Come on, KJP.

 

I get your larger point. Of course that's the case and of course there are bigger problems that need to be addressed.

 

But adding an 1/8 of a mile to a route, which would provide access to a vibrant neighborhood where it is now not safely provided, is fiscally impossible? Give me a break.

 

If you like, I'll scrutinize other routes and come up with an in-kind 1/8th mile to eliminate that won't adversely affect access. It will take some time, though, because I only ride 10 or so buses regularly, and usually not the length of them.

It's the same reason RTA refused to extend the Lakewood Circulator bus from the West 117th Station just 2,000 feet south on West 117th to the huge new Giant Eagle and Target store at I-90.

 

You can say "come on, KJP" all you want. But that won't change RTA policy, state transit policy or federal transit policies that are forcing reductions in service, not expansion. Sorry.

Jerry: Please tell me KJP is being ridiculous and this doesn't actually represent RTA's position on the matter.

 

(Why do I feel like I'm about to be let down?)

 

I think everyone understands there is a lack of funding.

 

Yet, even with that established, it does not excuse lack of service to a budding area while maintaining service to others.

 

I suppose one could excuse all of RTA's moves with "lack of funding."  I do not.  Driver runs over pedestrian?  Lack of funding to properly train drivers.  Dirty rapid tracks (which I actually do not care about)?  Lack of funding.  Inability to collect fares?  Lack of funding. etc etc etc

 

The next question: "Well, which routes would you eliminate?"  I have no idea.  I do not work for RTA, and they likely know better than I. 

 

However, only if every area currently being served is more important than the discussed area, then one can legitimately say "lack of funding." 

Are there any other sources for funding that RTA hasn't thought of yet?

 

I mean, this could be an opportunity for the leadership to not let these excuses get them down and actually try and think outside of the box.

Just to clarify my position...I would rank top service areas of importance:

 

1. Where people live who depend most on public transit

1. Where jobs those people work at.

 

 

After that, I'd say most popular destinations would probably be next, as well as destination neighborhoods, of which I'd include Waterloo (along with Ohio City, Shaker Square, Tremont, Detroit Shoreway, etc. etc. etc.)

Are there any other sources for funding that RTA hasn't thought of yet? I mean, this could be an opportunity for the leadership to not let these excuses get them down and actually try and think outside of the box.

 

"actually try and think outside the box"...apparently, you assume that we have not been thinking that way, which is just not true.

 

When Joe Calabrese took over, RTA was both a tenant and a landlord. Now, we are only a landlord, we do not rent from anyone.

 

Pepsi and food machines at major facilities produce revenue.

 

Selling naming rights to the HealthLine, and some stations, produces millions of dollars of revenue.

 

The Park-and-Ride lots charge more, because they are a premium service. Again, more revenue.

 

Do you know who designed the trolleys we use, and the BRT vehicles? RTA did, and now that manufacturers are producing those vehicles for other cities, we are getting "a piece of the action."

 

There may be other instances, but those are the only ones that come to mind now.

 

Before coming to Cleveland, Calabrese was named one of the most innovative transit managers in the nation. You do not win awards like that by thinking in the box.

 

Some people think outside the box. Others are still looking for the box.

 

I hope this answered your question.

Are there any other sources for funding that RTA hasn't thought of yet?

If you can think of a funding source that RTA hasn't thought of, please do share.

Jerry: Please tell me KJP is being ridiculous and this doesn't actually represent RTA's position on the matter. (Why do I feel like I'm about to be let down?)

 

Let me respond generically, rather than specifically.

 

1. More than 280 salaried staff just took a 3 percent wage cut (on top of not getting any pay increases earlier in the year).

 

2. An hour of RTA service costs about $100. Yes, something may only be "a few minutes off the route", but you have to multiply that change by the hundreds of time each year that an RTA vehicle makes the change. The numbers add up quickly.

 

3. If all RTA money is being spent (and it is), then to add service in Parma, you have to reduce service in Euclid. That is easier said than done.

 

KJP does not speak for RTA, but he has been around long enough to understand why we do what we do. Generally, his comments are on the mark.

Are there any other sources for funding that RTA hasn't thought of yet?

If you can think of a funding source that RTA hasn't thought of, please do share.

 

Honestly, that's why I asked the question.

 

Jerry, I'm not attacking RTA necessarily, and I hope my comments weren't seen as such. I was just honestly posing the question because I honestly didn't know, and I was just looking to open it up to discussion. I'm not going to take for granted that a transit agency is doing all it can to find funding sources because generally I'm quite jaded and cynical towards government/public agencies, and when I keep hearing the same line over and over again, I immediately wonder if that's just an excuse, or if every avenue really is being exhausted.

