I don't know if anyone reads Sheriff Jones' blog, but here's the recent entry about the bust:

http://butlersheriff.org/blog/?p=54

 

I thought I would weigh in on the topic...here is my comment:

 

"The Constitution is written in English (ever notice that?) and English, despite what people moving here now seem to want, is still the language of the land. The Pledge of Allegiance is ALSO in English.”

 

Ich verspreche Untertanenpflicht zur Fahne von den Vereinigten Staaten, und zur Republik, für den es steht: eine Nation unter Gott, unzertrennlich, mit Freiheit und Gerechtigkeit für alle.

 

You probably can’t read that because you are so closed minded that you only care about your surroundings and what you know. But what I said was the Pledge of Allegiance in German. Our documents are written in English mainly because we were settled by England! But guess what, there were both strong French and Spanish speaking influences here as well. Wake up to the world around you…why can’t you expand your horizon a little bit and learn something new. No one is forcing you, but guess what…even though you may not believe it, Hispanic immigrants are learning English and before you know it they’ll be bilingual and you’ll still be clutching to your closed-minded opinions.

 

There is no official language for this country because we are a nation of immigrants. The only people in this nation that can claim otherwise are the Native Americans…and I highly doubt that too many of you are Native Americans. Open up your mind and your heart for a change, realize what is taking place in the world around you and actually learn something about it.

Arrested illegals want lawyers first

BY DAN HORN | CINCINNATI ENQUIRER

August 31, 2007

 

The illegal immigrants arrested this week in Butler County asked a judge Friday to block federal authorities from moving or deporting them before they can meet with lawyers. “What we’re trying to do is just keep them here close to their families, close to their lawyers until we know what’s going on,” said Firooz Namei, one of their attorneys.

 

He filed a petition Friday in U.S. District Court in Cincinnati seeking an order from Judge Susan Dlott. The petition, backed by the American Immigration Lawyers Association, names just two of the immigrants but asks for an order on behalf of all of those arrested Tuesday in a raid at the Koch Foods plant in Fairfield.

 

Officials with Immigration and Customs Enforcement said the raid netted 161 illegal aliens, and about 80 remain locked up in southern Ohio jails. All of the illegal aliens face deportation proceedings.

I thought I would weigh in on the topic...here is my comment:

 

Well, you tried.  Unfortunately it's fairly obvious that almost nobody actually reads what other people post.

 

I thought I would weigh in on the topic...here is my comment:

 

Well, you tried.  Unfortunately it's fairly obvious that almost nobody actually reads what other people post.

 

I'm afraid to go back and look at what people responded with to that one.  It's amazing (in a bad way) how many people are active on that site.

I put up one more comment:

 

Let me throw this out there…For the people on here who object to Hispanic immigrants using Spanish to communicate…do you also object to those Chinese, Japanese and European immigrants who use their own native languages?

 

If you oppose illegal immigration that’s fine. But lets define it first. Exceptions seemed to be made for more ‘desirable’ immigrants that may have more of an education, are of a white skin color or who have something else to offer. I don’t remember when it became policy for the US to start picking and choosing who can immigrate here.

 

If you’re not a criminal and want to move to America for more freedom and the chance at the mystical ‘American Dream’ then what’s the problem.

 

I just want the policies and stances to be equal across the board. If you’re going to bust the chops of Hispanic immigrants (both legal and illegal) then do the same to the European, Asian and other immigrants that come. Or just make it easier for all to come to the land of the free and home of the brave. I prefer the latter, but that is up to each individual to choose. I just don’t like to see double standards.

"I don’t remember when it became policy for the US to start picking and choosing who can immigrate here."

 

Actually, it is policy. If someone from another country is highly skilled in certain areas, it's very easy for them to come over here. I'm not sure exactly what the skills are; they're probably in the high demand fields of healthcare, engineering , etc.

Yes it is certainly easier, because their employer or school will normally take care of all the paperwork for them...but that doesn't mean that it is policy.  Maybe it is, but if we're embracing discrimination then the US is in a worst state than I had previously thought.

As David stated, the U.S. certainly does pick and choose who can emigrate here based on skills, relatives who are citizens, etc. 

 

There used to be nation-based quotas until the mid-1960s when President Johnson signed into law a bill that establishes quotas by hemisphere, not by country of birth.  I believe there may be caps for any one country, but immigrants from each hemisphere get a slot on a first-come, first-served basis.

 

Stolen Away

ICE raid chills immigrant community

BY KEVIN OSBORNE | CITY BEAT

September 5, 2007

 

FAIRFIELD - A raid last week that led to the arrest of 161 illegal immigrants at a chicken packaging factory in Fairfield might fan emotions and make for good headlines but does little to address the problem of undocumented foreign workers, according an immigrant advocacy group.

 

The Coalition for the Rights and Dignity of Immigrants -- also known by its Spanish acronym, CODEDI -- criticizes the use of raids as causing the unnecessary breakup of families, adding that they are no replacement for a substantive federal policy for dealing with the issue in an even-handed manner.

 

When an undocumented worker is deported, it can take up to six years for that person to be reunited with his or her spouse and children left in this country due to the bureaucracy and procedures now in place, says the Rev. Manuel Viera, a Catholic priest who works with the burgeoning Hispanic community in Butler County.

I tried to add my two cents to the blog, but not sure if it got approved.  Anyways...

 

-----

 

"people arrested at Koch Foods were criminals."

 

Only because we made a law that says so.  Drinking beer was illegal at one time, but most people did it anyways, and many of them immigrants at the time.  Should they all have been shipped back?

 

Maybe we need to take a look at our laws, and better evaluate who could be a productive member of our society, and make it easier for them to immigrate, just like all of our ancestors did.

