Yes GSW is better on paper, but it is far from a foregone conclusion that we lose to them in the Finals again.  We were one 4th quarter meltdown away from the series being tied 2-2.  Hell, we were one missed Korver 3 away from that.  Lots of things can change.  GSW may not be fully healthy.  Durant may not be 'en fuego' at the right time.  Our bench may actually contribute something.

 

The experience is what you make of it.  Someone spoke the truth this week when they said we worship the 80's Browns teams like they were Gods, and enjoyed the runs they had to the utmost, but the entire City is one big negative nancy when it comes to the Cavs/LeBron.   

 

I just don't think reality matches up with this idea that some are pushing that the Cavaliers were all that close in this year's NBA Finals. But I will grant you one this, after I made my post about how hopes for next year are futile, I immediately thought of the one thing that I believe would significantly alter the chances of the Cavaliers winning next year. If Golden State has a season-ending injury to one of its superstars, I think the Cavaliers can compete and win. Short of that, I think the NBA would be safe in handing the trophy to the Warriors again.

 

The 1980s Browns actually went on several runs that were (by all accounts since I don't really remember) fun to experience and certainly nothing was given to them.* Those Browns teams also had opportunities to take the next step, and although they also had that one team that was their ultimate road block, it wasn't as if they were underdogs every time they matched up. I think there are other reasons why those 1980s Browns teams might be considered darlings, but in other important ways the situation is quite different. The Cavaliers are expected to make the NBA Finals, and rightly so, and for a city that has been bridesmaids so many times, that's simply not enough, especially with the best player in the game on the roster.

 

 

 

*The Cavaliers are 36-5 over the past three seasons in the Eastern Conference Playoffs. The Browns won three playoff games in their three AFC runner-up seasons by an average of 8 points.

I think the Cavs may be alright if they can get Derrick Williams to play up to his athletic ability.  To me that means training camp and a lot of time finding minutes for him in the regular season. He has to see now what it takes for players on a championship team to stay at that level and the sacrifices they make.  He has the exact physique to be able to guard Durant.

I think it's  also overlooked that we should be expecting improvement from Kyrie over the next 2-3 years as he enters his prime. It's not guaranteed, but players generally have their best seasons in their age 26-29 seasons.

Shakin my head - Griff is gone, no replacement and the Cavs are bragging about resigning Korver - (a no show on offense in the finals and a bad defensive player) and now Richard Jefferson!!! - Guess we'll have the oldest bench in the league.  And for those that are penciling in the Cavs for the finals again - consider that we've all gotten used to an injury- free LeBron. But what if that changed and he went down (especially late in the year?)  We've got to take some scoring pressure off LBJ by adding one more real game changer. Kryie's generally brilliant (well, most of the time) but Love sometimes disappears offensively in big games - I really think we need one more major scoring threat -  Now that PG and Butler have gone elsewhere, I'm rooting that Carmello signs on. Talk about adding some firepower... I know he's had some "issues" in terms of defensive effort, but playing alongside LeBron would take care of any "attitude problem".  Cavs have to get better - not just hope for better results from the same team.  Being champs of a clearly weaker conference is not what you settle for with the best player of a generation - 1 title in 10 seasons with LeBron here - not good enough.

I think Carmelo and Wade both have a shot to be bought out. We will see if they want to win or not.  We can't rely on injuries for the Cavs winning a title, have to assume full strength. And the 2 minute meltdown happened, that's the reality and the warriors were sitting here waiting to win that game. They will be waiting again next year.  You have to play 4 perfect games to beat the warriors. The Cavs played one this past finals and frankly 3 of the others were nowhere near perfect.

 

If they can land melo I will believe they are improved from last year because hey can score more and have a body that might be able to be inspired to play D that can disrupt Durant.

 

It's clear Gilbert has lost money going over the luxury tax the last two years and now is feeling it. He may be a good business owner (maybe) but he is all over the place as an owner. Clearly valued the title at any expense and now that he sees his Cavs income statement two years in a row is back tracking a bit. Low balled griffin and now billups and is rumored to ship out shumpert just to shave money.  No consistency and identity as an owner = a mess

 

Wtf are the Cavs doing?  They signed a 36-year old Korver to a THREE YEAR deal??? LOL.

