I'm a frequent critic but I thought RTA handled the parade well, considering the enormity of the task.  On days like that we should feel lucky to have the system we have.

I'm a frequent critic but I thought RTA handled the parade well, considering the enormity of the task.  On days like that we should feel lucky to have the system we have.

 

On an operational basis I won't disagree, and those fallshorts we saw (noted above, the Sunday schedule being as usual) we don't know the story behind.

 

Promoting usage, especially when unprepared to handle new and casual users, was a PR error of major proportions. 

I don't want to extend the discussion about RTA's performance on the day of the parade, but I am tired of the endless bashing of a system that I think is well run with limited resources. As previously noted, I took RTA to work that day and had a reasonably good experience. Anyone with even the slightest bit of sense would know that RTA would be strained that day and would not, say, show up at Green Road at 9 a.m. and expect an easy trip to a downtown event scheduled for an 11 a.m. start with an expected attendance of anywhere from 500,000 to more than a million people. RTA has reported that it provided 500,000 rides on that day--more than three times its usual daily passenger count. Imagine if even half of those riders had decided to drive downtown. I wonder what transit systems are set up to handle more than three times their average daily load without showing any signs of strain or without any delays. Let us know if you know of one.

 

Well, you know what happens when people assume …

 

For the record: I was as impromptu as the parade.  I left a meeting late Tuesday in Philadelphia and then ran to the dealer to get my car from an oil change and hit the road for Cleveland at around 8p (last min airl8ines tics were just too expensive – could have handled it, but why?)  Arrived in C-Town at 2:15a; to bed by 3a and up at 7:45a.  As a vet of these trips, I know the Zombie thing doesn’t set in till around 5p, especially this day with my Cavs adrenaline rush…. Some in-town friends we planned to meet downtown, departed early.  Me and another friend who I ended up going down the celebration with, was in the same boat (he’d driven in from Chicago) so obviously we were not going downtown early.  My intent all along was to attend the rally, only, not the parade.  I figured, correctly, that the parade and rally would be seriously delayed by the crowds; we were following it on radio and, then, TV.  I know that going to the parade meant standing in one place watching people go by and not going anywhere else because of the crazy crowds.  Again, I was correct.  By the time we waited for the crowds to die down and the Rapid somewhat normal, again, we departed around Noon and STILL got there to see the parade coming down Lakeside and into Mall B where the rally view stage was, where we stayed for about 5 hours… So that’s my personal story from last Wednesday.

 

As for RTA, as one woman mentioned waiting for the Green Line said on the platform yesterday: if they had provided the level of service for St. Paddy’s day, it would have been much better.  She, like me, was wondering why RTA ran 1-car Blue/Green line trains around every 20-30 minutes all day…  My major issue with RTA is this: if there are just enough available, working LRT trains to run a normal rush hour and not something of the parade’s magnitude, which of course is a massive limited-time event, why not just say so?  The budget woes are old news, but RTA management is ducking and dodging the question about LRT replacement and the apparently dire situation of possible Blue/Green shutdowns because of it.  If that’s the case, just say it.  Then folks like me would be a little more understanding instead of RTA acting as if all systems are a go while encouraging the parade multitudes to utilize their trains.

 

I don't want to extend the discussion about RTA's performance on the day of the parade, but I am tired of the endless bashing of a system that I think is well run with limited resources. As previously noted, I took RTA to work that day and had a reasonably good experience. Anyone with even the slightest bit of sense would know that RTA would be strained that day and would not, say, show up at Green Road at 9 a.m. and expect an easy trip to a downtown event scheduled for an 11 a.m. start with an expected attendance of anywhere from 500,000 to more than a million people. RTA has reported that it provided 500,000 rides on that day--more than three times its usual daily passenger count. Imagine if even half of those riders had decided to drive downtown. I wonder what transit systems are set up to handle more than three times their average daily load without showing any signs of strain or without any delays. Let us know if you know of one.

 

Well, you know what happens when people assume

 

For the record: I was as impromptu as the parade.  I left a meeting late Tuesday in Philadelphia and then ran to the dealer to get my car from an oil change and hit the road for Cleveland at around 8p (last min airl8ines tics were just too expensive could have handled it, but why?)  Arrived in C-Town at 2:15a; to bed by 3a and up at 7:45a.  As a vet of these trips, I know the Zombie thing doesnt set in till around 5p, especially this day with my Cavs adrenaline rush. Some in-town friends we planned to meet downtown, departed early.  Me and another friend who I ended up going down the celebration with, was in the same boat (hed driven in from Chicago) so obviously we were not going downtown early.  My intent all along was to attend the rally, only, not the parade.  I figured, correctly, that the parade and rally would be seriously delayed by the crowds; we were following it on radio and, then, TV.  I know that going to the parade meant standing in one place watching people go by and not going anywhere else because of the crazy crowds.  Again, I was correct.  By the time we waited for the crowds to die down and the Rapid somewhat normal, again, we departed around Noon and STILL got there to see the parade coming down Lakeside and into Mall B where the rally view stage was, where we stayed for about 5 hours So thats my personal story from last Wednesday.