 

Also, I am tired of hearing people whine and complain that immigrants and illegals (most of which should simply be immigrants in my opinion) are taking jobs from Americans.  What do you think Italian and Irish immigrants did over a hundred years ago when they came and took low-paying factory jobs?  Nobody shipped them back home then.

If they are willing to work and pay taxes like the rest of us,      I got no beef!

 

We already have enough (native, not immigrant) freeloaders here.

 

"people arrested at Koch Foods were criminals."

 

Only because we made a law that says so.  Drinking beer was illegal at one time, but most people did it anyways, and many of them immigrants at the time.  Should they all have been shipped back?

 

 

The law they are breaking is the one that says they can't be here.  Its not because they are illegally drinking beer, or speeding, or stealing, or anything else.  Immigrants who break other laws, aren't necessarily shipped back as you put it.  Immigrants indicates a LEGAL person.  Violating a minor law will not get them shipped back.

 

 

Maybe we need to take a look at our laws, and better evaluate who could be a productive member of our society, and make it easier for them to immigrate, just like all of our ancestors did.

 

 

Fine, change the laws, but there would still be quotas.  What gives you the impression it was so easy for our ancestors to emigrate?  There were quotas then also.

 

 

Also, I am tired of hearing people whine and complain that immigrants and illegals (most of which should simply be immigrants in my opinion) are taking jobs from Americans.  What do you think Italian and Irish immigrants did over a hundred years ago when they came and took low-paying factory jobs?  Nobody shipped them back home then.

 

You continue to miss the point.  What don't you get about the difference between people who come here legally and those that come illegally?  Why would anyone consider shipping back someone here legally because they took a job from another American?  Why can't there be rules to follow?  You're right, nobody shipped my grandfathers back for coming here at the turn of the century from Italy, working hard, learning the language, making their children speak English only, and then sending these same children back to Europe to fight to defend our country.

 

Do you really think this country can just open its doors to everyone?  We don't have the infrastructure for that.  For every hard working illegal, there is probably one or more who is not hard working.  What do you do for a living that you want to pay for all the worlds problems?

You continue to miss the point.  What don't you get about the difference between people who come here legally and those that come illegally?  Why would anyone consider shipping back someone here legally because they took a job from another American?  Why can't there be rules to follow?  You're right, nobody shipped my grandfathers back for coming here at the turn of the century from Italy, working hard, learning the language, making their children speak English only, and then sending these same children back to Europe to fight to defend our country.

 

Do you really think this country can just open its doors to everyone?  We don't have the infrastructure for that.  For every hard working illegal, there is probably one or more who is not hard working.  What do you do for a living that you want to pay for all the worlds problems?

 

The issue is that the country seems to be more accomodating to those immigrating here from Europe, Asia and the likes.  If you truly feel that we shouldn't open our doors everyone then that's fine...but I don't feel it is humane to pick and choose and essentially discriminate against particular cultures.  If you're going to drag Hispanics through the coals, then do the same to the others who are trying to immigrate here.  If you don't want to do that, then allow for Hispanic immigrants to have the same opportunity of immigration as everyone else.

 

We can't really call ourselves the land of opportunity if it is only a land of opportunity if you meet certain criteria.  This, IMO, is a MAJOR flaw with our society.  Being the wealthiest, strongest and most advanced nation in the world...I feel we have some social obligations to live up to.  If our neighbors are begging for a chance at the "American Dream" then why the hell should we stop them.

^Randy, you keep quoting statistics without any evidence.  I know it may look like we give preferences to Europeans and Asians, but I don't know the statistics of who is allowed more than others.  Obviously, the Asians and Europeans have a bit more difficulty crossing our borders than the Hispanics do.  Show me groups of illegal Italians living here, and I agree they should be removed!  Get the immigration facts and then we can have a serious discussion about it.  In previous posts you talk about student visas etc as if that is the same as legal immigration status.  Its not the same at all.  Student and work visas do not give permanent residence status.

 

I'm not against giving people the chance to live the American dream, we just can't take them all at once either!  I have nothing against Hispanics.  I just want them to do what previous cultures did when they came here.  Try to fit in with the majority.  They will be rewarded for that.  Certainly there are legal Hispanics here contributing as much or more than other Americans.  I applaud them.  Guess what?  So does Cunningham!

 

Another thing, you mention is following certain criteria.  Living here means following certain criteria.  We are a nation of laws, no one, including any of us, can do whatever we want, whenever we want.  Some of the laws seem foolish, but for the most part we follow them!

Here we go....

 

 

"people arrested at Koch Foods were criminals."

 

Only because we made a law that says so.  Drinking beer was illegal at one time, but most people did it anyways, and many of them immigrants at the time.  Should they all have been shipped back?

 

 

The law they are breaking is the one that says they can't be here.  Its not because they are illegally drinking beer, or speeding, or stealing, or anything else.  Immigrants who break other laws, aren't necessarily shipped back as you put it.  Immigrants indicates a LEGAL person.  Violating a minor law will not get them shipped back.

 

You missed my point completely.  My point was that things are only illegale because we say they're illegal.  If we made smoking illegale there'd be a hell of a lot more criminals in our country.  I was saying this is exactly whatg happened with drinking...we made it illegal and created criminals...same thing with immigration...it used to be people could come here and look for work, now you have to almost prove to have a good job before they'll even consider you...so now we've made hard-working people who come to our country willing to work illegal.

 

 

Maybe we need to take a look at our laws, and better evaluate who could be a productive member of our society, and make it easier for them to immigrate, just like all of our ancestors did.

 

 

Fine, change the laws, but there would still be quotas.  What gives you the impression it was so easy for our ancestors to emigrate?  There were quotas then also.

 

No, I believe the first quotas were enacted in 1921 and 1924.

 

 

Also, I am tired of hearing people whine and complain that immigrants and illegals (most of which should simply be immigrants in my opinion) are taking jobs from Americans.  What do you think Italian and Irish immigrants did over a hundred years ago when they came and took low-paying factory jobs?  Nobody shipped them back home then.

