Sweet, I'd much rather support a local and someone who cares about the outcome.  I'll send him an email, and see what he has to say.  All sorts of good ideas so far...

 

 

Does anyone else see the irony in using bumper stickers to support a streetcar?

 

:-)

 

So maybe we can shift the "...if Cincinnati had a streetcar" campaign to other venues.

 

For example:

 

A big sign at the entrance to the parking areas around at the stadium and ball park that said something like "There would fewer cars between you and your first beer if...".

 

or signs in front of some of those empty buildings on Race saying "Someone would be renovating this dump if..."

 

or a big sign on Fountain Square that said "You could be at anyone of these exciting destinations within X minutes if..." followed by the long list of restaurants, bars, clubs, art venues, and other destinations already within a block of the proposed streetcar line.

 

The possibilities are endless.

 

Frankly, I'll be putting the stickers on my bicycle, not my car, but hey, if people wanna stick em on cars, have fun ;)

 

The irony is awesome!

Does anyone else see the irony in using bumper stickers to support a streetcar?

 

 

I think a solution could be a bumper sticker that says:

 

[glow=red,2,300]I'D RATHER BE RIDING A STREETCAR![/glow]

 

 

That aint bad

What do people think of bumper sticker sized static clings? Some people don't like putting a sticker on their bumper, but would be more willing to put those removable static cling things in their window.  It also has better visibility.

 

The prices look about the same on a per unit basis.

 

Getting them on a decent number of cars that are driven downtown would probably be the best way to get the message visible. Think about it.  100 cars that drive in the central business district 5 days a week is a heck of a lot of visibility.  It might be worth giving that many away outside a few of the parking garages just to get it done. The trick is to somehow make sure they get displayed on the car, not hanging in their office cubicle.

 

Maybe bumper sticker sized magnetic stickers would be better. For single color imprint, they run about the same as everything else in that size. Just ask if they support the streetcar initiative.  Ask permission to stick it on the trunk flap after convincing them it's not permanent, and move on to the next car pulling in.

 

Sorry, I'm rambling tonight.

How about a variation on this one from the Virgina Railway Express?

 

"CAR BAD. TRAIN GOOD."   LOL!  I love that!

 

 

What do people think of bumper sticker sized static clings?

 

Maybe bumper sticker sized magnetic stickers would be better.

 

I'm for anything that gets the word out there.  I was planning on putting mine on a magnetic sheet anyway, so I'd definitely save myself the hassle and buy a pre-made magnetic one, if one is available.  In fact, I'll probably end up buying a bunch of these stickers, so that I can hand them out if someone compliments mine.

 

 

or signs in front of some of those empty buildings on Race saying "Someone would be renovating this dump if..."

 

I was actually driving down Vine Street yesterday and was having similar thoughts.  It would be cool to see these stuck all over the plywood (NOT ON THE BUILDINGS THEMSELVES) that is used to board up so many buildings in OTR.  At the very least it would make for a good photo to submit to the Enquirer.

I have another suggestion.  That is, why not consider using red, white and blue???  I'm serious  :whip:

 

I consider support of the Streetcar to be one aspect of my general, heart-felt patriotism, so there's honestly no cynicism intended.  Besides, I think using red, white and blue (and maybe even some stars and stripes -- no kidding!) may help make the case with some opponents by drawing their attention to the message.  We don't need to convince any believers, after all.  However, I can understand if supporters would prefer to have stickers whose purpose is showing solidarity rather than trying to win the hearts and minds of opponents.

 

My second choice would be taxicab yellow with bold black lettering. 

I'm actually wishing a moderator would end this bumper sticker back-and-forth.  Has anyone heard anything about the next council meeting and vote?

What do people think of bumper sticker sized static clings? Some people don't like putting a sticker on their bumper, but would be more willing to put those removable static cling things in their window.  It also has better visibility.

 

If/When I hear back from Bryan, I'll ask him about that possibility. 

 

I'm actually wishing a moderator would end this bumper sticker back-and-forth.

 

If people want to take this to PM's, emails, or a separate thread, thats fine, and I will make the announcement here when they are available, but in the end this is all part of the grass roots political support, and while what goes on the bumper sticker isn't directly relevant to the streetcar itself, it certainly is relevant to the way this particular political campaign presents itself, something that has been discussed here more than once *cough*

 

 

Great idea about this bumper sticker thing, but I would have to agree with LincolnKennedy.

