I went to bed angry last night assuming the Heat had easily disposed of the C/Mavs.  What a nice surprise this morning!

1996 stands out to me as a year the 'experts' said it was a weak draft.  That is how a skinny, young PG named Allen Iverson got picked first.  The draft then proceeded with Camby, Abdur-Rahim, Marbury, Ray Allen, and Antoine Walker being picked 2-6.  We picked up Potapenko at 11.  Immediately after that pick went Kobe, Stojackovic, Nash, and Jermaine O'Neal :(

 

 

aww man that kills to see that -- but be fair you know you can strike one off that horrorshow -- kobe wasn't going anywhere except to the lakers. he refused all other considerations. otoh -- to think that, for example, we could have had another mark price in nash...ugh.

 

 

^ I was watching a documentary recently about that draft, the whole 'Kobe' wasn't going anywhere but the Lakers was a total bluff by his agent. It worked and he ended up in L.A. but he would have played anywhere.

My biggest fear is that Kanter will go to the T-Wolves, if he does, trade out of that 4 spot for a veteran SF (if you have a trade partner that is). Or trade down no further than the 11 or 12 spot, and pick up an extra 2nd round pick. Irving and Kanter are the only two legit top 3 or 4 picks in this draft. The Jazz will take a PG at 3 out of need, not talent. We can only hope that Minny trades out to a team that wants Derrick Williams that badly or that they end up picking Williams, which I do not see happening. If we can't find a trade partner you may have to reach for a player like Vesely.

 

And we've drafted a few good players. Crawford could have been a great 2 for us right now and during the jackass era and Haywood is a solid starting center on most teams (Cavs being one of them) But we don't keep the good players we draft.

 

And somebody call me crazy if they must, but I see Eyenga being a VERY good 2 in this league. His shot started to come around last year, both off the dribble and catch and shoot. He can slash to the rim with his speed and athleticism. And his defense just needs some fundamentals fine tuned. I see a bright future for the Cavs, that's if Stern lets them win anything in his WWE type sport he's got going.

I was high on Williams for a long-time, especially since I'm a bit of an Arizona Wildcats fan and loved watching him play in college, but the more I've been thinking about it lately, the more I want the Cavaliers to get Kanter. 

Plus, Williams has this attitude that reminds me WAY too much of Lequeen. I don't want that kind of player on this team, not with the current rules in the NBA allowing the players to run the league. You can tell he wants to be the #1 pick for nothing more than his ego, not because he cares about helping the Cavs turn things around. The European players seem to be more loyal and Kanter seems like the type that would stick with his team and teammates through thick and thin. The same with Irving, he seems like a good kid with a good upbringing who will be thankful to play in the NBA and love playing for a team that's on the up and up. Not to mention that he has a chance at being a top 4 PG within a couple of years in the league.

Plus, Williams has this attitude that reminds me WAY too much of Lequeen. I don't want that kind of player on this team, not with the current rules in the NBA allowing the players to run the league. You can tell he wants to be the #1 pick for nothing more than his ego, not because he cares about helping the Cavs turn things around. The European players seem to be more loyal and Kanter seems like the type that would stick with his team and teammates through thick and thin. The same with Irving, he seems like a good kid with a good upbringing who will be thankful to play in the NBA and love playing for a team that's on the up and up. Not to mention that he has a chance at being a top 4 PG within a couple of years in the league.

 

I think top 4 would be a little high, but he is still the only player we should consider.  The beauty of getting Irving and hopefully Kanter is that the entire nucleus of the team will be ridiculously young.

Plus, Williams has this attitude that reminds me WAY too much of Lequeen. I don't want that kind of player on this team, not with the current rules in the NBA allowing the players to run the league. You can tell he wants to be the #1 pick for nothing more than his ego, not because he cares about helping the Cavs turn things around. The European players seem to be more loyal and Kanter seems like the type that would stick with his team and teammates through thick and thin. The same with Irving, he seems like a good kid with a good upbringing who will be thankful to play in the NBA and love playing for a team that's on the up and up. Not to mention that he has a chance at being a top 4 PG within a couple of years in the league.

 

Kanter is the only one who has shunned teams to make clear that he wants to control his destination.  That scares me a bit.  That and the fact that he has an impressive wingspan....... for a swing player.

