Here’s a thread for Gay Pride Month. 

 

 

Rather than do pix of pride events (which I’ve done before and can be found somewhere here at UO) here’s a look at some gay history.

 

Before Gay Bars

I don’t know if there were saloons or halls that catered to gays back before prohibition, but I do know that in the police records there was one or two arrests per year for ‘impersonating a female”.  Unfortunately the records don’t list particulars for those cases.

 

I do suspect, and this is just speculation, that the levee was a place of assignation, a cruising spot.  I say this because the levee was the cruising spot in modern times, but not actually on the levee, which makes me think that this is a name carried down from an earlier location that’s long gone.

 

Perhaps this location

 

 

…which appears in the New Dayton Illustrated

 

This would be the levee wrapping around downtown from Wilkinson Street to the west and south. 

 

Outdoor cruising spots have been pretty common in gay history: famous ones were Hempstead Heath in London, the Siegesaule in the Berlin Tiergarten, and the square in front of the Bolshoi Theatre in Moscow.  For the US it used to be ‘the rocks” on Lake Michigan and Bughouse Square in Chicago and Pershing Square in LA. 

 

In Ohio gay writer Edmund White mentions Fountain Square in its original version a gay cruising spot and pick-up place.

 

For Dayton perhaps this place, which might have been more a meeting place rather than a sex space.

 

 

Another thing that leads me to think this was the orginal Levee is that nearby Robert Boulevard was a place of residence for gay men.  Older gay men tell me their first sexual encounters were sometimes in these old houses, by then turned into apartments

 

 

Another cruising spot was Cooper Park.  The place appeared in a collection of coming-out stories, where one of his authors mentioned his first encounter was arranged here, with a local educator (either a principle or school board member).  The landscaping in these pix is somewhat sparse, but by the 1920s and 0s it was probably much more lush

 

 

 

This place might have been equivilant to Bughouse Square and Pershing Square as it (and the levee) was in an area of rooming houses and small apartments and cheap hotels, the other side of downtown Dayton.

 

Unattached men of whatever sexual orientation where considered deviant, as discussed in Todd DePastino’s “Citizen Hobo (which discusses the moralistic tut-tutting about “Hotel Society” as well as the intinerant world).  The book also has a section on “Hobosexuality”, discussing how this single society gave some cover for homosexuals. 

 

A collection of character studies on Chicagos’ “Hobohemia” mentions gay, transvestite and lesbian establishments as part of Chicago’s Tower Town, near Bughouse Square.

 

One can also see the SRO/roomer world as the gay habitat in John Rechy’s City of Night, recounting his days as an itinerant hustler.

 

For Dayton, the 1933 housing study helpfully identifies Dayton’s “Rooming House District” as the “1st Ward”’ AKA downtown and environs.  Perhaps Dayton’s first gayborhood (though it was shared by a lot of other folks).

 

 

What’s remarkable about this map is the concentrations, not mention it may not be counting one room and studio apartments, which would up the single population even further.

 

A close-up with some references.  Note, though, that a lot of these roomers were single woman, as there was a big rooming house or hotel for single Catholic country girls come to work in the city, in that quadrant northwest of Main Street.

 

 

But there were a lot of apartments and perhaps residential hotels downtown.  The most famous was the Arcade, but there were others, like these two on the Courthouse Square block (Atlas Hotel and Ratterman Apartments).

 

 

The Oldest Gay Bar

 

Looking at a map of this block, the buildings are on the lower left hand corner.  And, on this same block was Dayton’s first gay bar, 24 W Second Street.  The Latin Lounge, on the ground floor of a parking garage.

 

 

 

There may have been other post-Prohibition places, but this is the first one old-timers that I’ve talked to remember. 

 

From what I’ve been told this place wasn’t gay until later at night, which would parallel an old-school approach to socializing and meeting.  A bar or restaurant/bar would have a predominantly straight clientele, but as the evening wore on the straight folk would finish up their dinners or drinking and go home, and gays would slowly filter in until the establishment was predominantly gay by late evening and closing.  The old Bungalow Restaurant on Mill Street in downtown Lexington used to operate this way.

