July 9, 201014 yr I think the presence of the streetcar and potentially light rail in that area is great, and the fact that the streetcar runs by Government Square IS important. Still, the people who take the bus to downtown want to be put at the most central place possible. It may not matter a whole lot for those bus routes that take a north-south routing through downtown, but the person taking an east-west bus who needs to get to the County Courthouse, City Hall, or anything up near Court Street, Central Parkway, etc., would certainly balk at an extra 2+ blocks, especially for the morning walk up the hill between 3rd and 4th Streets. Ha, makes you appreciate the term "New York Minute" everyone there knows how to walk fast. Shoot, in 30 or so years we might adopt a "Cincinnati Minute" saying.
July 9, 201014 yr Is there a thread for Government Square somewhere? If not I can make one. Let's not get too off topic!
July 10, 201014 yr Looking at the aerial renderings posted in the Banks thread, you can see that capping FWW would make downtown even more impressive.
July 10, 201014 yr Is there a thread for Government Square somewhere? If not I can make one. Let's not get too off topic! Yes there is a Government Square thread somewhere. It might be in Completed Projects & Construction though...not sure off the top of my head.
July 25, 201014 yr Will the cap look like this? http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=Duisburg,+Germany&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Duisburg,+North+Rhine-Westphalia,+Germany&gl=us&ei=w-ZLTOiSPIH68AbRgvg0&ved=0CEAQ8gEwBg&ll=51.435144,6.808631&spn=0.000706,0.002064&t=h&z=20
July 25, 201014 yr "In 1998, construction began on the approximately 1.25-mile stretch of highway. Originally, the plan included burying the stretch of highway completely in order to hide the highway eyesore from the remainder of downtown. However, that idea was overturned in 1996 because many people wanted to ensure that visitors to the city would be able to see it as they traveled through. New plans were completed and construction began." WTF?
July 26, 201014 yr Well, it is a really pretty drive now that I think about it. Cincy first appears as you come down the cut in the hill, and then 2 minutes later (traffic depending) you're cruising right beneath it, with the skyline towering above you. There's a book titled "Zoomscape" that talks about that very experience and how much of an impact it has on our spatial awareness and memory of a place.
July 26, 201014 yr Unless you're a passenger or are blissfully staring up out your sunroof, there's not much to appreciate once you're in the trench. I'm more impressed by the design of the trench itself than anything else. The impact is in the approaches to downtown, not the dubious view once you're already there.
July 26, 201014 yr City planners didn't know what they were doing and thought that they did. Happens in every city.
July 27, 201014 yr Unless you're a passenger or are blissfully staring up out your sunroof, there's not much to appreciate once you're in the trench. I'm more impressed by the design of the trench itself than anything else. The impact is in the approaches to downtown, not the dubious view once you're already there. The trench experience could be much worse too. The bridges are quite nice and the lighting is not bad.
August 10, 201014 yr http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=Petueltunnel,+80807+M%C3%BCnchen,+Bayern,+Germany&sll=48.177369,11.584176&sspn=0.002561,0.004823&gl=us&ie=UTF8&cd=2&geocode=FeUh3wIdusGwAA&split=0&hq=&hnear=Petueltunnel,+80807+M%C3%BCnchen,+Bayern,+Germany&ll=48.177634,11.583935&spn=0.002561,0.004823&t=k&z=18 here is another example of a capped highway here in germany i used to live by. if you scroll to the left, what looks like streets there are actually bike paths. the park as well has a canal that runs through it. the street there was actually pretty busy and loud as it is the on/off to a rather busy highway...but while in the park you can't hear it at all. a cap would as well probably make a world of a difference for those apartments at the banks.
August 10, 201014 yr ^ that certainly looks like a hot mess placed in the back of the freezer, Cincinnatus. I'm all for monuments of our famed sports history taking up that space.
August 10, 201014 yr Yeah, Cincinnati (all Ohio cities) need more nice statues/monuments. What about Hamilton!?
August 10, 201014 yr Yeah, Cincinnati (all Ohio cities) need more nice statues/monuments. What about Hamilton!? Hamilton knows what's up: http://www.cityofsculpture.org/sculpture.html
August 16, 201014 yr How to connect the Banks to downtown Cincinnati Business Courier of Cincinnati - by Lucy May Courier senior staff reporter The city of Cincinnati is studying ways to strengthen the connection between the Banks riverfront development and the southern edge of downtown to make it easier for pedestrians to get to the development from downtown. Among the ideas are acoustic panels to buffer the sound from Fort Washington Way and wider sidewalks. To get from Third Street to the development, pedestrians must cross over sidewalks that span the Fort Washington Way expressway. In a letter to the Joint Banks Steering Committee, developer Trent Germano suggested several ways to make that crossing a bit easier. cont. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
August 16, 201014 yr Yea, I was surprised that wasn't mentioned. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
August 16, 201014 yr The east-west sidewalks north of 2nd street are horrendous. They eventually need to do something with that.
