April 24, 200817 yr Author Cincinnati City Council endorses streetcar plan Business Courier of Cincinnati - by Dan Monk Senior Staff Reporter Cincinnati City Council's finance committee has endorsed the concept of a streetcar system that would run from the Cincinnati riverfront to the University of Cincinnati, enabling city staffers to pursue funding sources for the project, estimated to cost $185 million.
April 24, 200817 yr Railway Age magazine has picked up the story: http://www.railwayage.com/breaking_news.shtml#Feature5-4-24 April 23, 2008 Cincinnati City Council OKs streetcar plan, but price rises By a 6-2 vote, Cincinnati's City Council Wednesday approved a proposed streetcar plan linking the city's downtown, Over-the-Rhine, and Uptown. The proposal authorizes the city manager to seek private contributions for the project. Private-sector funds must be guaranteed before any project work begins. But the addition of Uptown to the proposal adds $35 million to the project's original $102 million estimate, or $137 million, according to the Cincinnati Enquirer. The original plan anticipated a private-sector funding of $30 million, but about $41 million would be required if the private sector's contribution as a percentage remains constant. The motion also calls for city administrators to develop a "sustainable operations and maintenance financing plan for phase one that does not primarily rely on the city's capital or operating budgets." "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
April 24, 200817 yr It was a good day for the city of Cincinnati. The Young Professionals, bloggers, and subscribers of alternative media are, now, more important than ever in their advocacy of the Cincinnati streetcar. The next phase is to convince business and institutional leaders of the city that streetcars are vital to their continued growth. This is so true, so unlike the light rail campaign in 2002. Conventional media are not particularly interested in the lifestyles promoted by dense, walkable neighborhoods. They don't value authenticity very much. They value brands and scale. Being able to break though that bias and get to people in other ways -- and to mobilize large numbers of people, each with the own unique message -- that's been key. This is so much more than tracks and trains - it's about recapturing the essence of Cincinnati. Thanks Brad, for all you have done. Even people who read these pages every day, several times a day, probably don't fully realize the extent of your efforts in each and every aspect of this.
April 24, 200817 yr So, basically Cranley got what he wanted? Qualls got to vote yes. Nothing happens unless $60 million is found somewhere, right? How hard is this going to be? Is there a time table? (obviously the sooner the better)
April 24, 200817 yr Yes, the construction is contingent on several things, the funds being the really big question right now. The city manager will begin working to secure those funds as soon as he can, and it will take some effort but it is imminently possible. Everyone is still working towards an ambitious 2011 construction completion date.
April 24, 200817 yr "I sincerely hope that it works," said Cranley. "Completing a riverfront park is a better use of the money." There are so many things wrong with that quote... 1) No he doesn't. In no way does Cranley "hope that it works". He's shown again and again that he is opposed to rail. This is just blatantly dishonest. 2) No it isn't. We already have a riverfront park, Sawyer Point. And yes, it's great, but it isn't attracting new businesses and residents, and no one is complaining that it is too small or outdated. Sure it would be nice to have another riverfront park, but not at the expense of the streetcar system (which will hopefully open the door again for light rail eventually). 3) At what point was TIF money ever earmarked for the central riverfront park? I thought we got a massive federal grant that was going to cover the bulk of it. Yesterday, Cranley was saying that the money was needed for The Banks. Now it's for the central riverfront park. It sounds like he wants to use it for anything except streetcars. Wow, and I thought I was sick of Cranley 2 months ago!
April 24, 200817 yr ^ I don't think the city manager would have appeared before City Council yesterday if he didn't think he could get this done. My impression is, he under-promises and over-delivers. This is going to happen.
April 24, 200817 yr On a slightly related note, sounds like everyone had a grand time at the City Cellars celebration. I should have just come given the fact that I got home to do my work, but then later in the evening my neighbor's house caught on fire/closed the street/killed the power/forced the evacuation of my house.... SO, that work didn't happen anyhow. It would have been more fun enjoying some wine with everyone! edit - although, now that I think about it, it is a bit weird that I have been somewhat involved in both of the Enquirers top stories today...
April 24, 200817 yr I hope the city is already aware of this EPA program? http://www.epa.gov/smartgrowth/2008_sgia_rfa.htm They are offering to provide free technical assistance to a limited number of smart growth programs. The streetcar seems to perfectly fit their goal. They could certainly make planning this new uptown connector a lot easier (or at least cheaper).
April 24, 200817 yr May 8 is a pretty tight deadline for those applications. I'd certainly be willing to work with someone to put together an application for the streetcar project if there is buy in from the adminstration (the letter we'd want to support the project almost certainly would be from the mayor)... Seems doable to put together a proposal, but it would need to get started quickly. (Also, it seems a focus of that progam is brownfield development, and this line surely doesn't qualify, but EPA assistance on environmental planning/assessment woud be a big plus) edit - come on brad, you know you wanna put off studying for finals with me to write this ;) On a serious note, I am curious if the adminstration is aware of this program...
