Well I think it was all day yesterday. I had friends who got screwed by it late in the evening, and on my morning commute the workers were shouting westbound only at the ticket carousels. That was around 9am..on my train the conductor tried delivering a message but the PA was defective and I didn't realize something was up until my train came into Tower City on the wrong side.

 

I heard some overhead wires fell down east of TC.

I think RTA has a rider alert system that you can sign up for to get texts or emails about service issues which may be useful for cases like this.  Though I can't find anything on RTA's website about these service disruptions.

I think RTA has a rider alert system that you can sign up for to get texts or emails about service issues which may be useful for cases like this.  Though I can't find anything on RTA's website about these service disruptions.

 

There is a commuter alert service you can sign up for (which sent out multiple messages yesterday,) and they had a notification scrolling on the homepage of the website.  There wasn't (and isn't) anything in the "Rider's Alerts" section when you click "Important information," though.

Hey KJP - just got off the phone with RTA's press sec for an article I'm doing for the CSU rag and she confirmed they wanted to improve headways to 15 min but that has encountered significant delays due to some recent lightning damage near Brook Park and one other place that is critical to address first. So we're not talking 2012 anymore is my impression.

All trains (Red, Blue and Green) east of Tower City were halted yesterday. On the Red Line-west was running, and with just the three two-car trains that were trapped west of Tower City. So those three trains had to handle the afternoon rush hour when there's normally six trains. That meant 20-minute headways and jammed-packed trains. I was one of those jammed aboard, but it wasn't too terrible (except for that strong smell of an electrical fire -- in hindsight I should have taken down the railcar's number and reported it).

 

FYI, the wires came down somewhere between Tower City and the Central Rail Facility at East 55th. The weather was fine, so I was thinking -- what major construction project is occurring in that area? The only one I could think of is the Inner Belt project. If that was the cause, then this is ODOT's revenge against double-digit ridership growth on Ohio's only  rail transit system! Revenge, I tell you! :)

I think RTA has a rider alert system that you can sign up for to get texts or emails about service issues which may be useful for cases like this.  Though I can't find anything on RTA's website about these service disruptions.

 

There is a commuter alert service you can sign up for (which sent out multiple messages yesterday,) and they had a notification scrolling on the homepage of the website.  There wasn't (and isn't) anything in the "Rider's Alerts" section when you click "Important information," though.

 

How did you sign up?

 

How did you sign up?

 

http://commuteralerts.riderta.com/CommuterAlerts/Registration.aspx

Thanks!

 

All trains (Red, Blue and Green) east of Tower City were halted yesterday. On the Red Line-west was running, and with just the three two-car trains that were trapped west of Tower City. So those three trains had to handle the afternoon rush hour when there's normally six trains. That meant 20-minute headways and jammed-packed trains. I was one of those jammed aboard, but it wasn't too terrible (except for that strong smell of an electrical fire -- in hindsight I should have taken down the railcar's number and reported it).

 

FYI, the wires came down somewhere between Tower City and the Central Rail Facility at East 55th. The weather was fine, so I was thinking -- what major construction project is occurring in that area? The only one I could think of is the Inner Belt project. If that was the cause, then this is ODOT's revenge against double-digit ridership growth on Ohio's only  rail transit system! Revenge, I tell you! :)

 

One of the RTA workers I was chatting with just shrugged and said the overhead wires get the crap beat out of them all the time, chalking it up to wear and tear. I hope this doesn't happen often or I may need to do more than just bluster occasionally about relying on RTA...

We've been hearing about this lightning strike for some time now.  Enough time to replace every piece of hardware involved.  Do we have an estimate regarding the end of all lightning-related repairs?  Seems like an awfully long time for one lightning bolt to impair a public service of RTA's size and importance.

Hey KJP - just got off the phone with RTA's press sec for an article I'm doing for the CSU rag and she confirmed they wanted to improve headways to 15 min but that has encountered significant delays due to some recent lightning damage near Brook Park and one other place that is critical to address first. So we're not talking 2012 anymore is my impression.

The lightning damage to the signal system is what KJP was talking about.

I hope this doesn't happen often or I may need to do more than just bluster occasionally about relying on RTA...

