1 hour ago, Terdolph said:

There are certain industries and technologies where we have a home grown advantage

 

Like Health care, biotech, and manufacturing? I think the local economic development scene is actually pretty well tuned in to these local home grown advantages. I would say the execution could still be a whole lot better, but things aren't quite as bad as you're implying. 

Edited August 22, 20195 yr by mu2010

http://www.riderta.com/news/rta-re-open-red-line-between-airport-and-west-blvd-beginning-monday-morning

 

Quote

The Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority (RTA) is happy to announce the re-opening of the Red Line from the Airport to Tower City beginning with the start of service on Monday, August 26.

The Red Line had been closed between the Airport and the West Blvd. station since May 30, 2019, due to the need to repair and stabilize the S-Curve retaining wall on the Red Line’s West Side.  RTA had been running replacement bus service between those stops.

RTA contractors and engineers installed 75 steel beam frames to stabilize approximately 300 feet of the retaining wall for the $1.3 million project. All final safety checks and testing will be completed this weekend, allowing for the return to service Monday morning.

“It was not an easy decision to close our rail line because of the inconvenience to our riders, but we had to put the safety of our customers first,” said RTA’s Interim CEO and General Manager, Floun’say Caver. “We want to thank our riders for their patience, and we look forward to serving them again with the service they’ve come to depend on every day and for special events.”

 

1 hour ago, Terdolph said:

Our world class strengths are in metallurgy, macro-molecular engineering (polymers), medical imaging, some aerospace (e.g. landing gears, deep space propulsion), control systems (pneumatic, hydrolic), lighting, digital displays, and some expertise in industrial robotics.  Problem is, there is no strategic investment at a regional level in any of this.  Instead we chase stupid fad things like "block chain" that we have no expertise or special advantage in at all.

 

You raise some fair points. I think you're too quick to dismiss health care and biotech. Don't forget, these industries not only bring in a lot of outside $, they have huge supply chains. I agree the blockchain thing is a joke, though, I'm rooting for it. But not sure why Moreno wouldn't focus on any of the other industries we've mentioned. 

4 minutes ago, mu2010 said:

 

You raise some fair points. I think you're too quick to dismiss health care and biotech. Don't forget, these industries not only bring in a lot of outside $, they have huge supply chains. I agree the blockchain thing is a joke, though, I'm rooting for it. But not sure why Moreno wouldn't focus on any of the other industries we've mentioned. 

I agree but blockchain will have a lot potential in the health care space. Therefore it might make sense to try to grow that industry. 

22 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

And now back to this thread's topic: "RTA smart fare cards on the way, finally, RTA says"

 

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/08/rta-smart-fare-cards-on-the-way-finally-rta-says.html

 

RTA says that the delay is due to the contractor, who was acquired mid-project.  RTA says that they have withheld millions of dollars in payment to the contractor due to the smart card implementation delays.

 

And it seems that @KJP was referenced in the article, although not by name or direct quote.  "In a 2013 Plain Dealer story addressing the years-long delay in implementing smart-card technology, All Aboard Ohio’s executive director said the cards could save RTA millions of dollars a year in operating costs."  (Or was that outside your tenure, Ken?)

 

The article also mentions that the contractor is only obligated to provide technology that was available 10 years ago, but seems to indicate that GCRTA had the option to scrap the contract but chose to implement the older technology now. For those with more knowledge, like @KJP, is that wise considering the advancements that have been made? Are we going to get a something sub-par? Will this older technology be able to adapt to knew technology and potentially work in conjunction with similar tech in other cities?

I can't believe we're locked in this contract in perpetuity. There must be conditions within the agreement such as, oh I don't know, if you don't deliver by the the time the global population has jumped 13 f'ing percent, terms may need to be revisited.

I think RTA is in a strong position here if they're willing to be aggressive and assert their position. They have the legal high ground here and can use that to get a better deal, IE: a better end product from the contractor. But that all depends on RTA.