 

You continue to miss the point.  What don't you get about the difference between people who come here legally and those that come illegally?  Why would anyone consider shipping back someone here legally because they took a job from another American?  Why can't there be rules to follow?  You're right, nobody shipped my grandfathers back for coming here at the turn of the century from Italy, working hard, learning the language, making their children speak English only, and then sending these same children back to Europe to fight to defend our country.

 

There are plenty of people spiteful of even legal immigrants.  There are rallies around the country to stop immigration, even legal.  Regardless, I don't see a big difference between many of the illegals and their legal counterparts of old.  They both are hard-working and have simply come here to pursue opportunities.  The difference is that we have made it harder for them now to become citizens.

 

What irks me the most is the attitude that people think we need to tighten up our borders even against legal immigration (which we have done).  This is the typical suburban attitude...I want to move to a nice rural area and build a new McMansion, but then keep everyone else out.

 

Do you really think this country can just open its doors to everyone?  We don't have the infrastructure for that.  For every hard working illegal, there is probably one or more who is not hard working.  What do you do for a living that you want to pay for all the worlds problems?

 

I am a self-made hard-working American living off of a decent salary and I wish the same opportunity that was afforded to me for everyone else.  How about you?

^Randy, you keep quoting statistics without any evidence.  I know it may look like we give preferences to Europeans and Asians, but I don't know the statistics of who is allowed more than others.  Obviously, the Asians and Europeans have a bit more difficulty crossing our borders than the Hispanics do.  Show me groups of illegal Italians living here, and I agree they should be removed!

 

I can't quote statistics because I don't know of any sources that keep a statistical count on the which groups are favored over others.  I am simply employing my knowledge from conversations, discussions and experience.  Within the past month I spoke to legal citizens who immigrated from Poland and India...they both aknowledged the fact that it was easier for them to go through the immigration process than others.  One said his process was quite quick and only took about 2/3 years...others last much longer than that and can be quite difficult to deal with all the paperwork and what not yourself (especially if English isn't your first language).

 

I'm not against giving people the chance to live the American dream, we just can't take them all at once either!   I have nothing against Hispanics.  I just want them to do what previous cultures did when they came here.  Try to fit in with the majority.  They will be rewarded for that.  Certainly there are legal Hispanics here contributing as much or more than other Americans.  I applaud them.  Guess what?  So does Cunningham!

 

First of all...who gives a flying load about Cunningham...this conversation has nothing to do with that clown.

 

Secondly, you should read up on your American history and population patterns.  When the different Europeans came over they self-segregated themselves into enclaves.  Ever heard of Little Italy, Chinatown, etc?  They did not fit in right away...it took time, just as it will take time for the wave of Hispanic immigrants.  The first generation will have the most difficulty, the second a little less, third even less (barely noticeable) and by the fourth and on they will be completly integrated into the American culture.  Just have some patience.

 

Sure many of the adults don't know Enqlish...but I challenge any adult to just pick up and learn another language.  Then after that difficulty imagine how difficult it would be if you're coming from a piss poor education system.  Do you really think that the Hispanic children in school aren't learning English?!?!  Don't be soo foolish.

 

Another thing, you mention is following certain criteria.  Living here means following certain criteria.  We are a nation of laws, no one, including any of us, can do whatever we want, whenever we want.  Some of the laws seem foolish, but for the most part we follow them!

 

Great I agree...I think we should all follow the laws.  But guess what laws aren't always right and sometimes they need to be looked at and re-evaluated.  Remember when it was legal to have slaves...or when it was illegal to drink alcohol?

I've got another thing...the argument of "their taking jobs away from Americans" is absolute junk.  We encourage people to move here for IT jobs from places like India and Eastern Europe.  So it is acceptable for someone to come here for the opportunity of a white collar job, but a blue collar - absolutely not I guess.

 

Most Americans would probably say that they would prefer to have a white collar job over a blue collar one.  Shouldn't those be the jobs we are most upset about being "taken away?"

I am a self-made hard-working American living off of a decent salary and I wish the same opportunity that was afforded to me for everyone else.  How about you?

 

EXACTLY!!!

 

I can't quote statistics because I don't know of any sources that keep a statistical count on the which groups are favored over others.  

 

My point exactly, you don't know!!!!  Do you know of any Hispanics who were able to come into this country as quickly?  Can you prove they can't?  So you talked to a few immigrants.  Get the numbers first!

 

Secondly, you should read up on your American history and population patterns.  When the different Europeans came over they self-segregated themselves into enclaves.  Ever heard of Little Italy, Chinatown, etc?  They did not fit in right away...it took time, just as it will take time for the wave of Hispanic immigrants.  The first generation will have the most difficulty, the second a little less, third even less (barely noticeable) and by the fourth and on they will be completly integrated into the American culture.  Just have some patience.

 

Sure many of the adults don't know Enqlish...but I challenge any adult to just pick up and learn another language.  Then after that difficulty imagine how difficult it would be if you're coming from a piss poor education system.  Do you really think that the Hispanic children in school aren't learning English?!?!  Don't be soo foolish.

 

Are you that dense?  Did you even read my post?  Did you read about my grandparents from Italy?  Did you even read what I said?  They had to fit in!  And it didn't take 3 generations!  Yes, it was hard for my grandparents to learn a new language.  That's why my father as a small child would translate for them!  My parents can actually speak English!!  What a stupid statement you made.  And Guess what!  They didn't recite the Pledge of Allegience in Italian!  And the teachers weren't asked to teach them in Italian.  I even stated that they are welcome!  How can they fit in American culture, if we change it for them? 

 

Great I agree...I think we should all follow the laws.  But guess what laws aren't always right and sometimes they need to be looked at and re-evaluated.  Remember when it was legal to have slaves...or when it was illegal to drink alcohol?

