Which States Have the Worst Drivers?  Not Ohio!  We're 10th Best!

 

It’s the eternal question: which state has the worst drivers? While you may think your state has the worst drivers in the nation, especially when that guy pulls an illegal left turn in front of you, we decided to put it to the test. With bad driving comes high car insurance rates so be careful!

 

We compiled data from three sources: the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration (driving fatalities), the American Motorists Association (which states hand out the most tickets), and MADD (drunk drivers).

 

Then we translated all of this information into rankings: the higher the ranking, the worse the states were. For example, the state with the most tickets, Florida, got a 50 on the scale. Then we added up the numbers to give each state a score; the higher the score, the worse the drivers. If you find yourself in one of these states, expect your state car insurance to be higher than other states! One can save on car insurance by taking the time to use our ZIP code search! We will help you find cheap car insurance for whatever state you live in!

 

Complete Rankings

 

State Fatalities Per Million Miles Ticketing Rank Drunk Failure to Obey Careless Total Score Worst Driver Rank

 

--Worst--

Louisiana 49 41 41 18 47 196 1

Missouri 34 45 44 19 42 184 2

Texas 35 47 31 38 32 183 3

Florida 37 50 7 40 49 183 4

Oklahoma 40 34 25 42 39 180 5

Arizona 39 40 37 33 29 178 6

Kentucky 44 16 42 17 48 167 7

Alabama 42 46 29 41 7 165 8

Montana 50 1 49 25 40 165 9

Nevada 41 48 4 44 22 159 10

South Carolina 48 33 30 45 3 159 11

North Carolina 33 43 21 30 31 158 12

North Dakota 26 3 33 50 45 157 13

Delaware 29 25 36 39 27 156 14

Tennessee 36 31 45 21 23 156 15

Kansas 25 28 32 26 41 152 16

Arkansas 46 19 17 20 50 152 17

Idaho 38 8 34 24 44 148 18

Georgia 31 49 11 43 9 143 19

Alaska 24 5 48 23 34 134 20

Iowa 27 36 2 49 18 132 21

South Dakota 28 4 46 46 8 132 22

Mississippi 45 39 10 3 35 132 23

New Mexico 32 10 9 28 46 125 24

Colorado 21 26 35 12 30 124 25

Pennsylvania 30 21 20 32 19 122 26

Hawaii 12 14 47 9 38 120 27

Wisconsin 14 18 43 15 28 118 28

New York 5 44 16 34 17 116 29

Vermont 11 17 40 22 26 116 30

Indiana 22 32 14 36 10 114 31

Michigan 8 27 27 37 14 113 32

West Virginia 47 7 39 4 16 113 33

Maryland 18 37 19 5 33 112 34

Minnesota 2 24 13 47 25 111 35

California 13 38 22 31 6 110 36

Wyoming 43 2 50 14 1 110 37

Washington 6 35 23 8 37 109 38

New Jersey 4 42 8 11 43 108 39

Utah 17 12 15 35 24 103 40

Ohio 20 29 3 29 20 101 41

Nebraska 19 9 1 48 21 98 42

Illinois 9 30 18 27 13 97 43

Maine 16 6 26 7 36 91 44

Oregon 23 11 38 6 11 89 45

New Hampshire 15 15 24 2 12 68 46

Virginia 10 23 6 16 5 60 47

Massachusetts 1 22 5 13 15 56 48

Connecticut 7 20 12 10 4 53 49

Rhode Island 3 13 28 1 2 47 50

--Best--

 

http://www.carinsurancecomparison.com/which-states-have-the-worst-drivers/

Took the kids to the Braumeister last night on a whim. Its a usual hangout for me late night Thursdays, l, buy I never really ate the food.

 

This is when I noticed the banner on the side stating, "Der Braumeister Named One of the 20 Best Bars in America!"

 

Who knew???

 

http://derbraumeister.com/blog/news-events/2011/10/23/der-braumeister-named-one-of-the-best-bars-in-america/

 

Der Braumeister Named One of the Best Bars in America! 

 

23 October 2011  FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

 

Cleveland, OH – Der Braumeister Master Bier Haus, Restaurant & Market is proud to be named One of the 20 Best Bars in America by Men’s Health magazine. Der Braumeister is recognized in the November 2011 feature “The Thinking Man’s Guide to Drinking” by contributing editor Hugh O’Neill among bars in New York City, Chicago, Seattle, Boston, DC and San Francisco.