Plus, Williams has this attitude that reminds me WAY too much of Lequeen. I don't want that kind of player on this team, not with the current rules in the NBA allowing the players to run the league. You can tell he wants to be the #1 pick for nothing more than his ego, not because he cares about helping the Cavs turn things around. The European players seem to be more loyal and Kanter seems like the type that would stick with his team and teammates through thick and thin. The same with Irving, he seems like a good kid with a good upbringing who will be thankful to play in the NBA and love playing for a team that's on the up and up. Not to mention that he has a chance at being a top 4 PG within a couple of years in the league.

 

I think top 4 would be a little high, but he is still the only player we should consider.  The beauty of getting Irving and hopefully Kanter is that the entire nucleus of the team will be ridiculously young.

 

Rose, D Williams, Chris Paul...that's about it as far as ELITE. Meaning total package. Rondo would be up there if it weren't for his lack of offensive game and so would someone like Nash if he weren't as old as he is. You can argue guys like Westbrook to be up there but I don't think he's a complete PG. Irving can create for himself and others, he'll come into the league as a pretty good defender already and only improve plus he can play off the ball with his shooting ability.

 

Yeah, young would be one word if our starting line up was  IRVING (1), EYENGA (2), GEE (3), HICKSON (4) and KANTER (5) which is likely the case unless we lose out on Kanter and/or trade for a legit, veteran 3. Either way I don't see Andy starting at center this season, they'll keep Samuels around if need be and have him play or they'll start that Erden kid who we picked up last year. But he's only in his second or third year as well. I think we all found out the hard way that Andy isn't cut out to be a starting center. He's an energy back up for the 4/5 spots, that's where he's most productive.

Plus, Williams has this attitude that reminds me WAY too much of Lequeen. I don't want that kind of player on this team, not with the current rules in the NBA allowing the players to run the league. You can tell he wants to be the #1 pick for nothing more than his ego, not because he cares about helping the Cavs turn things around. The European players seem to be more loyal and Kanter seems like the type that would stick with his team and teammates through thick and thin. The same with Irving, he seems like a good kid with a good upbringing who will be thankful to play in the NBA and love playing for a team that's on the up and up. Not to mention that he has a chance at being a top 4 PG within a couple of years in the league.

 

I think top 4 would be a little high, but he is still the only player we should consider.  The beauty of getting Irving and hopefully Kanter is that the entire nucleus of the team will be ridiculously young.

 

Rose, D Williams, Chris Paul...that's about it as far as ELITE. Meaning total package. Rondo would be up there if it weren't for his lack of offensive game and so would someone like Nash if he weren't as old as he is. You can argue guys like Westbrook to be up there but I don't think he's a complete PG. Irving can create for himself and others, he'll come into the league as a pretty good defender already and only improve plus he can play off the ball with his shooting ability.

 

Yeah, young would be one word if our starting line up was  IRVING (1), EYENGA (2), GEE (3), HICKSON (4) and KANTER (5) which is likely the case unless we lose out on Kanter and/or trade for a legit, veteran 3. Either way I don't see Andy starting at center this season, they'll keep Samuels around if need be and have him play or they'll start that Erden kid who we picked up last year. But he's only in his second or third year as well. I think we all found out the hard way that Andy isn't cut out to be a starting center. He's an energy back up for the 4/5 spots, that's where he's most productive.

 

I would and will Argue that Westbrook should be up there, along with John Wall.  Both of whom are young and still learning the decision making aspect at the next level.  A PG in reality is at least a 2-3 year project to get to the highest level.  I don't think Irving will ever get to where DRose, Paul, or Williams are or where Westbrook or Wall are likely to be, but he still should be better than just about everyone else.

 

If Baron Davis can teach the kid all the good skills (insane vision, good touch, and ability to drive) he has and none of the bad (laziness, bad fitness habits, can jack stupid shots at the most in-opportune times) i think that trade could pay off in spades.

 

re: Andy.  Yeah he is an energy guy.  A big energy guy, but at least one that can give you a solid 20 min at the 4 or 5.  He's obviously undersized to play the 5, but if the whole team goes small it works because he can run.