 

You're right, all laws need to be reviewed now and then.  Take a look at Roe v. Wade too while you're at it!

 

Here we go....

 

You missed my point completely.  My point was that things are only illegale because we say they're illegal.  If we made smoking illegale there'd be a hell of a lot more criminals in our country.  I was saying this is exactly whatg happened with drinking...we made it illegal and created criminals...same thing with immigration...it used to be people could come here and look for work, now you have to almost prove to have a good job before they'll even consider you...so now we've made hard-working people who come to our country willing to work illegal.

 

No, your point was we didn't ship people back for breaking a no drinking law!  You missed your own point!

 

 

No, I believe the first quotas were enacted in 1921 and 1924.

 

Yes, those may have been the first official quotas, but there were other rules and regulations limiting who could come and how many, and where they were going, and whether or not they had a sponsor.

 

There are plenty of people spiteful of even legal immigrants.  There are rallies around the country to stop immigration, even legal.  Regardless, I don't see a big difference between many of the illegals and their legal counterparts of old.  They both are hard-working and have simply come here to pursue opportunities.  The difference is that we have made it harder for them now to become citizens.

 

What irks me the most is the attitude that people think we need to tighten up our borders even against legal immigration (which we have done).  This is the typical suburban attitude...I want to move to a nice rural area and build a new McMansion, but then keep everyone else out.

 

There are people who hate people just to hate them.  You aren't going to change it.  There are also people who don't want any immigrants.  I don't agree, but I understand the position.  That has never changed.  Don't think for a minute that it is a suburban problem.  There is as much hate in the cities as in the suburbs.

 

I am a self-made hard-working American living off of a decent salary and I wish the same opportunity that was afforded to me for everyone else.  How about you?

 

Are you really totally completely self made?  I doubt it.  If not the product of hard working parents, than the product of the American way of life.  I welcome anyone to come here, follow our rules and reap the benefits of our way of life.

^First of all, I've talked with far more than "a few" immigrants and I have a good number of friends who have gone through the process.  If you can tell me of a better way to be informed about the immigration process then please tell me.  I just thought that a first-hand source would be pretty good, apparently not though.

 

Are you that dense?  Did you even read my post?  Did you read about my grandparents from Italy?  Did you even read what I said?  They had to fit in!  And it didn't take 3 generations!  Yes, it was hard for my grandparents to learn a new language.  That's why my father as a small child would translate for them!  My parents can actually speak English!!  What a stupid statement you made.  And Guess what!  They didn't recite the Pledge of Allegience in Italian!  And the teachers weren't asked to teach them in Italian.  I even stated that they are welcome!  How can they fit in American culture, if we change it for them?

 

I'm sorry but you're just making statements without facts.  So you know your parent's story...give me the data set that quantifies everyones social experiences and then we'll talk.

 

I would also say it's easier to fit in when you have the same color skin.  Bottom line is that it is harder to identify differences that aren't visible with the naked eye.  I am going out on a limb when I guess that your parents were white, but since you say they are Italian I don't think I am too far off (correct me if I'm wrong and I'll surely back off).  You might respond with "well Asians have different color skin."  I'll counter it now.  Asians do not have the negative conotation, in this country, that Hispanics and Blacks have.  You could be a black individual from France and be treated the same (initially) as someone who is from the hood.  The same goes for a Hispanic individual who may be from a good background and decent education...but they're treated as if they just hopped a fence and scrambled across the border.  Let me ask you, how can you tell an illegal Hispanic immigrant from a legal one...it seems to me that most, with your position, are of the mindset that all Hispanics are illegal until they proove themselves legal.

 

You're right, all laws need to be reviewed now and then.  Take a look at Roe v. Wade too while you're at it!

 

Do you just have a problem with people who take more liberal stances on social issues.  This is the second comment you've thrown out there that is irrelevant.  I don't give a hoot about Cunningham, and we're talking immigration here not abortion.

 

I'm sorry but you're just making statements without facts.  So you know your parent's story...give me the data set that quantifies everyones social experiences and then we'll talk.!

That's all I was doing, telling my family's story, not speaking for all.

 

Let me ask you, how can you tell an illegal Hispanic immigrant from a legal one...it seems to me that most, with your position, are of the mindset that all Hispanics are illegal until they proove themselves legal.

!

 

When did I ever say anyone who looks Hispanic is illegal?  You truly are something. 

 

Great I agree...I think we should all follow the laws.  But guess what laws aren't always right and sometimes they need to be looked at and re-evaluated.  Remember when it was legal to have slaves...or when it was illegal to drink alcohol?

 

Do you just have a problem with people who take more liberal stances on social issues.  This is the second comment you've thrown out there that is irrelevant.  I don't give a hoot about Cunningham, and we're talking immigration here not abortion.

 

Exactly!!!!  We were talking about immigration, not slavery or prohibition!!!!!!  You are a hoot!  Grow up kid and maybe we can talk!!!!

 

 

from http://www.raven.umd.edu/~mddlmddl/791/legal/html/immi1800.html

 

The Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 was the first piece of legislation that targeted a specific ethnic group. The Chinese were prohibited from immigrating to the United States for the next ten years and it further denied them the right to citizenship. This racial policy of exclusion lasted until 1952. The effect of the 1882 Act was to stop all new Chinese immigrant labor for the next 10 years. Chinese laborers already here were allowed to leave and then re-enter provided they showed that they had a certificate of eligibility. Those who were not eligible were deported.

 

Later legislation, the Act of July 5, 1884 amended the earlier act of May 6, 1882. This act extended the prohibition against Chinese immigrants for another ten years and denied access to all Chinese except government officials. Altogether, Chinese immigrants were denied entry to the United States for the next twenty years.

