Still love the above "reality" picture!  Ha!

Cite an article or some research, tedolph.

 

I think he was referring to this... Which was mentioned in the Cleveland Economy thread. Otherwise Im seeing a question.   http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2010/08/sales_tax_collections_up_this.html

 

Hey, with Cuyahoga County sales taxes up by 2%, does that mean RTA is heading out of the woods?

 

RTA has presented something before along the lines that even with 1% or 2% sales tax increases, it will take until 2014 to get back to 2007 funding levels (and then be faced with 2014 costs).

 

so, it is a good thing for sure as to no immediate cuts, but it won't allow for any restoration of service.

Cite an article or some research, tedolph.

 

I read it somewhere. 

 

 

Is that good enough? What is this, my PhD. dissertation defense?

No, because this is how baseless rumors start. And we're not going to do that here.

Tedolph probably got it from here:

 

 

 

http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2010/08/sales_tax_collections_up_this.html

 

Sales tax collections up this year in Ohio

 

"Sunday's Numbers, a weekly feature from The Plain Dealer

 

2.5 percent: County sales tax collections are up 2.5 percent this year for the 80 Ohio counties that have not changed their rates from the same period last year. Some $529 million was collected through May and distributed to the counties through July.

 

2 percent: Size of the increase in sales tax collections for Cuyahoga County, or $1.7 million over the five months....."

Thanks, TBideon. Now that is how we do things here.

 

My thinking is that 2% is too small of an increase to impact GCRTA operations.

Someone asked in the Browns thread if the Waterfront Line would be open for tonight's game. That got me wondering about that and the schedules for all Labor Day weekend events. Here's the answer I found....

 

http://www.riderta.com/nu_newsroom_releases.asp?listingid=1489

 

News & Updates: Newsroom

 

RTA News

August 30, 2010

Let RTA take you to Labor Day events in Cleveland

 

CLEVELAND – The Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority (RTA) wants to take you to a host of fun events leading up to and during Labor Day weekend. Save traffic hassles and parking fees – leave the driving to RTA.

 

 

Thursday, September 2, 2010 – Cleveland Browns vs. Chicago Bears

The final pre-season game starts at 8:00 p.m. Buy an All-Day pass for $5, which gets you to and from the game – and includes any transfers.

 

 

How to Ride RTA to Browns Stadium, Waterfront Line, West Third Station

HealthLine to Tower City/Public Square, transfer to Waterfront Line

Green/Blue Lines: Stay on train all the way to West Third Station

Red Line: Transfer at Tower City to Waterfront Line, exit at West Third Station

Bus: Many bus routes serve downtown on Saturdays, transfer at Public Square/Tower City to the Waterfront Line

 

 

Service will be available on the Waterfront Line starting several hours before the game and after the game until all the crowds are cleared from the platforms.

 

 

Friday through Monday, September 3 - 6 -- Taste of Cleveland

At the Time-Warner Cable Amphitheater at Tower City, 1887 West Third St. Hours are 11:00 a.m.-11:00 p.m. on Friday; noon to 11:00 p.m. on Saturday and Sunday, and noon – 8:00 p.m. on Monday. The event features food from than 30 restaurants, and musical entertainment.

 

 

To reach the Taste of Cleveland:

 

Hop on the HealthLine and ride to Tower City.

Park for free at many rail stations on all lines and head to Tower City

Walk to the amphitheater south of Tower City

 

 

For more info: visit www.cleveland.com/tasteofcleveland or call 440-247-2722.

 

Saturday through Monday, September 4 - 6 -- Cleveland National Air Show

At Burke Lakefront Airport, 1501 North Marginal Road. Each day, gates open at 9:00 a.m. Show times are 10:00 a.m., noon and 2:00 p.m. Highlights include six U.S. Navy Blue Angels, and the U.S. Army Golden Knights parachute team.

 

From Tower City, ride RTA’s Waterfront Line to the North Coast Station, 1180 East Ninth St., and walk to the show. Follow same directions about going to Browns Stadium on how to get to Waterfront Line, and then exit at the East Ninth Street Station. Service on the Waterfront Line is every 15 minutes, from 9:00 a.m. to 6:30 p.m. Details on www.riderta.com.

 

For more information or to buy advance tickets, visit www.clevelandairshow.com, or call 216-781-0747.

 

All Weekend -- BODIES exhibit

The educational, eye-catching BODIES exhibit. Hours are: Sunday -Thursday, 10:00 a.m.-8:00 p.m. & Friday - Saturday, 10:00 a.m.-10:00 p.m. Buy an All-Day Pass for $5.00 that includes any transfers.