 

I hear ya. Fortunately, it doesn't happen often. Maybe a couple times a year.

 

However, you will face a long-term issue when the S-Curve between the West 117th and West Boulevard stations is taken out of service to completely replaced the track-floor through the S-Curve's cut. There's a natural spring under there and the entire thing needs to be scooped out and replaced. That means no trains west of West Boulevard for about a month next spring....

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2012/05/post_23.html

I hope this doesn't happen often or I may need to do more than just bluster occasionally about relying on RTA...

 

I hear ya. Fortunately, it doesn't happen often. Maybe a couple times a year.

 

However, you will face a long-term issue when the S-Curve between the West 117th and West Boulevard stations is taken out of service to completely replaced the track-floor through the S-Curve's cut. There's a natural spring under there and the entire thing needs to be scooped out and replaced. That means no trains west of West Boulevard for about a month next spring....

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2012/05/post_23.html

 

Holy crap. And there is no decent commuter parking W of 117...yikes

On Thursday, due to an overhead catenary issue, the Operations Division provided rail replacement bus shuttles from Tower City to the eastern rail terminals.  The replacement service was provided from 12:30 PM until 7:00 PM.  The power had to be cut to all service east of East 55th St. This meant that Red Line on the west side could not be beefed up to the normal rush-hour strength.

 

RTA kept customers informed through the Web site scroller, NextConnect, Commuter Alerts, Facebook, Twitter, and put extra manpower on the street to help direct people.

The Red Line signal damage occurred on July 22, 2011. The frequency will increase as soon as repairs are done.

The Red Line signal damage occurred on July 22, 2011. The frequency will increase as soon as repairs are done.

 

That was over a year ago.  What is the status of the repair operation?

That was over a year ago.  What is the status of the repair operation?

 

Until Jerry returns Monday, here's some background on the scale of the repairs:

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2011/09/repairs_from_lightning_strike.html

I remember the PD article... It seems like $3M is (or should be) a drop in the bucket for the enormity of what this signal toward brings to the Red Line in terms of safety and speed.  I'm a bit mystified as to why it's still 1 1/4 later and we still don't know when this tower is going to be repaired and, thus, still can't plan for the needed increase in train frequency for a region that needs quality/improved transit service on so many econmic levels.  Perhaps I'm being unfair, but it just doesn't seem like there's the urgency at RTA to get this critical rail infrastructure fixed.

^ You are entitled to your opinion. Work started immediately to bring the system to a point when service -- even slow service -- could be handled safely. Then, a vendor was hired to assess the long-range repairs, and work began to make those repairs. It's much more than just the tower -- it's all rail systems from Puritas to the Airport -- a massive job. It's also all a matter of safety. RTA will increase rail service just as soon as we are assured that people can be carried safely.

So Jerry, is it safe to assume that part of the repairs is going to include an upgrade to the grounding wires so that this doesn't happen again?

So is the timeline indefinite?  Surely there's a plan of some sort.  The number of affected components is finite, while the process of changing them out is hardly without precedent.  I think it's fair to wonder what's going on after a calendar year has passed.

So is the timeline indefinite?  Surely there's a plan of some sort.  The number of affected components is finite, while the process of changing them out is hardly without precedent.  I think it's fair to wonder what's going on after a calendar year has passed.

 

So without understanding the scope of the damage how can you estimate the time it will take to repair?  also take into consideration that unlike your home when storm damages it insurance can cover the repairs.  I suspect that RTA had to front the repair costs internally with capital funds. since capital funds are not as infinite as we think they are it has to be budgeted and it takes time to complete.

 

I can agree that this is taking a long time too, but the system is really old, and needs lots of love, The the signal problem was the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

The underfunding of transit systems s a national problem, the balancing act between maintaining old systems while safely handling increasing demand for transit. 

These are good points, but none of them preclude scheduling a job.  And this is a very important job.  Presumably, someone who is paid to do so has already made efforts to understand the scope of the damage and estimate the time it will take to repair.  In a normal world-- not a perfect one--that task would have been accomplished by Labor Day 2011, from which point there would have been measurables on the table. 