 

“We are thrilled to represent Cleveland with this achievement,” said Cindy Hoertz Otonoga, manager of Der Braumeister along with her sister, Linda Hoertz. “Finally, Cleveland has made a Top 20 list we can all be proud of!” The Hoertz family has owned and operated Der Braumeister since the early 1980s, and the building has been home to a German restaurant and bar since 1929. “When you come through the door, you know you are somewhere special,” Otonoga continues. “There is an old world vibe here that makes our guests feel right at home.”

 

Der Braumeister is Cleveland’s only authentic German restaurant, market and biergarten. You can choose from 140 imported beers, a large selection of wines and a full menu of Germany’s traditional foods. On your way out, visit our Old World Market & Deli for all the great tastes of Europe right on the West Side of Cleveland.

I didn't know either -- nor did I know they had a market/deli!

the editor is a clevelander.

 

***

 

i never used wiki travel before, but did recently and while i was messing around with it i noticed lots of list stuff for its cle travel entry -- bravo the wikihomers did a good job!:

 

 

 

Places Rated Almanac ranks the area second in recreational options out of 354 US metro areas.

 

Plus, this region ranks fifth in the nation in number of major cultural resources per one million residents.

 

Cleveland has been named one of the top 10 international visitor hotspots by Travel and Leisure magazine.

 

Cleveland might be one of the easiest cities in the world to navigate. There are almost no one-way streets, because the city was planned to have "European Avenues" (which resulted in the foresight to make them broad enough for vehicular transportation that couldn't have been imagined in the late 1700s). Traffic is generally not a problem relative to other major U.S. metro areas.

 

Terminal Tower, the centerpoint of Tower City Center, located on Public Square, is the Terminal Tower, built in 1929 as the second tallest building in the world (now it's the second tallest building in Cleveland).

 

Cleveland was named a Top 25 Arts Destination by www.americanstyle.com in 2003.

 

the second largest performing arts center in the U.S. (Playhouse Square Center

 

a world-renowned art museum (The Cleveland Museum of Art

 

the nation's first health museum (HealthSpace Cleveland)

 

Cleveland is home to the second longest span of sold out baseball games (5 consecutive seasons in the late 1990s), the largest American League baseball attendance (72,086 on 8/9/1981) and the birthplace of Monday Night Football (9/21/1970).

 

Cleveland boasts more miles of shoreline than any other city in the world

 

USA Today ranked Cleveland among the 10 best big cities for hiking.

 

Cleveland Orchestra, A world-famous "Big Five" orchestra.

 

In 2006, Cleveland was ranked the best city for business travel on the U.S. mainland (the lower 48 states) by The Economist in its article "The World in 2006 - Where Business is Pleasure".

 

Fortune magazine also ranked Greater Cleveland as one of the 10 best cities for business in North America.

 

In addition to 12 Fortune 1000 headquarters, more than 150 international companies have a presence here.

 

Nighttown, The only club in Ohio on Down Beat's list of The 100 Best Jazz Clubs in the World.

 

Intel named Cleveland as one of its four "Worldwide Digital Communities" (with Corpus Christi, Texas; Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; and Taipei, Taiwan).

 

The largest natural sand beach in Ohio, Headlands Beach State Park, is located east of Cleveland, in Mentor.

 

Site Selection magazine ranked Ohio as first in the U.S. with the most corporate facility projects and expansions in 2007.

 

Why city rankings always get it wrong

Happiest cities, most livable cities, loneliest cities -- the Web's filled with lists. Almost all of them are bogus

By Will Doig

 

Hey, Memphis: Are you happy? Are you sure? Because Men’s Health magazine isn’t so certain.

 

Last week, in a list of the “saddest U.S. cities,” Men’s Health ranked Memphis, with its subtropical climate and legendary music scene, as the third-saddest city in the country. Clearly the place has taken a dive since February, when Forbes reported that Memphis is the sixth-happiest city to work in. Memphis is apparently a little slice of heaven — as long as you’re sitting at the office.

 

http://www.salon.com/2011/12/05/why_city_rankings_always_get_it_wrong/singleton/

Why have I seen 3 people on Facebook this morning post the Reuters story about Cleveland being the most miserable city on the Februrary 2010 Forbes list?  Did some news agency just report it as new news or something?