 

The Latin Lounge opened in the early 1950s, say 1952 or 53.  In the early 1960s,  say 1961, it changed names to The Stage Door Musical Bar.  “Musical” was an old school coded way of referring to one as gay…as in “He’s musical”.  Old gay slang…the lost language of queens. 

 

The name change happened  after a brutal murder or gay bashing associated with a Latin Lounge pick-up gone wrong.  There was an earlier Stage Door in Dayton, but it was in the Mayfair Burlesque building, and as far as I know has no relation to this name change.

 

The Stage Door remained on 2nd until the early 1970s, when urban renewal demolition for Courthouse Square forced the location to change to Jefferson Street (1973), where it remains today.

 

 

The first bar was the building to the left, with an expansion in the 1980s to the building to the right.  So there are really two buildings and two bars here.  The first, older bar is usually closed, but open on weekends if there is a big crowd or special event.

 

Dayton’s Second Gay Bar

 

The well-remembered but short-lived “Club Tai Tae” (the city directories call it “a cocktail lounge”) shared the second floor of the Victoria with the Schwartz School of Dance.  You can tell where the place was by the porthole windows:

 

 

The odd name was because this was a Korean Karate studio before it became a bar, and I guess the owner decided to keep the name as cover or because it sounded exotic, like a tiki bar. 

 

The place was a piano bar, and the piano player, Harry, was also the doorman at the Stage Door in later years.  When Harry passed his funereal was at the local Metropolitan Community Church (a GLBT-oriented church) and was a sort of landmark event.

 

One can see how this was a fairly circumspect place, up in the shadows above the bright marquee lights of Main Street.

 

 

Yet one has to appreciate the fitting location, in a theatre, given the theatrical and showbiz world’s reputed tolerance of unconventional lifestyles, and not only that, but in a theatre that hosted Oscar Wilde on one of his American tours.

 

The Tai Tae lasted from 1969 to 72 or 73.  It had a small connection with Stonewall, as a participant in Stonewall was passing through and stopped in one night.  When the locals found out about it they bought him a round, which I guess marks that night at the Tai Tae as Dayton’s first gay pride celebration.

 

The Third Oldest Gay Bar

 

This being Dayton building demolition rears its ugly head in any story, and it does here, as The Martinque, Dayton’s third oldest gay bar was torn down, perhaps twice! 

 

The Martinique started out as a cocktail lounge on Salem Avenue, between the bridge and Grand Avenue, opening in 1967.  Presumably it served the singles who were living in the new apartments buildings in Grafton Hill. 

 

There was an ownership change in 1970 or 71, and after that the place turned gay.  Eventually it became Dayton’s lesbian bar (the first?) until being closed and torn down in the early 1990s.  It was in a converted old house when I moved here, but I am not sure if that was the original location.

 

One could do a pretty big timeline considering all the bars that have come and gone in since these three.  But what would be even more interesting is what happened inside…personages, characters, drag queen divas, shows, etc.  Plus the institutional and political history outside the bars.

 

Visiting Dayton’s Oldest. 

 

1953 to 2008 as a drinking establishment, under two names and at two locations, and 1973 to 2008 at the same location. 

 

 

 

 

 

And something theatrical or show biz, in the older part, as befits the bar name

 

 

Thanks Jeffrey. Very interesting.

Thanks Jeffrey. Very interesting.

Ditto!

This thread was totally unexpected. Very indepth as usual!

simply fascinating, Geoffrey

Thanks!

Believe it or not, even though"officialy" Ohio is that that freindly to the GLBT community, the historical society is actually doing gay history!

 

Check out GOHI....neat stuff (and maybe this thread header isn't that "out there" if the Ohio Historical Society is doing local gay history too).