 

At the same time, I'm the first to admit that I don't know all there is to know about transit funding and how that whole process works, and I know RTA's resources are limited. It's probably a bit of a Catch-22 situation. Ultimately, it just feels unfortunate that so much of the funding has to come from government sources, but in this economy, funding period is probably difficult from ANY sources.

EDIT: Nevermind...I'm going to just writeup a proposal rather than typing it here.

I can't solve the money problem, but I understand where you're coming from AMN.  I've been considering a move to Shaker Square, but lack of 24-hr transit access is an absolute dealbreaker.  Take away its transit and Shaker Square becomes remarkably isolated.  This is something I investigated on foot over the weekend.  It's a neighborhood which, by design and by placement, sinks or swims based on its transit access.

AMN- I agree about Waterloo deserving better service, but it may be wishful thinking at this point.  I do know that when I was at Northeast Shores, I was pursuing a grant from RTA for Transit Waiting Environments along Waterloo in conjunction with the Waterloo Streetscape Plan.  The district is beginning to draw more interest, and better public transit would definitely be an asset.  That, and a crackdown on the Lakesho Boyz, would make a big difference in my old neighborhood.

Start: Jun 9 2009 - 7:00pm

End: Jun 9 2009 - 8:30pm

Location

Cleveland Heights Community Center

One Monticello Blvd at Mayfield Road

Cleveland Heights, OH

United States

The design of a new Red Line rail station at University Circle will be the topic of a community meeting. The rail station, operated by the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority (RTA), is at 11150 Cedar Ave., near the border of Cleveland and Cleveland Heights.

 

Design architect Merhdad Yazdani will present his design concept. Residents who cannot attend the meeting can view the project summary. They can e-mail comments to RTA’s Maribeth Feke, or write to her at RTA, 1240 W. Sixth St., Cleveland, OH 44113.

I can't solve the money problem, but I understand where you're coming from AMN. I've been considering a move to Shaker Square, but lack of 24-hr transit access is an absolute dealbreaker. Take away its transit and Shaker Square becomes remarkably isolated. This is something I investigated on foot over the weekend. It's a neighborhood which, by design and by placement, sinks or swims based on its transit access.

 

Great!  Now we will have to listen to MTS whine about your post whenever he gets back from wherever he is!  Thanks alot!! ;)

 

I suppose one could excuse all of RTA's moves with "lack of funding."  I do not.  Driver runs over pedestrian?  Lack of funding to properly train drivers.  Dirty rapid tracks (which I actually do not care about)? 

 

Actually, you should care because that kind of dirtiness, which I haven't seen ever before on the RTA Rapid, esp along Shaker Blvd, is creeping into other parts of the system: dirty stations (W.25-Ohio City) and dirty cars (Blue and Green lines)... And you're dead on, the lack of funding excuse shouldn't be a catchall for such nonsense, particularly in light of the embarrassing Rapid-non fare collection article; practices that have gone on for years which, no doubt, has cost RTA millions of valuable dollars.  Yes, we need to pressure Ohio pols to get off their checkbooks, but RTA certainly needs to clean up its house (literally/figuratively) as well.

I witnessed something on the bus ride home yesterday that ive never seen before while riding with the RTA. Ive seen many wheelchair's/hoverrounds on RTA busses but yesterday was the first time ive ever seen the driver get out of the drivers seat and secure the chair with the belt around the wheels. I know the belts are on every  bus but is it not required of drivers to secure the chairs?

Also, can the RTA please take off those ridiculous "America's Greatest Transit Agency" decals from 2007?

 

Please stop boasting about it if you're not the award holder for the current year in which we live. It's embarassing.

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/06/rta_construction_manager_charg_1.html

 

RTA construction manager Faisal Alatrash charged with taking kickbacks

 

Posted by Peter Krouse, The Plain Dealer June 10, 2009 11:53AM

 

CLEVELAND — A Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority construction manager was charged with taking kickbacks from contractors and requiring prospective contractors to do free repairs to his home.

 

......

Notwithstanding today's events (which I will refrain from commenting on, as I know only as much about the specifics of them as all of you do), I wanted to let everyone know that RTA is exploring the use of various social media tools to communicate with and reach out to the public. One of the first of these is YouTube, where we've set up a channel at http://www.youtube.com/user/GreaterClevelandRTA.

 

The first items we've placed out there are the 15-second video spots that we started running locally in April, which will be television broadcast through the end of this month. The internet being what it is, we decided to give these pieces an online home to ensure their longevity, and I encourage our supporters to embed them, share them, spread the message, and by all means give us feedback through the comments (keeping it relevant to the videos, please).

