February 13, 20187 yr ^^ That also explains the "beet juice" comment someone upthread reported an operator making. The brakes don't work as well in cold weather.
February 13, 20187 yr Not more than usual for a streetcar, but more than usual for what you would expect from a compressor of that design/size/specification.
February 13, 20187 yr Not more than usual for a streetcar, but more than usual for what you would expect from a compressor of that design/size/specification. Why was the small compressor fitted in the first place? Was it the expectation that each car would be used less often since we would be operating more units? It seems like a silly oversight.
February 13, 20187 yr Cincinnati streetcar stops to close for repairs Repairs at the stops along the Cincinnati Bell Connector streetcar route will put stations out of commission intermittently for about a month. Concrete repairs and weatherproofing for the ticket vending machines along the streetcar route will close each stop for two to four days at a time starting this week. No more than three of the system’s 18 stations will be affected at any one time. More below: https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/02/13/cincinnati-streetcar-stops-to-close-for-repairs.html "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
February 13, 20187 yr Not more than usual for a streetcar, but more than usual for what you would expect from a compressor of that design/size/specification. Why was the small compressor fitted in the first place? Was it the expectation that each car would be used less often since we would be operating more units? It seems like a silly oversight. Just guessing here, but it might be related to the "Buy America" requirements. CAF usually builds streetcars in Spain, and these were the first built in their New York facility, so maybe they sourced some of the smaller parts like the air compressor from US suppliers?
February 13, 20187 yr Just guessing here, but it might be related to the "Buy America" requirements. CAF usually builds streetcars in Spain, and these were the first built in their New York facility, so maybe they sourced some of the smaller parts like the air compressor from US suppliers? Would CAF be on the hook for replacements/upgrades? Or was it contractually agreed upon making it a city problem?
February 13, 20187 yr Keep in mind that the city has still never "accepted" the vehicles from CAF. So I think CAF is still on the hook to fix them.
February 13, 20187 yr At this point, CAF should build Cincinnati a 6th car for free and then rotate out the existing 5 one at a time to repair the compressors. It would be a goodwill gesture and also could cover the cost of damages incurred by the city. “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
February 13, 20187 yr At this point, CAF should build Cincinnati a 6th car for free We should have ordered a sixth car to go along with the two that Kansas city ordered last year.
February 13, 20187 yr Keep in mind that the city has still never "accepted" the vehicles from CAF. So I think CAF is still on the hook to fix them. That's not really true, they've taken title and everything, they just haven't released the final payment.
February 13, 20187 yr At this point, CAF should build Cincinnati a 6th car for free and then rotate out the existing 5 one at a time to repair the compressors. It would be a goodwill gesture and also could cover the cost of damages incurred by the city. Not to mention that if we want to actually run our streetcars at the originally promised service levels (12 minutes peak, 15 minutes off-peak), we really should have 6 or 7 streetcars anyway instead of 5. Peak should be running 4, not 3. Off-peak should be running 3, not 2.
February 14, 20187 yr In an unprecedented display of regional unity, Dayton has sent one of its Next-Gen trolleybuses down to Cincinnati to help keep the ice off the streetcar's wire! Eat your heart out, North and South Korea! ;D (photos courtesy of GDRTA by way of the Dayton Trolleys Facebook page) “To an Ohio resident - wherever he lives - some other part of his state seems unreal.”
February 14, 20187 yr From what I hear, the Dayton folks were happy to come down and help us out. Maybe next time Dayton buys new trolleybuses, we should buy one of the old ones they're retiring, and keep it around for precisely this purpose.
February 14, 20187 yr The new Dayton trolleybuses are electric/battery vehicles. They can apparently run for 15 miles off batteries at 50mph with a full load of passengers. That's pretty impressive, and it's how they were able to run here without a second overhead wire. Anyway, trolleybus poles are heavy and rigid enough to support what's called a sleet scraper or sleet cutter shoe. Lightweight pantographs can't handle the additional longitudinal (?) force. Either it would damage the pantograph or it wouldn't have enough force against the wire to cut into the ice. That said, Dayton has a bunch of extra trolley poles from their old buses, and a suggestion was made to fit one of those with a sleet scraper and mount it (properly insulated of course) to a work truck. One could theoretically be mounted to a streetcar if there's room with all the a/c condenser fans and other stuff on the roof.
