November 4, 200915 yr Let's Make Cincinnati A Better Place to Live http://cincystreetcar.wordpress.com/2009/11/04/let%E2%80%99s-make-cincinnati-a-better-place-to-live/ Great article. Did not know Quinvalin was a staunch streetcar supporter. So we add Qualls, Thomas, Bortz, and Berding to make 5. Ghiz is back and forth depending on her voting support. Cole is still undecided and is in her last term, so she wont be swayed by re-election concerns. She could go either way. I really like the direction this is going. Just need to get this funding squared away. I'm glad the city decided not to let Smitherman and COAST decide the future. Although these Smitherman ballot initiatives are troubling. These next 7-8 months will be crucial. Lets do this!
November 4, 200915 yr Smitherman is planning a Mayor recall ballot initiative as well as a streetcar ballot initiative for 2010. Be cautious of any ballot initiative you are asked to sign! Oddly enough, I was asked to sign a ballot while walking at lunch today (around Walnut & 8th). The gentleman asked me to sign his ballot initiative. I asked for details and found out it was for the Slot Machines at Race Tracks issue. I later saw him at Fountain Square. They aren't wasting any time. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
November 4, 200915 yr West Sacramento will be a modern streetcar like we're doing. This is correct. It will be a spur that connects to their existing LRT system, although that too is being expanded. This was the very last project I worked on the day I got laid off. LOL!
November 4, 200915 yr Smitherman was sitting at the "Chesley Table" at the Palace today having lunch. Stan seemed to be doing all the talking. That must have been an interesting conversation.
November 4, 200915 yr "Streetcar advocates win across the US!" http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20091104/NEWS0108/911050315/Streetcar+advocates+win+across+USA
November 4, 200915 yr "Streetcar advocates win across the US!" http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20091104/NEWS0108/911050315/Streetcar+advocates+win+across+USA Cunningham said "I think I'm in favor of it because of the Casino!" He also spoke highly of passenger rail. Also Mallory on Tracy and Eddie at 3:10
November 4, 200915 yr You'll never have a chance to buy land/real estate in OTR as cheap as it was yesterday! :wink:
November 4, 200915 yr Shouldn't the NAACP have more pressing issues to deal with? Maybe it's a good sign for race relations in Cincinnati, that the NAACP has the time to get so worked up about rail transit. I think that they do have more pressing issues. I would appreciate NAACP getting involved in the redevelopment of OTR in a positive way. I don't know of anyone who lives here who wouldn't hope for a truly integrated community. The emotional key to Smitherman's push on NAACP to go anti streetcar is in his statement that it's a "toy for white yuppies" (can't remember the exact quote, but that was the essence). Everything else - the "boondoggle", the "excessive" costs, etc. is window dressing to play to a wider audience. So, the healthy racial integration of OTR as it redevelops is the keystone to defusing the entire streetcar issue. Of course this is difficult to accomplish, but without dialog nothing even has a chance. And I think there must be many "honest brokers" out there who could serve this city well by helping us to turn the corner. In my opinion the CFP and related groups should now turn their attention to finding those honest brokers, and asking how they can help to bring NAACP to the redevelopment table along with the city, 3CDC, and other groups. I'd like to suggest that this topic is not necessarily off limits for the recently announced City task force that will consider obstacles to OTR rehabilitation. The emperor has been naked for a long time. It's time to be really honest and get down to what the real issues that are holding us back.
November 4, 200915 yr It's too bad that Downtown critics would ignore the success of Fountain Square, the Gateway Quarter, and the progress at The Banks, and not start thinking that Downtown is improving until they see a casino. But if that's what it takes, let's build that casino. Cunningham said "I think I'm in favor of it because of the Casino!" He also spoke highly of passenger rail. Also Mallory on Tracy and Eddie at 3:10 Was he saying that he supports the Streetcar specifically?
November 4, 200915 yr It's too bad that Downtown critics would ignore the success of Fountain Square, the Gateway Quarter, and the progress at The Banks, and not start thinking that Downtown is improving until they see a casino. But if that's what it takes, let's build that casino. Cunningham said "I think I'm in favor of it because of the Casino!" He also spoke highly of passenger rail. Also Mallory on Tracy and Eddie at 3:10 Was he saying that he supports the Streetcar specifically? He didn't flat out say "I am behind the streetcar" but he did say that exact phrase of "But now I think I am in favor of it because of the casino". Cunningham wanted to talk about it some more but CFP kinda of went off topic into passenger rail. Regardless, its a positive step. It's around the 2:10 (2 hours and 10 minutes) mark of the podcast
November 4, 200915 yr Tracy sounds like an angry man talking to Mallory. Said the "trolley is stupid" and "high speed rail is dumb"
November 4, 200915 yr Tracy (and Chris Monzel) also wants the Casino put inside the Freedom Center... It's all apart of his radio act. Thankfully he lives (and votes) in Bellevue, KY. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
November 4, 200915 yr Tracy (and Chris Monzel) also wants the Casino put inside the Freedom Center... It's all apart of his radio act. Thankfully he lives (and votes) in Bellevue, KY. actually, a casino in the Freedom center would be a decent place (partially tongue in cheek).