Thanks @KJP! Article seems to indicated that the interim director Carver has indeed "changed the tenor" of their dealings with the contractor and is being more assertive/aggressive than the past administration. Hopefully Birdsong will do the same.

Except it's not the same vendor anymore. 

I see so many people using the smartphone fare app and scanning their phone screens at the turnstiles that it almost seems unnecessary at this point.

On 8/24/2019 at 8:31 AM, sizzlinbeef said:

I see so many people using the smartphone fare app and scanning their phone screens at the turnstiles that it almost seems unnecessary at this point.

 

It's been life-changing.  No more ruining the knees of my pants to buy a rail ticket! 

Smartphones (and active data plans therefor) are far from universal among the transit-dependent, and for a lot of us, smartcards would be an awful lot more convenient.  They're also an extremely mature and well-understood technology, which, frankly, I have trouble believing would be difficult or exorbitantly costly to implement in a modestly sized transit system such as ours.  The one does not exclude the other.

https://www.planetizen.com/blogs/105942-tale-two-estimates

^ACS is a lagging number, its only a survey, and ACS counts PEOPLE  not transit trips, so its not a 1:1 comparison.

RTA System Redesign Meeting 
Saturday, Oct. 12, 10:30am-12:30pm
Michael J. Zone Recreation Center, 6301 Lorain Ave 

Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority invites you to provide feedback on its system redesign studies to cost-effectively address service frequency and service coverage goals for the maximum benefit of both current and future riders. See more meeting locations and dates here. 

On 8/22/2019 at 5:06 PM, Cleburger said:

 

I don't disagree at all.   

 

But with the current political and business climates, we are in an uphill battle.   Until Ohio starts thinking more progressively, we'll continue to have a hard time attracting 20-something software coders who would rather be on the coasts with better transit, weather and tolerance.  

"Until Ohio starts thinking more progressively,"

 

Herein lies the rub. NEO is unlike the rest of Ohio. NEO cannot rely upon the state to drive initiatives that will benefit NEO, because in many instances they would be inconsistent with the needs in the rest of the state.

 

NEO needs to elect leaders with the vision, guts and foresight to make things happen for NEO. Cleveland had an excellent transit system with the Rapids, streetcars, and trackless trolleys along most major thoroughfares. They were dismantled, with tracks removed  to make way for automobiles.

Ohio may be largely rural by area, but is largely urban and suburban by population, and IIRC, the state legislature is determined almost exclusively by population.  I don't believe that urban areas should run roughshod over rural ones, nor vice versa.  However, even leaving aside that healthy cities benefit surrounding rural areas (and vice versa), the large urban areas such as our own absolutely should have sufficient voice as to be able to direct some attention to the needs of transit here.  While I don't know this for sure, I suspect it is more the executive branch, not the legislature, that ultimately prevents the state from funding transit at even the paltry levels typical of other comparable states.  I know others here know the politics way better than I do.  But am I far off base here?

I think you may be forgetting the political component.

 

The major urban areas are Franklin and Cuyahoga counties, which are Democratic strongholds, in a primarily suburban/rural Republican-controlled state. I wouldn't even include Columbus, because despite its size/population it lacks density.

On 9/6/2019 at 10:27 AM, jtadams said:

Ohio may be largely rural by area, but is largely urban and suburban by population

 

Earth also follows this pattern

2 hours ago, mu2010 said:

 

Earth also follows this pattern

 

In Ohio, unlike most of the rest of earth, the rural residents have 40% of the population, but 60% of the representation....

10 hours ago, Cleburger said:

 

In Ohio, unlike most of the rest of earth, the rural residents have 40% of the population, but 60% of the representation....

My understanding was that both the house and senate are determined by majority vote within supposedly equally sized districts (leaving aside the likely effects of gerrymandering). 

A positive step towards replacing the Red Line rail cars:

 

https://www.cleveland.com/metro/2019/09/rta-to-receive-96m-from-planning-agency-for-rail-car-replacement.html

 

 The Northeast Ohio Areawide Coordinating Agency, a transportation planning agency, on Friday approved $9.6 million toward replacing Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority rail cars.