 

Ride any Rapid line (Red, Blue or Green) to Tower City.

Ride the HealthLine to Public Square, which operates 24/7 along Euclid Avenue.

From Tower City/Public Square, walk to 340 Euclid Ave., on East 4th St.

 

Tickets are $22 for persons age 13 and older, with discounts for children, seniors, students, the military, school groups and private groups. For more info: www.BodiesCleveland.com

 

For more information on getting to these events, fares & other related RTA information, please visit our website at www.riderta.com or call the RTAnswerline at 216.621.9500.

 

Have a happy and safe Labor Day weekend in Cleveland!

^ The Waterfront Line is open every weekend and for special events. The Tall Ships in July, and a Thursday night Browns game, (ride the WFL to see the NFL) are both special events.

 

The "weekend" includes Monday, Labor Day, so you can ride it all 3 days.

 

Have a great weekend.

Just an FYI (this is not posted on the RTA site), due to Warren Rd being closed from 90 north to Detroit for repaving work thru mid-October, the 83 is be rerouted from Warren and 90 along Marginal eastbound to Bunts (and along Lakewood Heights westbound from Bunts to Warren), then along Bunts to Detroit, then along Detroit over to Warren.

Did some of the buses stop talking?  Maybe I've just been oblivious and it happened a long time ago (cause who would notice silence, lol!), but I've definitely been in the presence of a few silent buses as of late!

I still hear them talking!

I still hear them talking!

 

There are definitely still some talking.  But there are definitely some not talking as well......

I still hear them talking!

 

There are definitely still some talking. But there are definitely some not talking as well......

 

Maybe they're just shy

Oh and I ride the health line everyday several times at all hours and I dont ever get checked for a pass. They need to do a better job checking in my opinion

Proof of pass purchase needs to be checked regularly...this is essential... Not occasionally. But this agency will never get it..Hence why I am no longer riding it... Just on the occasion. I support PT, not ineptness/complacency in overlooking the obvious things, though.

The RTA website says the university circle red line station construction is supposed to start in 2010.  Does anyone know if this is still the plan?

The RTA website says the university circle red line station construction is supposed to start in 2010.  Does anyone know if this is still the plan?

 

Design work is in progress and is expected to be completed early 2011. After funding sources are identified, construction will begin, probably in 2011 or 2012.

 

The Washinton Post ran a nice piece on Ohio City and the West Side Market on Friday.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/24/AR2010092404092.html

 

Their experience with RTA, while fairly typical, was not what you would want running in a national newspaper.

 

In the morning, we took the Red Line of the light-rail system, the Rapid, to the main Tower City station downtown. After a frustrating wait there, we determined that the Waterfront line, which runs near the Rock Hall, no longer operates on weekdays even though it's on all the system's maps. Nobody had bothered to put up a sign on the platform, and transit employees were dismissive. It turns out that most service on the line, always underused, was discontinued this year for budget reasons.

^ Exactly the kind of little things they miss that mean a lot. The attitude needs to change from the top on down...especially the dismissive one. And I also cannot figure out why many of these writers seem to have some kind of moral obligation to ink the usual Cleveland smears before giving the compliments. Its not creative writing...its just boring and tired. He "didn't expect"....as though where he is from is the only place that can have something interesting or original ideas. That attitude, in its own right is very peasant. The article had some good tones as well, naturally...  But if this guy could not find good produce around here, he was not looking in the right places. I'll bet they had some god awful gas and bloating when they got home.  :-o

Is there no conspicuous sign on the platform at Tower City on days that WFL isn't running?  If not, that is shameful.  That is a $100 fix (being generous).  Honestly, the maps should all say "weekend and special event service only" if they don't already.  Jerry, could you let us know how RTA lets visitors know that the WFL is not regular service?

Let us know how RTA lets visitors know that the WFL is not regular service?

 

I certainly understand your question. When I use transit in another city, most recently Boston, Chicago and Seattle, the first two things I do are read and ask. Check the Web site, check the timetable, and then ask the staff. The Waterfront Line printed timetables reflect the correct hours, as does the Web site. And, there are certainly always staff at Tower City to answer visitor queries. I am disappointed to hear the staff was "dismissive." I have seen many times when staff have seen riders waiting at the wrong spot (for all lines) and have directed them to the proper track.

 

Bottom line: While there are lots communications tools already in place, there may be a need for more.

Before implementing more "stuff," I think the question should be, are your EXISTING communications tools effective?