February 14, 20187 yr From what I hear, the Dayton folks were happy to come down and help us out. Very much so. They had that bus down here within 2 hours.
February 14, 20187 yr How did they get the buses here? According to what I have read, they can only operate for 15 miles off-wire. This thing looks like a bit of a put-on by the Cran-man. Show that traditional buses work "just fine" -- even though I personally saw several of them broken down during cold weather in recent weeks.
February 14, 20187 yr I assume that the bus they sent is the dual-mode that has an internal combustion engine in it that Dayton bought for trial purposes, but I could be wrong. Some of the next-gens have ICE’s, and the other ones are battery powered. “To an Ohio resident - wherever he lives - some other part of his state seems unreal.”
February 14, 20187 yr ^ If it was one of the electric/diesels then that would make it easier to get it here, so you're probably right. Otherwise they'd need a flatbed, because I doubt towing one for 60 miles on I-75 is practical.
February 14, 20187 yr How did they get the buses here? According to what I have read, they can only operate for 15 miles off-wire. This thing looks like a bit of a put-on by the Cran-man. Show that traditional buses work "just fine" -- even though I personally saw several of them broken down during cold weather in recent weeks. Nah, Cranley and most of the city staff don't know anything about how rail or trolleybus technology actually works, so they never would've come up with the idea to pick up the phone and call Dayton. This plan was definitely hatched by someone on the streetcar staff who has experience with rail.
February 14, 20187 yr Americans have a tendency to think every problem is all new and that every solution has to be all new. They also think they have to come up with a solution themselves. When people have experience, though, they contact others that are in a similar boat and ask what they would do.
February 16, 20187 yr The Business Courier's poll this week: What grade would you give the Cincinnati Bell Connector streetcar's performance so far? Of course, next weeks poll should be "What grade would you give the current administration's performance in ensuring the Cincinnati Bell Connector is a success?" "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
February 21, 20187 yr Author Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather.
February 21, 20187 yr Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather. KC is blowing away all of the new streetcar systems, but receiving very little praise for it.
February 21, 20187 yr Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather. It's currently shut-down due to, guess what? Icy conditions. KC officials not sure when the streetcar will be back in service.
February 21, 20187 yr Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather. KC is blowing away all of the new streetcar systems, but receiving very little praise for it. Well, when a streetcar system is planned and routed correctly and performs accordingly when in service, why praise it? It's doing what it's supposed to be doing in the 21st Century despite it being a 19th Century innovation of urban transportation. When is a system is planned and routed incorrectly and performs accordingly when in service, it's going to be dumped on accordingly. CIN's streetcar is a warm weather ''fun ride''. Obviously KC's streetcar is routed correctly and it doesn't hurt that the rides are free. Projected to attract 2,700 riders per day, even less than CIN's, its numbers are closer to 6,000. Yet, despite KC's initial ''success" with its streetcar line, voters there still turned down an expansion funding. Streetcars are suspect as a ''new mode'' of transit yet cities like KC and CIN will pour money into these lines to be ''progressive'' magnets to attract those alleged tranist-demanding millennials.
February 21, 20187 yr Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather. That is a massive difference. I assume that the KC streetcar being free to ride accounts for part of that, but are there other nuances that account for its success relative to Cincinnati? (Looks like my questions were answered above)
February 21, 20187 yr The fact that it's free helps more than you would think. (Especially for Cincinnatians who have no experience ever riding transit or using a TVM, they just don't want to deal with it.) But the biggest difference has been the lack of FUD from Kansas City media and politicians. Cincinnatians have been hearing on an almost daily basis for the last decade that it doesn't go anywhere, that it cost $8 billion to build, that it doesn't run when it's cold out, that no one actually rides it... all of which are false or mostly false.