 

 

Saw this on one of my walks around Dayton. It looked closed, and looked like it had been for a while, from the debris in the entryway:

 

Back in the day (late 60s - early 70s) all Fort Wayne had for gay bars was the shadowy hotel cocktail lounge scene where out-of-town married businessmen went looking for a little action. The lounge at the Van Orman Hotel was probably the best-known place, and the hotel's Java Shop was where all the hustlers and underage flaming sissies hung out. There was some spillover to Johnny's Nitecap, a rather nice, cozy jazz bar next door with a genuine good-guy bartender. When I was new in town, I could always count on him for a heads-up if someone was to be avoided.

 

Henry's was always pretty much as it is now, very mixed with a visible gay presence (theatre crowd, you know :wink: :wink:). It's bigger and busier and more crowded now, with live music some nights, and less cruisy than it used to be. The food is good, and it's more a place to go with friends for dinner and drinks.

 

For lack of a real gay bar back then, with dancing 'n everything, it was common for a carload or two of Fort Wayne folks to head for Toledo on a Saturday night; the Scenic Bar (Monroe and Erie, if I remember correctly) was the usual destination. It was a fun, friendly place back then. The Club Baths were in the basement of the Milner Hotel, not far away. The cops used to watch the Scenic in hopes of busting anybody they could for any reason they could think of, and they used to put underage hustler decoys on the street for entrapment.

 

Those were the good old days. :|

In re Robs pix, DJs was a mid/late 1990s-era gay bar, starting out as a "western" bar but then changing (and changing owners).  I've posted a few pix on this board from the patio of that bar since it had a great view of the downtown skyline.

 

There used to be a straight cocktail lounge there years ago, according to the city directories.  No connection between the two.

 

What happened is that the property was bought, along with others on that block, and the structure torn down for the new Caresource parking garage (Caresources' office building is going up across the street).

 

The owners (who are a gay couple) transferred the liscense to a new location and changed the name to MJs.  The pix w. the rainbow flag at the start of the thread header was taken from their new patio.

 

@@@

 

There was some spillover to Johnny's Nitecap, a rather nice, cozy jazz bar next door with a genuine good-guy bartender. When I was new in town, I could always count on him for a heads-up if someone was to be avoided.

 

This place sounds interesting....the way you describe this and the others seem like out of a movie.  I've read about hotel lounges as a place to make connections..I think this was happening in other places, too.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nice, informative thread. 

 

My very first gay bar which was also really my first gay "experience" of any type was The Stage Door. Ah, memories.

Very interesting thread, especially due to the fact that it's Dayton, where you wouldn't think about there being anything gay over there.

Very interesting thread, especially due to the fact that it's Dayton, where you wouldn't think about there being anything gay over there.

 

Really? I didn't know it was that taboo ...

Very interesting thread, especially due to the fact that it's Dayton, where you wouldn't think about there being anything gay over there.

 

Uh...didn't Dayton just receive the "honor" of having the best gay club in Ohio?

Really? I didn't know it was that taboo ...

 

Dayton is a lot more closeted than Columbus, thus less visibility.  There is also the size issue.

 

 

There are several smaller cities that don't exactly evoke the adjective "gay", but I'm also sure they have interesting histories such as local ones like Toledo and Akron.

just a guess but it seems to me that of the three ohio red-headed stepchildren cities, dayton seems a little more well known for the gay binnis than toledo or akron are. but reality is they are probably all are about the same give or take a disco.