 

This is just the first part of a more generalized outreach effort RTA will be making throughout the remainder of this year. Readers here on urbanohio are the first (okay, second -- our Citizens' Advisory Board was first) group to hear about this.

Thanks, JeTDoG. We appreciate it.

Good stuff! Ill defo put them on the facebook

The first items we've placed out there are the 15-second video spots that we started running locally in April, which will be television broadcast through the end of this month. The internet being what it is, we decided to give these pieces an online home to ensure their longevity, and I encourage our supporters to embed them, share them, spread the message, and by all means give us feedback through the comments (keeping it relevant to the videos, please).

 

I love these! Very nicely designed and humorous. Keep it up!

Can't watch them right now, but love the idea.

Can I ask who put those 15 second spots together?

Those are really awesome! 

Yeah I saw those on local TV and thought finally somebody knows how to do marketing around here.  Get these same people doing marketing for the city and you have a fighting chance.

Can I ask who put those 15 second spots together?

 

Brokaw is the agency handling RTA's current marketing (at least some of it, I know they did those posters on the Trolleys, some radio spots, and these TV spots). 

 

http://www.brokaw.com/

http://www.youtube.com/user/ringerbrokaw

Edited by moderation for trolling/content inconsistent with the constructive intent of this thread. - Robert Pence

^ I really like that avatar.

This isn't the video we're talking about, is it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VHYZCHO57E&NR=1

 

Okay. We get it. You don't like the beeping buses. It's time to move on.

 

Thanks.

touchy little group on here!  wow...

 

Why doesn't RTA post those short commercials on their website?  A little promotion is a good thing.  how are people going to see them on the ad agency's website?

Because RTA was giving YouTube and UrbanOhio first crack at giving them feedback. Patience, young man. Beep, beep, beep, beep....  :-o

 

Notwithstanding today's events (which I will refrain from commenting on, as I know only as much about the specifics of them as all of you do), I wanted to let everyone know that RTA is exploring the use of various social media tools to communicate with and reach out to the public. One of the first of these is YouTube, where we've set up a channel at http://www.youtube.com/user/GreaterClevelandRTA.

 

The first items we've placed out there are the 15-second video spots that we started running locally in April, which will be television broadcast through the end of this month. The internet being what it is, we decided to give these pieces an online home to ensure their longevity, and I encourage our supporters to embed them, share them, spread the message, and by all means give us feedback through the comments (keeping it relevant to the videos, please).

 

This is just the first part of a more generalized outreach effort RTA will be making throughout the remainder of this year. Readers here on urbanohio are the first (okay, second -- our Citizens' Advisory Board was first) group to hear about this.

touchy little group on here!  wow...

 

Why doesn't RTA post those short commercials on their website?  A little promotion is a good thing.  how are people going to see them on the ad agency's website?

 

You're new here, so I'll cut you a little slack. Any perceived "touchiness" is likely a response to the dead horse you chose to further beat. Moving along...

 

Those videos being posted on YouTube was just the first of many steps to be taken. Frankly, far more benefit will likely be gained by those YouTube-hosted videos being embedded in OTHER web sites -- sites where transit might not normally even be a second thought, but where these videos can possibly provioke interest, or conversation. This doesn't mean that they won't make their way onto RTA's main site, or one of RTA's other internet properties, eventually. If anything, posting them on YouTube is an enabling step for this to happen.

 

Thank you for your interest.

This isn't the video we're talking about, is it?

 

 

 

Oh my god, that is the most annoying sound everywhere. I see some RTA buses drive by my neighborhood/have seen some driving around downtown recently and have not yet heard that racket.

The ads are very good though!  Very simply, but creative and interesting.  Get those babies on TV!

The ads are very good though! Very simply, but creative and interesting. Get those babies on TV!

 

They have been on TV since April

Let's move on shall we?

Jerry/JetDog -

 

I had a particularly awful ride on the #9 this morning....  The one that leaves Tower City at 7:59am just got a new driver.  Now I can't tell if she's new new or just new to the route and the buses from 2008, but it's one of those two.

 

While I appreciate her regard for safety, she honked multiple times at every single intersection and crosswalk in addition to the wee-ooos when stopping (even at the healthline stations).  I thought my ears were going to bleed.  Even my ipod (which can drown out the wee-ooos without deafening myself) can't drown out the bus horn, and I was even sitting towards the back of the bus!