 

Let's move this to it's own thread!  It's worthy enough.

OK, someone PM a mod and see if we can't split these posts into a new thread?  Not even sure if that is possible, but worth a shot.

 

We'd want a new thread to have a vote anyhow.

Let's just end the bumper sticker talk for now.  If a final design comes up, go ahead an d post it.

 

I don't really see that it ought to be a separate thread.

 

BTW: have you all noticed how many pages are on this thread?  125 ! There is a lot of back-and-forth about just about everything to do with the Cincy streetcar. 

OK, here's the plan!

 

Email me (cstpierre - AT - gmail.com) with your bumper sticker designs.  (this includes those of you who have already posted with your designs, just email me with the images you posted)  Lets say that the last day you can send me your design is Thursday (4/17).  On Friday, I will start a new thread with the competitors designs, and Friday will be the vote day.  I want to get these to a printer ASAP, so please, send as many designs as you want to me.

 

Does this work for everyone? (don't respond here, PM me :))

I'd keep it really short and simple and convey the broadest support independent of any particular plan or timing. It ought to be a message that works when it's on a vehicle or anywhere else.

 

Something like, "I'm for the Streetcar"

 

Sometimes, when you are less specific about something, people are more curious -- like, maybe they ought to find out what this "Streetcar" stuff is all about.

 

You're welcome to append www.protransit.com to it. It's the local site with the longest-running News on streetcars and light rail here and in other parts of the country. Shannon does a great job keeping it up to date.

Has anyone heard anything about the next council meeting and vote?

 

Ask and ye shall receive!

 

http://frontier.cincinnati.com/blogs/gov/2008/04/this-week-with-mark-mallory.asp

See number 9 on the list of the meeting with Mallory

 

9. The plan to move ahead with streetcars could be on council's agenda next week. "A little more conversation needs to happen. We can probably get it wrapped up this week."

 

You can bet I'll be at the finance meeting on Monday (and, fingers crossed, consequently at the full council meeting on Wednesday too!)

^that first "reader repsonse" on the enquirer blog page just makes me want to scream. 

^that first "reader repsonse" on the enquirer blog page just makes me want to scream. 

 

What the hell?  That guy needs to chill out.  I love that he doesn't even want the trees in the city to grow. 

He doesn't even live in the city, so his opinions don't count -- nor do mine. But from Cleveland I am cheering for you, Cincinnatians, that you get your streetcars. Keep up the good fight!

I read that but oh my this women is SMOKING.

Decade  Streetcars  Population

1890-00    yes          gain

1900-10    yes          gain

'10-20      yes          gain

'20-30      yes          gain

'30-40      yes          gain

'40-50      yes          gain

'50-60      no*          loss

'60-70      no          loss

'70-80      no          loss

'80-90      no          loss

'90-2000    no          loss

 

*streetcar service ended 1951

I read that but oh my this women is SMOKING.

 

I don't see a cigarette in her mouth....

 

But she is extremely hot.

I read that but oh my this women is SMOKING.

 

 

That's it, I am moving to Washington!!!        She can correspond my......... Nevermind!!

 

 

Decade  Streetcars   Population

1890-00     yes          gain

1900-10     yes          gain

'10-20       yes          gain

'20-30       yes          gain

'30-40       yes          gain

'40-50       yes          gain

'50-60       no*          loss

'60-70       no           loss

'70-80       no           loss

'80-90       no           loss

'90-2000    no           loss

 

*streetcar service ended 1951

 

Coincidence, I think not.......

I mean she's good looking and all, but seriously...you guys impress easily.

thomasbw.... not to be a total dick... because I understand what you are saying... but those statistics may represent correlation but not causality. There is definitely a correlation between the absence of the streetcars but was the population loss caused by the absence of streetcars? Who knows?

I'm pretty sure he realizes that correlation and causation are different, I mean there were a HECK of a lot of social and economic factors in play at that time.  Desegregation, the rise of the "everyone has to have a car" movement, the burgeoning baby boom, big oil buying out public transit, etc, etc.  Still, its a nifty little fact.