By the time the really popular gay clubs came along, I had pretty much given up on the bar scene. All I really wanted was a solid, true-blue boyfriend, and it took me far too long to figure out that I wasn't going to find him hanging out in a smoky, noisy dump full of drunks or a shadowy, stuffy hotel lounge frequented by closeted married men out of town on business and looking for some forbidden fruit (I've never been very good at being fruity, either).  :-D

 

Obviously, I still haven't figured out where he is hanging out.  :roll:

By the time the really popular gay clubs came along, I had pretty much given up on the bar scene. All I really wanted was a solid, true-blue boyfriend, and it took me far too long to figure out that I wasn't going to find him hanging out in a smoky, noisy dump full of drunks or a shadowy, stuffy hotel lounge frequented by closeted married men out of town on business and looking for some forbidden fruit (I've never been very good at being fruity, either). :-D

 

Obviously, I still haven't figured out where he is hanging out. :roll:

 

Oh sweetie, I feel your pain. 

just a guess but it seems to me that of the three ohio red-headed stepchildren cities, dayton seems a little more well known for the gay binnis than toledo or akron are. but reality is they are probably all are about the same give or take a disco.

 

That's kind of what I assumed too, that's why I asked.

 

I'm not gay, so I can't really comment from experience, but I've heard different stories and comments here and there that led me to believe that it isn't as taboo as Columbusite is making it sound ... but I don't know.

 

 

 

Hilariously, there is an article on the DMM Forum about this matter posted by PrfctTimeOfDay:

 

OUT Magazine Writer & Dayton

 

The Red State

Lastnight I went to a benefit on top of the firefly building in Dayton where the Rubi Girls performed. I was invited by the director of the film festival here, Jonathan, who last night transformed into the fabulous drag queen Ileasa Plymouth (!)

 

The Rubi Girls are a drag troupe who have been performing since the late 80's. They're famous for not only putting on a great show...but doing it all for charity. They've raised tons of money for various charities, and a lot for HIV/Aids. Not only that, the whole region has come to love them. A region in red state Ohio.

 

Besides wanting to support smaller town gay film festivals, I particularly wanted to visit Ohio. After the 2004 election loss, Ohio has become the poster boy red state. I wanted to come here and make peace with it.

 

I've met several people in Dayton who did everything they could back in 2004. They went to their neighbors, they made cold calls to try and sway the vote. One man told me that he was cold calling voters, and knew that Ohio was lost when every other person he spoke with said they were voting for Bush because, if not, gay marriage may come to pass.

 

I just love it when people base their vote on an issue that is not going to affect them at all. Things may be different if the gays weren't pushing for marriage at election time, but I say there is never a wrong time to do the right thing. And after seeing the Rubi Girls, and speaking with people who actually took action to try and change things, I see that it's much too easy for me to sit in Manhattan and shake my head at Ohio. In other words, these people are part of the solution.

 

 

One Night in Ohio

The after-party for A Four Letter Word was held at this massive 3 floored gay disco called Masque. They have hot boys, fun attitude, and an overall excellent scene in Dayton (yes, Dayton, Ohio!)

 

Our host Tippy (a man) generously set us up in a VIP tent, and supplied endless vodka redbulls (which apparently make me hungry: see last post) and discussed his latest venture with the club.

 

Tippy and Masque have begun a popular business of printing t-shirts with sexually explicit slogans like "I'd rather be masturbating." I suggested they make a one that says "It's not gonna suck itself" but Tippy tells me they've got to remember the lesbians.

 

Fair is fair, one must stick with gender neutral sexually explicit slogans. Next up: "Save a horse, ride my face!"

 

And just when you thought it couldn't get any gayer...it does. "Your name is Tippy? As in Hedren?" someone asks, and Tippy says. "No, it's Tippy as in toes."

 

Late in the night Tippy (as in toes) delivers me into the arms of a large drag queen named Montana (how apt) who pulled me up onto stage, introduced me, and offered a poster (that I signed) to anyone in the crowd who was willing to come onstage and get stark naked. Immediately, some guy comes on stage and proceeds to get stark naked. "I want the socks gone, too!" screams Montana, and only then will she give him the poster. A poster!

 

By this time, I'm in the mood for more nudity. I offer a free copy of You Can Run for the next person that gets naked. It doesn't take a second and we have another hot nude midwesterner. What a willing crowd. I'm staying in Ohio longer.

