Cleveland would rank even higher with some direct European (and Asia) flights, and better Hotel options.  I would think the new Convention Center, Casino & maybe even the Aquarium would help as well.  Will be interesting how this list looks in a few years.

 

More hotels are likely, but direct international flights aren't. If anything, we may rank higher with the likes of Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Detroit and other secondary airports because they may lose more international flights in the coming years.

Cleveland would rank even higher with some direct European (and Asia) flights, and better Hotel options.  I would think the new Convention Center, Casino & maybe even the Aquarium would help as well.  Will be interesting how this list looks in a few years.

 

More hotels are likely, but direct international flights aren't. If anything, we may rank higher with the likes of Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Detroit and other secondary airports because they may lose more international flights in the coming years.

I know there are no plans for direct Int'l flights, but I can dream..  Keep hoping that United/Continental reaches the point where they're out of airspace in Newark & Chicago, and/or it gets too costly to operate so heavily out of those two, and we get a bone or two tossed our way..  Direct European flights, more Hotels, along with some of the other projects would nudge Cleveland real close to the next tier with Minneapolis & Seattle.

Understood. I just think it's more likely that Minneapolis will come down to Cleveland's level of international air service than the other way around. Seattle's geographic location probably allows it to keep its overseas air service.

why is it people so over emphasize the importance of east-west europe-asia flights as "international" and under emphasize the north-south canada and central/south america flights?

So maybe someone smarter than me can determine if this world city ranking by the GaWC (Globalization and World Cities) actually means anything. But I always find it interesting how we (Cleveland) is looked upon from outside of the U.S. All I know is that this world city listing has us ranked above Columbus, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Portland, Phoenix, Pittsburgh etc. And anytime we are listed above Pittspuke in anything I sleep much better, just sayin.

 

Here is the link>>>>>>>>>> http://www.lboro.ac.uk/gawc/world2010t.html

 

 

Read more: http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,17033.900.html#ixzz1YmlQDahB

 

It's a specialized list created by a firm in London using a certain set of criteria.  Jacksonville in the same tier as Brazilia and Omaha, Palo Alto, Honolulu, and Nanjing in the same suffiency is a hint on the absurdity.

 

In other words, it means nothing but it's still fun to look at.

 

I think it does okay with the top few tiers.  But yeah, things start looking odd the lower you get on the list.

actually, Cleveland jumping from "high sufficiency" in 2008 to a "beta-" world city ranking in 2010 is a big deal. I didn't see other cities make those kinds of jumps. I don't know whether I'd classify the GaWC rankings as "bull" so I think its worth a little bit of excitement. (not like I am about to throw a party or anything haha)

^ you could also say what appears to be a big leapfrog over 'gamma' like that is another reason to mistrust the list. i dk, but for sure it is nice to see a ranking going in a positive direction!

Is there ever a "City ranking" list that can be objectively verified?  They all involve some level of subjective judgments and, inevitably, bias.

true. even what you might think is straightforward data like say total city population gets muddy when undocumented folks, out of town college and military kids, incarcerated, etc. are in the mix.

I am always surprised at how many "international" passengers there are on the Cleveland-Newark flights. I put "international" in quotes because, while I am hearing many accents and foreign languages on these flights, that doesn't mean they are traveling internationally. But it does mean that someone who is new enough to America has some sort of dealings in Cleveland. I fly to/from Newark every few months or so, and although that's not as often as some folks on this board (MTS?), I think that is just frequent enough to notice changes/trends but not so frequent that you don't notice them. And I am noticing more "international" passengers to Cleveland. That's all I have to say about that......

I am always surprised at how many "international" passengers there are on the Cleveland-Newark flights. I put "international" in quotes because, while I am hearing many accents and foreign languages on these flights, that doesn't mean they are traveling internationally. But it does mean that someone who is new enough to America has some sort of dealings in Cleveland. I fly to/from Newark every few months or so, and although that's not as often as some folks on this board (MTS?), I think that is just frequent enough to notice changes/trends but not so frequent that you don't notice them. And I am noticing more "international" passengers to Cleveland. That's all I have to say about that......

 

I dont use Newark, unless I have to go to Europe from CLE.  I hate Newark.  However, there are a lot of International Passengers on Continental flights.