Thoughts on possibly trading Hickson, Gibson and/or Sessions?  New York supposedly is interested in Sessions, but I've heard the names of all three of those guys mentioned in the past week or so on sports talk shows as having potential to be traded.

I would be comfortable trading just about anybody on the roster.  The problem is we don't have any players that are real assets, aside from possibly JJ.  What would Andy's value on the market be?  Maybe a late first rounder?  I wouldn't make that trade.  I think he might have had real value before last season but it's too late now.  I think Andy, Sessions, and Boobie would all be good backups on good teams.  But good teams usually don't shed even their marginal assets.  They take on debt and stockpile talent to make playoff runs.

I would agree that everybody on the team is tradeable other than Hickson. He's a very athletic big and a good rebounder. And on the rebounding, he really started getting them at the end of the year. Andy would be the next closest for me to say don't trade. If you look at most of the really good teams in the NBA, they usually have a big athletic energy guy. I would only trade him if I was going to get good value back if I was the Cavs. Jamison has only 1 year left on his contract I'm pretty sure, and Its around 15 million dollars. I think Antawn is a class guy, but I think he needs to be traded. I like Baron Davis, but I think he could have unexpectedly good trade value at the all star break next year(assuming theres no lockout) depending on how he plays.

Baron Davis isn't going anywhere until at least the year after next since he has two years left on his contract.  Interesting scenario, however, if he continues to play well for the Cavs.  Of course, a lot can happen in 18 months.  Varejao's contract looked a lot better when we had LeBron.  8 mil escalating to 9 mil by 2013 seems like too much now that he's just about 30 (I know, he might as well be dead).  Jamison definitely seems the most likely to be moved.  If he can stay healthy the Cavs can probably get some value for him. 

Jamison had a middling season last year, ending in injury. He's slower, and more injury prone than when we took him on.  He's a knowledgable player, and could provide some senior leadership...but if he's not actually playing that benefit is minimized as well. I doubt we're going to drum up much interest in him with that contract, unless cash is in the equation.

Now that I think about it, it would probably make more sense for them to hold onto those players till their contracts are up. Once those contracts come off the books, the Cavs should look pretty good in the cap department. I know its hard to get big name free agents to come play in Cleveland, but Im not convinced they couldn't get some good players to come there. I think with superstars they'll have to find them through the draft, but you can get good role players through free agency as well as all star caliber players.

Jamison has definitely declined.  But he's a valuable asset because of his expiring contract and successful veteran experience.  I think his play with the Cavs in 2009-10 was a bit underrated.  He produced at an above-average level, shot for above-average percentages from the field and from the arc, and was a dependable rebounder.  He definitely shrunk in the playoffs, though.

I hope that they find someway to keep Sessions through all of this, doubt it though. He'd be so productive as a scoring backup PG in this league. If he doesn't have to worry about getting people involved and can let the game come to him, either by scoring or dishing out, he's a much better player. Not to mention that he'd be PERFECT for that two PG set Scott likes to run. With him and Irving on the floor together it would be a tough match up for many defenses.

 

 

Sessions' trade value is probably as high as it ever will be.  Too bad the team that values him the least is probably Minny :(

I like Sessions a lot and think he could find minutes in the rotation for a competitive Cavaliers squad down the line.  But I guess it makes little sense to hold on to him if "down the line" isn't in the next year or two.

 

Jamison and Davis are both possible trade deadline moves, I don't see either one being moved in the offseason.

 

Boobie has little trade value now.

 

As much as I don't like his attitude, I want Hickson's talent and potential on this team.  Though if that potential doesn't become reality very soon, that will be a big problem.

 

I like Andy, but he's overpaid. 

Davis has virtually no chance of being moved this season.

Hickson came alive and showed his potential during the last 30 or so games last year. I predicted a 20/10 by the end of last season, obviously I was a bit premature and optimistic, but I don't see any reason that he can't be by mid season/late this season. I think we can have Davis, Irving and Sessions all on the same team. All 3 can play off the ball, so you have versatility there. If we can trade Gibson, that would be a gift from above, he's not that good at anything and is overpaid. I'd take a top notch sweat mop guy for him.