 

NOACA approved the money as part of its commitment to fund a total of $24 million for new rail cars over the coming decade, according to an RTA spokeswoman.

 

A new fleet of heavy and light rail cars is expected to cost $240 million.

I'd imagine any RTA news following twitterfolk saw this, but great to see hands on leadership, hopefully this type of thing continues!

 

 

^ Never thought I’d say this, but I agree with you. 

I recently traveled outside the US and returned home via Hopkins and the rapid, and it was embarrassing in comparison to my European travels (as is RTA's 500 character online suggestion form). 

 

The operator of the trains I rode was particularly abrupt in stopping the train at each station, making for a very rough ride.  Particularly compared to my experiences in the cities I had just visited.

 

There was a guy on the red line visiting Cleveland for the first time and trying to find his way to his hotel. RTA's wayfinding signage and promotions at the airport and Tower City suck.  First I had to help him with the ticket machines, which still aren't very intuitive.  I had an easier time in Europe, even when I didn't speak the language. Then once on the train, the station announcements were unintelligible and the electronic gates at Tower City wouldn't read his ticket.  Then I had to explain to him where to go from there, as the signs were not very helpful to someone who didn't know Cleveland. 

 

After transferring to the green line (and struggling with my luggage and that stupid handrail in the middle of the stairs), I completely missed my stop.  As an infrequent and very tired rider I forgot that you have to ring the bell in advance if you want them to stop, and the station announcements continued to be unintelligible or nonexistent. 

 

Now, as a frequent reader on this forum I am well aware that RTA is not well funded.  I don't know whether the mumbled station announcements are an operator or an equipment problem, and I realize that not stopping at every station might speed up service, but these things do not help out of town visitors or infrequent riders use and enjoy using your services. This is particularly difficult at night, when the well-lit train makes it hard to see outside the windows and know where you are in the city.

 

I'd like to see better signage, better station announcements (couldn't this be automated?) and better explanations of how to use the system at the ticket machines and at the major stations.  This would be hugely beneficial to out of town guests and new users.  I certainly don't feel like encouraging guests to use the rapid to visit from the airport given this recent experience.  I really want to support our local mass transit system, but you have to do better if you want people to use RTA over Uber.

 

 

 

I'm not on the red line often, but the impossible to understand station announcements is always a problem. Last time was labor day morning a couple weeks ago coming back from the airport. It really needs to be a recording.

Not to mention that the automated stop/station announcements, on buses at least, are often wrong, sometimes laughably so.  If one were visually impaired, and/or unfamiliar with the town, these wrong announcements could put a rider in real danger.

I hope India Birdsong is reading these constructive suggestions.

There is actually an email address for the GM on RTA's site.   

 

[email protected]

 

I'll do my part and send a link from this forum to her....

15 hours ago, KJP said:

I hope India Birdsong is reading these constructive suggestions.

Didn't we have a couple members here that worked for RTA? There truly is some useful info that comes across these pages.

1 hour ago, Clvlndr in LV said:

Didn't we have a couple members here that worked for RTA? There truly is some useful info that comes across these pages.

THIS.

 

Hell, i'm still waiting on individual update/information signage at every Shaker Station.  Granted that information can be updated via Google Maps, but RTA is far behind in that.

On 9/20/2019 at 1:04 PM, Foraker said:

After transferring to the green line (and struggling with my luggage and that stupid handrail in the middle of the stairs), I completely missed my stop.  As an infrequent and very tired rider I forgot that you have to ring the bell in advance if you want them to stop, and the station announcements continued to be unintelligible or nonexistent. 

As a daily green line rider I can assure you that even if you rang the bell and stood dutifully at the door, there would still be about a 50% chance the operator would be in autopilot mode and just blows by the stop anyway.  I feel bad for the individuals that have to use the stops between Warrensville and Shaker Square.