 

As for RTA, as one woman mentioned waiting for the Green Line said on the platform yesterday: if they had provided the level of service for St. Paddys day, it would have been much better.  She, like me, was wondering why RTA ran 1-car Blue/Green line trains around every 20-30 minutes all day  My major issue with RTA is this: if there are just enough available, working LRT trains to run a normal rush hour and not something of the parades magnitude, which of course is a massive limited-time event, why not just say so?  The budget woes are old news, but RTA management is ducking and dodging the question about LRT replacement and the apparently dire situation of possible Blue/Green shutdowns because of it.  If thats the case, just say it.  Then folks like me would be a little more understanding instead of RTA acting as if all systems are a go while encouraging the parade multitudes to utilize their trains.

 

 

You used the Rapid and, as you just said above, got to accomplish what you wanted to do. So where is the problem?

I don't want to extend the discussion about RTA's performance on the day of the parade, but I am tired of the endless bashing of a system that I think is well run with limited resources. As previously noted, I took RTA to work that day and had a reasonably good experience. Anyone with even the slightest bit of sense would know that RTA would be strained that day and would not, say, show up at Green Road at 9 a.m. and expect an easy trip to a downtown event scheduled for an 11 a.m. start with an expected attendance of anywhere from 500,000 to more than a million people. RTA has reported that it provided 500,000 rides on that day--more than three times its usual daily passenger count. Imagine if even half of those riders had decided to drive downtown. I wonder what transit systems are set up to handle more than three times their average daily load without showing any signs of strain or without any delays. Let us know if you know of one.

 

Well, you know what happens when people assume

 

For the record: I was as impromptu as the parade.  I left a meeting late Tuesday in Philadelphia and then ran to the dealer to get my car from an oil change and hit the road for Cleveland at around 8p (last min airl8ines tics were just too expensive could have handled it, but why?)  Arrived in C-Town at 2:15a; to bed by 3a and up at 7:45a.  As a vet of these trips, I know the Zombie thing doesnt set in till around 5p, especially this day with my Cavs adrenaline rush. Some in-town friends we planned to meet downtown, departed early.  Me and another friend who I ended up going down the celebration with, was in the same boat (hed driven in from Chicago) so obviously we were not going downtown early.  My intent all along was to attend the rally, only, not the parade.  I figured, correctly, that the parade and rally would be seriously delayed by the crowds; we were following it on radio and, then, TV.  I know that going to the parade meant standing in one place watching people go by and not going anywhere else because of the crazy crowds.  Again, I was correct.  By the time we waited for the crowds to die down and the Rapid somewhat normal, again, we departed around Noon and STILL got there to see the parade coming down Lakeside and into Mall B where the rally view stage was, where we stayed for about 5 hours So thats my personal story from last Wednesday.

 

As for RTA, as one woman mentioned waiting for the Green Line said on the platform yesterday: if they had provided the level of service for St. Paddys day, it would have been much better.  She, like me, was wondering why RTA ran 1-car Blue/Green line trains around every 20-30 minutes all day  My major issue with RTA is this: if there are just enough available, working LRT trains to run a normal rush hour and not something of the parades magnitude, which of course is a massive limited-time event, why not just say so?  The budget woes are old news, but RTA management is ducking and dodging the question about LRT replacement and the apparently dire situation of possible Blue/Green shutdowns because of it.  If thats the case, just say it.  Then folks like me would be a little more understanding instead of RTA acting as if all systems are a go while encouraging the parade multitudes to utilize their trains.

 

 

You used the Rapid and, as you just said above, got to accomplish what you wanted to do. So where is the problem?

 

As I said above, I had to wait until the crowds died down as they were running 1 car around every 30 minutes for a crowd that began leaving, taking buses or driving.  That's a problem.  And as I just stated, I wasn't aiming to see the parade but did want to get downtown just to establish a location but couldn't... and my problem wasn't nearly as acute as those who simply gave up and went home (or crowded buses).  Surely you're not saying this is: OK?

I don't want to extend the discussion about RTA's performance on the day of the parade, but I am tired of the endless bashing of a system that I think is well run with limited resources. As previously noted, I took RTA to work that day and had a reasonably good experience. Anyone with even the slightest bit of sense would know that RTA would be strained that day and would not, say, show up at Green Road at 9 a.m. and expect an easy trip to a downtown event scheduled for an 11 a.m. start with an expected attendance of anywhere from 500,000 to more than a million people. RTA has reported that it provided 500,000 rides on that day--more than three times its usual daily passenger count. Imagine if even half of those riders had decided to drive downtown. I wonder what transit systems are set up to handle more than three times their average daily load without showing any signs of strain or without any delays. Let us know if you know of one.