^^Agreed.  Hell... the Clippers just gave up an unprotected 1st round pick to get out from under his contract.  Trade deadline during the 2012-2013 season is another story (because his contract will be expiring that summer), but I think the Cavs REALLY like having Davis around.  He is a natural leader.  The best one we have had.... perhaps in the history of this franchise.  Guys follow him and he brings that requisite tough, no-back-down mentality to this team

 

^Hickson's play at PF improved dramatically with the acquisition of B Davis.  Baron is able to put JJ in his place and keep his ego in check.  Let's wait and see what kind of player Baron can transform Hickson into. 

It's not fair to say Gibson's not good at anything.  He is an elite-level 3-point shooter.  He shot 40% from behind the arc last year, and an amazing 48% from deep in 2009.  His salary isn't great for us, but isn't a bank-breaker either.  He's scheduled to make $4mil/year for the next couple of years.  He's also only 25.  I could see him being a valuable Steve Kerr-type, a real deep threat when you need to stretch the defense.  Also, thinking about this made me look up Steve Kerr on basketballreference.com.  Did you know that he was born in Beirut?  Now you do!

The problem I have with Gibson is that he does not seem to play at full speed.  He seems more interested in looking 'cool' out there on the court than going all out.  But for the reasons BS stated, I'd keep him around.... unless some other team wanted him as part of package that brought us something of value.

Davis has virtually no chance of being moved this season.

 

Yeah, not this year.  Trade deadline 2012-2013.

The problem I have with Gibson is that he does not seem to play at full speed.  He seems more interested in looking 'cool' out there on the court than going all out.  But for the reasons BS stated, I'd keep him around.... unless some other team wanted him as part of package that brought us something of value.

 

I agree.  I also think he takes way too long to get his shot off.

Gibson is a decent 3 point shooter, that's about it. Perhaps on a good team that is valuable, but not on a rebuilding team, especially when you're paying him 4 mil a year. He sucks at creating for himself and is only useful as a guy to park outside the arc and wait for the PG to penetrate and kick or place him and a dominant post player on the weak side together and wait for his man to help for the big to kick out to him. He had good strength on defense for a small guy too, I'll give him that much. Maybe there's a team out there who's missing that type of player who would be willing to give us something decent for him, but I can't think of who that may be. If he's traded I see him being packaged in with another player, like Sessions  :cry: to a team for a draft pick or a veteran small forward. Otherwise he'd be more contract than most teams would be willing to take on given what he brings to the table.

I really didn't intend to defend Gibson this much, but he makes less than the league average, and his contract is up after this year (he has a non-guaranteed year in 2012).

Didn't see this posted here..the Cavs are looking to start up their own D-League team in Youngstown -http://www.tribtoday.com/page/content.detail/id/557885/Mayor--Cavs-eye-Niles-facility.html?nav=5021

A week away from the draft and all we know for sure is that Irving will go number 1. Other than that I think everything is up in the air. I'm almost more excited to see what kind of trades we pull off. Sessions and trade exception for Rip Hamilton and the 8th overall pick???? Using our two 2nd round picks to jump back into the 1st round? It's not like this team is concerned with locking up roster spots with 1st round picks.

 

The player I keep hearing rumors about being shopped that makes me nervous is Hickson, I'd love to see him stick around to see what he does this year. The only way I trade him is if we can pull of a package trade for a Rudy Gay or similar caliber player. What kind of day would that be? Irving at number 1, Kanter at number 4, trade for Detroits number 8 and pick up Biyombo with that pick. Then trading Hickson and another guy or two for Rudy Gay. I know, it's never going to go down like that but one can dream.

Sounds pretty good to me.

Can you package the TPE along with roster players?

Man, I feel like I usually understand stuff like this, but I just read five different articles about the TPE and didn't understand any of it.  Here is the most technical explanation (question 71) http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q19.

After reading this: http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/sports_magic/2011/06/the-orlando-magics-trade-exception-dilemma.html it seems like Hts. is right.  The TPE can be used to acquire 1 player, or a player and draft picks, and can be combined with draft picks, but can't be combined with another salaried player or trade exception.  So, we trade the TPE to Detroit for Rip Hamilton and the #8, and Detroit ends up with a $12.6 mil dollar (Rip Hamilton's salary) trade exception.  I think.