 

If no measurables exist going into Year 2 of a project, then significant corrective action is advised. 

also take into consideration that unlike your home when storm damages it insurance can cover the repairs.  I suspect that RTA had to front the repair costs internally with capital funds. since capital funds are not as infinite as we think they are it has to be budgeted and it takes time to complete.

A portion of the cost was covered by insurance if I recall correctly.

 

It doesn't seem inappropriate to me to ask for an estimated timeline on the repairs now. A multiyear repair of damage from a lightning strike sounds abnormally long to the average person, so an occasional update on roughly how far along the work is would be helpful.

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

 

You and I both know that.  That is why I asked Cleburger the question, in that manner.

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

 

You and I both know that.  That is why I asked Cleburger the question, in that manner.

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

 

You and I both know that.  That is why I asked Cleburger the question, in that manner.

 

Sorry I did not know that actually.  I travel for a living and wasn't around when this happened.  I don't think you have to resort to snarky comments though.

Are the red line cars going to get their interiors refurbished anytime soon? They are hideous.

 

Plus there always seems to trash in the Red Line cars. I wonder if that is because of how crappy the interiors are. When I ride the Green/Blue lines which have far nicer interiors, I notice little to no trash, and a overall much cleaner car.

 

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

 

You and I both know that.  That is why I asked Cleburger the question, in that manner.

I'm no expert, but wouldn't there be some sort of Federal assistance available for damage caused by natural causes?    If there are funds to replace a levee post-hurricane in New Orleans, or a freeway bridge post-earthquake in Los Angeles, why should our damages via natural causes be precluded?

 

Question?  Did the Mayor, Governor or President declare this a natural disaster?

 

And that's the difference.

 

You and I both know that.  That is why I asked Cleburger the question, in that manner.

 

Sorry I did not know that actually.  I travel for a living and wasn't around when this happened.  I don't think you have to resort to snarky comments though.

 

Honey.  There was no snark. I asked you a specific question.  To me your question read as if RTA did not do enough, didn't have the know how to do better, etc. 

 

Who declares a disaster

Federal - the POTUS (FEMA)

State - Governor

County - Chief Elected official

Mayor - Local w/FEMA (This is a complicated mix)

 

I'm unsure how a lightening strike could be declared a "disaster"?  Even if we had a more complicated system, I wouldn't think it would fall under a "disaster" unless bundled with other issues.

Cleburger never said "disaster."  He seemed to be going out of his way to suggest a different type of program, and to avoid this very issue.  This is a classic straw man scenario.

 

It's not unreasonable to think there might be federal funds available when weather damage is bad enough to impair a large transit system for this long.  If I had to guess I'd say there probably isn't, but that's what insurance is for.  Either way, what we need is a plan. 

Cleburger never said "disaster."  He seemed to be going out of his way to suggest a different type of program, and to avoid this very issue.  This is a classic straw man scenario.

 

It's not unreasonable to think there might be federal funds available when weather damage is bad enough to impair a large transit system for this long.  If I had to guess I'd say there probably isn't, but that's what insurance is for.  Either way, what we need is a plan. 

 

Ding ding ding...we have a winner.  Thank you 327.

 

Moving on.

I checked. RTA's goal is to finish the repairs in November. I was told that part of the long process comes from ordering and then testing each signal control box. I am at home today, will not be checking this forum again until late Wednesday afternoon

 

Thanks for all your interest in the Red Line. Nobody wants the system up and running more than RTA.

Thanks Jerry!

I checked. RTA's goal is to finish the repairs in November. I was told that part of the long process comes from ordering and then testing each signal control box. I am at home today, will not be checking this forum again until late Wednesday afternoon

 

Thanks for all your interest in the Red Line. Nobody wants the system up and running more than RTA.

:clap:

Are the red line cars going to get their interiors refurbished anytime soon? They are hideous.

 

Plus there always seems to trash in the Red Line cars. I wonder if that is because of how crappy the interiors are. When I ride the Green/Blue lines which have far nicer interiors, I notice little to no trash, and a overall much cleaner car.

 

 

yes.  1 car is currently being outfitted and then will be tested for comments and then all red line cars will be have interiors redone.

 

- basically it will be the same color scheme as the blue/green line cars with gray walls/ceiling, dark gray flooring, and use the same or very similar seats to the blue/green line cars. 