 

The first general federal immigration law was a further reaction against the new immigrant groups - Southern and Eastern Europeans (Italians, Slavs, Poles, Russians) pouring into the United States for the first time. The federal law was a compromise with state and local authorities who had been forced to deal with the great influx of immigrants. Port of entry states faced economic hardships when indigent, poor, and sick immigrants landed at their doors. States governments had been forced to pay for these immigrants by providing medical care and housing for the new arrivals. The economic burden on the State’s treasury was greatly resented. The Eastern state governments wanted the federal government to provide economic support to ease the financial burdens of immigration.

 

The federal government responded by passing the Immigration Act of 1882. The law, for the first time, imposed a 50 cent head tax on all immigrants that entered the United States. The collected moneys were used to pay inspectors who were responsible for determining who would and would not be allowed to enter the United States. The law excluded specific immigrants groups who were identified as convicts, lunatics, and anyone that was unable to provide for themselves and thereby become a dependent to the state government. The Immigration Act of 1882 ended the period of federal inaction toward immigration and took control over the issue.

 

The Alien Contract Labor Law of February 26, 1885 (23 Stat. 332) restricted immigration even further. Congress learned that, since 1869, employers had been running advertisements in foreign newspapers describing great wages and employment opportunities in the United States. Immigrants, attracted by the promise of jobs and high wages, arrived in the United States to find few jobs and low wages. The surplus labor, however, had the tendency to push down wages for domestic laborers. Domestic laborers were particularly upset with industrialists who frequently brought in immigrants to break strikes and to keep wages low. (Higham 1956, 218) The Knights of Labor urged Congress to deal with the situation by restricting contract labor. The rising surplus labor supply coupled with an severe economic depression of 1883-1886 led Washington to regulate further the flow of immigrants into the United States. The legislation passed in the Alien Contract Labor Law was designed to make it illegal to import "aliens or to assist in the ir importation or migration into the United States under any contract made prior to the importation or migration for the performance of labor or service of any kind." (Bennett 1963, 18) Exceptions to the law included professional actors, singers, artists, lec turers, and relatives and personal friends already residing in the United States.

 

The Chinese Exclusion Act and the Alien Contract Labor Law, however, did not prevent European immigration from increasing during the 1880s and into the early 1890s. New calls for restricting immigrants were heard during the late 1880s and early 1890s. Unlike earlier times, the immigrants came not from Northern Europe but from Southern and Eastern Europe - Italians and Slavs were increasing in numbers.

 

In 1888, congressional hearings were held and later published as the Ford Committee Report. The report concluded that undesirable immigrants (anarchists, convicts, and the poor) were coming into the United States unheeded. Congressmen declared that it was time to slow down unrestricted immigration and to protect American workingmen from the ill effects of cheap immigrant labor. The Federal Census also reported in 1890 that because of the flow of unrestricted immigration, the vast open lands of the United States, the frontier, had disappeared. Responding to this news, alarmed political and social leaders encouraged Congress to deal with the situation with the passage of the Immigration Act of 1891. Later all three major political parties, the Republicans, Democrats, and the Populists, all adopted platforms that endorsed further immigration restrictions.

 

The Immigration Act of 1891 added to the list of those who were denied entry into the United States - paupers, idiots, and the insane, as well as diseased persons, convicts, polygamists, and those whose passage had been paid by another. In addition, the authority of the Immigration Bureau was increased at the expense of the state boards. The Immigration Bureau now had jurisdiction over medical examinations and inspections of immigrants. The immigration officers determined who could and who could not enter the United States. Their decisions were final, subject to administrative appeals.

 

 

When did I ever say anyone who looks Hispanic is illegal?  You truly are something.

 

I never said that you said that...I was just making a point.  Please answer some of these questions that jam40jeff and I have asked of you...all you keep doing is looking for ways to refute what we say.  You're not making any substantial points to back up your own stance.  If you feel this strongly about people who break the law...then I hope you're this vigilant in all cases where someone breaks any law.

 

Exactly!!!!  We were talking about immigration, not slavery or prohibition!!!!!!  You are a hoot!  Grow up kid and maybe we can talk!!!!

 

I'm sorry, but I have ever met you...or do you know me personally from somewhere else?  I certainly don't remember knowing you from anywhere and as a result I don't make slanderous statements about your character or knowledge.  Yes I'm 21, but what the hell does that mean.  I often get this response from older people who I stand toe to toe with and have political discussions with.  Maybe it's rare that a young person like myself cares, maybe you're threatened by me because of my youth...I don't know, but I sure as hell consider myself more informed and knowledgeable on politics and social issues than many people.  You don't have to 30+ years old to know how to read.  Regardless of my age...I am informed.  I don't know everything but I don't claim to either.  If I'm wrong on something point it out and correct me...but simply saying "grow up" isn't going to cut it.

 

You have yet to prove me wrong on ANY of my points and you expect me to wither away because of your age complex?  You can keep throwing out your comments that try to shoot holes in my stance, but they are weak at best.  I haven't interviewed every single immigrant that has come to this nation...I also haven't interviewed every single Native American out there.  With that said it all really isn't necessary to know that certain segments of society suffer from discrimination.  Please tell me that you don't actually think that Hispanic immigrants get a fair shake in the process...especially compared to someone more "desirable."

 

You have yet to prove me wrong on ANY of my points and you expect me to wither away because of your age complex?  You can keep throwing out your comments that try to shoot holes in my stance, but they are weak at best.  I haven't interviewed every single immigrant that has come to this nation...I also haven't interviewed every single Native American out there.  With that said it all really isn't necessary to know that certain segments of society suffer from discrimination.  Please tell me that you don't actually think that Hispanic immigrants get a fair shake in the process...especially compared to someone more "desirable."

 

I have proven you wrong on all of your points by pointing out to you that you are speaking without the data.  In the real world, people are expected to back up their position with facts.  The fact is, you know nothing about the immigration quotas comparing Hispanics to Europeans, yet you continue to to say things like above that the Hispanic immigrants don't get a fair shake in the process.  All I have asked is that you show me the facts.  If you are right, and they don't get a fair shake I will agree with you and apologize to you. 