Really??? I thought that I kept hearing something about Detroit wanting Sessions in the deal. I wonder if there's a loophole that can make it work without technically being traded in the same package as the trade exception?

More bad news for you, heatohio.  All indications I have read recently have the Cavs being underwhelmed by Kanter.  They are brining him back on Monday to double check on that, but it appears they will take Big V at #4 if D Williams is off the board.  That is... unless they can work a trade up to #2.  I think the Cavs and Minny are in a game of chicken right now trying to see who will flinch first.  Minny desperately doesn't want to be at 2 and the Cavs desperately want that pick.  Both are trying to leverage against the other.  Should be interesting.

I think I would be okay with Valanciunus.  I think I would also be okay with Vesely.  I know it's hard to judge from highlight tapes, but Vesely is really long and can jump out of the gym. Kanter terrifies me.  He has bust written all over him.  At least we would get some cool-looking dunks from Vesely.

All of them have bust potential.  I like Kanter's look, but then I see his game (albeit there is only limited film) and have trouble translating it to the NBA.  Here is the highlights from the Nike Hoops Summit where he basically made a name for himself.  What I just can't get over is how 'below the rim' he plays.

 

 

 

Jonas ('Big V') on the other hand.....

 

 

 

And, yes.  Vesely is impressive...

 

 

 

For the last two, I would be interested in the examination of their frames to know how they might fill out.  Yes, NBA teams actually do that.  With Kanter, there is no such concern as he already has an NBA body.  But Kanter's short wingspan bothers me.  He is 6'11 with a 7'1 wingspan while Jonas is 7'0 with a 7'6 wingspan.

Oh god, those videos just made me really hope that we don't draft Kanter (I realize it's stupid to make judgments off of highlight videos).  But give me the 7-footers who can run and jump, not the 6'10'' guy with stumpy arms who can't get above the rim.

Funny you should be having this discussion. This is today's Bleacher Report........

 

NBA Draft 2011: Enes Kanter and the Most Overrated International Players   

By Eitan Katz on June 17, 2011

 

With the NBA Draft less than a week away, teams are putting the final touches on their draft night big boards. There have been some major shifts in the last few weeks, with Kyrie Irving as the No. 1 pick being the only thing close to a certainty.

 

A key component to the draft is international scouting. Teams pay millions and millions of dollars to send scouts all around the world just to get the slightest peek into the games of potential lottery picks like Enes Kanter, Jan Vesely and Jonas Valanciunas.

 

With dreams of drafting the next Dirk Nowitzki (and not the next  Saer Sene or  Nikoloz Tskitishvili, who has been added to the discussion of "worst lottery pick ever"), coaches, general managers and scouts always seem to overrate foreigners, completely neglecting the fact that their competition is extremely inferior both in size and skill from the college level.

 

READ MORE AT:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/738221-nba-draft-2011-enes-kanter-and-the-most-overrated-international-players

Kanter dominated Sullinger recently.  Kanter was to play at Kentucky...he knows the American game  Ill pass on BOTH JV's.  Between Irving, Williams, Knight, Kanter....if we get 2 of those 4 (not irving/knight) i will be thrilled!!!

 

Any second round suggestions?  Shelvin Mack  Norris Cole?

I like Knight a lot, but I think he is out of the conversation because we are going to take Irving.  There really isn't much legitimate doubt about that, despite the arguments you can make that it would make sense to take Williams #1 and Knight or Walker at #4.  Similarly, the thought that Williams might fall to #4, although not TOTALLY out of the question, is also probably not realistic.  So.... sticking with what is really viable talk, and assuming that the first three picks goes Irving, Williams, Knight, you're essentially left with the two JV's, Kanter, and Leonard from SDSU as picks you can pass off as having value at #4.  I honestly like Marshon Brooks better than any of those guys, but you can trade down 5-10 spots and still get him.

 

BTW, that video I posted IS the highlight from when Kanter and Sully went head-to-head.  They dominated EACH OTHER on the offensive end.  I think Sully had 22 pts that game.  They actually play a lot alike, but Kanter is probably an inch or two taller and Sully is a little more mobile. 