 

Let's bring in 35-year old Jose Calderon to back up Kyrie?

 

James Jones might retire...which is utterly meaningless, but ok.

 

Who's the GM?  Gilbert?  LeBron?

 

I don't see where Melo fits in - will he come off the bench?  Would he start at the 4 if they move Love?

Shakin my head - Griff is gone, no replacement and the Cavs are bragging about resigning Korver - (a no show on offense in the finals and a bad defensive player) and now Richard Jefferson!!! - Guess we'll have the oldest bench in the league.  And for those that are penciling in the Cavs for the finals again - consider that we've all gotten used to an injury- free LeBron. But what if that changed and he went down (especially late in the year?)  We've got to take some scoring pressure off LBJ by adding one more real game changer. Kryie's generally brilliant (well, most of the time) but Love sometimes disappears offensively in big games - I really think we need one more major scoring threat -  Now that PG and Butler have gone elsewhere, I'm rooting that Carmello signs on. Talk about adding some firepower... I know he's had some "issues" in terms of defensive effort, but playing alongside LeBron would take care of any "attitude problem".  Cavs have to get better - not just hope for better results from the same team.  Being champs of a clearly weaker conference is not what you settle for with the best player of a generation - 1 title in 10 seasons with LeBron here - not good enough.

 

No, no.  We need defense more than we need offense.  We have two 25ppg+ scorers and a 20ppg scorer.  Since everyone is so freaked out and panicking about GSW, how about we try something novel..... like not allow them to score close to 70 points in every first half?  That would be a good place to start.

Is anyone here familiar with how the new collective bargaining agreement

works regarding the new 16th & 17th roster spot two-way agreements.

I read somewhere that these 2 spots will be able to spend 45 days with the

NBA team.  So does that mean that somewhere along the way rosters

expand past the 15 players or is it something else.

Are they still dressing 13 with 2 inactive as in the past or has that increased? 

LeBron James reportedly frustrated and concerned by Cavs' lack of offseason moves

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/lebron-james-reportedly-frustrated-and-concerned-by-cavs-lack-of-offseason-moves/

What does LeBron expect? The Cavs are capped out with no assets. We all knew this was coming.

What I expected was to move Love for paul George or Jimmy butler. Have to get someone athletic enough to guard Durant. Now u have to hope for a melo/Wade buyout so we can get some athleticism on the cheap

Wade buyout so we can get some athleticism

 

Does not compute.

I believe the Butler trade would have happened had not Gilbert stupidly fired Griffin the day it was to happen.  LeBron was reportedly very high on Griffin and this just created more problems.  Gilbert is being portrayed nationally as a nutcase owner who has created the image of a franchise in disarray.  This no doubt scared away Billups and, word is, rumors surfaced of LeBron leaving, as the article notes, following the Griffin firing.

I believe the Butler trade would have happened had not Gilbert stupidly fired Griffin the day it was to happen.  LeBron was reportedly very high on Griffin and this just created more problems.  Gilbert is being portrayed nationally as a nutcase owner who has created the image of a franchise in disarray.  This no doubt scared away Billups and, word is, rumors surfaced of LeBron leaving, as the article notes, following the Griffin firing.

The bottom line is that the Bulls, like the Pacers, didn't want to trade with a team within the division and conference. Griffin wouldn't have changed that. And while he did a decent job here, a lot of you people have him way overrated!! After all, LeBron and Kyrie fell into his lap (he had absolutely nothing LeBron coming back), and he made the easy trade for Kevin Love. Any GM would look good with these players. Griffin was just in the right place at the right time. He's really not all that special!!

I believe the Butler trade would have happened had not Gilbert stupidly fired Griffin the day it was to happen.  LeBron was reportedly very high on Griffin and this just created more problems.  Gilbert is being portrayed nationally as a nutcase owner who has created the image of a franchise in disarray.  This no doubt scared away Billups and, word is, rumors surfaced of LeBron leaving, as the article notes, following the Griffin firing.