Why have I seen 3 people on Facebook this morning post the Reuters story about Cleveland being the most miserable city on the Februrary 2010 Forbes list?  Did some news agency just report it as new news or something?

 

Good question.  I saw a few folks post the same thing last night on Twitter.  I guess Cleveland's so miserable that Forbes is now releasing the rankings biannually to remind everyone of this reality.

I saw it posted by two people and blasted it of course.

It's not even a new Forbes story (or even a new article about the Forbes story), but links back to the original February 2010 story.  Someone must have decided to spread it again, knowing most people would be so glad to have an opportunity to bash on Cleveland that they wouldn't even check the date.

 

(By the way, for what it's worth, Forbes did release "Miserable City" rankings last year and Cleveland was 10th.)

 

I think Facebook comment arguments are dumb, but I started one by blasting the ignorant comments left by friends of a friend from the East Coast who were laying into Cleveland (and I'm sure none of them have ever even been here).

It's not even a new Forbes story (or even a new article about the Forbes story), but links back to the original February 2010 story.  Someone must have decided to spread it again, knowing most people would be so glad to have an opportunity to bash on Cleveland that they wouldn't even check the date.

 

(By the way, for what it's worth, Forbes did release "Miserable City" rankings last year and Cleveland was 10th.)

 

I think Facebook comment arguments are dumb, but I started one by blasting the ignorant comments left by friends of a friend from the East Coast who were laying into Cleveland (and I'm sure none of them have ever even been here).

 

Have any of you contacted the Forbes editor?

http://bestcities.milkeninstitute.org/

 

This is for the top 200 largest metros.

 

Ohio Metros

Columbus: #55, up from #108 in 2010.

Cincinnati: #138, up from #141 in 2010.

Akron: #147, up from #171 in 2010.

Dayton: #166, up from #169 in 2010.

Toledo: #171, up from #195 in 2010.

Cleveland: #176, up from #183 in 2010.

Youngstown: #178, up from #192 in 2010.

 

I guess the good news is that they all went up. 

 

Rankings 2002-2011

Columbus

2002: #66

2003: #105

2004: #138

2005: #135

2007: #154

2008: #135

2009: #108

2010: #108

2011: #55

 

 

Cincinnati

2002: #130

2003: #131

2004: #115

2005: #149

2007: #167

2008: #173

2009: #138

2010: #141

2011: #138

 

Akron

2002: #154

2003: #180

2004: #153

2005: #160

2007: #155

2008: #172

2009: #167

2010: #171

2011: #147

 

Dayton

2002: #173

2003: #188

2004: #188

2005: #187

2007: #190

2008: #189

2009: #183

2010: #169

2011: #166

 

Cleveland

2002: #172

2003: #194

2004: #187

2005: #194

2007: #193

2008: #193

2009: #186

2010: #183

2011: #176

 

Toledo

2002: #174

2003: #195

2004: #195

2005: #196

2007: #196

2008: #194

2009: #198

2010: #195

2011: #171

 

Youngstown

2002: #199

2003: #199

2004: #175

2005: #199

2007: #191

2008: #188

2009: #193

2010: #192

2011: #178

Top 10 US travel destinations for 2012

1. US Virgin Islands

2. Hudson River Valley, New York

3. Cincinnati, Ohio

Seen Cincy lately? The pretty city on the Ohio River – off the main cross-country interstates – gets bypassed by many road trippers, but it’s quietly transformed itself in the last decade into a worthy weekend getaway. Life centers around the river – much which can be seen by foot: river walkways are best on the Kentucky side, reached via a couple bridges including John Roebling’s Suspension Bridge (a prequel to his famous Brooklyn Bridge). Narrow, twisting (and steep) brick roads of the Mt Adams district lead past 19th-century Victorian townhouses and the free Cincinnati Art Museum, while the once-dangerous, emerging Over-the-Rhine, just north of downtown, is home to the Findlay Market and a sprawling collection of historic Italianate architecture. Best, though, is the National Underground Railroad Freedom Center, open since 2004, on the banks of the river where many slaves escaped to freedom in the 19th century.