 

Also, I never said that Kanter can't jump.  He is not a high flyer, but he can dunk.  He just doesn't seem like he has that necessary nasty streak around the rim.

I love Irving and would take him, but Im not so sure he is what he is built up to yet.  Notwithstanding the "Duke players are never stars argument"...i watch Derrick Williams take down Duke while Irving wasnt winning it for his team...and on a different channel, Brandon Knight was hitting clutch shot after clutch shot (OSU game, UNC game).  I know i shouldnt base things on one game...but if we blow this draft, we are in trouble.  European guys scare the heck out of me.  FOr every one Dirk, there are 25 Darko's.  Agree?

^I think a lot of folks here are getting skittiish about Irving, present co. included... The kid played 11 total games, has a questionable wheel and piloted an alleged powerhouse to an early NCAA exit... Pundits and scouts, though, are uniformly high on this kid and they tend to be right more often than not -- 3 years ago was eerily similar to what the Cavs face next Thursday -- remember how some in Chicago were leaning toward Michael Beasley ago over Derrick Rose -- well, how did that turn out? -- Beasley's now, what? on his 3rd team in 3 years while Rose was MVP; yeah, I know the kid flamed out in the EC finals, but he did have LeBron hounding him all over the court (before, of course, LeBron did a similar move in the Finals).  Plus, Rose got ZERO help in the EC finals, again, eerily like former No. 23 didn't in those deep playoff runs when he toiled for the Cavs... including, zippo from that overpaid fraud, Carlos Boozer --- oh yeah, another punk who stiffed the Cavs when he got a chance after Paxson/Gund's foolish free agency blunder.

 

You never can tell... Cavs could land both Irving AND Williams.... WE KNOW how driven Gilbert is -- look at the casino and (cough, cough) how he got his way in taking down the Columbia building... It's kind of amazing that the Cavs are in as sweet a position as we are -- it's all about Chris Grant's aggressive, smart moves at Gilbert's behest -- anyone, for example, who doesn't think the Moon/Mo trade for Baron Davis (despite the bad contract) and the Clippers' 1st round pick (which turned out to be our No. 1 lotter ball), is anything short of brilliant, just doesn't know hoops... btw, last rumor I heard, the Cavs are shopping JJ to, perhaps, try and get yet another 1st round pick.  Not sure of the details...

 

...I'm not sold on  Kanter.  He'll be good, but not for our no. 4 pick.  I'd take Valanciunus before him, who has more upside, from what I'm reading, but is a bit more long term project.

As of right now it's a guess among NBA GM's let alone a bunch of people on a message board as far as who's going to be a bust and a HOFer. Personally, I like a physical center and I see that in kanter, and dude can jump, I saw him getting up plenty at the scouting combine. I do not want Williams or that "Big V" guy. I'd be willing to trade out of the 4 spot or take that Vesley kid before those two. Like I said before, Williams is too Lebron like for my taste, plus him being a tweener scares me, tweeners usually don't fit in too well in the NBA. And that Jonas kid seems like another soft center that will get beat up in the middle and provide little to bring us what we need, rebounding and defense. Whatever pick(s) and trade(s) we make, I just hope they turn out for the best. I want a winner and that's all I care about.

Like I said before, Williams is too Lebron like for my taste, plus him being a tweener scares me, tweeners usually don't fit in too well in the NBA.

 

Dude, if Williams has half LeBron's talent, I don't care how much of a tweener he is, we'll deal with it.  I for one think that in today's NBA, designated positions 1s, 2s, 3s and 4s, esp, are increasingly irrellevant... The Heat didn't go down because LeBron was a tweener, they went down because he completely lost his nerve in the clutch, plus, his coach had a piss-poor game plan.  Rick Carlisle ran rings around Spoelstra... I mean Dirk Nowitski is 5, who really plays the 4 but, really, almost plays the 3 in many ways -- he's usually way out on the wing spotting up for jumpers and, until this playoffs, very really took it to the rim... Jason Terry's a 2 who, in crunch time these finals, really was a surrogate point guard the way he played on the ball, ran the pick'n roll and set up his bigs... I'm in love with Derrick Williams skills.  Be he a 4 or a stretch 3, we will open up the floor the way he can hit spot up jumpers from the wing.  He can also handle the ball -- though he's no LeBron, obviously, at this point... Like I said, I'll take a an extreme talent like Williams and work him in somewhere.  I really like the idea a front line with him and JJ... that is, if we somehow grab Williams and don't  deal JJ...