The bottom line is that the Bulls, like the Pacers, didn't want to trade with a team within the division and conference. Griffin wouldn't have changed that. And while he did a decent job here, a lot of you people have him way overrated!! After all, LeBron and Kyrie fell into his lap (he had absolutely nothing LeBron coming back), and he made the easy trade for Kevin Love. Any GM would look good with these players. Griffin was just in the right place at the right time. He's really not all that special!!

 

I'm not saying Griffin was God, but you downplay him way too much.  And the fact is you simply don't fire a GM right at the beginning of free agency when we needed a GM in place.  And this free agency was critical for us because the Warriors showed the world how much better they are than us. It was a bonehead move and indicated that the organization is/was unstable.

Wade buyout so we can get some athleticism

 

Does not compute.

 

Don't discount a dwyane Wade who is the 6th option. He's the type of vet that would come in and make huge playoff plays. He can still play D too

I believe the Butler trade would have happened had not Gilbert stupidly fired Griffin the day it was to happen.  LeBron was reportedly very high on Griffin and this just created more problems.  Gilbert is being portrayed nationally as a nutcase owner who has created the image of a franchise in disarray.  This no doubt scared away Billups and, word is, rumors surfaced of LeBron leaving, as the article notes, following the Griffin firing.

The bottom line is that the Bulls, like the Pacers, didn't want to trade with a team within the division and conference. Griffin wouldn't have changed that. And while he did a decent job here, a lot of you people have him way overrated!! After all, LeBron and Kyrie fell into his lap (he had absolutely nothing LeBron coming back), and he made the easy trade for Kevin Love. Any GM would look good with these players. Griffin was just in the right place at the right time. He's really not all that special!!

 

I'm not saying Griffin was God, but you downplay him way too much.  And the fact is you simply don't fire a GM right at the beginning of free agency when we needed a GM in place.  And this free agency was critical for us because the Warriors showed the world how much better they are than us. It was a bonehead move and indicated that the organization is/was unstable.

What I'm telling you is that he had little to do with the Cavs winning the title because he basically inherited a championship caliber roster. And you don't know the circumstances of why he was let go. I read where he wanted to be one of the highest paid GMs. If that's the case, I don't blame Gilbert for saying adios!! As far as free agency goes, because of Griffin's moves, the Cavs obviously don't have the cap space to sign any meaningful free agents. And because we are a long way from the trading deadline, there is plenty of time to improve the roster. So let's stop all of this "Griffin-to-the-hall-of-fame" talk!! He just happened to be the GM when LeBron decided to come back!! You are giving him WAY WAY too much credit!!!

You're obviously not hearing what I'm saying at all.  This isn't a referendum on David Griffin, it's about the appearance of instability of the franchise.  Whether you like it or not, David Griffin has a strong reputation around the league and received many votes for Executive of the Year, twice.  He didn't just inherent LeBron and Kyrie, he had the balls to fire David Blatt during the middle of a post-finals season.  But I don't care of Daffy Duck was GM, if you fire him right in the beginning or middle of sensitive negotiations to bring one of the true impact players of the League to Cleveland, you're a fool; and in this case, the fool is Dan Gilbert.  He shot his own franchise in the foot.

A big center with strong defensive skills is what they need, more than anything else.  Bogut stays healthy and they win last year.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see them talk to Phil Jackson.  He's like Hargrove, better at getting the most out of a great team than building one.

Click bait

Uh oh.  Kyrie has requested a trade.

Who is steering the Cavs right now?  Because they're driving us off the road.

 

Kyrie Irving requesting trade out of Cleveland to find bigger role

 

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20124505/kyrie-irving-seeking-trade-cleveland-cavaliers

 

Kyrie Irving is ready to end his run with the Cleveland Cavaliers, as league sources told ESPN that the guard has asked the team to trade him.

 

The request came last week and was made to Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert. Irving has expressed that he wants to go play in a situation where he can be a more focal point and no longer wants to play alongside LeBron James, sources said.

 

Irving's agent Jeff Wechsler would not confirm or deny whether Irving asked for a trade.

WTF

Kobe once demanded a trade from LAL.  He wasn't traded and won multiple more championships with the team.