4. Four Corners Region, Southwest USA

5. Culebra, Puerto Rico

6. California Gold Country

7. Boulder, Colorado

8. Hawai’i: The Big Island

9. Chicago

10. Yellowstone National Park

 

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/usa/travel-tips-and-articles/76941?affil=twit

^ Thanks, Quimbob!  What's there not to like about a little publicity like this, huh huh huh?  (Enough said for now; no place to reiterate the recent and volatile local debate over the continued funding of the Freedom Center, okay?)    :drunk:

WOW!  That's a great endorsement. 

Recognize.

Top Midwestern Colleges in the US By Salary Potential

 

The rolling fields of America's heartland host many top universities known for their school pride, challenging academic programs and successful graduates. Are Ohio, Indiana and Iowa on your list of favorite spots? See PayScale's list of top Midwestern colleges in the US by salary potential. 

Methodology

 

 

 

FULL LIST BY CLICKING ON LINK

 

 

Top Midwestern Colleges in the US By Salary Potential

 

Starting Median Salary    Mid-Career Median Salary

 

University of Notre Dame $52,900 $107,000

 

Case Western Reserve University $52,600 $101,000

 

Carleton College $42,800 $98,300

 

South Dakota School of Mines & Technology $56,700 $96,300

 

Illinois Institute of Technology (IIT) $52,000 $96,000

 

Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology (RHIT) $60,700 $95,800

 

Missouri University of Science and Technology (MST) $58,600 $94,400

 

University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign (UIUC) $51,500 $94,300

 

Denison University $40,600 $94,000

 

Ohio Northern University (ONU) $44,800 $92,900

 

University Of Chicago $46,900 $92,700

 

Ohio Wesleyan University (OWU) $40,300 $92,500

 

Kenyon College $40,200 $89,700

 

Lawrence University $37,900 $89,700

 

 

http://www.payscale.com/best-colleges/midwestern-colleges.asp

A university with a medical school has highly paid graduates.  That is how it should be.  However, it skews the data.  What if you don't go to medical school?

That list is for people with bachelor's degrees only.

Top 10 US travel destinations for 2012

1. US Virgin Islands

2. Hudson River Valley, New York

3. Cincinnati, Ohio

Seen Cincy lately? The pretty city on the Ohio River – off the main cross-country interstates – gets bypassed by many road trippers, but it’s quietly transformed itself in the last decade into a worthy weekend getaway. Life centers around the river – much which can be seen by foot: river walkways are best on the Kentucky side, reached via a couple bridges including John Roebling’s Suspension Bridge (a prequel to his famous Brooklyn Bridge). Narrow, twisting (and steep) brick roads of the Mt Adams district lead past 19th-century Victorian townhouses and the free Cincinnati Art Museum, while the once-dangerous, emerging Over-the-Rhine, just north of downtown, is home to the Findlay Market and a sprawling collection of historic Italianate architecture. Best, though, is the National Underground Railroad Freedom Center, open since 2004, on the banks of the river where many slaves escaped to freedom in the 19th century.

4. Four Corners Region, Southwest USA

5. Culebra, Puerto Rico

6. California Gold Country

7. Boulder, Colorado

8. Hawai’i: The Big Island

9. Chicago

10. Yellowstone National Park

 

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/usa/travel-tips-and-articles/76941?affil=twit

 

Figures some local would chime in with this gem:

 

28 December 2011 8:49AM jstoli13

I live in Cincinnati, and I have only one question ... could the Cincinnati visitor and travelers bureau not afford to pay for the #1 or #2 spot on this list?

 

No wonder the city does not get more recognition, when those who choose to live there instinctively talk sh!t about it given the opportunity. How much you want to bet this guy doesn't live "in Cincinnati," but in Florence or Mason or something? (Somewhere that really would require payment for a slot on the list!)

 

I don't see anyone from Boulder or Coxsackie coming on alleging bribes were necessary to get on the list.

"Hey kids, I know mom and I promised to take you to Yellowstone and the Big Island of Hawaii this summer, but we read this article in Lonely Planet and decided to go to the Freedom Center in Cincinnati instead. We're sure you'll love it!"

-- Nobody

Cincinnati is the American version of the type of city I would vacation to in Europe. Yes, instead of going to the Greek Isles.