November 4, 200915 yr Funny how COAST's blog today mentions nothing about Issue 9, and they're now back to harping about red light cameras.... Fine, let them obsess about that while the city moves ahead with 3C and the streetcar.
November 4, 200915 yr Streetcars hot voter issue across USA By John Miller, The Associated Press, November 2, 2009 BOISE, Idaho - A streetcar revival in American cities isn't just kicking up sparks from the tracks, they're flying down at city hall, too. In Idaho's capital, a proposed $60 million trolley plan has become a major theme of local elections Nov. 3. Likewise, mayoral races in Charlotte, N.C., and Cincinnati hinge at least partially on whether they should build lines of their own. -- Streetcar backers hope check's in mail By Barry M. Horstman, Cincinnati Enquirer, November 4, 2009 Having turned back a bid to slow down, if not kill, the Cincinnati streetcar plan, city leaders hope they soon will be able to say the check is in the mail from Washington to proceed with the project.
November 4, 200915 yr In retrospect, a casino between the stadia would have been a much better idea than the freedom center which isn't exactly bringing in throngs of people. That would have been better at the Harriet Beecher Stowe home in Walnut Hills. Of course, it can only help Broadway Commons, which should have had a baseball park in it already! Can't you guys see the difference between entertainment and serious discussions? Would people really want to listen to pro-streetcar people talk on the radio all day long?
November 4, 200915 yr Congrats to y'all on this win. I was following this and could sense that there was some uncertaintiy...but common sense prevaled!
November 4, 200915 yr ^---"Common sense prevaled!" I know that some voters voted "NO" and thought they were voting against the streetcar. I have no way to know how many might have done this, and we may never know. In any case, it's over, and we can talk about routes and funding again. :-)
November 4, 200915 yr Funny how COAST's blog today mentions nothing about Issue 9, and they're now back to harping about red light cameras.... Fine, let them obsess about that while the city moves ahead with 3C and the streetcar. COAST was pretty specific about being happy no matter which way it went, because the people got the vote and that was all they were after. Could be BS, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. No. The vote they wanted the people to have was the vote on any expenditure on any rail project in Cincinnati. Not the vote that happened yesterday, which is what you implied. I mean, that's just nonsensical - if they just wanted the vote they got yesterday, the result would have never mattered, and they would have succeeded just by gathering 6000 signatures. No, COAST lost yesterday. They care, and yes, anything else is BS, and not deserving of any benefit, from doubts or otherwise.
November 5, 200915 yr The rise of Issue 9 did force Mark Mallory to get behind the issue and risk a major embarrassment if the streetcar never got off the ground. COAST exists in large part to try to chisel cracks in the Mallory machine.
November 5, 200915 yr The distance from the planned route to Gilbert Ave. is approximately a half mile. I think the high per-foot cost of the streetcar line will encourage them to place the casino entrance close to Broadway, instead of fronting Gilbert Ave., as was the case in the graphic they published months ago in The Enquirer. In such a track layout, I suspect that only one streetcar would run the route from the riverfront to the casino, and that particular streetcar would probably receive a ridiculous casino paint job. Hopefully provisions would be made so that the line could be extended through the casino to Gibert Ave. then north to Walnut Hills.
November 5, 200915 yr Needs to get to Gilbert. You'd have a lot of bus to streetcar transfers there. Adds value to the North Frame.
November 5, 200915 yr I would like to see the "Smitherman Issue" placed on the ballot whereby the number of signatures required to get something on the ballot is raised substantially. As it is, I feel like the city is held accountable to the whims of any idiot.
November 5, 200915 yr All I know is I can't wait to catch a train from Columbus to Cinci and a streetcar to the zoo; our zoo will continue to suck eggs far into the future.
November 5, 200915 yr A significant problem with a casino spur is that light rail requires a wider turn radius than streetcar, meaning if an eventual Gilbert Ave. line is built to light rail specs as envisioned in the Metromoves plan, this streetcar spur must allow for wider light rail turn radii and preferably be built to more robust light rail track specs to avoid a later reconstruction. If the casino helps foot the bill, they might not want to pony up the extra money for light rail specs for a line that might never be built, or they might not want light rail coming through at all.
