site called Cleveland.com--go there.

 

Your quick and dirty generalization of the people that populate Michigan Avenue is ridiculously inaccurate. Its no surprise you got tired of it after only a couple of weekends since your knowledge of the area seems to be based on limited experience. How can tell by looking at people where they from? What does "decked out in North Face gear from head to toe" mean, exactly? Do people strolling NYC's Fifth Avenue not wear North Face and only fur coats and tuxedos? How can you tell a European from a Nebraskan?

 

Finally, you completely lost me on your description of Chicago as a "hyper-manicured" city. Is this because its clean? How is that negative? What does "a level of exuberance" mean and why would that make you want to limit your stay? If by "perfect" you mean home to the nation's best architecture, remarkably clean streets and vibrant street life, you'd be correct.

 

I am not sure how someone comparing--accurately so--Chicagoan's use of public transportation to Clevelander's reliance on cars initiated a wholly unrelated, illogical and poorly worded rant on the demographics of Michigan Avenue shoppers and the "level of perfection" of Chicago causing 80% of native Chicagoans to want to leave. Seems to me someone is hyper-sensitive and defensive.

 

Master is absolutely correct, comparing Chicago to Cleveland is apples to oranges. Chicago is the nation's 3rd largest city and the 4th biggest economy in the world. There are nearly 3 million    living downtown alone, more than Cleveland and the surrounding suburbs. To state the foregoing is not a slight against Cleveland, but a fact. We're talking about two different beasts here. For you not to see that is either willful ignorance or a genuine misunderstanding of reality.

There's nothing, Master, particularly attractive in Twinsburg's location, a bland, low-density strip mall in the woods next to freeway (and in the next county, no less) over downtown Cleveland.  Where do you get your definitions?  Secondly, I only mentioned Chicago to thwart your assumption the main thing making downtown more attractive is freeway access – which, btw, Cleveland has in abundance; that Chicagoans (and Philadelphians, Bostonians and others) use trains often.  And btw, I specifically said “Metra” trains, to which you talked about the Rapid’s lack of suburban penetration.  In case you don’t know Chicago, Metra’s a commuter rail system.  The Chicago L is more comparable to our Rapid (and also doesn’t penetrate Chicago’s burbs well either.  Developing commuter rail plans for Cleveland, which is happening, can help alter the auto mindset, but we’ll never be Chicago, I understand that; but we need not be Phoenix or San Antonio, either.  I’ve never bought into your (and too many others) mindset that Cleveland needs more freeways to be attractive.  You’re from East Cleveland, one of the few burbs with direct Rapid service.  Why should you care so much about damn freeways? 

 

Do you want Cleveland to become Detroit--a sprawling city that freeways have cut up neighborhoods in and sucked the live blood from these hoods leaving, more than any place I’ve seen, miles upon miles of vacant, weed-covered lots?  I really don’t buy your mentality on this score at all…

 

Master, I do agree with you that there’s a Chicken Little mentality among developers here that stymies retail and other development downtown.  Add to that, our politicians have not been known for the creativity, cooperation or aggressiveness needed to attract business.  The new Medical Merchandize Mart may signal a new day, however.  It’s the kind of Big Idea and bold move we need.    About Cleveland schools attracting people, I don’t put much stock in this.  As long as Republicans run this country, and they do so even when Democrats run Congress and the White House, funding and problems for big city schools (including Chicago) aren’t changing anytime soon – it stinks, absolutely, but what are you going to do?

 

This is going to be long.

 

clvlndr-Downtown doesn't need any more freeways and I never said it did. Never! My comment about the absence of a freeway with a direct route to downtown, from East Cleveland, was in response to someones comment on how accessible downtown is to outlying communities. I found this frustrating at times and I have heard others say the same thing. I also said that I didn't think we should try to build one. It will never happen anyway. The point being; your fixation on me wanting more highways is mind blowing, because I have never even implied that.

 

Also, unless my car was broken down, I would never leave it parked, in the middle of winter, to stand in the cold waiting for the number 6 to the rapid and go downtown to shop when I could just drive down there and be able to go anywhere else from there. I also wouldn't have to carry my shopping bags on the bus. Not even with today's gas prices would I do that. It is an unnecessary inconvenience because this is Cleveland, not Chicago or New York. 