August 16, 201014 yr Agreed. Little to no maintenance has been done, it's very narrow in areas, and the bricks are very uneven.. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
August 17, 201014 yr ^streetcar Yea, I was surprised that wasn't mentioned. I was just happy to see light rail mentioned in that article.
August 17, 201014 yr I've always thought form an aesthetic standpoint there are one too many lanes on both Second and Third. Narrowing each by one lane could make a big difference, however street trees near the curb might not be a possibility due to the Transit Center beneath 2nd and
August 17, 201014 yr ^ you could do some above ground planters to create a barrier between the sidewalk and the street.
August 17, 201014 yr It appears that I was abducted by aliens halfway through that last post. I'm back now.
August 20, 201014 yr It appears that I was abducted by aliens halfway through that last post. I'm back now. Stewie - Say Whaaaaaaat?
September 30, 201014 yr Hey, check this out: Casino to pay for streetcars By Jane Prendergast [email protected] September 30, 2010 Other priorities were approved without showing up on a public agenda and without public input: 25 percent to streetcar operations, 14 percent to city facilities, 10 percent for decks over Fort Washington Way and 1 percent for outdoor sculptures.
September 30, 201014 yr ^ I noticed that too. The Enquirer article was too busy physco-analyizing the Mayor to realize that there was pretty significant news about the FWW decks that came out of the meeting yesterday.
September 30, 201014 yr I have to say that this is a pretty good use of these funds. The Port needs to be funded, and it is to be expected that the percentage of funds it gets will go on in perpetuity. Second, the funds for streetcar operations should be temporary. Obviously the economic development (and therefore tax gains) from the streetcar won't be realized immediately, so this expense makes sense. However, the City administration should really try and move the operating costs from general revenues to revenues that stem directly from the economic development area around the streetcar. While I fully believe the Streetcar to be the best project the City has undertaken in decades, ultimately a certain amount of justice requires that the areas that benefits most contribute most. Third, the caps are a great value add to that area, and are obviously a limited expense. I think it might be a good idea for the City to consider this percentage of funds to be a consistent set aside for capital projects like the caps. After the caps are done, they can move onto other projects. Let's hope the outdoor sculptures look cool.
September 30, 201014 yr I have to say that this is a pretty good use of these funds. The Port needs to be funded, and it is to be expected that the percentage of funds it gets will go on in perpetuity. Second, the funds for streetcar operations should be temporary. Obviously the economic development (and therefore tax gains) from the streetcar won't be realized immediately, so this expense makes sense. However, the City administration should really try and move the operating costs from general revenues to revenues that stem directly from the economic development area around the streetcar. While I fully believe the Streetcar to be the best project the City has undertaken in decades, ultimately a certain amount of justice requires that the areas that benefits most contribute most. You could also look at the streetcar funding from the casino as a way to reward the neighborhoods directly around the casino with something they want and will benefit from for having to deal with the negative externalities produced by the casino
September 30, 201014 yr ^That's a good point, though most of the chatter about the Casino struck me as being that it will materially benefit the neighborhoods in the vicinity, at the in the sense it will benefit the property owners and certain businesses, which isn't necessarily the same thing as "the neighborhood."
September 30, 201014 yr ^That's a good point, though most of the chatter about the Casino struck me as being that it will materially benefit the neighborhoods in the vicinity, at the in the sense it will benefit the property owners and certain businesses, which isn't necessarily the same thing as "the neighborhood." The mayor has said that after the streetcar, FWW caps are his next infrastructure priority. BlackBengal was right, the Enquirer completely missed that and preferred to focus on the nitty gritty details of the relationships and discussions between council-members. They sure love to hate the mayor (and the city overall). I also enjoyed the, 'he met with democrats and other groups of council members'. They could have said republicans, the independent or the chartierite, (there are only a few of them!) but that's less politically charged...
September 30, 201014 yr >it will materially benefit the neighborhoods in the vicinity, Funny how people were/are cool with OTR being boosted by economic activity generated by the Broadway Commons stadium and the casino, but not the streetcar.