 

Well, you know what happens when people assume …

 

For the record: I was as impromptu as the parade.  I left a meeting late Tuesday in Philadelphia and then ran to the dealer to get my car from an oil change and hit the road for Cleveland at around 8p (last min airl8ines tics were just too expensive – could have handled it, but why?)  Arrived in C-Town at 2:15a; to bed by 3a and up at 7:45a.  As a vet of these trips, I know the Zombie thing doesn’t set in till around 5p, especially this day with my Cavs adrenaline rush…. Some in-town friends we planned to meet downtown, departed early.  Me and another friend who I ended up going down the celebration with, was in the same boat (he’d driven in from Chicago) so obviously we were not going downtown early.  My intent all along was to attend the rally, only, not the parade.  I figured, correctly, that the parade and rally would be seriously delayed by the crowds; we were following it on radio and, then, TV.  I know that going to the parade meant standing in one place watching people go by and not going anywhere else because of the crazy crowds.  Again, I was correct.  By the time we waited for the crowds to die down and the Rapid somewhat normal, again, we departed around Noon and STILL got there to see the parade coming down Lakeside and into Mall B where the rally view stage was, where we stayed for about 5 hours… So that’s my personal story from last Wednesday.

 

As for RTA, as one woman mentioned waiting for the Green Line said on the platform yesterday: if they had provided the level of service for St. Paddy’s day, it would have been much better.  She, like me, was wondering why RTA ran 1-car Blue/Green line trains around every 20-30 minutes all day…  My major issue with RTA is this: if there are just enough available, working LRT trains to run a normal rush hour and not something of the parade’s magnitude, which of course is a massive limited-time event, why not just say so?  The budget woes are old news, but RTA management is ducking and dodging the question about LRT replacement and the apparently dire situation of possible Blue/Green shutdowns because of it.  If that’s the case, just say it.  Then folks like me would be a little more understanding instead of RTA acting as if all systems are a go while encouraging the parade multitudes to utilize their trains.

 

 

You used the Rapid and, as you just said above, got to accomplish what you wanted to do. So where is the problem?

 

As I said above, I had to wait until the crowds died down as they were running 1 car around every 30 minutes for a crowd that began leaving, taking buses or driving.  That's a problem.  And as I just stated, I wasn't aiming to see the parade but did want to get downtown just to establish a location but couldn't... and my problem wasn't nearly as acute as those who simply gave up and went home (or crowded buses).  Surely you're not saying this is: OK?

 

I'm going back to my original point. This is a once in a half century event. Even Metro here in DC would have trouble handling those crowds on a weekday. Yet local governments here would still encourage people to use transit if there was parade in DC.

 

People gave up because they got going late. It happens. Could RTA do better? Sure. Could people have planned better? Sure. It's a complex situation but RTA, on the whole, didn't do so bad.

I don't want to extend the discussion about RTA's performance on the day of the parade, but I am tired of the endless bashing of a system that I think is well run with limited resources. As previously noted, I took RTA to work that day and had a reasonably good experience. Anyone with even the slightest bit of sense would know that RTA would be strained that day and would not, say, show up at Green Road at 9 a.m. and expect an easy trip to a downtown event scheduled for an 11 a.m. start with an expected attendance of anywhere from 500,000 to more than a million people. RTA has reported that it provided 500,000 rides on that day--more than three times its usual daily passenger count. Imagine if even half of those riders had decided to drive downtown. I wonder what transit systems are set up to handle more than three times their average daily load without showing any signs of strain or without any delays. Let us know if you know of one.

 

Well, you know what happens when people assume …

 

For the record: I was as impromptu as the parade.  I left a meeting late Tuesday in Philadelphia and then ran to the dealer to get my car from an oil change and hit the road for Cleveland at around 8p (last min airl8ines tics were just too expensive – could have handled it, but why?)  Arrived in C-Town at 2:15a; to bed by 3a and up at 7:45a.  As a vet of these trips, I know the Zombie thing doesn’t set in till around 5p, especially this day with my Cavs adrenaline rush…. Some in-town friends we planned to meet downtown, departed early.  Me and another friend who I ended up going down the celebration with, was in the same boat (he’d driven in from Chicago) so obviously we were not going downtown early.  My intent all along was to attend the rally, only, not the parade.  I figured, correctly, that the parade and rally would be seriously delayed by the crowds; we were following it on radio and, then, TV.  I know that going to the parade meant standing in one place watching people go by and not going anywhere else because of the crazy crowds.  Again, I was correct.  By the time we waited for the crowds to die down and the Rapid somewhat normal, again, we departed around Noon and STILL got there to see the parade coming down Lakeside and into Mall B where the rally view stage was, where we stayed for about 5 hours… So that’s my personal story from last Wednesday.

 

As for RTA, as one woman mentioned waiting for the Green Line said on the platform yesterday: if they had provided the level of service for St. Paddy’s day, it would have been much better.  She, like me, was wondering why RTA ran 1-car Blue/Green line trains around every 20-30 minutes all day…  My major issue with RTA is this: if there are just enough available, working LRT trains to run a normal rush hour and not something of the parade’s magnitude, which of course is a massive limited-time event, why not just say so?  The budget woes are old news, but RTA management is ducking and dodging the question about LRT replacement and the apparently dire situation of possible Blue/Green shutdowns because of it.  If that’s the case, just say it.  Then folks like me would be a little more understanding instead of RTA acting as if all systems are a go while encouraging the parade multitudes to utilize their trains.