 

The other reason that leads me to believe she was new was her stomping on the break pedal.  I just about darn near got launched out of my seat at least five times over a twenty minute ride.  In addition, she missed the bus signal at Stokes and Euclid cause she was playing with her announcer computer thingy, so we sat there for ten minutes.  Then she blew past the Adelbert station (after sitting at Adelbert and Euclid through a green light talking to a dispatcher or someone on the bus phone) and I had to start screaming at her to stop.

 

I don't want to get this woman in trouble or anything, but I don't think I (or any of the other passengers) can tolerate the honking every day.  Please make it stop!

 

In addition, we got lucky and were on good old bus 2831....  Bus 2831 (which I think only serves the #9 route) sounds and shakes like a mack truck.  I don't know what's wrong with it, but it sounds pretty awful for only being a year or two old.

 

Finally, I was wondering what is up with the announcer computers on the #9 (regardless of the exact bus).  They tend to announce a few of the stops downtown as well as a few in University Circle but nothing in between.....

 

Okay, end rant.  Just not quite the way I wanted to start my Friday!

Jerry/JetDog -

 

I had a particularly awful ride on the #9 this morning....

 

-- edited for space --

 

Okay, end rant.  Just not quite the way I wanted to start my Friday!

 

Doc-

 

Your PM box comes up as full, so I couldn't message you offline. Please clean your inbox out a bit so we can discuss further.

^I concur with her honking at every intersection sentiment.  The lengths RTA is going to prevent pedestrian accidents is getting to be a little much.  I noticed the Healthline buses have been used in a lot of training lately and they are honking at every intersection.  Why can't they just use the much more pleasent 'ding ding ding' of the bell to alert pedestrians?

 

I have overheard people on the street complaining about the annoying RTA buses after they honk their way through the intersection.  This policy is hurting RTA's image.

Jerry/JetDog -

 

I had a particularly awful ride on the #9 this morning....

 

-- edited for space --

 

Okay, end rant.  Just not quite the way I wanted to start my Friday!

 

Doc-

 

Your PM box comes up as full, so I couldn't message you offline. Please clean your inbox out a bit so we can discuss further.

 

I cleaned out mine, but I tried to PM you, and it says yours is full too.  So try to PM me again, but if it tells you mine is still full, then there's a server problem.....

Has RTA considered that all these measures might DECREASE community confidence in bus safety?  Their persistence in the face of noise pollution complaints makes them seem frighteningly necessary.  It implies that RTA drivers have two choices:  run people over, or drive an alarm clock down the street at all hours.  No middle ground. 

 

And has anyone considered that this does nothing to protect deaf people from getting run over?  Henceforth, I demand that each RTA vehicle be equipped with multi-directional strobe lights and disco balls instead of standard turn signals.  If it doesn't attack the peripheral vision of everyone nearby, we might as well just use cow-catchers and be done with it.

 

The honking during turns seems downright reckless.  Honking can make other drivers freeze up, assuming their current trajectory has become dangerous, hence the honking.  It's a boy who cried wolf problem.  Horns are supposed to indicate immediate danger, not the fact that someone is making a routine turn. 

 

Seriously, I'm not sure RTA's safety department thought this through.  It's primary effect is to punish those who use or live near a bus route.  That is not a good long-term strategy for RTA.

Has RTA considered that all these measures might DECREASE community confidence in bus safety? Their persistence in the face of noise pollution complaints makes them seem frighteningly necessary. It implies that RTA drivers have two choices: run people over, or drive an alarm clock down the street at all hours. No middle ground.

 

And has anyone considered that this does nothing to protect deaf people from getting run over? Henceforth, I demand that each RTA vehicle be equipped with multi-directional strobe lights and disco balls instead of standard turn signals. If it doesn't attack the peripheral vision of everyone nearby, we might as well just use cow-catchers and be done with it.

 

The honking during turns seems downright reckless. Honking can make other drivers freeze up, assuming their current trajectory has become dangerous, hence the honking. It's a boy who cried wolf problem. Horns are supposed to indicate immediate danger, not the fact that someone is making a routine turn.

 

Seriously, I'm not sure RTA's safety department thought this through. It's primary effect is to punish those who use or live near a bus route. That is not a good long-term strategy for RTA.

 

This wasn't just honking during turning this morning.  It was honking when crossing every intersection or crosswalk on Euclid Avenue. 

The honking is extremely irritating.  I have several friends who bought condos in the Park Building and they are all going nuts.  Actually I can hear it out my apartment building right now.