Like I said before, Williams is too Lebron like for my taste, plus him being a tweener scares me, tweeners usually don't fit in too well in the NBA.

 

Dude, if Williams has half LeBron's talent, I don't care how much of a tweener he is, we'll deal with it.  I for one think that in today's NBA, designated positions 1s, 2s, 3s and 4s, esp, are increasingly irrellevant... The Heat didn't go down because LeBron was a tweener, they went down because he completely lost his nerve in the clutch, plus, his coach had a piss-poor game plan.  Rick Carlisle ran rings around Spoelstra... I mean Dirk Nowitski is 5, who really plays the 4 but, really, almost plays the 3 in many ways -- he's usually way out on the wing spotting up for jumpers and, until this playoffs, very really took it to the rim... Jason Terry's a 2 who, in crunch time these finals, really was a surrogate point guard the way he played on the ball, ran the pick'n roll and set up his bigs... I'm in love with Derrick Williams skills.  Be he a 4 or a stretch 3, we will open up the floor the way he can hit spot up jumpers from the wing.  He can also handle the ball -- though he's no LeBron, obviously, at this point... Like I said, I'll take a an extreme talent like Williams and work him in somewhere.  I really like the idea a front line with him and JJ... that is, if we somehow grab Williams and don't  deal JJ...

 

Lebron is and never has been a tweener, he can play all positions 1-4 but his best and most natural position is the small forward spot. Dirk is only a center by height, not skill set which is what determines a persons position. Bottom line, you're confusing a player stepping in and playing limited minutes at an off position for a guy who will play 90% of his time at a particular position. And as for my not wanting Williams, he isn't good enough to play the 3 and he's an undersized 4 where we already have like 15 power forwards on our roster.

 

Derrik Williams was known for disappearing during many games throughout the season and showed spurts of being really good, but didn't do it on a game in game out basis. If he's there at # 4 I think we'll be able to make one hell of a trade that should help this team a lot more than picking up a huge question mark that will come with off the court issues.

^Yes, LeBron is a natural 3 but plays on the ball like a point guard which, as we've seen here, and Miami saw in the finals, reeks havoc ... both on the natural point guard (Mo, in the Cavs' case -- who really was a weak point anyway), and on LeBron, at least in the finals, when he seemed confused when he didn't get enough touches, which I contend, threw off his game.

Lebron is a different kind of player, he has the skill set and size of a 3 but needs the ball in his hands to be effective. I've said that since his 3rd year. I also said that he and Wade won't work well together because they both need the ball to be effective. But all it would take is for Lebrons ego, not his skill set, to change. (not sure which one would be harder to change or improve on) Besides, Lebron got plenty of touches during the finals, he just passed the ball as soon as he touched it.

 

As for Williams being a tweener, he won't have a roster spot on most teams. I'm pretty sure he'll drop to 4 if the Cavs want him that badly, the T-Wolves don't want him, and Utah needs a PG, so they won't take him. I sure as hell don't want a 6'7" PF on my team, regardless of how big his wingspan is. The last inch on his finger won't do so good when defending guys like Pau Gasol in games. I want real size. Hickson is already undersized enough at 6'9".

 

Bottom line is that I want Irving and Kanter, IMO those two guys will give us the two most important positions in the game, PG and center, for years to come. Tough and physical, can play with his back to the basket, can stretch the floor to 16 feet, strong rebounder. I'm not saying he is going to be or has to be Shaq or Dwight, he just has to be a very good center that protects the rim, gathers in 9 or more rebounds a game and gives you 15 points.

 

Williams will be a liability on the defensive end for his first 2 years at least, if he's anything like in college he'll be missing in action for a bunch of games during the year and either be playing out of position, taking over for a player we've developed nicely or coming in off the bench where we already have Andy, Samuels and Jamison playing the same spot. But like I said before, if we take him, I hope he's the best player he can be and wins us a ton of games and championships over the years.