 

As said before, the main reason CLE hasn't been upgraded is Continental has said they do not want to cannibalize their Newark infrastructure to improve Cleveland when they can just add hourly service between the two city pairs.  Cleveland has strong O&D business travel with the Convention Center opening up and more jobs coming to the region we should see more leisure travel.  Not to mention several international events coming to the city.  They will need to upgrade facilities here to handle the traffic.

 

With CHI and EWR at capacity I cannot see Continental gutting CLE.  Whenever there is a bad storm in EWR, where do they reroute flights?  CLE.  We can handle the aircraft, just not the processing of international passengers.

actually, Cleveland jumping from "high sufficiency" in 2008 to a "beta-" world city ranking in 2010 is a big deal. I didn't see other cities make those kinds of jumps. I don't know whether I'd classify the GaWC rankings as "bull" so I think its worth a little bit of excitement. (not like I am about to throw a party or anything haha)

 

^ you could also say what appears to be a big leapfrog over 'gamma' like that is another reason to mistrust the list. i dk, but for sure it is nice to see a ranking going in a positive direction!

 

I'm fairly certain that over the years GaWC has reworked and refined its categories, so I'm not sure you can really point at the movement of Cleveland from one designation to another as an indication that the study is recognizing progress by Cleveland (or any other city), although it's possible.  Either way, I am still pleased to see Cleveland regarded as a "Beta City," even if it doesn't mean much.

Here's a great article about how dumb (...inaccurate) lists are compiled and why we should give cities that aren't typically on the top 10 lists a better evaluation.

 

Note: This article seems to think cities like London and New York, who miss out on some lists, are the "greatest cities" because of their organic and "dirty" features.  So it's not saying cities like Cleveland or Columbus should be up there -- however it does have some good points about why typical lists are just so dumb! (...inaccurate)

 

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/2/dd9bba18-769c-11e0-bd5d-00144feabdc0.html

New York is one of the least "organic" cities I have seen in my life. If not the least (well, after LA).

 

It's definitely on that top 10 list!

Why do you say it's inorganic?  In urban terms organic means that it's naturally developed and that it evolves.  This means areas grow and decline over time, and populations move around based on those changes.  I think people are quick to judge New York on Manhattan alone and see the boom of the last 15 years as what "New York City" is...  But New York is a lot more than just the skyscrappers of midtown and extremely expensive Chelsea condos.  If you take a wider lens to both the city physically and temporally you'll see that New York is one of the greatest incubators for urban studies as it has not only evolved and changed over the centuries but has moved beyond what most other American cities have because it's survived the decline in the 70s and 80s to hit a new high.

 

It may not be your cup-of-tea, but it's very much an organic, evolving, and extreme example of what happens as an urban jungle develops.

From Brookings, a  study (and "stoopid list") of citys based on education/jobs/industry mismatches.  The study segregates metro areas by four or five different classifications, from best prospects to worst...long term...

 

Favorable Education Match and Industry Composition: These metropolitan areas do not have a long-run structural problem related to the matching of worker education to what available occupations require; nor do they have a short-run problem related to demand for their specific industries. The typical job in these areas requires less education than what is possessed by the typical worker. Likewise, these economies were more heavily concentrated in growing industries or relatively resilient industries during the worst of the recession, mitigating unemployment. As in all metropolitan areas, highly educated workers are more likely to be employed than less educated workers, but the difference between the two is not as severe as in metropolitan areas with a more pronounced education gap. These metro areas may be better positioned to recover as the national economy recovers.

 

One ohio metro falls into this category:

 

Columbus

 

Favorable Education Match; Unfavorable Industry Composition: These metropolitan areas have a short-run economic problem related to inadequate demand for workers in their most prevalent industries, but they do not have a long-run structural problem related to the matching of worker education to what available occupations require. The typical job in these areas requires less education than what the typical worker possesses. However, these economies were more heavily concentrated in declining or more vulnerable industries during the worst of the recession, resulting in significantly more layoffs than better positioned metros. As in all metropolitan areas, their more educated workers are more likely to be employed than their less educated workers, but the gap between the two is not as severe as in metropolitan areas with a more pronounced education gap. These metros are not well positioned to recover unless national demand for what their industries produce rebounds significantly, or they diversify into faster growing industries like healthcare, professional services, and clean energy.