 

 

You used the Rapid and, as you just said above, got to accomplish what you wanted to do. So where is the problem?

 

As I said above, I had to wait until the crowds died down as they were running 1 car around every 30 minutes for a crowd that began leaving, taking buses or driving.  That's a problem.  And as I just stated, I wasn't aiming to see the parade but did want to get downtown just to establish a location but couldn't... and my problem wasn't nearly as acute as those who simply gave up and went home (or crowded buses).  Surely you're not saying this is: OK?

 

I'm going back to my original point. This is a once in a half century event. Even Metro here in DC would have trouble handling those crowds on a weekday. Yet local governments here would still encourage people to use transit if there was parade in DC.

 

People gave up because they got going late. It happens. Could RTA do better? Sure. Could people have planned better? Sure. It's a complex situation but RTA, on the whole, didn't do so bad.

 

As I said, I understand thoroughly of RTA's financial troubles as well as the impromptu, unprecedented nature of the crowd.  Everybody in the City were flying by the seats of their pants.  I heard the Red Line and the buses were less problematic.  I just want some transparency regarding the LRT trains... This is ongoing and first raised months by Ken/AAO as well as Scene Magazine.  It seems, though, that the doo-doo hit the fan last Wednesday when services were severely restricted due to a railcar shortage... Given this, to me, it's not acceptable to simply pat RTA on the back for giving it the Ol' College Try under extreme circumstances when lesser events than the parade, even regular rush hour service, may be hampered by the current car failure/shortage.  I think the agency, esp Mr. Calabrese, have been less than forthcoming.  The riding public needs answers as well as some kind of plan for the future.

I'm going back to my original point. This is a once in a half century event. Even Metro here in DC would have trouble handling those crowds on a weekday. Yet local governments here would still encourage people to use transit if there was parade in DC.

 

People gave up because they got going late. It happens. Could RTA do better? Sure. Could people have planned better? Sure. It's a complex situation but RTA, on the whole, didn't do so bad.

 

I'll go along with this for now. 

 

But in the end,  I'd like to see the final number that RTA moved that day.  And I'd also like to hear what they actually did EXTRA to try to accommodate more passengers.  When I hear that #55 buses were heading back to the garage empty at 9 am, you have to wonder....  So far we've gotten public statements about the lack of funding for transit, something we all are very aware of.  Now let's hear the tales from RTA employees of what that day was like for them....

Got a voice-mail from Carl Monday yesterday. Apparently he's doing a story about the RTA cuts. Not sure what he's got up his sleeve...

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

I had been told that Forest City was not hot on the idea of increasing RTA signage around Tower City. RTA is well aware of the deficiencies there. I too hope we see that improved soon.

I had been told that Forest City was not hot on the idea of increasing RTA signage around Tower City. RTA is well aware of the deficiencies there. I too hope we see that improved soon.

 

Forest City didn't even want to celebrate the building's history at a major railroad terminal. There are a few momentos around, but you have to look carefully for them -- including one of the train departure signs that once stood atop the stairwells from the steam concourse down to track level.

^It's problematic when a private company adversely impacts the function of a public service entity as RTA.  Tower City, though a beautiful environment, is a labyrinth of different courts, levels, escalators and stairs that is confusing enough just to get around to its retail, restaurants, the Ritz, etc.  Now RTA is likely getting more casual riders to come enjoy downtown; even more so with the new/improved Public Square, which hopefully now will be more of a destination.  Let's hope this gets fixed.

 

From a non-copyrighted, nonprofit blog.....

 

The sorry state of public transit

Cavs celebration shows shortcomings of grossly underfunded system

 

Hundreds of thousands of people who trekked downtown for the spirited Cavaliers NBA Championship celebration last week were encouraged to take the RTA. Many did, and the public transit system was quickly overwhelmed. Lines to catch the Rapid Transit stretched the length of eight football fields. When the celebration ended, RTA users struggled to get home. At Tower City, people waited for hours for a train (see photo). A line of buses stretched a half-mile on Veteran's Memorial Bridge.

 

While our transit system is not designed to handle such a crush of people in a short period of time, the problems highlight shortcomings of our grossly underfunded public transit system.

 

Ohio is the seventh most populous state with the 14th highest public transit ridership rates, yet we rank 47th in public transportation funding. About 96 percent of public transportation spending funnels into urban cores, which is a good thing. But public transit represents less than 1 percent of Ohio's entire transportation budget. The most recent Ohio transit study conducted by the Ohio Department of Transportation concluded that Cleveland needs to enhance its public transit system to the same level as Portland, Oregon, and the rest of Ohio's mid-sized cities need to make their systems equivalent to Cleveland's current system. With Ohio choosing to spend only 63 cents per person on transit per year while neighboring states spend an average of $24 to $85 per person, the necessary public transit expansion is impossible with the current budget.

 

This is problematic as Ohio, specifically Cleveland, attempts to attract millennials to a downtown that is showing signs of a viable renaissance. Research from the National Association of Realtors shows millennials own fewer cars and drive less than their predecessors. "...[They] show a stronger preference than other generations for expanding public transportation and providing transportation alternatives to driving... ," according to the 2015 National Community and Transportation Preference Survey.