- all new windows

- all fluorescent lights will be replaced by LEDs with new plastic lenses

- some seats will be removed at the ends of the cars to provide additional space for wheelchairs/bikes/luggage

- trashcans are being added to the cars

- working on possibly having digital destination signs in each car, but communications problems between cars and limited weathertight connections between cars may prevent this

- no plans to update speaker system or to add a digital stop sign within the cars, but this may change

 

there may be some kind of public display in the next few months to get rider feedback before all of the cars are done.  expected timeline was over the next year to complete the project.

 

overall, it should look and function much better.

Are the red line cars going to get their interiors refurbished anytime soon? They are hideous.

 

Plus there always seems to trash in the Red Line cars. I wonder if that is because of how crappy the interiors are. When I ride the Green/Blue lines which have far nicer interiors, I notice little to no trash, and a overall much cleaner car.

 

 

yes.  1 car is currently being outfitted and then will be tested for comments and then all red line cars will be have interiors redone.

 

- basically it will be the same color scheme as the blue/green line cars with gray walls/ceiling, dark gray flooring, and use the same or very similar seats to the blue/green line cars. 

- all new windows

- all fluorescent lights will be replaced by LEDs with new plastic lenses

- some seats will be removed at the ends of the cars to provide additional space for wheelchairs/bikes/luggage

- trashcans are being added to the cars

- working on possibly having digital destination signs in each car, but communications problems between cars and limited weathertight connections between cars may prevent this

- no plans to update speaker system or to add a digital stop sign within the cars, but this may change

 

there may be some kind of public display in the next few months to get rider feedback before all of the cars are done.  expected timeline was over the next year to complete the project.

 

overall, it should look and function much better.

 

any word on hanging or vertical bike racks on the redline cars?

 

when will the mock up be avialable for viewing?

Are the red line cars going to get their interiors refurbished anytime soon? They are hideous.

 

Plus there always seems to trash in the Red Line cars. I wonder if that is because of how crappy the interiors are. When I ride the Green/Blue lines which have far nicer interiors, I notice little to no trash, and a overall much cleaner car.

 

 

yes.  1 car is currently being outfitted and then will be tested for comments and then all red line cars will be have interiors redone.

 

- basically it will be the same color scheme as the blue/green line cars with gray walls/ceiling, dark gray flooring, and use the same or very similar seats to the blue/green line cars. 

- all new windows

- all fluorescent lights will be replaced by LEDs with new plastic lenses

- some seats will be removed at the ends of the cars to provide additional space for wheelchairs/bikes/luggage

- trashcans are being added to the cars

- working on possibly having digital destination signs in each car, but communications problems between cars and limited weathertight connections between cars may prevent this

- no plans to update speaker system or to add a digital stop sign within the cars, but this may change

 

there may be some kind of public display in the next few months to get rider feedback before all of the cars are done.  expected timeline was over the next year to complete the project.

 

overall, it should look and function much better.

 

any word on hanging or vertical bike racks on the redline cars?

 

when will the mock up be avialable for viewing?

 

vertical bike racks are probably not going to happen for 2 main reasons:

1) the way the structural elements are behind the panels make it difficult to mount a hanging rack without expensive retrofit

2) serious concerns about rain/snow/mud etc. on the walls of the cars

 

there was an expressed commitment to provide more space for bicycles and to provide some kind of a rack/tie down mechanism that will secure a bicycle.  these haven't been developed yet, but will be similar to something that is used often in Europe or the more basic caltrain tie down

 

i expect a car may be made available in a month or so for viewing.

^Great information!  I suspect the public display of the car would happen on the center rail on the red line side of Tower City Station?

Now why do vertical bike racks work in Minneapolis vs. here? Do they not have mud in Minny? And you can attach the racks to the vertical "grab" posts which are very strong.

 

Does anyone know if and when RTA will implement a Smart Card?

The Red Line trains really need it. Good timing from RTA.

Does anyone know if and when RTA will implement a Smart Card?

 

Not sure, but you are likely to get a response here from RTA representatives.

 

BTW, welcome to the board, bking1224!

Does anyone know if and when RTA will implement a Smart Card?