Jet Dog, I sure as he!! hope that this is not a dead horse we are beating. Please tell me that you're not turning a deaf ear, yes pun intended, to your clients.  This beeping is probably your most serious issue that you have to deal with.  Obviously you will think I'm over reacting, and that funding, or paying off your dead clients is more important, but every one of your clients, i.e. riders, every time they ride the bus are being pissed off by this beeping.  Not only that but your pissing off any future clients that may happen to live, work, or be in the vicinity of your routes.  I've written the RTA multiple times and gotten responses that this is the new policy and they are still working on it.  This is a quality of life issue in the city and maybe it's time to take it to the Mayor.  Community of choice is not what comes to mind with all this beeping.  And no I don't think we have to move on to another subject, until this one gets remedied.

Jet Dog, I sure as he!! hope that this is not a dead horse we are beating. Please tell me that you're not turning a deaf ear, yes pun intended, to your clients.  This beeping is probably your most serious issue that you have to deal with.  Obviously you will think I'm over reacting, and that funding, or paying off your dead clients is more important, but every one of your clients, i.e. riders, every time they ride the bus are being pissed off by this beeping.  Not only that but your pissing off any future clients that may happen to live, work, or be in the vicinity of your routes.  I've written the RTA multiple times and gotten responses that this is the new policy and they are still working on it.  This is a quality of life issue in the city and maybe it's time to take it to the Mayor.  Community of choice is not what comes to mind with all this beeping.  And no I don't think we have to move on to another subject, until this one gets remedied.

 

The issue has been identified, your objections are noted, and ALL input (including that of those in favor of the action that has already been taken) is being considered as this policy is further refined. You have voiced your objections to the appropriate parties, and now seem to be upset that you haven't immediately gotten your way. The use of absolutes in your statements belies your self-centeredness, which is unfortunate. I would hope you would be as open to compromise as you desire us to be.

 

My input on this topic is done.

Jet Dog, I sure as he!! hope that this is not a dead horse we are beating. Please tell me that you're not turning a deaf ear, yes pun intended, to your clients. This beeping is probably your most serious issue that you have to deal with. Obviously you will think I'm over reacting, and that funding, or paying off your dead clients is more important, but every one of your clients, i.e. riders, every time they ride the bus are being pissed off by this beeping. Not only that but your pissing off any future clients that may happen to live, work, or be in the vicinity of your routes. I've written the RTA multiple times and gotten responses that this is the new policy and they are still working on it. This is a quality of life issue in the city and maybe it's time to take it to the Mayor. Community of choice is not what comes to mind with all this beeping. And no I don't think we have to move on to another subject, until this one gets remedied.

 

The issue has been identified, your objections are noted, and ALL input (including that of those in favor of the action that has already been taken) is being considered as this policy is further refined. You have voiced your objections to the appropriate parties, and now seem to be upset that you haven't immediately gotten your way. The use of absolutes in your statements belies your self-centeredness, which is unfortunate. I would hope you would be as open to compromise as you desire us to be.

 

My input on this topic is done.

 

Psst!  It still says your inbox is full, so I can't reply to your message :(.

Psst! It still says your inbox is full, so I can't reply to your message :(.

 

Nor can I personally reassure you of the excellent job you're doing, despite the lack of run support you've been getting from the operations side.

Yup, that sounds like the same response I got before.  I'm not sure how I'm self centered, why the personal attack?  It sounds like a heck of a lot more people than just I are not in favor of this solution.  I'm speaking up for my neighbors and other people who can't stand this not just myself.  I really appreciate that this forum is here and that RTA frequents it to hear complaints and compliments.  And because it's here I'm going to continue to use it. and other venues.  The worst thing is that I'm a huge proponent of RTA.  I have applauded their service and lauded the fact that they were voted best Mass Transit to anybody that would listen.  Now that I have a complaint I shouldn't be as free to voice my concerns?

 

I am definitely open to compromise.  When I first voiced my concern I was told they had many complaints and that they were looking at working on the noise level.  I thought, well at least they're trying to listen to the comments and even though it's not no noise it's less. Since than they have strongly enforced the three horn honk rule and all busses are beeping.  I'm not sure that's a compromise.  Also how have you addressed concerns of the deaf or hard of hearing.  Many residents and riders are elderly and how does this protect them?  To me a compromise would be working out the kinks to get rid of the horn honking and only use the beep system at turns, not at every stop.  If the system was revamped to not go on when busses put their turn signal to change lanes or hazards at stops that would go a long way in removing a good portion of the noise.

 

Lastly if the argument is that this is being done for safety isn't there other things that can be done.  If this has no relation to the person being killed, as RTA has stated, than why does it directly address that situation that happened, but not any other safety issues.  I feel for that family and all people hurt by busses and do care that people would be made safer, IF there was any proof that the positive outweighed the negatives.