 

If the system were fully funded, the city would have 135 new buses to replace those that are past their useful life; new fiber optics to help the RTA control the rail system more efficiently; a new communication system, and a greater span of service that runs frequently during weekends and nights, RTA chief Joe Calabrese said in a phone interview with Policy Matters Ohio. Because Cleveland cannot offer this, it is unlikely that the city will be able to attract millennials long-term.

 

Even more important, we have long-time residents who don't own cars and struggle to commute without them. Cleveland recently ranked worst in the country in a report about the decline in proximity to jobs for urban residents.

 

It is unfortunate, then, that instead of addressing the intense need for public transportation, a significant chunk of money has been dedicated to building another highway. The Opportunity Corridor will transport people from Cleveland's outer-ring suburbs to University Circle. The Ohio Department of Transportation says this highway will create opportunity for "potential new economic development, new jobs and a new identity for the community."

 

However, it will not increase access to public transportation for the low-income neighborhoods it cuts through. More than 8 percent of Ohio households have no access to a car, while one in five African American households do not have access. What would happen if the money devoted to the Opportunity Corridor had instead been directed toward a streetcar in the same area?

 

There is already a $555.3 million gap between the current public transportation budget and what is needed, according to the Ohio Statewide Transit Needs Study -- this gap will grow to $904 million by 2025. In order to at least preserve Ohio's number of buses, a third of them need to be replaced now or will start costing more to maintain. At the moment, there is no plan for replacement. Research says public transit is the future for cities if they want to thrive. Why don't state leaders act on that knowledge?

 

If Cleveland had a fully funded public transportation system, the Cavs victory celebration would have still been a lot for it to handle. But, as the RTA Tweeted (@GCRTA) to an upset traveler: "We apologize for your delay. We know u are upset with us. We are over capacity & underfunded. We are working with what we have." If only it had more to work with.

 

-- Grace Billiter

 

Grace is a Policy Matters research intern.

I wish the RTA would be more visible from the street in downtown. I've always been a fan of the "GO BY STREETCAR" neon sign in Portland:

 

 

Even absent of that, how would you know Terminal Tower is a train station?

^Similarly, I wish there was some seriously bold signage on the rail bridges over Mayfield prominently marking the new LI station.

^Similarly, I wish there was some seriously bold signage on the rail bridges over Mayfield prominently marking the new LI station.

 

Or above Lorain at West Park station, which is a little bit hidden from view.

^It's problematic when a private company adversely impacts the function of a public service entity as RTA.  Tower City, though a beautiful environment, is a labyrinth of different courts, levels, escalators and stairs that is confusing enough just to get around to its retail, restaurants, the Ritz, etc.  Now RTA is likely getting more casual riders to come enjoy downtown; even more so with the new/improved Public Square, which hopefully now will be more of a destination.  Let's hope this gets fixed.

 

Forest City did not want to advertise for RTA and its riders; the fewer the better for its mall.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Wonder if Gilbert will promote RTA?  Now that he owns the Tower City Mall (The Avenue) it will be interesting to see how he uses the train station to promote his businesses.  Obviously the train station didn't help the mall and arguably, may have hurt it in the long-run given The Avenue's initial high-end retail base.

 

If airport passenger traffic picks-up enough it would be nice to have a shuttle train between the airport-Tower City.  One can hope but Cleveland is seeing a nice increase in visitor/tourist traffic; not sure what the numbers are at the airport though.

If airport passenger traffic picks-up enough it would be nice to have a shuttle train between the airport-Tower City.  One can hope but Cleveland is seeing a nice increase in visitor/tourist traffic; not sure what the numbers are at the airport though.

 

First quarter CLE traffic:  2014 (with UA hub) 1,802.3K passengers  2015 (post-UA hub) 1,622.7K  2016 1,783.0K.  As you can see, the airport has almost made up the UA losses but today's traffic is 97% local (potential Rapid riders) while 2014's traffic was only about 70% local.

 

Theoretically, therefore, the airport Rapid ridership should be UP this year; but I have to say my experience (~3 trips a year to Cleveland a year)has been that it is more or less unchanged at the airport station, although the trains have gone from single car to two and ridership at the other stations is up nicely by my unscientific estimate.

Well, the airport has also seen a significant dip in passengers.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

Again, having one truly downtown station, buried in the bowels of a mall, set in the old Union Terminal Building, with no outside signage indicating RTA, is ridiculous.  It's not convenient to get to from a large section of downtown anyway.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

While this is true, there are arguably only two places the rapid goes that would be of major interest to visitors who didn't already come in via the airport, W. 25th and Shaker Square.

 

Oh. And the waterfront.  But I'm not suggesting we start that again [emoji2]

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

While this is true, there are arguably only two places the rapid goes that would be of major interest to visitors who didn't already come in via the airport, W. 25th and Shaker Square.

 

Oh. And the waterfront.  But I'm not suggesting we start that again [emoji2]

 

University Circle? Little Italy?