 

Ive also decided that all my future publicity should involve naked people. I want people to associate me with getting people undressed. I want 'em thinking: Jesse Archer = You Can Strip.

 

 

Get that Candy!

I can't tell you what fun I had at Club Masque in Dayton. Here I am beating some innocent stiletto with my belt. I thought it was a pinata.

 

 

It held tenaciously to the ceiling.

 

 

So, I attacked it with a pool cue.

The bartender called me over, and I thought -damn, I'm getting kicked out!--but he just offered me a shot of jager. I could live in Dayton.

 

Despite my best efforts, that stiletto never tore open, no candy ever tumbled out. How hungry was I?

 

Next thing I know, I woke up next to the remnants of Wendys happy meal. This is pretty horrible, but admittedly, it's better than waking up next to Wendy herself.

 

Sex in the Midwest City!

Speaking of charitable institutions, here's a recent clip from the Rubi Girls.

 

The Rubi Girls are a group of friends in Dayton, Ohio -- who formed a drag troupe that puts on shows for charity. So far they've raised over $200,000 to combat HIV/AIDS. I had the great opportunity to see them perform in Dayton and have blogged about them. They are also going to be featured in my next Out magazine column.

 

Here the Rubi Girls spoof Sex and the City. This video was used to augment a recent live performance. If you've seen the Sex & the City movie, you'll get the second part. But if you haven't, the first 49 second opening credits will definitely have you rolling.

 

Carrie Bradshaw is drag queen Ilseasa Plymouth, and New York City has been replaced with the hot-spots of downtown Dayton, Ohio....

 

http://jesseonthebrink.com/

Out is one of those gay lifestyle mags that came out in the 1990s (though I think they were more newsy back when they started), and yeah it's a hoot reading this guy name checking Dayton in his column or blog.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and now we have Masque. Dayton does not deserve a club this nice! haha.

 

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name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="

type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Dayton deserves everything it gets, good and bad.

"Lastnight I went to a benefit on top of the firefly building in Dayton where the Rubi Girls performed. I was invited by the director of the film festival here, Jonathan, who last night transformed into the fabulous drag queen Ileasa Plymouth (!)"

 

Jonathan also hails from Salem, Ohio - he's a year younger than me, and his dad was my geography teacher in junior high. Another one for the "who'da thunk" column.

 

 

Very interesting thread.  LGBT history is so often swept under the rug in our society, and much has been lost.  For many years I volunteered a the LGBT Historical Society of Northern California, and helped maintain the archives.  They have since moved to larger quarters, with an unbelievably rich resource of print material and ephemera of mostly San Francisco related queer history. 

 

That you documented this for Dayton is a real plus.  For larger cities it is pretty much given that an organization will pick up the ball, but our smaller cities and towns are so often left high and dry and have, in my opinion, contributed to history every bit as much, if not more so, than many larger cities. 

 

Columbus has been very fortunate in having a very out population for many years.  It wasn't always so much fun, of course.  The police were abominable in the 70s, as were the politicians.  But as times changed, so did Ohio.  Dayton was considered quite liberal in the 1970s and we headed over there often as an alternative to C'bus and Cincinnati.  Was always fun.  Thanks for the effort you put into the thread!

Damn, Masque looks sweet! Is it a gay club?

Damn, Masque looks sweet! Is it a gay club?

 

Yes, and you are so in luck. The UO Gay Brotherhood has openings and is actively seeking new members to fill them.

 

After you submit an application you'll be scheduled for an interview and aptitude test, and if all goes well and you then pass your initiation, you'll be eligible for all the benefits of membership, including in-house specialized training. Among our faculty members, MayDay teaches Divas 101, Popular Culture and Skin Care, and MTS teaches Interior Design. I teach Tractor Maintenance, Concrete Replacement and Residential Demolition and Reconstruction. The latter course is a prerequisite for the interior design course taught by MTS.