 

I'm sorry if you feel I've slandered you by telling you to grow up.  I think the word you are looking for is libel, which is the defamation of someone using the written word.  Slander would be verbal defamation.  Defamation itself is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may harm the reputation of an individual,  I merely stated a fact, that you are young, and should grow up.  I made no false claims.  I may have insulted you, or hurt your feelings, but it certainly was not slanderous.

 

A libelous statement could be if I said to you: "I could see the mistake you made, being a product of the Oak Hills School system and all"; but that would be wrong and I wouldn't do that!  :wink:

 

By the way, lighten up too!

^Classy...but I'll give you some sources now (since I'm too young to actually know/understand anything):

 

I'm not sure who invented the phrase "computerized discrimination," but it's a good one to describe the bureaucratic complexities of the INS and U.S. State Dept.  The visa and quota systems are complex, and adding lotteries, loopholes, amnesty programs, extensions, and exemptions to the fray makes it even more so. I can't imagine too many immigrants, legal or otherwise, being able to successfully navigate this world of forms, fees, applications, proofs, documentations, checks, and reinstatements without expert assistance. Perhaps the whole thing's designed to provide work for the growing area of legal practice in immigrant law, business consulting startups, or self-help books like Carrion (2002).  Perhaps it's designed to encourage fraud and/or illegal immigration by making legitimate routes so complex. The whole thing, even the amnesty program which is obviously designed to cover-up our inability to deport millions of undocumented aliens, is not very family-friendly; e.g., husbands on H1s, wives on H4s, and spousal income doesn't count toward family support.

http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/soc/355lect08.htm

 

U.S. policy allowed unrestricted immigration until 1930 when our special "open door" relationship with Mexico came under heavy criticism. Since then, there have been various repatriation efforts to get Mexicans back to Mexico, such as Operation Wetback in 1954 and the 1986 Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA). Operation Wetback gave the Border Patrol extraordinary powers, and IRCA fined employers $3000 for each illegal alien they hired but set up a green card lottery. It's estimated that the Border Patrol and the INS return back at least 1 million Mexicans a year under these programs, but an estimated 3 million a year slip through.

http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/soc/355lect13.htm

 

Smith’s analysis paints a far more optimistic portrait of Hispanic immigrants that looks similar to other ethnic groups. For example, Mexican immigrants born early in the early 20th century had an average four years of schooling. Their American-born sons doubled that schooling, with the third generation descendents graduating from high school.

http://www.rand.org/news/press.03/05.22.html

 

Hmmm this one seems to pretty much back up my 3-4 generation curve that I mentioned earlier - which you quickly refuted by saying that earlier European immigrants didn't need this long of a time.  From the same article...

 

A new RAND study shows that Hispanic immigrants to the United States and their children move up the economic and educational ladder across generations just as quickly as European immigrants did generations earlier

 

I'll add some more at a later time, but once again I seem to have to spell out everything that I say.  Hopefully you back up some of your statements as well (ie that Hispanic immigrants are NOT discriminated against in the immigration process, the immigration laws are fair/valid and that they don't single out a particular segment of society)...it's only fair.

Sheriff wants illegal alien ballot issue

Wednesday, November 14, 2007

 

Butler County Sheriff Richard K. Jones wants a federation to initiate a state ballot issue that would force legislators to pass legislation on illegal alien issues. 

 

In a letter sent to state legislative leaders today, Jones expressed concern about the lack of activity on illegal alien issues and said he could contact the Federation for Immigration Reform to see if it was interested in initiating illegal alien reform as a state-wide ballot issue.

 

Jones sent letters to Ohio House Speaker John Husted and Senate President Bill Harris asking them to join state Rep. Courtney Combs and Sen. Gary Cates in trying to get legislation passed on the issue. 

 

MORE: http://www.journal-news.com/n/content/oh/story/news/local/2007/11/14/hjn111507sheriffletter.html

I just don't understand...is it really fair to constantly lambaste individuals who are being encouraged to come here by the businesses here?  Shouldn't it be the businesses that we focus our attention on and not the people who are simply following opportunity?  One day (I hope) people will understand...one day.

More illegal immigrants deported each year

Enforcement in Ohio, elsewhere up since 9/11

BY DAN HORN | CINCINNATI ENQUIRER

December 5, 2007

 

Immigration agents set another record this year when they deported more than 4,000 illegal aliens from Ohio and Michigan, a 37 percent increase over last year.

 

The jump in deportations mirrors a national trend toward annual increases since at least 2003, when U.S. immigration enforcement was overhauled in the wake of the 9/11 attacks.  Nationwide, deportations are up about 34 percent since last year, climbing from 204,000 to 273,000.

 

Immigration officials say the increase is the result of greater emphasis on enforcement, the creation of special teams to pursue fugitives, bigger detention facilities and speedier legal proceedings.

This is one of the best special reports that the Enquirer has ever done.

 

Our Hidden Communities (Special Section)

 

You can find the main article for the in-depth report here:

Four lives, Two worlds

 

The above article is quite powerful and very well done.  Like I said, one of the best jobs of reporting that I've ever seen from the Cincinnati Enquirer.

Illegal immigrant crackdown

Butler officers get special immigration police powers

BY JANICE MORSE | CINCINNATI ENQUIRER

February 8, 2008

 

HAMILTON - Butler County's tough stance on illegal immigration is getting tougher.  Eight officers returned Tuesday from four weeks of special training that allows them to perform some limited immigration-related duties.

 

As a result, the Butler County Sheriff's Office became the first police agency in the Midwest to receive immigration enforcement powers that are typically reserved for federal agencies, authorities said Thursday - about a year-and-a-half after Sheriff Rick Jones first tried to get those powers.