 

I honestly don't understand the rationale for Kyrie.  He is NOT a good first option.  If he was, we wouldn't struggle so much when LeBron takes a seat.  He is a great second option..... at least on offense.  His current role, which allows him to stay at PG without really being a PG, is ideal.

 

If he really does want out and we can find a trade that makes us better, I'm all for it.  But if I'm the Cavs, I tell him to plan to be here next season.  A lot can change over the course of a year.  While the NBA journalists are having a lot of fun right now painting the three time defending EC champs as a sh!tshow, none of this matters.  All that matters is where we are NEXT June/July.

Reports are coming out that Kyrie has been seeking a trade for a while.

 

And the Cavs are reportedly upset that this Kyrie news has come out because it will hurt his trade value.

Obviously Kyrie is the ultimate prima dona.  He was the key player to helping the Cavs win the biggest championship in Cleveland history; we'll always be appreciative of that.  But ultimately we'll be better off without him -- that is, if we can swing a good deal for him... Anybody for bringing Wiggins back?

 

...btw does this change how fans feel about Dion Waiters?

Here's the funny thing. Kyrie is great and clutch and has the best handles and finishing in the game.  That being said if the Cavs land Melo AND Bledsoe in a 3 team deal like is being rumored, you can argue they are a better team...which is what they needed to be anyway to beat the warriors. The only downside of this whole thing is if he made his intentions clear earlier we would have paul George and probably more ok the team RN

It's starting to feel like the Cav's run as legitimate contenders is coming to a close. Even if all pieces come back from this year's team, the likelihood of beating a full strength GSW is pretty low, imo. Without Kyrie? Forget about it.

^maybe? Your not going to stop GS, so you have to outscore them, that's what the Cavs did in game 4.  Get Melo and Bledsoe and you have more firepower. Kyrie was beyond exceptional, not sure he could play better! And look where it got them

 

Yes I understand he got them a ring with his clutch shot, but that was also a different warriors team

In the NBA playing defense is all about heart, so they say.

 

So how's Kyrie on defense?

The Cavs basically have no incentive to trade him. He has one of the most team friendly contracts in the league and it lasts for two more seasons. Everyone is acting like the Cavs have to trade him because he asked. Melo and Bledsoe? GTFO

If it weren't for Bledsoe's knee issues, I'd jump on that trade.  He is a way superior perimeter defender.  If we play our cards right, we can come out of this as good or better.  Like ^ said, Kyrie has a very friendly contract.  He will be a much sought after commodity. 

Kyrie's idol Kobe gave the Lakers a trade ultimatum too after they won a title with him. The Lakers told Kobe to shut up and play. They won two more titles.

Seems like a bad time to be trying to trade a player, no?

Kyrie's a guy who can get shut down if a better than average team can focus on him.  We've seen that in games LeBron has missed.  Of course most of the time they can't and he goes off.

 

One thing to note:  if he really wants to go so he can be "the man", he must think LeBron is staying more than one more year.

 

As do I, I suspect LeBron is going to eventually be the owner and if league rules allow it it may even overlap his playing career.

 

As do I, I suspect LeBron is going to eventually be the owner and if league rules allow it it may even overlap his playing career.

 

I was just thinking about that today.  I'm hoping LeBron can eventually buy out Gilbert and become the owner.

Kyrie's a guy who can get shut down if a better than average team can focus on him.  We've seen that in games LeBron has missed.  Of course most of the time they can't and he goes off.

 

One thing to note:  if he really wants to go so he can be "the man", he must think LeBron is staying more than one more year.

 

As do I, I suspect LeBron is going to eventually be the owner and if league rules allow it it may even overlap his playing career.

 

LeBron's oldest son will be entering high school in two years. I have to believe that he's going to attend St. Vincent-St. Mary and that LeBron would want to be close enough to attend his games.

 

In regards to Kyrie, I'd have no problem trading him, but I'm just not sure they're going to get fair return for him at this point. I think they need to be in win now mode and that means that any package that doesn't include multiple high quality NBA players (not rookies or future draft picks) are the only deals they should be entertaining at this point.