It's not even a new Forbes story (or even a new article about the Forbes story), but links back to the original February 2010 story.  Someone must have decided to spread it again, knowing most people would be so glad to have an opportunity to bash on Cleveland that they wouldn't even check the date.

 

(By the way, for what it's worth, Forbes did release "Miserable City" rankings last year and Cleveland was 10th.)

 

I think Facebook comment arguments are dumb, but I started one by blasting the ignorant comments left by friends of a friend from the East Coast who were laying into Cleveland (and I'm sure none of them have ever even been here).

 

Have any of you contacted the Forbes editor?

 

I was complaining about people on Facebook spreading around a link to an old Forbes list.  What good would contacting Forbes do?

"Hey kids, I know mom and I promised to take you to Yellowstone and the Big Island of Hawaii this summer, but we read this article in Lonely Planet and decided to go to the Freedom Center in Cincinnati instead. We're sure you'll love it!"

 

And I'm sure the kids would love Disney World over Yellowstone or even Hawaii, but not every vacationer is a kid.  I agree with natininja.  I'll take a vacation to a nice, walkable, active city any day over a "single attraction" type of place.

 

I've only been to Cincinnati a couple times and my wife has never been there.  We've talked about making it a vacation at some point.

Cincinnati is the American version of the type of city I would vacation to in Europe. Yes, instead of going to the Greek Isles.

 

Have you ever actually been to any city in Europe?

Cincinnati is the American version of the type of city I would vacation to in Europe. Yes, instead of going to the Greek Isles.

 

Have you ever actually been to any city in Europe?

No, I only lived there for three years.

Cincinnati is the American version of the type of city I would vacation to in Europe.

 

I completely agree with this assessment. 

People be trollin' up in here.

 

Try living in Europe for a few years and letting the foreignness/exoticness wear off. Then you start to see the character traits of Euro cities which make them appealing to visit. Then you can apply this to think outside of the media-perpetuated, coastal-centric American notions of which American cities are interesting or cool.

 

We all know LA is a turd, right? Yet Americans eat it up (so do people from other countries for that matter). It's a media hub, so the media constantly tells us how awesome it is.

 

But Cincinnati has the deep culture and old-world style which sets it apart, and makes it akin to the interesting European cities. Like New Orleans and San Francisco, but forgotten as a victim of the media's collective dump on the Midwest.

A university with a medical school has highly paid graduates.  That is how it should be.  However, it skews the data.  What if you don't go to medical school?

 

That list is for people with bachelor's degrees only.

 

It probably helps CWRU in such a ranking that most of its graduates are leaving there with degrees in high in-demand STEM fields.

As far as Cinti goes, a poll in the Springfield News Sun a few years ago cited Cincinnati as the best day trip.

Lori Kurtzman nicely articulates my own misgivings about that Lonely Planet list, and the collective reaction to it:

 

Why visit Cincinnati? (Really, why?)

 

The earnest enthusiasm that’s greeted this list has almost been embarrassing. No other city freaked out about the Lonely Planet list the way Cincinnati did. No other city wondered aloud whether it was finally “chic.” I can’t even find a news item about it from Boulder, Colo., which was No. 7 on the list. We are the Sally Field of metropolitan cities!

 

Cincinnati needs to find its own inner confidence. It needs self-esteem. It needs to leave middle school for good and care a little less about what other people think about it. It needs to continue to work on itself and be proud of what it’s done. Accept the praise, accept the criticism, push forward.

 

I think Cincinnati will be in a great place if one day it shows up on a top 10 list and people shrug and say, “Cool. Now where are we going to dinner tonight?”

 

Short version: When you finally make it into the end zone, act like you've been there before.

^ Agreed. People shouldn't be surprised.

 

But that contradicts your earlier satirical quote, inferring it's a poor vacation destination.

It's not even a new Forbes story (or even a new article about the Forbes story), but links back to the original February 2010 story.  Someone must have decided to spread it again, knowing most people would be so glad to have an opportunity to bash on Cleveland that they wouldn't even check the date.

 

(By the way, for what it's worth, Forbes did release "Miserable City" rankings last year and Cleveland was 10th.)

 

I think Facebook comment arguments are dumb, but I started one by blasting the ignorant comments left by friends of a friend from the East Coast who were laying into Cleveland (and I'm sure none of them have ever even been here).

 

Have any of you contacted the Forbes editor?