April 24, 200817 yr (Also, it seems a focus of that progam is brownfield development, and this line surely doesn't qualify, but EPA assistance on environmental planning/assessment woud be a big plus) Is there anything along the line that could remotely be considered "brownfield"? I must admit that I'm not familiar with a fair portion of OTR. If there is, the streetcar could be tied in tangentially as aiding the redevelopment of that site.
April 24, 200817 yr ^ Almost any urban site has some sort of contamination, usually lead (from paint and gasoline) and asbestos but that alone typically doesn't qualify as a brownfield for funding purposes. Some of the larger buildings/sites in the Brewery District may qualify due to industrial use over the years, though. Don't know of any specifics off the top of my head.
April 24, 200817 yr I can't believe I found this so quickly (thank you Google Desktop)...here'a a GIS site to peruse EPA data. A quick glance at Cincinnati shows plenty of information, but I'm not clear whether any of these would qualify as "brownfield." http://www.epa.gov/enviro/wme/
April 24, 200817 yr I can't believe I found this so quickly (thank you Google Desktop)...here'a a GIS site to peruse EPA data. A quick glance at Cincinnati shows plenty of information, but I'm not clear whether any of these would qualify as "brownfield." http://www.epa.gov/enviro/wme/ Geez ... that's a pretty damn cool site! It looks like we can maybe finally get an accurate idea of Cincy's "Downtown" population and pop. density as well from it!
April 24, 200817 yr Good god. If this is built, I'll be the first to relocate along the line :) You're certainly not going to be the only one. The investors are turning up the heat on some of their potential projects with this approval. I should be meeting with the Cincinnati Beer Co. people tomorrow. They are certainly pumped. Remember they're the ones who said they will turn the old Christian Moerlein office building into a brew pub should the streetcar become reality. One step closer, my friends (channeling John McCain).
April 24, 200817 yr Great great news!!! What is the next step for us members of the general public? Any way that we can urge local businesses to support funding the project?
April 24, 200817 yr Any way we can start a fund for private citizens to contribute to the streetcar? I'll be the first one to throw $100 in.
April 24, 200817 yr Tracy and Eddie Fingers are trashing this thing on WLW right now. They're wondering where this has worked before. I think the requirements to be a host on WLW is 1. Be and idiot and 2. Be able to talk. John, please call in and school the fools. BTW I want to move to Cincy now.
April 24, 200817 yr ^ Thanks. It's amazing what even a little bit of knowledge can do to demystify this issue.
April 24, 200817 yr How many times have you, Chris Bortz, etc been on there to inform and demystify this very issue? I applaud your dedicated work, but these same people will go on the air tomorrow and spew the same nonsense. We have also discussed how WXIX Channel 19 has handled the issue (poorly)...and how news stations continue to use the vintage trolley images as their case file. Last night on the 10 o'clock news Tricia Macke highlighted what she seemed to list as extreme expenses/burdens for as she implied a questionable project. All the meanwhile the image lurking over her head, for the viewers to see, was an image of a vintage trolley...not a modern streetcar as proposed.
April 24, 200817 yr ^ I really hate that. Every time I try to comment on Enquirer blogs with links to pictures of modern streetcars, guess what, my comment gets moderated to the trash bin. *sigh*
April 24, 200817 yr wcpo.com had the worst photo of an old streetcar yesterday on their news story. It was blurry and it looked like it had broken down and cars were going around it. LOL
April 25, 200817 yr Let's be thankful The Enquirer had a big color photo of a modern [Portland] streetcar on its front-page today! And Margaret McGurk's article was very good -- she's been great. Poor-quality news media shouldn't cause people to believe some beat-up or funky old trolleys are what we're going to get for all of the millions the project will cost. If anyone does believe it, well, they're in for a big and pleasant surprise. It just goes to show that rather than being in the information business, the news media all-too-often aim to inflame public opinion these days.
April 25, 200817 yr Being a member of the news media (I write for a Northeast Ohio newspaper chain), I seriously doubt your local media is intentionally trying to mislead you. I can tell you that my colleagues are as uninformed about transit and many others in the general public. So when they see a photo of a run-down streetcar, they wouldn't think twice about questioning its use in their publications/broadcasts. Most of us in the media are skeptics and don't believe anything anyone tells us. Some of my colleagues are also very set in their beliefs so no matter what you say, they won't change their beliefs. Not all, but some are. And some have to see something with their own eyes and experiences to embrace a new belief. So if someone tells us it's a modern streetcar, my colleagues will probably laugh and say "isn't that a contradiction in terms?" My basic message: Don't assume you know something about the media until you talk with some of them and get to know them. To form opinions about them with little experience is to make the same mistake you accuse them of making. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
April 25, 200817 yr All I heard on 700 was Eddie and Tracy trashing the streetcars and then they had Monzel on who even said the money could be spent on repairing potholes in our streets and highways! What was their reaction after John called in? I didn't have the pleasure of hearing it.