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

While this is true, there are arguably only two places the rapid goes that would be of major interest to visitors who didn't already come in via the airport, W. 25th and Shaker Square.

 

Oh. And the waterfront.  But I'm not suggesting we start that again [emoji2]

 

Absolutely the Waterfront Line with FEB now booming on weekends, esp warm ones -- and Phase 3 hasn't even started building, added to fact that there are a number of empty and boarded-up former Flats eateries and establishments south of the MAB, like the fine Watermark restaurant; whose building has just been repainted.  If these places came back to life along with Phase 3, there's be more than enough interest (hell, in my book, there's already enough down there to use the WFL... and me and my friends use it... it seemed there was a small bump in riders to FEB -- the journey of a thousand miles begins with one step).

 

...just sayin', but yeah, let's not start another protacted WFL debate.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

While this is true, there are arguably only two places the rapid goes that would be of major interest to visitors who didn't already come in via the airport, W. 25th and Shaker Square.

 

Oh. And the waterfront.  But I'm not suggesting we start that again [emoji2]

 

University Circle? Little Italy?

 

Yep; double yep... Soon we can throw in the soon to be built, end-of-the-line Van Aken Center... The Shaker Nature Center on the Green Line also could qualify...

 

People don't realize it, but you can actually hoof it to clubs and restaurants in the Edgewater neighborhood from the West Blvd station (or simple ride the #26 bus from there a few blocks down Detroit if you don't feel like walking.  That martini bar, among other joints on Clifton, at W. 104th street is very walkable, as is the western portion of Edgewater Park... Unfortunately some consider West Blvd/Cudell to be "dangerous" and won't use it.  Me personally find such fears to be unfounded.

^ All true, but if I were a visitor to Cleveland, I wouldn't consider using transit to get to those places.

 

"It is unfortunate, then, that instead of addressing the intense need for public transportation, a significant chunk of money has been dedicated to building another highway. The Opportunity Corridor will transport people from Cleveland's outer-ring suburbs to University Circle. The Ohio Department of Transportation says this highway will create opportunity for "potential new economic development, new jobs and a new identity for the community."

 

However, it will not increase access to public transportation for the low-income neighborhoods it cuts through. More than 8 percent of Ohio households have no access to a car, while one in five African American households do not have access. What would happen if the money devoted to the Opportunity Corridor had instead been directed toward a streetcar in the same area?"

 

 

^ All true, but if I were a visitor to Cleveland, I wouldn't consider using transit to get to those places.

 

Why not?  (excluding the West Blvd suggestion). 

Little Italy counts and especially now with the new station that is a good call.  University Circle is better accessed by the BRT.  Anyway I agree with the general sentiment that we could use a little more advertising of the rail service we do have, and thinking about it, if I'm Dan Gilbert, I want as many people to know that they can get to the West Side Market and bars via rail, and Little Italy, and Shaker Square.  Every new person, be they a lifelong Clevelander who's always just driven, new transplants, or tourists, that starts using the rail rather than driving, is another person who's walking through his mall and past his casino.

PHS14, rightfully so, has griped about the poor rapid transit signage in/around Tower City... I noticed walking through the other day that JACK casino has large directional signs while RTA's are small and not very informational (just a characterization of a locomotive and an arrow).  I know Dan Gilbert now owns TC mall as well as the casino, but the building is also the central station to the rail system.  RTA's signage should be improved.

 

Anyone visiting Cleveland/downtown would never know Cleveland has a rapid transit system, unless, of course he or she used the rapid to get downtown. 

 

While this is true, there are arguably only two places the rapid goes that would be of major interest to visitors who didn't already come in via the airport, W. 25th and Shaker Square.

 

Oh. And the waterfront.  But I'm not suggesting we start that again [emoji2]

 

University Circle? Little Italy?

 

Yep; double yep... Soon we can throw in the soon to be built, end-of-the-line Van Aken Center... The Shaker Nature Center on the Green Line also could qualify...

 

People don't realize it, but you can actually hoof it to clubs and restaurants in the Edgewater neighborhood from the West Blvd station (or simple ride the #26 bus from there a few blocks down Detroit if you don't feel like walking.  That martini bar, among other joints on Clifton, at W. 104th street is very walkable, as is the western portion of Edgewater Park... Unfortunately some consider West Blvd/Cudell to be "dangerous" and won't use it.  Me personally find such fears to be unfounded.

 

You seriously would promote using W 98 Station to go clubbing in Detroit/Shoreway/Edgewater?  No one is or should be doing that currently.

there is nothing wrong with the west blvd. stop.  i use it all the time.

Little Italy counts and especially now with the new station that is a good call.  University Circle is better accessed by the BRT.  Anyway I agree with the general sentiment that we could use a little more advertising of the rail service we do have, and thinking about it, if I'm Dan Gilbert, I want as many people to know that they can get to the West Side Market and bars via rail, and Little Italy, and Shaker Square.  Every new person, be they a lifelong Clevelander who's always just driven, new transplants, or tourists, that starts using the rail rather than driving, is another person who's walking through his mall and past his casino.