February 21, 20187 yr The fact that it's free helps more than you would think. (Especially for Cincinnatians who have no experience ever riding transit or using a TVM, they just don't want to deal with it.) But the biggest difference has been the lack of FUD from Kansas City media and politicians. Cincinnatians have been hearing on an almost daily basis for the last decade that it doesn't go anywhere, that it cost $8 billion to build, that it doesn't run when it's cold out, that no one actually rides it... all of which are false or mostly false. I understand the points you make were pre-streetcar opening; it's been open 1 1/2 years and its become a laughing stock due to, it sounds, being badly planned and operated, not to mention the hilarious pics of Dayton's buses towing the streetcar around all night. If all those points are false, then the streetcar being up and running now would prove these points to be false. How would the exaggerated cost of funding the streetcar prevent people from using it if it was convenient for them? Why doesn't CIN make the streetcar ''free rides'' like KC?
February 21, 20187 yr Why doesn't CIN make the streetcar ''free rides'' like KC? Because the current city administration has demanded that none of the streetcar's budget comes out of the city's operating budget ... so it has created a elaborate funding system cobbled together from 4 different sources, one of which is farebox revenue. All of the problems you mention are not problems with "the streetcar", they are problems with the way that our anti-streetcar administration is running our streetcar system. There are a dozen easily-solvable problems that they refuse to solve. This is intentional, because the continuing existence of these problems allows Cranley to say, "see, I told you the streetcar was a bad idea." Literally last week, he said in front of Council that we need people on the SORTA board who "haven't drank the streetcar kool-aid." This guy is totally uninterested in fixing the streetcar's problems.
February 21, 20187 yr Cranley is such a DINO that he uses the age-old Republican trick of breaking government then pointing out that it doesn't work. He should be kicked out of the Democratic Party.
February 21, 20187 yr ^ The way to win an election in the City of Cincinnati is to be a Republican but call yourself a Democrat.
February 21, 20187 yr What if the city built a new swimming pool but refused to fill it all the way, saying it couldn't afford the last foot of water. Fewer than half as many people would swim or hang out around a slightly shallow pool. That's the streetcar under Cranley.
February 21, 20187 yr What if the city built a new swimming pool but refused to fill it all the way, saying it couldn't afford the last foot of water. Fewer than half as many people would swim or hang out around a slightly shallow pool. That's the streetcar under Cranley. Or if the filtration system broke in the middle of the summer, they refused to fix it and said, "Sorry, the pool will just be down for a couple of days." And then pointed at the empty pool and said, "See, I told you that pool was a boondoggle!"
February 21, 20187 yr What if the city built a new swimming pool but refused to fill it all the way, saying it couldn't afford the last foot of water. Fewer than half as many people would swim or hang out around a slightly shallow pool. That's the streetcar under Cranley. Or if the filtration system broke in the middle of the summer, they refused to fix it and said, "Sorry, the pool will just be down for a couple of days." And then pointed at the empty pool and said, "See, I told you that pool was a boondoggle!" They could have just built the hop-on trolley instead! “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
February 21, 20187 yr Kansas City Streetcar had 97,000 riders in January, Cincinnati Streetcar had 17,000 riders. Same rolling stock. Virtually the same route length, city size, and weather. KC is blowing away all of the new streetcar systems, but receiving very little praise for it. Yet, despite KC's initial ''success" with its streetcar line, voters there still turned down an expansion funding. Streetcars are suspect as a ''new mode'' of transit yet cities like KC and CIN will pour money into these lines to be ''progressive'' magnets to attract those alleged tranist-demanding millennials. Jeez you sound so angry about transit. I suggest going to Cincinnati.com. Search for 'PX'. It'll make you happy.
February 21, 20187 yr Author KC Streetcar has the 5th highest ridership per mile of light rail systems in the US https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_light_rail_systems_by_ridership
February 21, 20187 yr Also, the expansion has been approved by several public votes. OC17 must be getting his "news" from Randal O'Toole. Or a Russian bot.
February 22, 20187 yr Angry about transit? You sound like one of those sensitive millennials. Hardly angry, as a daily transit rider, unlike the majority of posters here, any points that are deemed to be ‘counter’, are dismissed. Anything called ‘the connector’ is not transit. I have to remember that the ‘connector’ is routed properly and is only a flop due to a local political conspiracy. How then does one explaine the bump in ridership during warm weather generally and warm weather weekends in particular? Why isn’t the political conspiracy taking its toll during these particular times.?