 

I was complaining about people on Facebook spreading around a link to an old Forbes list.  What good would contacting Forbes do?

Um, contacting the editor and providing them with the facts does help.  Have you tried?

Lori Kurtzman nicely articulates my own misgivings about that Lonely Planet list, and the collective reaction to it:

 

Why visit Cincinnati? (Really, why?)

 

The earnest enthusiasm thats greeted this list has almost been embarrassing. No other city freaked out about the Lonely Planet list the way Cincinnati did. No other city wondered aloud whether it was finally chic. I cant even find a news item about it from Boulder, Colo., which was No. 7 on the list. We are the Sally Field of metropolitan cities!

 

Cincinnati needs to find its own inner confidence. It needs self-esteem. It needs to leave middle school for good and care a little less about what other people think about it. It needs to continue to work on itself and be proud of what its done. Accept the praise, accept the criticism, push forward.

 

I think Cincinnati will be in a great place if one day it shows up on a top 10 list and people shrug and say, Cool. Now where are we going to dinner tonight?

 

Short version: When you finally make it into the end zone, act like you've been there before.

 

Great post.  Hence the title of the thread.  All of Ohio really needs to get rid of that attitude that cares so much about what OTHER people feel about where YOU live.  Even here on UO, it is a recurring theme that people might not want to live here because some dude down in Miami with an opened collared shirt, a tacky gold chain, botox injections in his forehead, collagen injections in his lips, and just a 'touch of gray' doesn't think it is a 'cool' place to live or visit.

 

No part of Ohio is a true travel destination.  Never was and never will be.  But it is a great place to live ;)

Lori Kurtzman nicely articulates my own misgivings about that Lonely Planet list, and the collective reaction to it:

 

Why visit Cincinnati? (Really, why?)

 

The earnest enthusiasm that’s greeted this list has almost been embarrassing. No other city freaked out about the Lonely Planet list the way Cincinnati did. No other city wondered aloud whether it was finally “chic.” I can’t even find a news item about it from Boulder, Colo., which was No. 7 on the list. We are the Sally Field of metropolitan cities!

 

Cincinnati needs to find its own inner confidence. It needs self-esteem. It needs to leave middle school for good and care a little less about what other people think about it. It needs to continue to work on itself and be proud of what it’s done. Accept the praise, accept the criticism, push forward.

 

I think Cincinnati will be in a great place if one day it shows up on a top 10 list and people shrug and say, “Cool. Now where are we going to dinner tonight?”

 

Short version: When you finally make it into the end zone, act like you've been there before.

 

Great post.  Hence the title of the thread.  All of Ohio really needs to get rid of that attitude that cares so much about what OTHER people feel about where YOU live.  Even here on UO, it is a recurring theme that people might not want to live here because some dude down in Miami with an opened collared shirt, a tacky gold chain, botox injections in his forehead, collagen injections in his lips, and just a 'touch of gray' doesn't think it is a 'cool' place to live or visit.

 

No part of Ohio is a true travel destination. Never was and never will be.  But it is a great place to live ;)

 

That I don't agree with.  Charlotte, Houston, Dallas, Boston, Philly have become places to visit over the past two decades there is no reason Cleveland/NE Ohio cannot do the same!

^ Agreed. People shouldn't be surprised.

 

But that contradicts your earlier satirical quote, inferring it's a poor vacation destination.

 

I never said Cincinnati was a poor vacation destination. In fact, I've taken vacations to Cincinnati, from New York City. (And I happen to think the upper Hudson River valley is beautiful, too, and is very comparable to the geography of Cincinnati's own Ohio River valley.) I just don't think it belongs on the same list as Hawaii, Yellowstone, Chicago, and the Virgin Islands. Apples and oranges.

 

If they want to make a list of "Best Vacation Spots", I'm sure it would include Hawaii, Yellowstone, etc., but it certainly wouldn't include Cincinnati. Cincinnati will never be in that league, and that's perfectly fine with me. (You think hipsters in OTR are annoying? Imagine having to shove your way past a constant stream of Duck Tour boats and fat tourists waddling down Main Street, and then paying hyper-inflated prices for a Bud Light at what used to be your favorite neighborhood bar before it got priced out of the neighborhood and had to close.)