 

I can't believe you don't see the correlation between good schools and a successful economy. And I can't believe you think Republicans rule the world. Wow! (I won't even comment on that)

 

One of the key things that decision makers take into consideration when deciding where to locate a business is the quality of the schools their children will be attending. In the future, the quality of our youth's education will determine the quality of our work force, which is another big consideration. If Cleveland had the most educated high school and college graduates in the country or the world, businesses would almost be forced to locate in Cleveland, because that is where the talent would be and that is where the highly paid people with disposable income would be. Better education leads to less crime, higher wages and more consumer spending. I could go on and on... I applaud Akron for committing to education with the new Learning Centers, which are replacing most all elementary and secondary schools. This was an investment that ordinary people feel and it makes people feel like their government is working for the people.

 

Finally, I never said or implied that Twinsburg is better than Cleveland. I'm sure we can point out positives and negatives about both. It depends on how you like to live. But if I'm an investor looking to build this type of development, today, I see nothing but a hard way to go to get it build downtown. And I view downtown as a bigger risk and getting the project done will be a big headache. If I want to build or start a night club, downtown is the place for me. Trying to open a nightclub in Twinsburg would likely be a headache and risky. Cleveland must develop a marketing strategy that destroys that perception. Until the city becomes more proactive at changing that perception, investors will continue to ignore downtown for these types of development. Sometimes you don't just sit there, you have to do something.    :lol:

clvlndr and others - knock it off with the insults and get back on topic.

 

Cleveland must develop a marketing strategy that destroys that perception. Until the city becomes more proactive at changing that perception, investors will continue to ignore downtown for these types of development. Sometimes you don't just sit there, you have to do something.    :lol:

 

I can agree with the bold portion of your statement, however, not having been privy to any development plans you - being in the industry - cannot make blanket statements like that. :wink:

 

I think now that the ECP is winding down, we will begin to see actual development on the Avenue.  And development intrest on Carnegie and Chester.  You don't spend that kind of money and not do a thing, ESPECIALLY since the ECP is more than just about building a dedicated bus lane.

Chicago is the nation's 3rd largest city and the 4th biggest economy in the world. There are nearly 3 million living downtown alone, more than Cleveland and the surrounding suburbs.

 

I'm staying out of the debate but I would just like to point out that the entire population of Chicago is just over 2.8 million people.

 

 

Cleveland must develop a marketing strategy that destroys that perception. Until the city becomes more proactive at changing that perception, investors will continue to ignore downtown for these types of development. Sometimes you don't just sit there, you have to do something.    :lol:

 

I can agree with the bold portion of your statement, however, not having been privy to any development plans you - being in the industry - cannot make blanket statements like that. :wink:

 

I think now that the ECP is winding down, we will begin to see actual development on the Avenue.  And development intrest on Carnegie and Chester.  You don't spin that kind of money and not do a thing, ESPECIALLY since the ECP is more than just about building a dedicated bus lane.

 

The seemingly blanket statement was not intended in that way. In fact; I think this project may and hopefully will help to destroy some of these prementioned perceptions. There should be plenty of preexisting retail space available, increased residency and increased foot traffic. Definitely good access via mass transit. I, just like you, am very hopefull. I am still a little concerned about parking. Investors in retail will have to be convinced that there will be enough Residency, Foot Patrons and Mass Transit Customers to offset the shortage of nearby and inexpensive parking. One or two success stories could light the fire. Let's hope the "You go first" attitudes don't prevail.

 

 

 

 

Isn't the Glimcher Co, listed in the article the company that gave us Polaris Fashion Place north of Columbus?  They appear to be doing some sort of "Lifestyle" extension in what was the old Kaufmanns (later Macy's)?  Perhaps that is what they intend for Twinsburg.  I have noticed a number of projects slated for northern Summit county, none of which is going anywhere fast, so I am keeping my credit cards on ice for now. 

I bet it will be a bunch of crappy stores already in existence in ne ohio.  yawn!

Chicago has 3 million people downtown??

 

LOL, what?  Maybe in Cook County but downtown??????

My mistake, thanks for catching that. I stand corrected.

Theres how many malls in summit county. 3 with one being abandoned. All of which are mainly in or near by Akron. Correct me if I'm wrong but I would drive up to Twinsburg for a multi-level high end retail mall. Something of sorts of Kenwood Towne Center in Cincinnati. that would be nice.

:roll: "Nice."

 

Sustainable, no. Exacerbating sprawl in a region with a stagnant population? Yep! Adding to poor air quality by removing dozens of acres of healthy trees? H#ll yeah! Being harmful to the environment by building un-needed new retail space that's totally auto-centric in a day and age when fuel prices are at an all time high, with construction materials that will no doubt be shipped in from China? And you think this is "nice"?