February 22, 20187 yr When did KC voters pass a tax specifically funding the KC streetcar extension? You must be getting your news from your personal ‘rail obsessed’ agenda as you spread more false news than CNN. The taxing district approval doesn’t count btw.
February 22, 20187 yr Why hasn’t Cincinnati released its ridership numbers for ‘the connector’ yet? Still noticeably absent from the list cited here.
February 22, 20187 yr Angry about transit? You sound like one of those sensitive millennials. Hardly angry, as a daily transit rider, unlike the majority of posters here, any points that are deemed to be ‘counter’, are dismissed. Anything called ‘the connector’ is not transit. I have to remember that the ‘connector’ is routed properly and is only a flop due to a local political conspiracy. How then does one explaine the bump in ridership during warm weather generally and warm weather weekends in particular? Why isn’t the political conspiracy taking its toll during these particular times.? It isn't the ONLY variable. Other variables still accept ridership. We are able to process multiple concepts at once here.
February 22, 20187 yr Such as? I keep reading about the streetcar woes being rooted in a political conspiracy to destroy it. No one other than you has mentioned “other variables.” What are these variables? A transit system has variables like time of day and weekday v. Weekend and rely as it’s bread and butter on the daily commuters. The daily commuters being your weekday riders. Weekends tend to be lighter. The opposite is the case with the connector and the fact that ridership increases during warm weather.
February 22, 20187 yr Angry about transit? You sound like one of those sensitive millennials. Hardly angry, as a daily transit rider, unlike the majority of posters here, any points that are deemed to be ‘counter’, are dismissed. Anything called ‘the connector’ is not transit. I have to remember that the ‘connector’ is routed properly and is only a flop due to a local political conspiracy. How then does one explaine the bump in ridership during warm weather generally and warm weather weekends in particular? Why isn’t the political conspiracy taking its toll during these particular times.? Who's to say it isnt taking its toll ALL the time, even in the warm months? When it is crowded ALL the cars should be running and that does not usually happen for some questionable reason or threats that every extra car on the lines needs to recoup all the money instantly in fares or it stays parked. Also there are no pics of the buses towing the Streetcar around since that didnt happen. At one point in the ice storm a tow truck towed a disabled streetcar and at another point a dayton bus with a electrical pantograph did make the rounds to help clear off ice. I dont have any special knowledge about the situation but that is what was said in the media.
February 22, 20187 yr Why hasn’t Cincinnati released its ridership numbers for ‘the connector’ yet? Still noticeably absent from the list cited here. What are you even talking about? The ridership numbers are released every month. The media frequently reports on the ridership numbers.
February 22, 20187 yr ^ indeed. And I've never heard anyone on this board say that weather wasn't a significant variable -- under any circumstances but especially for a connector route covering a short distance. On the other hand, I have heard many, many people, who supported and support the streetcar development, complain about the lack of a traffic study to support efficient operations of the streetcar and the street grid, the lack of hardwired network cabling that would make real-time arrival signals be reliable, various stupid decisions about the fare machines, and a general sluggishness of city administration to tackle these and other problems and make this 145M investment run efficiently and produce benefits. but, you know, that doesn't fit OC17's narrative about being abused by sensitive millennials (including this 57 y.o. one).
February 22, 20187 yr Well you said I was angry about transit and I countered with the fact that the connector was not transit, which you agree with from this post.
February 22, 20187 yr ^ indeed. And I've never heard anyone on this board say that weather wasn't a significant variable -- under any circumstances but especially for a connector route covering a short distance. On the other hand, I have heard many, many people, who supported and support the streetcar development, complain about the lack of a traffic study to support efficient operations of the streetcar and the street grid, the lack of hardwired network cabling that would make real-time arrival signals be reliable, various stupid decisions about the fare machines, and a general sluggishness of city administration to tackle these and other problems and make this 145M investment run efficiently and produce benefits. but, you know, that doesn't fit OC17's narrative about being abused by sensitive millennials (including this 57 y.o. one). But everything except the weather, at least so far, has been blamed on the political conspiracy including no traffic study, cabling, fare machines. It sounds like everything wrong with this streetcar loops back to the political conspiracy.
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