 

If they want to make a list of "Best Overlooked Weekend Getaways in the US", then Cincinnati would be perfectly appropriate for the list along with Boulder, the Hudson River Valley, etc. But that list wouldn't include Chicago or the Virgin Islands, because those are already major tourist destinations and could hardly be considered "overlooked". Yellowstone National Park is almost as famous for its traffic jams as it is for its geysers.

 

What it looks like Lonely Planet tried to do was mash two completely different lists together, but did so in a very clumsy and ham-fisted manner.

 

As for the reaction that Lonely Planet article got among Cincinnati's cheerleaders, it reminded me of a bunch of 12-year-olds shrieking because Justin Bieber glanced in their general direction during a concert. IMO, uncritical cheerleading is almost as damaging to a city as Enquirer-style naysayng. As Lori mentions in another blog post, Cincinnati doesn't need cheerleaders, it needs coaches who love the city but who also point out its flaws and work toward solutions.

Honestly, as some people have noted, why care?  Especially when a majority of articles posted here are advertorials and are really not a dig a Ohio/Ohio cities but paid advertisements to point to something else.

That I don't agree with.  Charlotte, Houston, Dallas, Boston, Philly have become places to visit over the past two decades there is no reason Cleveland/NE Ohio cannot do the same!

 

Boston and Philly have those historical attractions that make them appealing to tourists.... but more along the lines of school field trips and people (foreign and domestic) with a keen interest in US history.  Charlotte is on par with Cleveland, in that its biggest draw (outside of conventions) is the NASCAR HOF, much like our RRHOF.  It is not a travel 'destination' in the sense I think of Miami, LA, NYC, Paris, Amsterdam, New Orleans, Hawaii, Yellowstone, Bermuda, etc.  Nor is Dallas or Houston.  They attract visitors for various reasons, but when is the last time you heard of a family planning a trip to Houston for vacation (and it not be based around visiting relatives)?

 

For the reasons LIG stated, I really have no interest in living in a place that we have to have derogotory names for tourists.  We could use some more, but touristy tends to mean tacky in my book.

That I don't agree with.  Charlotte, Houston, Dallas, Boston, Philly have become places to visit over the past two decades there is no reason Cleveland/NE Ohio cannot do the same!

 

Boston and Philly have those historical attractions that make them appealing to tourists.... but more along the lines of school field trips and people (foreign and domestic) with a keen interest in US history.  Charlotte is on par with Cleveland, in that its biggest draw (outside of conventions) is the NASCAR HOF, much like our RRHOF.  It is not a travel 'destination' in the sense I think of Miami, LA, NYC, Paris, Amsterdam, New Orleans, Hawaii, Yellowstone, Bermuda, etc.  Nor is Dallas or Houston.  They attract visitors for various reasons, but when is the last time you heard of a family planning a trip to Houston for vacation (and it not be based around visiting relatives)?

 

For the reasons LIG stated, I really have no interest in living in a place that we have to have derogotory names for tourists.  We could use some more, but touristy tends to mean tacky in my book.

 

And we don't?  We have quite a few historical areas.  Lets not take this off topic though.

 

I personally believe, as i've said before, our lack of hotels along with non existent marketing is our biggest Achilles heel.  Now that we have more destination events and a downtown and surrounding areas that are skewing younger, the perception of the city will change.

People be trollin' up in here.

 

Try living in Europe for a few years and letting the foreignness/exoticness wear off. Then you start to see the character traits of Euro cities which make them appealing to visit. Then you can apply this to think outside of the media-perpetuated, coastal-centric American notions of which American cities are interesting or cool.

 

We all know LA is a turd, right? Yet Americans eat it up (so do people from other countries for that matter). It's a media hub, so the media constantly tells us how awesome it is.

 

But Cincinnati has the deep culture and old-world style which sets it apart, and makes it akin to the interesting European cities. Like New Orleans and San Francisco, but forgotten as a victim of the media's collective dump on the Midwest.

 

If you think LA is a turd, you've obviously never been here.  I live here and I love it.  It takes a while to get used to, but the sheer number of things to do and the number of places to go is overwhelming.  Great art (as can be seen in a huge number of museums and galleries.  I recommend the current multi museum/gallery show Pacific Standard Time which traced the evolution of LA into a global art powerhouse) great music, great geography, amazing food.  Yeah, it's a turd.