 

I agree that BRT is more direct to most U. Circle places, but a person can't go wrong with the Red Line.  The Rapid gets there in half the time or less than the HL (about 14-16 minutes has been my avg), and new UC/LI stop is just 4-5 minutes from the corner of Euclid and Mayfield depending how fast you walk.  Plus I just think the Rapid is just a more pleasant experience; even when HL buses aren't packed, which they often are, they seem a bit claustrophobic.  ... I would also throw in the WFL to FEB.  While many Clevelanders talk about how slow the WFL as opposed to their walking 8 or so blocks and up 'n down the steep Flats hill, it's much easier for visitors just to hop the train and arrive steps away from the new FEB boardwalk after a 3-4 minute WFL ride. 

 

As for locals, the Rapid could be a lot more useful than people give it credit for.  In addition to the West Blvd destinations I mention, there are the Big Box stores near the W. 117 station if that's your thing -- actually, Home Depot, which is about a 6-8 minute walk can be quite useful if you're not carrying heavy stuff.  Also near W. 117, the strip along Madison near Birdtown has cleaned up quite a bit in recent years and there are some clubs and restaurants along there -- it's a far cry from W. 25, Gordon Sq or Professor Street, but better than it was and it can be useful.  Also the Lee Road Blue Line stop, with it's spanking new, very attractive and useful station, puts you near a number of retail services at Shaker Town Center... Avalon, 1 stop further, is closest to the excellent Shaker Hardware store (imho the best neighborhood hardware store in the world)... and these are just some of the places the Rapid goes.  There are umpteen such destinations at Shaker Square and Larchmere, for example,...

there is nothing wrong with the west blvd. stop.  i use it all the time.

 

You use it at night to go clubbing?

I often transfer there from red line to 26 at night when coming home from UC.

Random thought. What if during the tear up of Public Square, they installed an RTA entrance (with big visible signage), that was stairs and escalator down to the bowels of TC for the rapid?

 

Re: Detroit/West Blvd. I feel like that area could be something that you can just say "give it time". Detroit is continuously improving, and has hot spots, I call that a string of pearls. (Detroit=String, Pearls=Ohio City@W25, Harp@W45ish, Gordon Square@W60ish, lots of Edgewater cut throughs, battery park, and then Lakewood begins at W117). I can see downtown to Gordon square gentrifying soonish. And W120 to W110 could continue to improve. You have weird land use from 110 to West Blvd. Like almost absolutely nothing on the north side of Detroit, and then very far set back institutions on the south side. Detroit having to underpass the track always raises my blood pressure, as a biker. Berea road is not residents and retail. And there are a lot of boarded up buildings at Berea/Detroit. So if you could pick one location to magically inject TOD magic, I'd pick West Blvd / Detroit.

Also I assume that West Blvd is 100 blocks west of public square and East Blvd (University Circle) is 100 blocks east of public square.

 

A developer should find all that worth considering. It's also an easy bike ride from there to downtown, flat, mostly bike lanes.

 

Lastly, my parade two cents. Just like there is some auxiliary police, where for the RNC, outside police agencies will be on loan to CLE. For last minute parade, what if Chicago CTA/NYC MTA drove a bunch of trains and buses to Cleveland, for us to handle the walloping of 1.3M?

 

Other than that, if be curious to get a post-mortem from RTA on what they had to do to prep, what they got done, how many more operators, vehicles, miles were driven, strategies, etc. My view is they were limited by fluid dynamics, only so much can floor with so much capacity... my only tweak would be that instead of running the train all the way to airport, or the bus to westgate transit center, to turn around halfway (w117, or bunts), and then pick up people in the core. Otherwise your just serving the fringe, and covering a lot more miles. You want the most passengers per mile, not the most passenger miles. Then with the vehicle covering half the distance, you can double the frequency, thus double the throughput?

I often transfer there from red line to 26 at night when coming home from UC.

 

Nothing wrong with the station, just the neighborhood.

nothing really wrong with the neighborhood heading west either.  I ride my bike there often too.  From West Blvd east to Gordon Square I agree.

nothing really wrong with the neighborhood heading west either.  I ride my bike there often too.  From West Blvd east to Gordon Square I agree.

 

...and south.

A developer should find all that worth considering. It's also an easy bike ride from there to downtown, flat, mostly bike lanes.

 

Great points. But if I'm a developer I'm standing pat until RTA gets some kind of vote of confidence from state or local leadership. Why invest in and around something that's on shaky ground?

Is this our long-awaited mobile payments trial?

 

http://appshopper.com/travel/rta-cle

 

The official mobile ticketing app for the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority is here!

RTA CLE is the convenient mobile solution for planning and paying for your transit fares.

Is this our long-awaited mobile payments trial?

 

http://appshopper.com/travel/rta-cle

 

The official mobile ticketing app for the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority is here!

RTA CLE is the convenient mobile solution for planning and paying for your transit fares.

 

Yupp. They are currently in beta testing for it, so it only can be used for monthly passes on the rail system or park and ride. Hopefully it will be rolled out for full use in the coming months.