April 25, 200817 yr I hardly listen to WLW except for some news updates or Reds games, but I listened today because of the topic. Tracy Jones is a fool, and I am surprised he is from California with such a conservative attitude - I guess he fits the profile for the station. They have all been programmed to talk about crime (no matter how much it drops) in the city and to trash the street car. It seems like all the talkers are pretty interchangeable.
April 25, 200817 yr Being a member of the news media (I write for a Northeast Ohio newspaper chain), I seriously doubt your local media is intentionally trying to mislead you. I can tell you that my colleagues are as uninformed about transit and many others in the general public. So when they see a photo of a run-down streetcar, they wouldn't think twice about questioning its use in their publications/broadcasts. Most of us in the media are skeptics and don't believe anything anyone tells us. Some of my colleagues are also very set in their beliefs so no matter what you say, they won't change their beliefs. Not all, but some are. And some have to see something with their own eyes and experiences to embrace a new belief. So if someone tells us it's a modern streetcar, my colleagues will probably laugh and say "isn't that a contradiction in terms?" My basic message: Don't assume you know something about the media until you talk with some of them and get to know them. To form opinions about them with little experience is to make the same mistake you accuse them of making. All it takes is a simple Google search...here is what turns up when you search 'streetcar': http://images.google.com/images?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=&q=streetcar&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi Now if you search for 'trolley' you come up with the images that many of the local media outlets have been using: http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&q=trolley&btnG=Search+Images
April 25, 200817 yr Tracy Jones is a fool, and I am surprised he is from California with such a conservative attitude - I guess he fits the profile for the station. The problem isn't that he's conservative; it's that he's ignorant.
April 25, 200817 yr Speaking of the media and the streetcar, Fox19 had a very nice piece about the Brewery District this evening, and Steve Hampton mentioned the potential of the streetcar in revitalizing the neighborhood. You can find the original piece, as well as extended footage here: http://www.fox19.com/Global/category.asp?C=132741 WAY TO GO STEVE!! :wave:
April 25, 200817 yr Author Being a member of the news media (I write for a Northeast Ohio newspaper chain), I seriously doubt your local media is intentionally trying to mislead you. I can tell you that my colleagues are as uninformed about transit and many others in the general public. So when they see a photo of a run-down streetcar, they wouldn't think twice about questioning its use in their publications/broadcasts. Most of us in the media are skeptics and don't believe anything anyone tells us. Some of my colleagues are also very set in their beliefs so no matter what you say, they won't change their beliefs. Not all, but some are. And some have to see something with their own eyes and experiences to embrace a new belief. So if someone tells us it's a modern streetcar, my colleagues will probably laugh and say "isn't that a contradiction in terms?" My basic message: Don't assume you know something about the media until you talk with some of them and get to know them. To form opinions about them with little experience is to make the same mistake you accuse them of making. there is this one picture of a trolley bus passing a broken down streetcar on madison road that keep popping up in the media. that is like using a picture of a fatal car wreck to sell sports cars.
April 25, 200817 yr Good Luck John! Let this guy have it! Streetcars to be debated at forum Streetcar advocate John Schneider from the Alliance for Regional Transit and anti-streetcar City Council member Chris Monzel will square off at a public forum hosted by Blue Chip Young Republicans at 7 p.m. Monday at Monty's, 4108 Montgomery Road, Norwood. http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080425/NEWS01/304250019/1056/COL02
April 25, 200817 yr I watch FOX19 news at 10:00 and saw the Brewery District piece last night. Timely, informative and interesting story. Very well done.
April 25, 200817 yr Monzel said the money could be spent on repairing potholes in our streets and highways! Isn't it funny how money spent repairing roads is a no-brainer for everyone. People are worried about what the upkeep on the streetcar will be and no one knows what the true cost of roads are, not even me. How far would a 100 million go putting in a new street and the upkeep for 10 years? Not very far I bet.
April 25, 200817 yr A mile of freeway through an urban area costs approximately $39 million I answered my own question, the streetcar won't cost anymore than 3 miles of new freeway.
April 25, 200817 yr Give Willie Hell for putting the streetcar down when YOU are not on there. Seems to me, he sounds like he is for when he talks to you, but once you hang up, he goes right back to putting it down. Put him on the spot and ask why everyone on WLW is so Anti-Cincy. There is more to this city than just Kenwood. (which is extremely over-rated) AFTER SHOW: Nice work John!! This guy is clueless and never leaves Kenwood. He is stuck in a 90's
April 25, 200817 yr John, Good luck Monday. I fear that anything put on by the "Blue Chip Young Republicans Club" is going to be like walking into a trap. haha, blue chip young republican club...really??
April 25, 200817 yr willie and some state representative are going off on everything about streetcars. called it the 100 million dollar freedom center on wheels. hes just mindlessly bashing...i turned it off after that.. 700wlw.com. go to live stream if you want to listen to the bashing. i highly recommend you dont
April 25, 200817 yr called it the 100 million dollar freedom center on wheels. Yeah. Because the two things are similiar in SOOO many ways.
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