3 hours ago, sizzlinbeef said:

As a daily green line rider I can assure you that even if you rang the bell and stood dutifully at the door, there would still be about a 50% chance the operator would be in autopilot mode and just blows by the stop anyway.  I feel bad for the individuals that have to use the stops between Warrensville and Shaker Square.

I've been riding the Shaker Rapid for 48 years.  The least used stations in Shaker have always been between Southington, S. Park, Attleboro and Eaton.  In MY EXPERIENCE if you indicate your stop, drivers will not ignore it.  Historically, after 9pm (on non event days) if a driver doesn't see a passenger standing or said passenger does not indicate they want to exit at X stop, the train continues.

 

I've watched people pull the indicator as we are rolling through the station.  Then get mad.  Passengers know IN ADVANCE what station they want to exit.  They need to take some responsibility for notification - in a timely matter.

 

Regarding announcements, RTA could do better system wide.  I'm overly irritated when there is NO announcement.

When/if they replace rail cars will they add more than 2 cars per train you think? Has the red line rail been fixed yet?

Edited September 21, 20195 yr by Mildtraumatic

‘RTA let its customers down’: Packed trains come to standstill after Browns game

POSTED 3:48 PM, SEPTEMBER 23, 2019, BY MATT WRIGHT, UPDATED AT 05:34PM, SEPTEMBER 23, 2019

 

CLEVELAND – Browns fans who took RTA rapid transit trains home from Sunday night’s game faced major delays, with some Waterfront Line trains stopping on the tracks after losing power, and now, RTA is apologizing.

 

Passengers said some train cars lost power just west of the West 3rd Street station following the game.

 

“It was jam packed, shoulder to shoulder, a lot of people were drunk,” said passenger Nick Szabados, who said he boarded at the North Coast Station. “Finally started taking off, and the tram just shuts off. The lights shut off, the air conditioning cuts out, and it stops moving.”

 

He said passengers on his train were kept on board with no air conditioning and little communication from RTA for about an hour.

 

“It's already humid as-is, it's getting hotter and hotter, and people are freaking out,” Szabados said, noting another passenger forced open train doors to create airflow.

 

https://fox8.com/2019/09/23/people-are-freaking-out-packed-rta-trains-come-to-standstill-after-browns-game/

 

Browns fans were trapped on RTA trains hours after the game Sunday night

RTA response: “RTA let its customers down."

 

By Dan DeRoos | September 23, 2019 at 4:26 PM EDT - Updated September 23 at 9:11 PM 

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio (WOIO) -As if watching the Cleveland Browns come up short wasn’t bad enough, some fans had a nightmare RTA Rapid ride as icing on the cake.

 

https://www.cleveland19.com/2019/09/23/browns-fans-were-trapped-rta-trains-hours-after-game-sunday-night/

 

 

I find it interesting the RTA problems showed up on a Yahoo news feed:

 

RTA riders sound off on social media about delays after Browns game

 

https://news.yahoo.com/rta-riders-sound-off-social-030911296.html

 

What a way to start as CEO of RTA. Sadly the system no longer seems to be capable of smoothly handling large events which leads to negative experiences like this which leads to negative press, and negative word of mouth by riders = continued ridership loss. It’s a vicious cycle. Though this quick response gives me hope things will move in the right direction:

 

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/09/rta-identifies-fixes-after-waterfront-line-strands-browns-fans-early-monday-morning.html

 

 

It is always harder to handle peaks than averages.  Rail should shine in that its peak capacity is vastly greater than other modes of transportation.  But . . . . ?

Per the RTA's application, they were asking for $60mm.

 

http://www.dot.state.oh.us/trac/2019 Applications Recieved/GCRTA Rail Car Replacement Program.pdf

 

 

 

Hopefully GCRTA will resubmit but with different numbers. Imagine if a city asked for $60 million to help rebuild a roadway that moves only 35,000 people a day...wait, never mind.