 

The goal: to speed deportation of illegal immigrants who are jailed on criminal charges that allege offenses other than lacking proper immigration documents.

Mentor restaurant part of five-state raid

Posted by Robert L. Smith April 16, 2008 11:54AM

Categories: Breaking News, Impact

 

Surprised employees arriving for work at a Mexican restaurant in Mentor this morning walked into federal custody.  Agents of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, or ICE, awaited inside Jalapeno Loco, a family-style restaurant in the Points East shopping plaza on Mentor Avenue.  In four hours, the agents arrested six men and three women accused of being in the country illegally.  Agents picked up the manager, Alvaro Soto, at his Willoughby home.  He has not yet been charged.

 

MORE: http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/04/mentor_restaurant_part_of_five.html

Bill would require proof of citizenship

By Josh Sweigart

Thursday, April 24, 2008

 

HAMILTON — A proposed law to crack down on illegal immigration would require every Ohio resident to show proof of citizenship or valid travel papers next time they register a car.

 

State Rep. Courtney Combs, R-Hamilton, introduced the bill Tuesday, April 22.  He said he's responding to a March 14 raid on three Hamilton car dealerships that has left nine people charged with helping undocumented workers illegally purchase and register their cars with fake identification.

 

In addition to a driver's license and social security card, the bill would require drivers to present a birth certificate or other proof of citizenship, or a green card, visa or other proof they're legally in the country, to register their vehicles.

 

MORE: http://www.journal-news.com/n/content/oh/story/news/local/2008/04/24/hjn042508Combs.html

newsflash:  The counterfeit industry will then make a killing.

It already does here in DC, where the illegals are out of control.

It already does here in DC, where the illegals are out of control.

 

"illegals are out of control".  I'm sure that is not what you meant.

newsflash:  The counterfeit industry will then make a killing.

 

It's an economic stimulus package.

newsflash:  The counterfeit industry will then make a killing.

 

It's an economic stimulus package.

OK.  I had a fake ID back in the day. My alias was Nestor Quinones.  The best $50 bucks!

Technically KY, but relevant anyways...

 

Contractor who was ex-official sentenced

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080722/NEWS0103/807220333/1170/NEWS

SanduskyRegister.com Front Article http://sanduskyregister.com/articles/2008/07/24/front/doc4888072d45f43239773364.txt

 

Feds: The party's over (for illegal immigrants) at Casa Fiesta

By CORY FROLIK

Thursday July 24 2008, 6:28am

 

Federal agents from U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement arrested 58 Casa Fiesta employees Wednesday from the restuarant's Ohio chain, which has locations in Norwalk, Sandusky, Vermilion, Oberlin, Oregon and Youngstown.

 

Post edited 9-5-09 to comply with terms of use.

Fremont's didn't close??

 

I haven't had a chance to eat there yet.

Ohioans believe illegal immigrants should stay

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20081025/NEWS0106/810260302/1168/NEWS

 

Let illegal immigrants stay here.  That's what 56 percent of Ohioans said in a poll conducted this month by the University of Cincinnati Institute for Policy Research -- and people polled in Southwest Ohio topped that figure.

 

In this corner of the state, 60 percent said they favored a government policy that allowed undocumented immigrants to stay in the country and become U.S. citizens if they met unspecified requirements in a certain timeframe.

 

That puts Ohioans in sync with the rest of the nation, according to a Gallup Poll last year, said Eric Rademacher, the institute's interim co-director.

can someone explain why Republicans are perpetually demonized on the issue of illegal immigration when in fact Obama has deported more people than anyone?

 

More Deportations Follow Minor Crimes, Records Show

By GINGER THOMPSON and SARAH COHEN

APRIL 6, 2014

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/07/us/more-deportations-follow-minor-crimes-data-shows.html?_r=0

 

Painesville, Ohio, 30 miles east of Cleveland, offers a snapshot of some people caught up in the system. Every Tuesday night at a nondenominational church downtown, several dozen immigrant families cram together to talk about ways they can help loved ones who are either facing deportation or who have already been removed. The stories spill out so fast, and they all seem to share the same general narrative arc — immigrant drives through red or yellow light, police officer asks for driver’s license, immigrant lands in Immigration and Customs Enforcement custody, children reel from uncertainty.

 

“It’s been hard without my husband here,” said Elizabeth Perez, a 35-year-old American-born woman and a former Marine who briefly served in Afghanistan. Her husband was deported to Mexico in June 2010 after the police detained him during a traffic stop and the authorities found 14-year-old misdemeanor charges for assault and marijuana possession.

can someone explain why Republicans are perpetually demonized on the issue of illegal immigration when in fact Obama has deported more people than anyone?

Because they won't support changing the laws that Obama is merely enforcing.

 

Also, while Obama's numbers look worse, it's because the ICE now reports the number caught at the border as deportations where under previous administrations those deportations weren't tracked or reported. If you exclude the caught at the border deportations, Obama has actually deported slightly less than Bush per year. (Don't ask me for a source I can't remember where I read this a few weeks ago and I'm far too lazy to google it.)

can someone explain why Republicans are perpetually demonized on the issue of illegal immigration when in fact Obama has deported more people than anyone?

 

Let Iowa Republican Senator Steve King explain it to you.  Here's just a sampling from youtube when you search for steve king + immigration:

 

 

 

^did you read the article? Obama is deporting many, many more people who committed the most minor offenses when he promised not to; people who are established as residents (with families) for many years, a far different and more traumatic situation than for those just turned back at the border. The numbers do look worse because they are. Or maybe the New York Times reporters are just making up statistics (I really don't trust most of what they write anyway :laugh:). And to top it off, I was under the impression that Painesville was considered a "sanctuary city" for many years now. Don't know exactly what happened to change that, except maybe that minor traffic violations by illegals must be reported to the Feds and they take over from there.