 

Hudson has their lifestyle center and other unique shops.  Everyone knows Macedonia is already packed with retail.  They just built a large new building called "great escape" in macedonia to compete with litehouse i guess..  Who in this area is underserved by a lack of retail opportunities close at hand?  Because developers still wish to add 3-4 giant new retail/office complexes alongside rt. 8 going into Boston Heights..

 

Heinen's and Chico's is hardly "unique".  What is your defintion of "unique retail"?

 

FYI, Hudson does have some (fairly) unique shops.  For example, Nicky Nicole's is a store for young girls and is the only one of its kind. Also, "Jake's Good Life", "Huggy's Nuts and Chocolate's), not to mention many stores along Main Street. There are more, I just can't remember off the top of my head.

 

Chicago has 3 million people downtown??

 

LOL, what?  Maybe in Cook County but downtown??????

 

cook co has 5.2 mil ppl

by saying nice.. I mean having someplace in the county that is decent to spend a few hours shopping then to eat out without having to drive miles apart. I'm extremely glad to see Bravo at Summit Mall now.. always went to Bravo in West Chester when I lived in cinci.

^this is going to sound snobbish, but in northeast ohio, with the abundance of italian restaurants, i'd never choose to eat chain italian.  i'm not an akron person, but there have to be more authentic restaurants than bravo in summit county, luigi's, mayhaps.  if you ask me, non-chains will give you better food, bigger portions, and at better prices. 

 

sorry this is veering OT

^I was feeling the same way...  Altho, I've had Bravo when I worked in Dayton and its good.  He's not from the area so here goes: Papa Joes in the Valley,  Vaccaro's Tratoria on Ghent rd., and Rizzi's in Copley.  Thats three different directions you might be coming from...

 

I don't care about this project as long as its kept at a smaller scale.  It has better than average shopping.. No Walmarts, Meijers, or anything thats 5 minutes down the road in Macedonia or 5 the other way in Streetsboro.  That should be a challenge...

That didn't sound snobbish to me, I always say the same thing (and especially about Italian food).  I guess that probably makes me a snob, too. :)

 

EDIT: Bravo is horrible Italian food in my book.  The sauce tastes like something out of a can (I'm a red sauce snob, yes) and the prices are outrageous for fairly bland food.  The only thing it beats out is Olive Garden (the McDonald's of Italian food).

 

EDIT FOR ON TOPIC PURPOSES: I hope that this doesn't get built for the simple reason that it will simply put out of business stores already in existence closer to the city, further pushing retail options out into farmland unnecessarily.  Of course, if it has chain restaurants like Bravo, it'll be a cold day in Hell before I eat there.

^yeah if i really wanted to sound snobbish i would have said 'chain italian is so below me,' or 'i'm deeply offended by the thought of chain italian.' 

 

and no, i don't like bravo.  the only time i was there was once this summer because i won a gift certificate in a raffle.  the eggplant parmesan was a disappointing 2 slices. 

 

and to get back on topic, if this gets built, who knows, it might be the only indoor mall completed in the US in its year. 

There is always CICI's pizza in Streetsboro for fine Italian!   LOL

 

I am waiting for the details prior to judging the development.

 

Im with ya that the non italian chains give have better, more fresh food.. I just like to see some chain places come into the immediate Akron Area. The national chain places to eat are generally fast food in Akron. I'd like to see a PF Changs in the new development or even a Bucca de Beppo..

 

 

BTW.. Cici's is nasty.. thats one pizza I cannot eat even if it is all-u-can-eat.

BTW.. Cici's is nasty.. thats one pizza I cannot eat even if it is all-u-can-eat.

 

Take it easy on Cici's. I can't eat cheese and they never look at me like I'm crazy when I order a cheeseless pizza. And I like their salad bar.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?category=framelink&link=www.ohio.com%2fnews%2ftop_stories%2f25495699.html&oas=www.ohio.com_news_top_stories_25495699.html

 

Twinsburg development hits snag  (From Ohio.com via Crains)

Homeowner not selling to make way for $100 million Fashion Place project

By Rick Armon

Beacon Journal staff writer

Published on Wednesday, Jul 16, 2008

 

TWINSBURG TWP.: South Park Road, a small street once sprinkled with homes, today is a mix of trees and overgrown fields.

 

Except for one well-kept house — a bi-level with a neatly manicured lawn and colorful flowers outside.

 

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