 

One Ohio metro falls into this categroy:

 

Akron

 

Unfavorable Education Match; Favorable Industry Composition: These metropolitan areas have a long-run structural problem related to a mismatch between worker education and occupational demand, but they have a relatively strong mix of jobs in resilient industries, which have provided ballast against what would otherwise be higher unemployment during the recession. The typical job in these metropolitan areas requires more education than what the typical worker possesses. Yet, these economies were more heavily concentrated in growing or slower-declining industries during the worst of the recession. As in all metropolitan areas, their more educated workers are more likely to be employed than their less educated workers, but the difference between the two is more severe because of the overall education gap. These metro areas may be well positioned for short-term rebound as the national economy recovers, but unemployment rates above the national average will tend to persist until they can either boost educational attainment or stimulate greater employer demand for less educated workers.

 

Two Ohio metros fall into this category:

 

Cleveland

Dayton

 

Unfavorable Education Match and Industry Composition: These metropolitan areas have a long-run structural problem related to a mismatch between worker education and occupational demand, and they have a short-term problem related to significant employment declines in their most prevalent industries. The typical job in these metro areas requires more education than what the typical worker possesses. Likewise, these economies were more heavily concentrated in declining industries or more vulnerable industries during the recession. Like all metropolitan areas, their more educated workers are more likely to be employed than their less educated workers, but the unemployment difference between the two groups is more severe because of the education gap. These metro areas are not well positioned to recover unless national demand for what their industries produce rebounds significantly, and they may have to diversify into faster growing industries like healthcare, professional services, and clean energy. Moreover, regardless of national industry demand, above average unemployment rates will tend to persist until they can either boost educational attainment or stimulate greater employer demand for less educated workers.

 

Three Ohio metros fall into this category:

 

Cincinnati/Middletown

Toledo

Youngstown.

I agree with the Cleveland assessment. A major complaint I hear from my clients (outside of the fees we charge) is about the skill gap. Manufacturers, particularly, are moving more toward technology based processes, and the applicant with a background in long run metal-forming  / assembly, doesn't have a matching skill set. Sadly, neither side seem to be inclined to step up and provide the training either.

yet, these descriptions don't explain the overall demographic trends of these areas. Maybe cleveland and akron have better industry composition because all but the most efficient operations have left entirely. This would explain their population loses in the last decade. Maybe this kind of "rationalization" hasn't happened in cincinnati and would explain its 6% population growth. Those who were employed in those less than most efficient industries have left cleveland while they've remained in cincinnati along with the less efficient operations they work for. What does this mean for the future?

Don't take it so personally, Max.  After all, it's just another dumb a#% list....

 

Besides, the Cleveland Akron CSA's population 'loses' over the last 10 years were rather miniscule to have the effect you are speculating they did.

I would not consider a study (this is not some arbitrary ranking) from Brookings to be "dumb-$$".

Ya-- The title of this thread annoys me.  Some of these are from very well done survey's/rankings of prominent groups.  Yes, others may be silly things, but some do not fall in the "dumb-a$$" category.

Getting deeper into the study (which can be accessed via the link in my previous post), three Ohio cities are in the top 10 metro areas with the highest unemployment gap between education groups....this is for 2009:

 

                Unemployment rate                  Unemployment rate

                High School or Less                  Bachelors Deg or Higher

Toledo    18.1%                                        4.1%

Akron      15.6%                                      3.6%

Dayton    14.3%                                        3.8%

 

These are pretty impressive gaps, and it seems for college educated folks there is fairly low unemployment (official rate)...that the "unemployment recession" is being felt by the lower-educated workforce...in Toledo it looks like pushing Depression era unemployment rates.

 

 

yet, these descriptions don't explain the overall demographic trends of these areas. Maybe cleveland and akron have better industry composition because all but the most efficient operations have left entirely. This would explain their population loses in the last decade. Maybe this kind of "rationalization" hasn't happened in cincinnati and would explain its 6% population growth. Those who were employed in those less than most efficient industries have left cleveland while they've remained in cincinnati along with the less efficient operations they work for. What does this mean for the future?

 

Greater Cleveland's population has not fallen. It has stayed stuck at 2.9 million for 50 years.

 

And here's a ranking of cities you might find interesting:

 

Greater Cleveland in 2010 had the lowest vacancy rate for Class A industrial space in the nation, allowing it to command leases as high as those in Los Angeles or New Jersey.