 

no time soon.  smartcard was always phase II of the ticket vending machine and new bus fare box roll out.  rta hasn't accepted phase I, so the design, testing, etc. for the smartcards hasn't even started and won't start until the other issues are worked out - screen flows and rusting machines are the most visible customer issues, but there are maybe a half dozen other back end data, communications, remote updating, and equipment issues as well.

 

in theory smartcards could go quickly once other machine issues are resolved, but seeing as it has taken more than 4 years and initial issues aren't resolved, it may be a while.

Question....after reading about this overhead wire issue would it be better to switch or is it even possible to switch to tracks and cars that conduct electricity without the wires but with the track themselves? It seems like this would solve a lot of issues

Does anyone know if and when RTA will implement a Smart Card?

 

no time soon.  smartcard was always phase II of the ticket vending machine and new bus fare box roll out.  rta hasn't accepted phase I, so the design, testing, etc. for the smartcards hasn't even started and won't start until the other issues are worked out - screen flows and rusting machines are the most visible customer issues, but there are maybe a half dozen other back end data, communications, remote updating, and equipment issues as well.

 

in theory smartcards could go quickly once other machine issues are resolved, but seeing as it has taken more than 4 years and initial issues aren't resolved, it may be a while.

 

This machine deal sounds increasingly scandalous.  What a mess.

Question....after reading about this overhead wire issue would it be better to switch or is it even possible to switch to tracks and cars that conduct electricity without the wires but with the track themselves? It seems like this would solve a lot of issues

It would solve some issue but create others such as being more dangerous for surface crossings. (Besides being crazy expensive to convert.)

PoshSteve, that article about the Cedar station was already posted at:

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,6956.msg641516.html#msg641516

Ridership highlights, through Sept. 1:

 

* Systemwide, Up 6.2 percent in August, 5.7 percent year-to-date.

* 17 straight months of growth

* Highest August ridership since 2009

* Since last year, average weekday ridership rose more than 10,000 trips

 

* HealthLine up 9 percent in August, 3.6 percent YTD.

* Red Line ridership up 16.3 percent in August, 10.7 percent YTD.

* Light rail flat in August, up 6.3 percent YTD

 

* Trolley ridership up 20 percent over last year, or more than 4,000 rides a day.

* YTD bike trips 29,403

Are the red line cars going to get their interiors refurbished anytime soon? They are hideous.

 

Plus there always seems to trash in the Red Line cars. I wonder if that is because of how crappy the interiors are. When I ride the Green/Blue lines which have far nicer interiors, I notice little to no trash, and a overall much cleaner car.

 

 

yes.  1 car is currently being outfitted and then will be tested for comments and then all red line cars will be have interiors redone.

 

- basically it will be the same color scheme as the blue/green line cars with gray walls/ceiling, dark gray flooring, and use the same or very similar seats to the blue/green line cars. 

- all new windows

- all fluorescent lights will be replaced by LEDs with new plastic lenses

- some seats will be removed at the ends of the cars to provide additional space for wheelchairs/bikes/luggage

- trashcans are being added to the cars

- working on possibly having digital destination signs in each car, but communications problems between cars and limited weathertight connections between cars may prevent this

- no plans to update speaker system or to add a digital stop sign within the cars, but this may change

 

there may be some kind of public display in the next few months to get rider feedback before all of the cars are done.  expected timeline was over the next year to complete the project.

 

overall, it should look and function much better.

 

any word on hanging or vertical bike racks on the redline cars?

 

when will the mock up be avialable for viewing?

 

vertical bike racks are probably not going to happen for 2 main reasons:

1) the way the structural elements are behind the panels make it difficult to mount a hanging rack without expensive retrofit

2) serious concerns about rain/snow/mud etc. on the walls of the cars

 

there was an expressed commitment to provide more space for bicycles and to provide some kind of a rack/tie down mechanism that will secure a bicycle.  these haven't been developed yet, but will be similar to something that is used often in Europe or the more basic caltrain tie down

 

i expect a car may be made available in a month or so for viewing.

 

Urban Life I have heard these Reasons before, I feel this is more of a copout than a valid reason.

 

I Actually developed a solution to all the issues About

 

here

 

The key was to use existing mounting points and to use rust proof materials.

 

the solution is simple.  I would be happy to build a mock-up for RTA.