I know... I was just in a mood because I had my statistics class yesterday and that was one of the topics.... :smile:

 

 

I'm pretty sure he realizes that correlation and causation are different, I mean there were a HECK of a lot of social and economic factors in play at that time.  Desegregation, the rise of the "everyone has to have a car" movement, the burgeoning baby boom, big oil buying out public transit, etc, etc.  Still, its a nifty little fact.

 

 

Interesting though, that the "everyone has to have a car movement", "big oil buying out public transit", & "streetcar disappearance" can all be traced directly back to the american auto industry.  I'm not necessarily assigning blame, but it is odd how many of these factors are related.

I'm pretty sure he realizes that correlation and causation are different, I mean there were a HECK of a lot of social and economic factors in play at that time.  Desegregation, the rise of the "everyone has to have a car" movement, the burgeoning baby boom, big oil buying out public transit, etc, etc.  Still, its a nifty little fact.

 

 

 

 

Interesting though, that the "everyone has to have a car movement", "big oil buying out public transit", & "streetcar disappearance" can all be traced directly back to the american auto industry.  I'm not necessarily assigning blame, but it is odd how many of these factors are related.

 

Don't forget the AHA

No doubt, it was a "perfect storm" of things coinciding.  And now its time to turn it around.  Just about the perfect storm for re urbanization is happening right now, its just harder to capitalize on if you aren't "big oil"

 

Anyone else notice how man oil company feel good commercials have been running lately?

^Yea, BP says they have spent what, 10 billion in research for alternative fuels over the last 10 years.

 

Congrats a$$holes, you pulled what, a 40 billion dollar proffit in the past three months.

 

Anyway, I agree with you all that the downfall of Cincy wasn't single handedly from ending the streetcars service, but a perfect storm of sorts.      You can bet we are going to pay for it now!!

Congrats a$$holes, you pulled what, a 40 billion dollar proffit in the past three months.

 

Wouldn't want a public company making profits, now would we!  Down with all corporations!!!

They can make trillions in profit for all I care, just don't come on the airwaves telling me that the solution to our problems is... wait for it... BURN MORE STUFF.

 

Anyone else notice how man oil company feel good commercials have been running lately?

 

I swear I saw animation of a light rail train in an ExxonMobil commercial the other day.

 

And what about the car commercials -- no more pastoral scenes in Big Sur with naturally weathered  fence posts along winding, hilly roads, with cattle grazing in the distance and a newly damp highway. Not a single person, building or even another car in the picture -- you know, the kind of commute that no one has. What I tend to see in car commercials these days are real-life urban scenes and city people.

That is a direct representation of the change of mentality of the American consumer. Usually, marketers are on the cutting edge of knowing what consumers are looking for and can relate too. I honestly think that is a big signal illustrating a resurgence of Urban American. Hopefully we can just prevent it from also being car-centric like sub-Urban America.

This is very true, you can often see the "sea change" in mentality well before it comes through what is shown in advertising.  It is after all their job to be on top of that.  The good news is that serious reurbanization can't support the 2+ cars per household model.  The need for a personal transportation vehicle isn't going to go away any time soon, but I hope I see that average shrink below 1 in my lifetime.

Congrats a$$holes, you pulled what, a 40 billion dollar proffit in the past three months.

 

Wouldn't want a public company making profits, now would we!  Down with all corporations!!!

 

 

No, just the ones that suck the life out of our economy.     Big oil is the farthest thing from an honest "public company making profits".      There profits are coming at the expense of middle and lower class America and NOW they are starting to effect every sector of industry across this country.

^Yea, BP says they have spent what, 10 billion in research for alternative fuels over the last 10 years.

 

Congrats a$$holes, you pulled what, a 40 billion dollar proffit in the past three months.

 

Hey, if I were Big Oil, I wouldn't spend ANY money on alternatives.  "There's a ton of oil out there and we're making an unbelievable amount of money on this with no end in sight.  Hey, why don't we try to find something that will make our cash cow obsolete?"  No way in hell would I do that.

Because they aren't trying to make their cash cow obsolete, they are trying to figure out what the hell they are going to do when their cash cow is gone (and score some PR points along the way).  And make no mistake about it, their cash cow will be gone soon enough as oil gets more and more expensive to extract from more and more difficult sources (well before we hit the no oil left point)

 

 

http://www.chamberpost.com/2008/02/some-perspectiv.html

 

Some Perspective on Exxon

by David Chavern

 

Exxon made a lot of money in the fourth quarter last year -- $11.66 billion in net income to be exact.  Now the predictable sound and fury can begin about the fact that a major U.S. company is successful.