SOURCE (see #6):

http://terrycoyne.blogspot.com/2010/12/top-ten-commercial-real-estate.html

^

I guess enough old/obsolete plant has been demolished or abandoned that what's left in the industrial facilities market is enough to match demand....or, considering how tight this market is, maybe not enough to match demand?

If it was old or obsolete, then it wasn't Class A inventory.

http://mediagallery.usatoday.com/America's-best-neighborhoods/G2800,A10334

 

10 Best Neighborhoods in America.  German Village is slide 13 of 13.

I would not consider a study (this is not some arbitrary ranking) from Brookings to be "dumb-$$".

Most of these lists have some sort of data backing them. Even the super-dumb-a$$ ones.

I suppose that I can see a difference though between rankings backed by empirical data and those rankings backed by surveys of subjective feelings.  For instance, a lot of these rankings place a great deal of emphasis on weather.  Well.... people tend to disagree on what is a good climate. 

Here's a ranking system of neighborhoods/suburbs in Cuyahoga County:

 

http://media.heightsobserver.org/media/docs_1317664543.pdf

 

I question some of the methodology, but overall I like what they were trying to do.

Ohio came in 20th for states with the most mental illness. 20.4% of the state's population has some sort of mental illness or other.

 

But the reason I'm really sharing this is that Cincinnati's Music Hall is the picture used to represent the state, which I find pretty awesome. Beats the image for most states by a mile! Especially Idaho's, #3, which shows an outhouse with only two walls. Really?! LOL

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/13/mental-health-states-america_n_1007844.html#s404463&title=20_Ohio

Dayton, Columbus, and Cincinnati all made it, but not Cleveland.

 

 

 

25 Worst Cities to Be Young

America’s young adults are staring down record unemployment and diminished career prospects. The Daily Beast crunched the numbers to find the cities where unemployment and debt are the highest.

 

Census data released in September revealed the statistical proof behind what millions had already known—the recession caused severe, and possibly irreversible, damage to the future of America’s newest adult population. Dubbed the “lost generation,” young adults are facing record unemployment and debt, which has caused more of them to stay close to home and remain single. Their earnings and career prospects may be stunted for decades.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/10/20/worst-cities-for-young-people-from-seattle-to-cincinnati-photos.all.html

That list from worst place to be young says Dayton is #5!  And that the % of pop with a BA/BS actually declined by 12%?  Woah!

Even Charlotte made it on the list of worst places to be young.

Especially, if you want to marry a millionaire.  (See The Official "I Love Cleveland" Thread.)

Even Charlotte made it on the list of worst places to be young.

 

Pursuant to data released yesterday by the BLS, NC led the nation in increase in umemployment for August, 2011.  Charlotte's unemployment is around 11% while the state is 10.5%.  With the deline in investment banking over the past few years (some products are not even structured anymore), banking personell, lawyers/firms, underwriters, etc have drastically cut back.  Some Law firms, based in other cities, have closed or reduced their CLT workforce.  Lawyers who built their practice around mortgage-backed securities have left or tried to build a practice in other areas. BofA has scaled back and Wachovia is now Wells Fargo.  As Wells fully integrates Wachovia, who knows what the CLT workforce is in for.

Charlotte is attemptinng to change its focus from banking to energy.  It is a risky and will be a painful process.

^Yes. In the mid-2000s, Charlotte was turning into an NYC Jr. with massive growth in the financial sector. But when times got tough, the Manhattan guys made sure to save their jobs by getting rid of the new guys in Charlotte. Charlotte was definitely a bubble city.

"Even Charlotte made it on the list of worst places to be young."

 

Why the "even" - I'd never want to live in the Carolinas! Young or old! you drive 15 miles outside of Charlotte and you're still in the deep south with confederate flags and like-minded folks...

"Even Charlotte made it on the list of worst places to be young."

 

Why the "even" - I'd never want to live in the Carolinas! Young or old! you drive 15 miles outside of Charlotte and you're still in the deep south with confederate flags and like-minded folks...

 

I don't even think the core city itself is all that special.

I think because Charlotte is always thought of as a greener pasture.  "The new south", and saw a lot of growth, which drew lots of people looking for jobs.  Yeah I think many of us wouldnt want to live there, with the exception of Hts121's dad.   