November 5, 200915 yr Author A significant problem with a casino spur is that light rail requires a wider turn radius than streetcar, meaning if an eventual Gilbert Ave. line is built to light rail specs as envisioned in the Metromoves plan, this streetcar spur must allow for wider light rail turn radii and preferably be built to more robust light rail track specs to avoid a later reconstruction. If the casino helps foot the bill, they might not want to pony up the extra money for light rail specs for a line that might never be built, or they might not want light rail coming through at all. The casino spur could be single tracked
November 5, 200915 yr It could be if it ran down Central Parkway's median, but provisions for double-tracking should be made if an extension to Gilbert is expected.
November 5, 200915 yr Moved the Freedom Center (and etc.) topics to the Freedom Center thread, which is in the process of being cleaned as it contains copyrighted full-text articles.
November 5, 200915 yr Are there talks of sponsorship, or possible monetary assistance from the casino in the streetcar extension?
November 5, 200915 yr I vote that the Streetcar be known as P&G In Motion. Paint the streetcar the P&G blue and have graphics showing the history of P&G. Let them donate $500 million to it.
November 5, 200915 yr Well, this isn't Tom Luken's $200 million $400 million $4 billion streetcar here :D
November 5, 200915 yr Author Are there talks of sponsorship, or possible monetary assistance from the casino in the streetcar extension? http://cincystreetcar.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/casino-developer-extend-streetcar-to-broadway-commons/
November 5, 200915 yr And now the international railroad and rail transit industry knows what happened on Tuesday.... Cincinnati anti-streetcar referendum fails to pass Nov. 5, 2009 Efforts by local groups to turn back a proposed streetcar line for Cincinnati fell short at the ballot box Tuesday. By a 56%-to-44% margin, voters rejected Issue 9, a proposed charter amendment that would have given public opinion the ultimate say on proceeding with the streetcar and other regional, statewide, and national rail systems involving Cincinnati. Backers of the measure said it was designed to better reflect the "will of the people." Pro-rail advocates, including elected officials such as Mayor Mark Mallory, opposed the measure, claiming it provided a “double standard” for transport improvements that road and highway projects have not been subject to, and that decisions for all modes should be made by elected representatives. READ MORE AND SEE MAP AT: http://www.railwayage.com/breaking-news/cincinnati-anti-streetcar-referendum-fails-to-pass.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 5, 200915 yr i wouldn't go that far...we're not Blue by a long shot. In fact, i'm amazed that 9 went down like it did.
November 5, 200915 yr its a blue county. went obama last year. more registered dems than republicans. its blue. get used to it.
November 5, 200915 yr Author its a blue county. went obama last year. more registered dems than republicans. its blue. get used to it. i wouldn't go that far...we're not Blue by a long shot. In fact, i'm amazed that 9 went down like it did. http://hamiltoncountydems.org/pdf/Hamco%20trends%205.pdf
November 5, 200915 yr The presidential election last year brought a lot of blue voters out of the woodwork who are not going to be participating in mid-term elections, or possibly other presidential elections lacking the hype of the 2008 campaign. That said, you didn't have to be a democrat to understand the idiocy of issue 9 and you don't have to be a democrat to recognize the value of rail transit. I consider myself conservative but am very excited about the prospect of a streetcar and other forms of rail in the Queen City in the very near future.
November 5, 200915 yr The City also just elected a conservative/Republican council and we'll see if it's still blue enough to reelect Driehaus over Chabot in 2010. Issue 9 wasn't about democrat or republican. I think that both sides coming out strongly against it really helped defeat this measure.
November 5, 200915 yr Author World Class Hotel, Casino to Be Built on Streetcar Line http://cincystreetcar.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/world-class-hotel-casino-to-be-built-on-streetcar-line/
November 5, 200915 yr That said, you didn't have to be a democrat to understand the idiocy of issue 9 and you don't have to be a democrat to recognize the value of rail transit. I consider myself conservative but am very excited about the prospect of a streetcar and other forms of rail in the Queen City in the very near future. Exactly. I'm conversative on many issues, and I'm very excited about the possibility of streetcars and light rail in the region. Passenger rail makes more sense to me than constantly expanding highways.
November 6, 200915 yr Just listened to John on Scott Sloan's show. Great conversation about the Streetcar and the growth of Cincinnati. Wonderful job John! "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
November 6, 200915 yr podcast: http://www.700wlw.com/cc-common/podcast/single_podcast.html?podcast=scott_sloan.xml
November 6, 200915 yr Excellent piece, thanks for that John. The casino has really brought the streetcar deal to a more favorable status.
November 6, 200915 yr I think a section of the streetcar should run from the casino through the banks and over to newport on the levee. Connecting the downtown\casino area with newport I think will is a crucial step in all of this. There is such a vast amount of people that would use the streetcar across the river to get into downtown.
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