 

What all of these commentators and complainers will certainly miss, however, is that absolute financial numbers don’t matter – it is all about how you are doing relative to where you started.  Exxon is a huge company, with massive and complex operations all around the world.  It had $116 billion in total revenue over the fourth quarter.  But total revenue doesn’t count expenses.  Let’s take a look at those:

 

We can start with $96.9 billion in total business and other operational costs and deductions, leaving us with income before taxes of $19.7 billion.  Still not too shabby, but a lot less than $116 billion.

 

Next let’s subtract $8.062 billion in income taxes that funded a lot of government operations in many places.  For those keeping score that is 40.87% of the $19.7 in income, which leaves us with our $11.66 billion in net income.

 

$11.6 billion is a whole lot of money in absolute terms – but remember that the company had $116 billion in total revenue.  The back of the envelope tells me that they are making about 10% on their revenue.  Respectable, certainly, but not mind blowing.

 

It appears to me that people want to condemn Exxon because they provide 123,000 high quality jobs, fulfill a vital need for the global economy and earn a 10% return.  I am afraid that I don’t see it.

 

It can be easy (and fun) to criticize the big kid on the block – but in this case it mostly shows that you can’t do math very well.

 

February 01, 2008 at 01:05 PM in Business, David Chavern, Energy | Permalink

 

The funny thing is that 'big oil' isn't really all that big compared to the state owned oil companies that dominate the world's oil market. The private owned US and European corporations are mere drops in a bucket compared to the Russian, Saudi Arabian, Venezuelan, and Mexican oil companies among others.

^ this is true.  But it is the US based "big oil" monopolies that have worked against the public interest here at home, through such ventures as buying up electric powered public transportation systems and replacing them with fossil fuel burning buses -- because they were more efficient and better... no wait.. they're not.

I don't blame Exxon one bit, I blame policies that has kept oil prices artificially low and the public for consuming a ridiculous amount of fossil fuels. 

 

If I were an oil company, would I try to use my money to influence federal policy....ummm, let me think about it..... yes.  If we keep on buying SUVs and believing that 25mpg is an accomplishment, they will continue to have record profits.  If Americans still value large military vehicles to commute to work instead of something that plugs in to your wall, Exxon will still make bundles of money.  If we have outrage over the cost of gas and oil company profits, it is us to blame.

Eh, its a twofold problem.  There are the policy issues, granted.  But there has also been a great deal of monopolistic practice on the part of the oil companies as well - which is to be expected, companies always want to extend their monopolies, and thats how capitalism works (unchecked).

 

^Technically BP, as a company in which you can purchase common stock, is a public corporation.  But I get your point.

I don't blame Exxon one bit, I blame policies that has kept oil prices artificially low and the public for consuming a ridiculous amount of fossil fuels. 

 

If I were an oil company, would I try to use my money to influence federal policy....ummm, let me think about it..... yes.  If we keep on buying SUVs and believing that 25mpg is an accomplishment, they will continue to have record profits.  If Americans still value large military vehicles to commute to work instead of something that plugs in to your wall, Exxon will still make bundles of money.  If we have outrage over the cost of gas and oil company profits, it is us to blame.

 

agreed.

 

Because they aren't trying to make their cash cow obsolete, they are trying to figure out what the hell they are going to do when their cash cow is gone (and score some PR points along the way).  And make no mistake about it, their cash cow will be gone soon enough as oil gets more and more expensive to extract from more and more difficult sources (well before we hit the no oil left point)

 

Actually, there's a ton of oil out there, it's just that all of it isn't easy to reach.  As technology improves and the price per barrel rises, it makes economic sense to go after reserves that weren't feasible in the past.  I'd be less scared if the oil actually would run out at some point, because then we'd have no choice but to find an alternative, but it's possible that this won't happen any time soon, if ever.

 

 

 

/edit:  All of this aside, it's amazing how detrimental Big Oil and the Big Three have been to our urban areas.  I love it when people insist that we should buy American cars.  Ford and Chevy aren't doing the US any favors, and even Toyotas are built here now.

FINANCE COMMITTEE

MONDAY

APRIL 21, 2008

1:00 P.M.