Also...

 

Sources: LeBron James will not waive his no-trade clause for Cavs

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20140756/lebron-james-not-waive-no-trade-clause-cleveland-cavaliers

They didn't even hold exit interview lmao what a terrible mess they are.

One thing to note:  if he really wants to go so he can be "the man", he must think LeBron is staying more than one more year.

 

That was one of my initial reactions as well.  For as much as we hear from the Ric Bucher's of the world that the 'overwhelming consensus amongst NBA players" is that LeBron is as good as gone, someone must've forgotten to mention that to Kyrie.

 

Regardless, Kyrie's rationale makes little sense.  He wants to be more of a focus point but yet he had a higher usage rate than LeBron last season.  He averaged a career high.  He has played into the Finals the last three years, putting the spotlight more on him than it would be if he was the unquestioned star on a mediocre team.  Either that is not really his reason or he is getting very bad advice.

 

That said, I'm ready to move on.  As much as I love watching Kyrie play, the advanced metrics don't place a whole lot of value on him.  But he is young, coming off is best year, on a cap friendly contract, and is marketable.  We can get a haul for him if we play our cards right.  A much better return package than Love would bring and what he brings to the table is easier to replace.  So here's an opportunity to improve the perimeter defense and perhaps the interior as well.

In response to this Kyrie fiasco, I saw something like this on twitter - "Before you go saying that Kyrie believes the world revolves around him, remember that he believes the Earth is flat."

One thing to note:  if he really wants to go so he can be "the man", he must think LeBron is staying more than one more year.

 

That was one of my initial reactions as well.  For as much as we hear from the Ric Bucher's of the world that the 'overwhelming consensus amongst NBA players" is that LeBron is as good as gone, someone must've forgotten to mention that to Kyrie.

 

Regardless, Kyrie's rationale makes little sense.  He wants to be more of a focus point but yet he had a higher usage rate than LeBron last season.  He averaged a career high.  He has played into the Finals the last three years, putting the spotlight more on him than it would be if he was the unquestioned star on a mediocre team.  Either that is not really his reason or he is getting very bad advice.

 

That said, I'm ready to move on.  As much as I love watching Kyrie play, the advanced metrics don't place a whole lot of value on him.  But he is young, coming off is best year, on a cap friendly contract, and is marketable.  We can get a haul for him if we play our cards right.  A much better return package than Love would bring and what he brings to the table is easier to replace.  So here's an opportunity to improve the perimeter defense and perhaps the interior as well.

 

I definitely don't like what Kyrie is doing; it appears selfish and  foolish on its face.  But the other way to view this is that Kyrie doesn't want to get stuck on a middling club after LeBron possibly pulls up stakes and leaves next year if we don't win the title.  He's done this twice now, with the Decision 2 being more destructive than Decision 1 in a way since that Heat team was still spectacular despite being knocked out easily (4-1 like this year's Cavs) to the Spurs in 2014.  That 2010 Cavs team had a lot of flaws even though we were in the E.C. finals that year with a good shot at beating out Boston... And LeBron left his best friend, D. Wade, holding the bag (Wade must be a really good guy because he refuses to hold any gripes against LeBron ... publicly at least).  Because LeBron refuses to commit beyond next season, he's holding the team hostage. 

 

I know the cover story is that Kyrie simply doesn't want to continue being Robin to LeBron's Batman, and there is some traction to this aspect.  But there may be other factors involved, including a potential negative Decision 3.

As much as I love watching Kyrie play, the advanced metrics don't place a whole lot of value on him. 

 

My assumption was that this statement couldn't be true, but I went and looked and you're right, he wasn't in the top 20 last season for PER, WS/48, or VORP, despite essentially having a career year.

 

That said, the guy the Cavs probably could have had that did rank top 10 or top 15 in those categories is Jimmy Butler. Dammit.

To be fair the Cavs had a trade in place before the draft with the Pacers and Nuggets to send PG13 to the Cavs. The Pacers pulled out of that deal. So we almost did have PG-13, apparently (according to reports) Kyrie wasn't happy about that as well as the trade rumors to the Bulls for Butler.