Personal View: Reaffirm our commitment to mass transit

July 03, 2016 UPDATED 3 DAYS AGO

By SEAN P. MALONE

 

Cleveland’s history can be traced through its mass transit systems, from the street cars in use at the turn of the 20th century, to the rapid transit constructed a few decades later, to the 1974 formation of the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority and the recent HealthLine. Ridership has ebbed and flowed, but mass transit has remained an important facet of life in Northeast Ohio.

 

Our commitment to public transportation is being tested again, and not just by jubilant Cavs fans and RNC conventioneers. RTA’s rapid transit cars continue to deteriorate and may be forced out of service earlier than expected.

 

Anyone who tried to ride the Rapid to the parade celebrating the Cavs’ victory knows our region’s commuter rail system is imperfect. Yet even on days when hundreds of thousands aren’t trying to board, the system is prone to arbitrary delays caused by malfunctioning trains.

 

MORE:

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20160703/NEWS/160709969/personal-view-reaffirm-our-commitment-to-mass-transit

There has been a lot of discussion here about the state of the Rapid here lately, but I have had increasingly frustrating problems with the buses.  The number #22 bus has skipped three times and not just two but three 22 buses have shown  up at once. These buses are more than a half hour late. This has happened downtown, at W. 25th and Lorain and at W. 110th  and Lorain. I have called and written RTA three times.  There is construction on Lorain Ave. near the West Park station requiring the bus to be rerouted. Why doesn't RTA publish a temporary schedule for this route during the construction if they know there will be delays?

 

Also, twice in the last month, a bus broke down and passengers had to get off and wait for a new bus. Once a bus was smoking and the other time it was the Health Line. It was leaking a green fluid.  Now, I wonder if RTA is keeping up with maintenance of the buses.

Personal View: Reaffirm our commitment to mass transit

July 03, 2016 UPDATED 3 DAYS AGO

By SEAN P. MALONE

 

Cleveland’s history can be traced through its mass transit systems, from the street cars in use at the turn of the 20th century, to the rapid transit constructed a few decades later, to the 1974 formation of the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority and the recent HealthLine. Ridership has ebbed and flowed, but mass transit has remained an important facet of life in Northeast Ohio.

 

Our commitment to public transportation is being tested again, and not just by jubilant Cavs fans and RNC conventioneers. RTA’s rapid transit cars continue to deteriorate and may be forced out of service earlier than expected.

 

Anyone who tried to ride the Rapid to the parade celebrating the Cavs’ victory knows our region’s commuter rail system is imperfect. Yet even on days when hundreds of thousands aren’t trying to board, the system is prone to arbitrary delays caused by malfunctioning trains.

 

MORE:

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20160703/NEWS/160709969/personal-view-reaffirm-our-commitment-to-mass-transit

 

Where are our Congressional representatives on this?  Especially Sherrod Brown and Marcia Fudge.  The other area reps have districts that extend into rural Ohio.  For example, OH District 9 has a bizarre map, from Toledo along the lake to western CLE suburbs.  I don't consider these reps as ''home players''.

 

Where are the local reps in Columbus on this?

 

Politicians used to make deals, politics aside.

We need GCRTA to lay out its budget needs and wants first, and what community goals and benefits it hopes to achieve by funding them. If the goal is just to let transit survive, GCRTA isn't going to inspire many leaders with that.

^ Unfortunately Joe C seems to be content with just managing decline. 2019 is only 3 years away...

I've lived in the same inner-ring community my entire life, so I haven't run anywhere.

 

I don't like insular attitudes. Some of us didn't run. Not all people left because they hated Cleveland. Some did it for work and some (like myself) had personal issues to deal with.

 

Anyway, this debate has nothing to do with RTA.

 

It has to do with personal planning of a major event. No amount of a fare increase is going to be enough to chase people away from a once in half-century victory parade so you can get up at 8AM and plan to be downtown by 11AM using the Rapid.

 

I'm in total agreement of dropping the subject.

 

FYI, I wasn't saying that anyone here ran, I was responding to PHS who was implying that I ran.

 

This debate has everything to do with RTA and how it could be funded in a fairer way that actually might make sense. In terms fare increases not chasing people away, if that's true that they would had the same amount of riders with a slightly higher fare, they would have had a few hundred thousand dollars more to at least possibly help service move more quickly and smoothly on that one day (and other busy days).

 

You arguing that a 3 hour wait is reasonable is unreasonable and suggesting that it is my fault is ridiculous, but it's not really the discussion I care to have at the moment.

 

You called out people that abandoned the ''urban core''.  So, don't throw rocks at people when you live in an inner-ring glass house to start with and never lived in the city.

Both ticket vending machines at CLE were out of service this morning.

You called out people that abandoned the ''urban core''.  So, don't throw rocks at people when you live in an inner-ring glass house to start with and never lived in the city.

 

I live in, and have always lived in, one of the densest parts of the county and pay taxes to GCRTA. I'll throw whatever rocks I want to throw at whomever I choose, particularly when they're not willing to take part in funding amenities they want to use.

 

By the way, you never did elaborate on the "good reasons" for people abandoning the urban core. I wonder why.