COUNCIL CHAMBERS

ROOM 300

 

AGENDA

 

15-200800316

 

MOTION, dated 03/21/2008, submitted by Councilmembers Qualls and Cranley, that Cincinnati City Council approves the development of a Streetcar System t he first phase of which will link downtown Cincinnati with the Uptown area and include the downtown circulator and a connector to Uptown. The downtown circulator and the connector are hereafter referred to as Phase 1. (BALANCE ON FILE IN CLERKS OFFICE)

16-200800410

 

MOTION, dated 03/26/2008, submitted by Councilmember Bortz, that Cincinnati City Council approves the development of a Streetcar System that will link downtown Cincinnati with the Uptown area; and accept the recommended financing plan present by the Administration, which balances the available capacity in Tax Increment Financing (TIF) and Capital sources t insure that such sources remain viable for other City projects and does not use dollars that are available for the City's general operating expenses; and that the Administration enter into discussions with public and private institutions and companies about their financial commitments to the project; and that signed Memoranda of Understanding (MOU) with all public and private institutional and corporate partners for each phase will be place prior to construction beginning of the phase. The MOU's shall specify benchmarks, financial commitments, timing and other activities to assist the project; and that prior to construction the Administration present a sustainable Operations and Maintenance financing plan for phase 1A that does not primary rely on the City's Capital or Operating Budgets; and that the Administration explore a minimum of two contingency financing plans for the capital and operations and maintenance of Phase 1B in the event federal funds are not secured for the project. The funding plan cannot primarily rely on the City's Capital Budget to fill the gap.; and that the Administration provide city-council with a list of studies, their sequence, expected completion dates, and decision points for council for the streetcar line.

Actually, there's a ton of oil out there, it's just that all of it isn't easy to reach.  As technology improves and the price per barrel rises, it makes economic sense to go after reserves that weren't feasible in the past.  I'd be less scared if the oil actually would run out at some point, because then we'd have no choice but to find an alternative, but it's possible that this won't happen any time soon, if ever.

 

I know you're aware of this thread, but others should continue this discussion at:

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,2706.0.html

 

No oil well suddenly runs out, just as no oil-producing nation just "runs out." They all peak in their volume of production and decline until the last bits of oil aren't worth the time and expense to extract.

 

Thus we won't run out of oil because the last reserviors will be so valuable and yet so expensive to tap that burning this oil would make as much sense as burning diamonds to drive your car or $1,000 bills to heat your home.

All Aboard Ohio put out an e-mail notice today, asking our members in the Cincinnati area to contact their council persons and ask them to support the financing plan to build the streetcar now!

 

City Council contact information at the following link was provided:

https://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/council/pages/-4126-/

MOTION, dated 03/21/2008, submitted by Councilmembers Qualls and Cranley, that Cincinnati City Council approves the development of a Streetcar System the first phase of which will link downtown Cincinnati with the Uptown area and include the downtown circulator and a connector to Uptown. The downtown circulator and the connector are hereafter referred to as Phase 1. (BALANCE ON FILE IN CLERKS OFFICE)

16-200800410

 

MOTION, dated 03/26/2008, submitted by Councilmember Bortz, that Cincinnati City Council approves the development of a Streetcar System that will link downtown Cincinnati with the Uptown area; and accept the recommended financing plan present by the Administration, which balances the available capacity in Tax Increment Financing (TIF) and Capital sources t insure that such sources remain viable for other City projects and does not use dollars that are available for the City's general operating expenses; and that the Administration enter into discussions with public and private institutions and companies about their financial commitments to the project; and that signed Memoranda of Understanding (MOU) with all public and private institutional and corporate partners for each phase will be place prior to construction beginning of the phase. The MOU's shall specify benchmarks, financial commitments, timing and other activities to assist the project; and that prior to construction the Administration present a sustainable Operations and Maintenance financing plan for phase 1A that does not primary rely on the City's Capital or Operating Budgets; and that the Administration explore a minimum of two contingency financing plans for the capital and operations and maintenance of Phase 1B in the event federal funds are not secured for the project. The funding plan cannot primarily rely on the City's Capital Budget to fill the gap.; and that the Administration provide city-council with a list of studies, their sequence, expected completion dates, and decision points for council for the streetcar line.

 

So are these two competing motions?  Or is Bortz' a more in depth version of motion 1?