 

Side Note: The best trade proposal I've heard was Wiggins and Dieng for Kyrie, that could be great for the Cavs if they can get Wiggins to re-commit to playing defense.

^There's a few ideas I saw floated that I like better.  Never been much of a Wiggins fan.  I've never thought his game would translate well to playing alongside LeBron.

 

The best deals I've seen have Eric Bledsoe coming back as part of the package.

 

But one idea I just saw floated had Delly coming "home" in some sort of multi-team format.  Obviously, we would need some established all-star or super high-end prospect to be part of that package.  But I love the idea of bringing Delly back.  He gives us so much of what Kyrie did not and he is familiar with and to the coach and team.  No transition period for him.   

^There's a few ideas I saw floated that I like better.  Never been much of a Wiggins fan.  I've never thought his game would translate well to playing alongside LeBron.

 

The best deals I've seen have Eric Bledsoe coming back as part of the package.

 

But one idea I just saw floated had Delly coming "home" in some sort of multi-team format.  Obviously, we would need some established all-star or super high-end prospect to be part of that package.  But I love the idea of bringing Delly back.  He gives us so much of what Kyrie did not and he is familiar with and to the coach and team.  No transition period for him. 

Those sound like the Bleacher report trade proposals, I've seen on Twitter that that's actually a proposal for Minny (supposedly).

^There's a few ideas I saw floated that I like better.  Never been much of a Wiggins fan.  I've never thought his game would translate well to playing alongside LeBron.

 

The best deals I've seen have Eric Bledsoe coming back as part of the package.

 

But one idea I just saw floated had Delly coming "home" in some sort of multi-team format.  Obviously, we would need some established all-star or super high-end prospect to be part of that package.  But I love the idea of bringing Delly back.  He gives us so much of what Kyrie did not and he is familiar with and to the coach and team.  No transition period for him. 

If you think the advanced metrics don't place a lot of value on Kyrie, you should check out Delly's. He was one of the worst players in the NBA last year, with worse defensive numbers than Kyrie on a better defensive team.

 

Edit: He's also on a horrible contract

Minny is getting a lot of play in the twitterverse because Kyrie supposedly listed them, along with Miami, SAS, and NYK, as his preferred destinations..... not that he has much say in where he goes.  He is good friends with Jimmy Butler and Karl Anthony Towns.  A few reasons why I don't see that happening.  Wiggins is due for an over-bloated contract.  Trading Kyrie for him would either this year or next, INCREASE the luxury tax bill Gilbert would have to pay.  The other reason is fit.  Wiggins doesn't fit..... and who would be your starting PG?

Minny is getting a lot of play in the twitterverse because Kyrie supposedly listed them, along with Miami, SAS, and NYK, as his preferred destinations..... not that he has much say in where he goes.  He is good friends with Jimmy Butler and Karl Anthony Towns.  A few reasons why I don't see that happening.  Wiggins is due for an over-bloated contract.  Trading Kyrie for him would either this year or next, INCREASE the luxury tax bill Gilbert would have to pay.  The other reason is fit.  Wiggins doesn't fit..... and who would be your starting PG?

 

I think Wiggins could definitely fit here.  He could play the 2 or the 3, the latter with either LeBron not on the floor or him moving to the 4.  I would do everything to make Wiggins fit because he's exactly the kind of young, 2-way player who loves to play D on a D-starved team.  And his offense, esp his 3-point shooting, has improved markedly this past year.

 

Starting PG... Derrick Rose.

Minny is getting a lot of play in the twitterverse because Kyrie supposedly listed them, along with Miami, SAS, and NYK, as his preferred destinations..... not that he has much say in where he goes.  He is good friends with Jimmy Butler and Karl Anthony Towns.  A few reasons why I don't see that happening.  Wiggins is due for an over-bloated contract.  Trading Kyrie for him would either this year or next, INCREASE the luxury tax bill Gilbert would have to pay.  The other reason is fit.  Wiggins doesn't fit..... and who would be your starting PG?

Yeah I really hope they don't trade for Wiggins. It's like nobody realizes he's not very good for some reason.

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-nba-haters-ball/