Agreed. 

^^ Spot on.

Let us know how RTA lets visitors know that the WFL is not regular service?

 

I certainly understand your question. When I use transit in another city, most recently Boston, Chicago and Seattle, the first two things I do are read and ask. Check the Web site, check the timetable, and then ask the staff. The Waterfront Line printed timetables reflect the correct hours, as does the Web site. And, there are certainly always staff at Tower City to answer visitor queries. I am disappointed to hear the staff was "dismissive." I have seen many times when staff have seen riders waiting at the wrong spot (for all lines) and have directed them to the proper track.

 

Bottom line: While there are lots communications tools already in place, there may be a need for more.

 

Thanks, Jerry for the reply.  OK, so I'm a visitor heading to Cleveland interested in using transit; I head to RTA's web site and I download the downtown transit map and the rapid system map- which, I suspect, is where lots of folks start when visiting other cities.  And I see zero indication on these maps that the WFL is weekend and special event only: http://www.riderta.com/pdf/maps/System_Map_Downtown.pdf; http://www.riderta.com/pdf/maps/System_Map_Rapid.pdf.  You're right that reviewing the timetable would show this, but I think that's asking a whole lot from your visitors.  I certainly never do this for midday subway/rapid transit service in other cities.

 

In any case, I don't think think you want to lean too hard on RTA's web site for visitors when its system maps still show several routes that were eliminated many months ago and omit crucial info.

 

They're definitely not sexy, but on-platform posters/sandwich boards, whatever, are the ultimate fool-proof communication tool :).

 

Are there printed system maps available anywhere, particularly in an easy location for visitors to find?

Are there printed system maps available anywhere, particularly in an easy location for visitors to find?

 

I got one at the RTA table at the Tall Ships Festival this past summer, but I've never seen them at any of the rapid stations (including Tower City) or on buses.  There is a large system map posted at Tower City, but it's outside the turnstiles, and like I said, I haven't seen any available for the taking.

I'm pretty sure I've seen maps available at Tower City, but it's been awhile since I was a rider now, so who knows.

Ill look for maps today

Does anyone besides me desperately wish for a free, E-line style trolley that goes to Ohio City and back?  Many times I have wanted to go to the places up there for lunch (and with Crop moving there at some point, even moreso), but there's no way to get there.  Back when I was an RTA rider with a monthly pass, I tried going there ONCE on the redline for lunch.  It took me a horribly long time to get there and back due to longer wait times for trains during the day. And now that I'm not a rider, well, I'm not going to pay to go to OC and back.  But this is such a vibrant pocket, and could be helped a lot by downtown lunchers - wouldn't this be a great place for a loop?

Does anyone besides me desperately wish for a free, E-line style trolley that goes to Ohio City and back? Many times I have wanted to go to the places up there for lunch (and with Crop moving there at some point, even moreso), but there's no way to get there. Back when I was an RTA rider with a monthly pass, I tried going there ONCE on the redline for lunch. It took me a horribly long time to get there and back due to longer wait times for trains during the day. And now that I'm not a rider, well, I'm not going to pay to go to OC and back. But this is such a vibrant pocket, and could be helped a lot by downtown lunchers - wouldn't this be a great place for a loop?

 

At a minimum, it would be good to get a trolley service going on the Market days (M,W,F) from 10am until 7pm or something to better connect the downtown office crowd with the market and surrounding restaurants. 

 

If OCNW / WSM / OC businesses could work out some sponsorship dollars, something like this might be doable - and it actually might be much cheaper if it wasn't an offical RTA service.

I dk if market traffic would really increase - most downtown workers don't have access to a fridge appropriate for this, and then have to cart it to your car in the parking lot at the end of the day, not sure how many people would do this.  This is why I quit going to the DT farmer's market after just a couple of visits - my stuff took up a huge amt of room in the work fridge, and then lugging it to the parking lot was a pain (let alone home on a bus or train if you are an RTA rider).  I imagine the downtown residents who are interested in the market are already riders and could take existing buses there?

I dk if market traffic would really increase - most downtown workers don't have access to a fridge appropriate for this, and then have to cart it to your car in the parking lot at the end of the day, not sure how many people would do this. This is why I quit going to the DT farmer's market after just a couple of visits - my stuff took up a huge amt of room in the work fridge, and then lugging it to the parking lot was a pain (let alone home on a bus or train if you are an RTA rider). I imagine the downtown residents who are interested in the market are already riders and could take existing buses there?