September 30, 201014 yr ^ City council has 3 Democrats 3 Republicans 2 Charterites 1 Independent Oh I know- I go to council meetings from time to time. Technically its 3 dems 1 dem/charterite, 1 charterite, 1 independent and 3 repubs, but ya. Either way- To say 'met with the democrats and others' could have very easily specified what others. ie., Berding, Bortz, Winburn, etc. Instead it has a decidedly partisan slant to it.
September 30, 201014 yr ^ City council has 3 Democrats 3 Republicans 2 Charterites 1 Independent Oh I know- I go to council meetings from time to time. Technically its 3 dems 1 dem/charterite, 1 charterite, 1 independent and 3 repubs, but ya. Either way- To say 'met with the democrats and others' could have very easily specified what others. ie., Berding, Bortz, Winburn, etc. Instead it has a decidedly partisan slant to it. Although I could be reading way too far into it... haha
September 30, 201014 yr It's also interesting to note that Thomas, one of only three Democrats, seems to be the most vocally opposed to the mayor's methods. That's a pretty strong blow to the partisan framework the Enquirer was trying to portray.
October 1, 201014 yr Lincoln: more likely Thomas is positioning himself for a future campaign for higher office. One with ad like: "When on city council Thomas publicly opposed the back-room methods of Mayor Mallory... Thomas for transparency, Thomas for order." Or some BS Back on topic its great to hear about the CAPS. 10% is roughly 2M/year, but the 2M/year is more important as a matching fund balance when applying for grants and hopefully would put us in better standing for future applications.
October 1, 201014 yr Maybe jmecklenborg can sort this one out: Is the 46M-50M that is generally quoted on the project for all 4 caps (2 fulls and 2 partials)? In that case is it realistic to say that with this funding, even without grants, we could have at least 1 cap in place in 6-7 years?
October 2, 201014 yr So Thomas' concerns are purely self-serving? Has any at the city described what the caps would accomplish? Ie parks, buildings etc?
October 2, 201014 yr So Thomas' concerns are purely self-serving? Has any at the city described what the caps would accomplish? Ie parks, buildings etc? I hope the sculpture funding is a hint, but at this point there aren't even solid plans to do the capping. Once that becomes closer to reality, I'd guess there will be more talk about what to do with them. If a developer comes forward with plans for buildings, I have a feeling the city would be receptive to the idea. I don't think the city will itself be building commercial, office, or residential space, however. How cool would it be to have big sculptures which make up the front of the skyline, as viewed from across the river? (Assuming the sculptures are tasteful, which may be a big assumption...especially if put up to public vote.)
October 3, 201014 yr How cool would it be to have big sculptures which make up the front of the skyline, as viewed from across the river? (Assuming the sculptures are tasteful, which may be a big assumption...especially if put up to public vote.) yea that's a big If. But some tasteful sculptures would be great
October 4, 201014 yr Lincoln: more likely Thomas is positioning himself for a future campaign for higher office. One with ad like: "When on city council Thomas publicly opposed the back-room methods of Mayor Mallory... Thomas for transparency, Thomas for order." Or some BS I like Thomas a lot - one of the best on council from my perspective. I really doubt it was anything like what you suggest.
October 4, 201014 yr ^I've met Mr. Thomas, I too liked him. I was just reacting to what his position seemed to represent and where it seemed to be leading given his previous ambitions. (I'm probably also jaded by the current election cycle) On the CAPS I am of the opinion that at least 50% should be buildings. I am against the idea of sculptures- Pershing Square in LA used to sit right outside of my office and it was basically just a sculpture in a greenspace created for aerial viewing... basically it sucked walking past during lunch and was wasted space (not earning tax revenue or being used for active recreation). As far as skyline contributing sculptures... the hotel at The Banks is 8-9 stories in the renderings, and they do not reach the air-rights zoning for The Banks which I believe was around 150ish so a 200+ foot sculpture would be needed to be seen from the river view which is referred to. (depending on the sculpture those point loads might be in excess of the 4 story dead load able to be carried by the CAP) IMO there are more attractive views of the CBD.
October 4, 201014 yr Back on topic its great to hear about the CAPS. 10% is roughly 2M/year, but the 2M/year is more important as a matching fund balance when applying for grants and hopefully would put us in better standing for future applications. Agreed- I think both the Streetcar vote and the Caps vote is to increase our standing for future grants, etc. The mayor has said he wants to push the caps much more now that the Streetcar is going to be built. I'm pretty sure I read that the caps could support 4-5 story buildings at max. so if they can do 4, one that is park like, and 3 that are smaller buildings could be reasonable. I highly doubt they would put condos or anything above the so this is probably going to be retail/commercial. Should be interesting-
Create an account or sign in to comment