My dad was drawn to Charlotte by a "higher authority" a long time before it became the thing to do

My dad was drawn to Charlotte by a "higher authority" a long time before it became the thing to do

 

A few years ago I dated someone who lived in CLT and spent alot of time there.  Its not a bad place but on the other hand its like what Gertrude Stein said about Oakland, CA "There's nothing there, there".  Its newer, so of course it gives the illusion of being cleaner and modern.  As far as entertainment goes, downtown has a lot of bars and I donlt mean that in a positive way.  At 5:00pm, downtown empties out and is deserted, even though there alot of residential areas in and around downtown.  Downtown is essentially Tryon Street for 12 blocks and maybe 2 blocks on either side of that.  Too bad Jim and Tammy Fay Bakker didn't complete Heriyage USA or whatever they called it.  Would have provided all the entertainment you could want.

My dad was drawn to Charlotte by a "higher authority" a long time before it became the thing to do

[/quote

 

Thats funny, my dad actually lived there for a few years.

KJP your argument isn't with me, it is with the U.S. Census Bureau. The 'shortage' of A class office space in Cleveland may well be due to the long-time lack of demand that has resulted in a long period without the construction or maintenance of A class space as much as increased demand today. Both supply and demand matter and a lack of demand over time results in a lack of supply in later years as developers choose not to build. Cleveland is at best stopping its decline. That is good and necessary for any hope of building for the future, but it is only the very beginning of a solution.

Here's a ranking system of neighborhoods/suburbs in Cuyahoga County:

 

http://media.heightsobserver.org/media/docs_1317664543.pdf

 

I question some of the methodology, but overall I like what they were trying to do.

 

 

Interesting. Cleveland Hts came out pretty well in the study. But it looks like the study may need some tweaking to have any credibility regarding Cleveland Hts after today's PD break. The PD today (front page, Sunday) had a study of how city of Cleveland Hts has been lying about their crime stats, making things seem safer than they really are.  I hope the Justice Dept (to whom the city must report data) goes after them for lying on their reports, though I guess lying may be hard to prove if city officially 'accidentally' misclassify a serious crime as 'miscellaneous' again and again. Kudos to the PD for their making noise and insight to look into this.

 

"....while city officials flaunt one set of statistics, they conceal another. A Plain Dealer analysis of police records in nearly 90 cases reported over three years reveals that officials have chronically misinformed the public about the number of sex crimes reported in the city...."

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2011/10/public_misled_on_cleveland_hei.html

KJP your argument isn't with me, it is with the U.S. Census Bureau. The 'shortage' of A class office space in Cleveland may well be due to the long-time lack of demand that has resulted in a long period without the construction or maintenance of A class space as much as increased demand today. Both supply and demand matter and a lack of demand over time results in a lack of supply in later years as developers choose not to build. Cleveland is at best stopping its decline. That is good and necessary for any hope of building for the future, but it is only the very beginning of a solution.

 

There was a massive boom in class A construction from the mid 80's through the mid 90's.

If only there had been an analagous boom in workers.

If only there had been an analagous boom in workers.

 

And indeed there was - just not in heavy industry/mfg.  That declined at a rapid pace to end up at values closer to the national average.  Health care and its related fields added many jobs.  As I've written before, CLE's CSA has essentially replaced each loss on a 1:1 basis.

KJP your argument isn't with me, it is with the U.S. Census Bureau. The 'shortage' of A class office space in Cleveland may well be due to the long-time lack of demand that has resulted in a long period without the construction or maintenance of A class space as much as increased demand today. Both supply and demand matter and a lack of demand over time results in a lack of supply in later years as developers choose not to build. Cleveland is at best stopping its decline. That is good and necessary for any hope of building for the future, but it is only the very beginning of a solution.

 

Except that there is a demand.  I recall information published prior to the fall of 2008 (and I beleive posted here in the appropriate thread) that specifically stated the who and where.  The County, some law firms (law firms - major nationally recogized firms - employ alot in the CLE often practising esoteric law), etc.  The financial conditions of the times have precluded alot of this construction and demand remains unfulfilled.  Flats East Bank is one of the only major office developments in process anywhere in the Country that was started post 2009.  In such cities as RDU and ATL some developments sit abandoned and the developers bankrupt. 

That's funny -- I thought I had locked it! I hope I didn't unlock it.

 

EDIT: nope. It's locked until the locals go home and simmer down.