 

I think you just answered your own question. Setting up a new trolley route (much less a free route that would really only benefit those who aren't regular riders) for what is effectively a two-hour window each weekday would take resources from routes that already have demand doesn't make a lot of sense. Besides, from 11:50a to 12:05p, there are three buses that go from Public Square to the West Side Market.

People aren't going to pay to go to OC, and there are a LOT of non-RTA riders working downtown, but if there were a free trolley, I think more people would go there for the restaurants. Not for the market.

The Market is just the landmark that I used, esp. since it is in the center of all of the restaurants on W. 25th.

 

So, let me see if I understand this: you think that there should be a free trolley set up to run for two hours each day (since it wouldn't get that much use otherwise) for downtown workers who have the money to go eat at Great Lakes, Crop, or Bar Cento, but who don't want to ride the regular bus or pay money to get there.

Yes, actually, that's just what I think.  I mean, isn't that a similar purpose that the trolley serves that goes to the warehouse district? And Flying Fig and Leolai and Phnom Penh and Nate's and the burrito place and all the other restaurants up there in addition to the ones you've named, they would all benefit from the business.

The trolley that serves the Warehouse District also serves a dense mass of workers who are moving from business to business; it's not just for the lunchtime crowd and it's not a similar purpose to what you are proposing.

 

When I have a meeting across downtown, I hop on the trolley unless I have the time to walk or I have my bike.  The trolleys don't make sense without enough ridership throughout the entire day to sustain it, and presently, there are not enough offices or non-restaurant businesses in Ohio City to warrant such an investment.

You're probably right, it was just wishful thinking. As that area grows with restaurants, it's just a shame for both them and "us" (DT workers) that there isn't a free, easy way to connect there.  99.9% of the people I know do not park anywhere that has in/out privs.

I hear you RnR.  I would love to eat lunch at many Ohio City venues but it's just not practical.  And the $4 it would take to ride the RTA there and back just seems like a huge waste of money...like a cover charge just to go eat lunch.

 

Maybe Ohio City businesses should chip in for a Christie's-esq shuttle bus during lunch hours ;)

If the RTA shopper shuttles are any indication, $10,000 could get you a circulator running every 15 to 20 minutes between downtown and OC from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m.

Any idea how much the trolleys costs Dollar Bank? Is it similar?

I remember hearing those numbers at one time, so maybe they're available on the web someplace.

I think it would be great if there were better circulation between OC and downtown, even if it weren't free.  But for lunch groups, I'd think splitting a taxi by four would work pretty well too...just sayin'.

I understand that, but nobody I know is going to pay even $1 when there are places to go that are free, anymore than they paid to park and shop at Tower City instead of parking for free at the suburban mall.  And a cab both ways, I bet that would be $10 at least, plus tip making it $12.  It's not like a cab is $1.

If that $10,000 is an annual fee, then it may very well make sense for the restaurants in Ohio City to split the fee by either working through Ohio City Near West or by creating a Business Improvement District to fund this, if one doesn't exist already.

 

This assumes, of course, that the Ohio City restaurants aren't already full during lunch. In any case, this may make sense for not just Ohio City, but Tremont, Detroit Shoreway, or Asiatown to also implement. Of course, this would also take some business away from downtown restaurants.

I think an OC/Tremont loop would be awesome, but Tremont is much more spread out than the concentrated area of OC where the restaurants are, not sure if that would work - but maybe it would make more restaurants there open for lunch than are open now.

 

I don't assume the restaurants are empty, but I've certainly never seen Leolai full, or Nate's, or the WSM cafe, which I think is open every day.  As a note, the blurb in the Scene about Karen Small's take-away place she's started next to the Flying Fig is what prompted this, though I've thought about it a number of times.

work is actually being done on this... though its initial service would be weekend evening oriented.  here is a link to the survey:

 

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/entertainmentbusloop

 

I think once a service is instituted it would be easier to expand if it is working... at any rate if you think lunchtime is more beneficial, you can give your 2 cents on the survey.

thx!

It's more expensive than I thought. I found an article I wrote in April about weekly shopper shuttles in Lakewood and West Park. Each cost $30,000 for 6.5 hours of weekly service to subsidize what standard RTA fares couldn't cover. So if you wanted a free service, it would cost more than $30,000 for a 6.5 hours of weekly service. If a shuttle ran back and forth between Ohio City and downtown from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m. each weekday, that's 15 hours of weekly service.

 

So it's highly possible we're looking at about $100,000 for a free lunchtime circulator -- proof that there are, in fact, no free lunches!