Edited September 25, 20195 yr by KJP

Right.  Surely there was more feedback than a red rubber stamped REJECTED on the cover page.

 

 

Edited September 25, 20195 yr by KJP

On 9/25/2019 at 5:15 PM, KJP said:

 

 

That's depressing and infuriating, I hate the shortsighted and one track (or car lane) mind of this state leadership and government agencies. 

Even allowing for a little uncertainty as to predicted traffic volumes, this sounds like a near perfect example of a quantifiable, and extreme, bias in favor of a less-needed and more expensive road project, over a more-needed and less expensive rail project.  Textbook.  Unlike a lot of folks here, I have no extreme prejudice against roads in general or the OC Boulevard in particular.  But, even so, it was a no-brainer that keeping rail alive, which is really what this boils down to, is MUCH more important than building another road of at best moderate importance.  In this case, and in the general case as well. 

The cynic in me says maybe.  However, I don't see who directly benefits from killing rail.  It would greatly diminish the value of downtown and UC as major employment centers.  It throws away the (today's equivalent of) multiple billions of dollars of investment already made, in exchange for essentially nothing.  There are a dozen or more good ways to fund the needed replacement vehicles.  Probably not all of them would work, but none have been tried.  I'm not quite seeing how someone turns the death of GCRTA rail into a profit center.  If anything I'd imagine just the opposite: it comes with all the usual opportunities for "profit" via corruption and graft that northeast Ohio is known for.

It doesn't fit into their paradigm of what criteria should be included in the project scoring process which, is what TRAC does. The criteria they use are things like level of service, pavement/bridge conditions, number of vehicular crashes, and so on. How does a rail car replacement address any of these criteria in a clear and direct way? Fact is, it doesn't, and so TRAC claims it has no choice but to give the rail car replacement a low rating.

1 minute ago, KJP said:

It doesn't fit into their paradigm of what criteria should be included in the project scoring process which, is what TRAC does. The criteria they use are things like level of service, pavement/bridge conditions, number of vehicular crashes, and so on. How does a rail car replacement address any of these criteria in a clear and direct way? Fact is, it doesn't, and so TRAC claims it has no choice but to give the rail car replacement a low rating.

 

Then, not to state the obvious, but perhaps the project scoring process is seriously flawed?

4 hours ago, jtadams said:

 

Then, not to state the obvious, but perhaps the project scoring process is seriously flawed?

 

A decade ago, it included criteria like economic development, jobs access, job creation, limiting vehicle-miles traveled, etc. On that score, rail projects ranked more highly. But since ODOT and Ohio's constitutionally firewalled gas tax is an ATM for road contractors, they got the criteria changed back to what they liked.

Of course the project scoring system is flawed; it's biased. Please keep in mind that Cleveland (NEO) is the only major metropolitan area in the state of Ohio that offers commuter rail service. Cleveland is and has always been an outlier, compared to the other cities and the rest of the state. The state has never, and still doesn't get it. You have NEO and then you have the rest of Ohio.  Cleveland is its ultra-urban outlier, that doesn't fit neatly into Columbus' perception of what the state is all about, which in this case, is supporting roadway construction and maintenance.

 

That being said, GCRTA must be protected and supported, if not by the state, then locally or regionally. To replace the existing system would cost many billions of dollars. Prime examples are the costs to build new systems in LA, SFO and SEA.

 

As a society we are finally coming to the realization that automobiles should not be the primary solution to our transportation needs.  At one time, Cleveland's transit system (CTS) included street cars and then trackless trollies on most major thoroughfares, as complements to the Rapid. They were ripped out to make room for cars. 

 

NEO taxes go to Columbus. What comes back?

 

Do not allow GCRTA to deteriorate. It is another one of Cleveland's many great assets; even if the State of Ohio prefers to fund roadways over railways.

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/FQ5Kur3Krw2MDYhS6

Edited October 6, 20195 yr by Frmr CLEder
Correcting, autocorrect.