I visited LA for the first time this past summer on a business trip, and was pleasantly surprised by what I found. I was expecting an sprawl-choked urban wasteland, and while many areas certainly meet that description, the more central parts of LA were much more urban and pedestrian-scaled than I was expecting. I'm not sure if I could ever live there, but I'd love to go back for another visit and see more of the area.

 

 

But Cincinnati has the deep culture and old-world style which sets it apart, and makes it akin to the interesting European cities. Like New Orleans and San Francisco, but forgotten as a victim of the media's collective dump on the Midwest.

this is an interesting comment. I recall an article a few years ago (I think in the NY Times, but I couldn't find it online) about German tourists going to Cincinnati on group tours, obviously because of the city's rich German heritage, but also for its cultural and historic attractions generally. Don't know if this is still going on.

I visited LA for the first time this past summer on a business trip, and was pleasantly surprised by what I found. I was expecting an sprawl-choked urban wasteland, and while many areas certainly meet that description, the more central parts of LA were much more urban and pedestrian-scaled than I was expecting. I'm not sure if I could ever live there, but I'd love to go back for another visit and see more of the area.

 

Really?  Where?  Please explain.

I'm sure SoCal has some nice parts, but what I remember most from my trips there is spending lots of time in bumper-to-bumper traffic on the freeway.

.... And plenty of VERY expensive surface lots in what I would have thought to be prime real estate for development.

 

 

 

But Cincinnati has the deep culture and old-world style which sets it apart, and makes it akin to the interesting European cities. Like New Orleans and San Francisco, but forgotten as a victim of the media's collective dump on the Midwest.

this is an interesting comment. I recall an article a few years ago (I think in the NY Times, but I couldn't find it online) about German tourists going to Cincinnati on group tours, obviously because of the city's rich German heritage, but also for its cultural and historic attractions generally. Don't know if this is still going on.

 

Yes. I'd see Germans hanging around town all the time when I lived there. On a train in Germany, we talked to a guy who had just gotten back from Cincinnati two weeks before.

 

For what it's worth as anecdotes.

Just to be clear here, the average Density for the entire 502 square mile city of Los Angeles is 8,092 people per square mile.  It's the 7th most dense city in america (with a population over 500,000).  It does have traffic problems, for sure, but LA itself is VERY dense with few surface lots.  spend 20 minutes on google maps cruising around Hollywood, Silverlake, Koreatown, Mid City, Rampart Village, etc. and you will see a pretty dense city, and that's not even including Bunker Hill where the major high-rise developments are. 

 

The main issue is alternative transportation- it can't get much more dense until you can stop needing a car and LA has a major plan to change the situation dramatically but it's a 30 year plan... 

 

^I live in Los Feliz and work downtown and almost never use my car. I knew I didn't want to be held hostage by my car by living on the Westside, so I found a neighborhood I liked that had transit accessibility and I absolutely love it.  I rarely leave Los Feliz/Silverlake/Echo Park, though.

Just to be clear here, the average Density for the entire 502 square mile city of Los Angeles is 8,092 people per square mile.  It's the 7th most dense city in america (with a population over 500,000).  It does have traffic problems, for sure, but LA itself is VERY dense with few surface lots.  spend 20 minutes on google maps cruising around Hollywood, Silverlake, Koreatown, Mid City, Rampart Village, etc. and you will see a pretty dense city, and that's not even including Bunker Hill where the major high-rise developments are. 

 

The main issue is alternative transportation- it can't get much more dense until you can stop needing a car and LA has a major plan to change the situation dramatically but it's a 30 year plan... 

 

 

I have to work in LA on a regular basis and have home there.  There aren't many walkable neighborhoods, maybe blocks or small districts, but not neighborhoods.

 

Let me ask what your definition of "pedestrian friendly"?

 

Hollywood? During the day, Hollywood and Highland is pretty busy, but go three, four blocks in any direction and its not really pedestrian friendly walkable neighborhood.  Our office is on Sunset and it's a mess.

 

Koreatown?  Mid City?  :wtf:

 

I completely disagree.

 

 

 

I will have to have a drink so we can move up...

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45817593/ns/local_news-cleveland_oh/#.TvzI3tQV1fZ

 

Cleveland makes list of drunkest cities

Gotta be related to the Browns.