Obama is playing tough guy on immigration because A) he can, and B) it gives him a better bargaining position to pass reform, not that the House will ever let him anyway. And you'd be surprised how many Obama voters don't give a flying whoop about deportations, and more importantly, how much flak he'd catch for being too lenient. So he goes all-out. Politics, pure and simple.

 

I know some immigration lawyers, and they all say Obama's deportations are the worst they've seen, so I'd be interested to see the source you're referencing, Keith (I know you said not to ask, but... :) )

 

A lot of immigration policy is in the enforcement, because the federal government has a tremendous amount of leeway in how it interprets and enforces those laws - it's an exclusive power of the federal government with little judicial oversight. So I think it's a bit disingenous to say he's merely enforcing the law and leave it at that - there are plenty of technically legal enforcements of the law that can be lambasted in public for being unjust or unwise. Politics isn't a court of law.

 

EDIT: I forgot to answer the original question. Republicans are demonized because they haven't made it a focus issue and because of tone-deaf ways of addressing the issue. There are plenty of them who would support reform if their constituents wouldn't go berserk and elect a tea party replacement if they did, and then there are some that are in left field believing that immigrants do nothing but steal jobs and commit crimes - not a ton of those, but they're very...visible.

 

Obama wants to deny the extreme opposition their main focus, which is simply, "It's illegal, what is there to talk about?" So he 'merely' enforces the law and tries to change the conversation. It doesn't work because GOP half believes that reform is a bad idea and half is unwilling to give Obama/Dems a public image win before the midterm elections. It might happen in 2015, though - less for GOP to lose, especially if their chosen guy/gal for 2016 publicly supports it and it passes. But they'll probably wait until they've had their shot at retaking the Senate before they compromise.

 

Like I said, people who work in immigration know that this administration has been incredibly draconian. And they'll still vote for Obama anyway. Politics.

can someone explain why Republicans are perpetually demonized on the issue of illegal immigration when in fact Obama has deported more people than anyone?

 

What Keith said.  Plus, let Iowa Republican Senator Steve King explain it to you.  Here's just a sampling from youtube when you search for steve king + immigration:

 

 

no, it's not "what Keith said" or what Steve King said. It's what Obama promised to do and he's not doing. It's just an example of hypocrisy that doesn't seem to be subject to any accountability. I know this is a bit of a long article (and admittedly my interest in it was sparked because it profiled the situation in my hometown), but ultimately it's about what Hispanic leaders said and are saying about what is clearly an unfulfilled promise:

 

"Janet Murguia, the president of the National Council of La Raza, the country’s largest Hispanic civil rights organization, joined a growing chorus of unions, religious groups and immigrant advocacy organizations that have labeled Mr. Obama the nation’s “deporter in chief,” and demanded that he make good on his promises to protect immigrant families from unfair removal policies. The pressure has prompted similar calls from leading congressional Democrats, including some of Mr. Obama’s closest allies, who are worried about, among other things, the impact deportations may have on Hispanic turnout in this year’s midterm elections."

can someone explain why Republicans are perpetually demonized on the issue of illegal immigration when in fact Obama has deported more people than anyone?

 

What Keith said.  Plus, let Iowa Republican Senator Steve King explain it to you.  Here's just a sampling from youtube when you search for steve king + immigration:

 

 

no, it's not "what Keith said" or what Steve King said. It's what Obama promised to do and he's not doing. It's just an example of hypocrisy that doesn't seem to be subject to any accountability. I know this is a bit of a long article (and admittedly my interest in it was sparked because it profiled the situation in my hometown), but ultimately it's about what Hispanic leaders said and are saying about what is clearly an unfulfilled promise:

 

"Janet Murguia, the president of the National Council of La Raza, the country’s largest Hispanic civil rights organization, joined a growing chorus of unions, religious groups and immigrant advocacy organizations that have labeled Mr. Obama the nation’s “deporter in chief,” and demanded that he make good on his promises to protect immigrant families from unfair removal policies. The pressure has prompted similar calls from leading congressional Democrats, including some of Mr. Obama’s closest allies, who are worried about, among other things, the impact deportations may have on Hispanic turnout in this year’s midterm elections."

 

There is no accountability as regards federal immigration policy, legally, and politically, it's a short-term gamble. Obama takes it all on his shoulders because he's a lame duck President and the electorate is (probably?) unlikely to punish the entire Democratic party, trusting that the spotty/non-existent record and image of the GOP will push those voters to vote Dem anyway. The real risk is, as you quoted, that they won't vote at all.

 

But if the GOP wants to seriously take advantage of this, well, why aren't they? As a disaffected former conservative, I've asked that question on numerous issues for years - oh, here's an opening, see how bad the Democrats are handling this? I remain unimpressed. There's no real winner in this issue, other than DHS/USCIS and other agencies that have gotten more federal funding to do all this enforcement.

^^I don't think anyone is saying that Obama isn't being criticized for not doing enough to ease deportations, and a large (and growing) portion of the left is unhappy with the policies of the administration. That said, most of the policies are based upon the administrations attempts to enforce the laws in place, even if they disagree with said laws.

 

Now this wasn't the article I was thinking of, but it conveys the same points and was the first I found.

 

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-obama-deportations-20140402,0,3514864.story#axzz2yPciLT00

Expulsions of people who are settled and working in the United States have fallen steadily since his first year in office, and are down more than 40% since 2009.

 

On the other side of the ledger, the number of people deported at or near the border has gone up — primarily as a result of changing who gets counted in the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency's deportation statistics.

 

The vast majority of those border crossers would not have been treated as formal deportations under most previous administrations. If all removals were tallied, the total sent back to Mexico each year would have been far higher under those previous administrations than it is now.

 

The shift in who gets tallied helped the administration look tough in its early years but now may be backfiring politically...