 

In case you're wondering, the Tractor Maintenance is an accomodation for farm lads. We are nothing if not equal-opportunity.

Damn, Masque looks sweet! Is it a gay club?

 

Yes, and you are so in luck. The UO Gay Brotherhood has openings and is actively seeking new members to fill them.

 

After you submit an application you'll be scheduled for an interview and aptitude test, and if all goes well and you then pass your initiation, you'll be eligible for all the benefits of membership, including in-house specialized training. Among our faculty members, MayDay teaches Divas 101, Popular Culture and Skin Care, and MTS teaches Interior Design. I teach Tractor Maintenance, Concrete Replacement and Residential Demolition and Reconstruction. The latter course is a prerequisite for the interior design course taught by MTS.

 

In case you're wondering, the Tractor Maintenance is an accomodation for farm lads. We are nothing if not equal-opportunity.

 

lol ... Ummmm ...

 

I'm as straight as they come, and I can hold my own in skin care, interior design, and Pop culture. ;)

"I'm as straight as they come, and I can hold my own in skin care, interior design, and Pop culture."

 

I'll be the judge of THAT!

 

just a guess but it seems to me that of the three ohio red-headed stepchildren cities, dayton seems a little more well known for the gay binnis than toledo or akron are. but reality is they are probably all are about the same give or take a disco.

 

That's kind of what I assumed too, that's why I asked.

 

I'm not gay, so I can't really comment from experience, but I've heard different stories and comments here and there that led me to believe that it isn't as taboo as Columbusite is making it sound ... but I don't know.

 

 

exactly. that's pretty naive. heck even lorain had a locally well known and long running open gay bar and also a lesbian bar. everyone knew. far as i know the cops left it alone. the only thing i ever heard about them growing up was "you would be surprized who is in there" from people (both were on blocks that were all torn down). so gay bars are not strictly a big city phenomonon by any means.

 

^

The one Lorain had a funny name, or there was some sort of joke or story behind the name.  I recall reading about it.  Small city gay bars are usually a lot of fun for vistors. 

 

Very interesting thread.  LGBT history is so often swept under the rug in our society, and much has been lost.  For many years I volunteered a the LGBT Historical Society of Northern California, and helped maintain the archives.  They have since moved to larger quarters, with an unbelievably rich resource of print material and ephemera of mostly San Francisco related queer history.

 

That you documented this for Dayton is a real plus.  For larger cities it is pretty much given that an organization will pick up the ball, but our smaller cities and towns are so often left high and dry and have, in my opinion, contributed to history every bit as much, if not more so, than many larger citiesp.

 

Thanks I appreciated that!  I was thinking a bit about the gay archives in Louisville, which are now with UofL. 

 

Asking around I never heard of much police action regarding bar harrassement in Dayton (most of the people I talked to came out in the 1970s), but yes, I've heard  Columbus was suprsingly repressive back in the day.  That extended to non-gay political activists too.

 

If you visited Dayton I'd be interested in what bars do you recall here?

 

 

 

 

 

 

..... but yes, I've heard  Columbus was suprsingly repressive back in the day.  That extended to non-gay political activists too.

 

Yes, even into the 80's!

I don't recall the names of the bars in Dayton.  One was on Ludlow.  It's a long time ago....Dayton did have a reputation for being fairly liberal and the police were much more okay than in Columbus.

 

Dealing with Columbus police was impossible.  They were absolutely the most red neck, backwards, knuckle-dragging, condescending, good old boys to be found this side of the Mason Dixon Line.  Routine traffic stops would turn into four car rousts, with guns drawn to issue a ticket for the most minor infraction. Jaywalkers were also routinely taken to jail for walking against the light, especially if they "criminal" was from out of town.  Welcome to the big city!  Police would also harass people eating at after hours restaurants, if the customer appeared to be gay.  Many times I saw gay friends being hauled off to jail, for no reason whatsoever. 

 

Luckily this stopped in the 1980s.  I had already left Columbus by that time.