a great read about the Terrace Plaza - written in 2009 by Casey Coston

 

http://www.soapboxmedia.com/features/01006terracehotel.aspx

 

as the column says, this would be the perfect location for a W hotel - sorry to say it won't happen

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/08/12/new-owner-of-former-terrace-plaza.html?ana=e_cinci_bn&u=mdqxSjVwpbwLHTa+xb7xwQ0dc4b18a&t=1376329345

 

Looks like they are planning to make it a hotel again. 

Good news!  I hope they keep the interior with the 50s look.

pretty awesome news. 

 

so that is 3 large vacant buildings (terrace plaza, enquirer building, Bartlett building) that are all being renovated. this plus the 580 building that was more or less empty takes a lot of empty square footage up in the CBD.  keep moving forward!

Assuming all three of these projects are brought to fruition, will there be any large vacant buildings remaining downtown? 

^It depends on how you define "large." I think the Schmidt building is pretty much empty, as is the Brendamour building next door. The building with McHahn's in it on Race is empty but for the first floor retail. Can't recall the status off the top of my head of the old Delta building at 7th and Plum but I thought that was empty too.

Good news. I hope the new owner does something with the rooftop bar.

Guests like outdoor area and rooftops. Also outdoor space on the level where to hotel portion begins.

 

 

I do worry about a potential glut of hotel space in the city.  The one place that I think could really use a hotel is The Banks, and they're the ones who appear to be struggling the most to get one built.  Any chance the development team could turn that portion of the site into residential instead?

I do worry about a potential glut of hotel space in the city.  The one place that I think could really use a hotel is The Banks, and they're the ones who appear to be struggling the most to get one built.  Any chance the development team could turn that portion of the site into residential instead?

 

I think the Banks is struggling to land a hotel for two reasons. It is very expensive to build brand new. All of these "new" hotels are in old buildings that have been bought on the cheap. The second reason is that now there are a bunch of new hotels coming online, making the hotel a riskier investment to banks/investors.

I now worry the Holiday Inn could be in jeopardy now, as they have already reduced the size and scope of the project.

 

Assuming all three of these projects are brought to fruition, will there be any large vacant buildings remaining downtown?

 

The large, 10-story red-brick building (old Pogue's warehouse?) on the east side of Race between Third and Fourth is probably the largest completely vacant building in downtown. And I've never heard so much as a whisper of it ever being redeveloped. Surprising, considering its great location and seemingly awesome views.

Assuming all three of these projects are brought to fruition, will there be any large vacant buildings remaining downtown?

 

The large, 10-story red-brick building (old Pogue's warehouse?) on the east side of Race between Third and Fourth is probably the largest completely vacant building in downtown. And I've never heard so much as a whisper of it ever being redeveloped. Surprising, considering its great location and seemingly awesome views.

 

Plus, much like Terrace Plaza, the old Pogue's Warehouse is a fine example of Modernism. I would love to get a look inside it.

 

Also, it seems like the Warehouse is owned by the development arm of Drury hotels... But it has been since 2000 so it doesn't seem like there's any plan for it.

I do worry about a potential glut of hotel space in the city.  The one place that I think could really use a hotel is The Banks, and they're the ones who appear to be struggling the most to get one built.  Any chance the development team could turn that portion of the site into residential instead?

 

With how hot Apartment development is, and low vacancy rates, you have to think they looked at that but the cost to convert was too much.

Since this was hotel not long ago the cost to renovate much less than a conversion to a different end use.

I do worry about a potential glut of hotel space in the city.  The one place that I think could really use a hotel is The Banks, and they're the ones who appear to be struggling the most to get one built.  Any chance the development team could turn that portion of the site into residential instead?

 

With how hot Apartment development is, and low vacancy rates, you have to think they looked at that but the cost to convert was too much.

Since this was hotel not long ago the cost to renovate much less than a conversion to a different end use.

 

 

I thought it would go apartment as well.  I would think that the fact it was built as hotel would only ease its conversion to apartment.  There is already so much existing plumbing infrastructure- the piece I would think is most difficult and costly to retrofit.  Of course, the parking component is already in place as well.

My only concern with apartment conversion would be the potential loss of the public spaces at the former lounge and terrace.  It doesn't mean those couldn't remain as public uses/attractions, but it would certainly not be as likely as in a hotel project.

 

Yikes -- this is a lot of new hotel inventory coming on the market at one time. You have to wonder which one of these is the first to back out and/or what this means for maintaining a healthy rate & occupancy environment...

Keep in mind we have a casino now which is also driving people to stay downtown more than past years. 

 

Two recent personal stories:

 

1.) We had some friends come in town last minute a few months back during the weekend of the Taste of Cincy.  They tried every hotel downtown, Covington, and as far out as I-74 Rybolt.  Every one was booked solid.  They ended up staying farther north of the city.

 

2.) I took a trip to Cleveland a few weeks back and ran into the same problem there.  Most of the hotels I've stayed in the past were booked solid three weeks out.  I luckily got a cancelled room at the Marriot last minute.

 

I think these casinos have been a game changer in driving the hotel industry in Ohio over the past year.  Not to mention the many other events that are happening it seems every week/weekend downtown.

Demolish the Millennium. Build at The Banks.  Plus a JW on Plum.  ;)

From the article:

 

Currently, all of the furniture, fixtures, carpet, operating supplies and equipment in the building are being removed.

 

I peered in the lobby a few years ago, and the furniture looked cool...maybe even original.  I hope they don't toss things that might be of value....wouldn't be surprised if the stuff was Florence Knoll or Herman Miller (or similar).  It was also pretty amazing that the street lobby doors and windows looked original and custom.

Demolish the Millennium. Build at The Banks.  Plus a JW on Plum.  ;)

 

Even if the Millennium does get demolished (from your lips to God's ears!), the smart play is to build another hotel on its site - generally a good idea to have a big hotel that directly connects with your convention center.

 

anyway, the news about the Terrace Plaza is super exciting.  Wondering what they'll do with the space where the department stores used to be. It's actually a great space for a data center.

From the article:

 

Currently, all of the furniture, fixtures, carpet, operating supplies and equipment in the building are being removed.

 

I peered in the lobby a few years ago, and the furniture looked cool...maybe even original.  I hope they don't toss things that might be of value....wouldn't be surprised if the stuff was Florence Knoll or Herman Miller (or similar).  It was also pretty amazing that the street lobby doors and windows looked original and custom.

 

Hopefully they aren't just tossing it.  I would pay money for a lot of that stuff - I'm sure others would, too. Mid Century Modern furniture is a goldmine right now.

^It depends on how you define "large." I think the Schmidt building is pretty much empty, as is the Brendamour building next door. The building with McHahn's in it on Race is empty but for the first floor retail. Can't recall the status off the top of my head of the old Delta building at 7th and Plum but I thought that was empty too.

 

A lot of buildings are getting gobbled up with the current apartment frenzy... McHahn's and at least 3 others are currently pending on CincyMLS.

^It depends on how you define "large." I think the Schmidt building is pretty much empty, as is the Brendamour building next door. The building with McHahn's in it on Race is empty but for the first floor retail. Can't recall the status off the top of my head of the old Delta building at 7th and Plum but I thought that was empty too.

 

A lot of buildings are getting gobbled up with the current apartment frenzy... McHahn's and at least 3 others are currently pending on CincyMLS.

 

I live on race so it would be nice to see the McHanns building have some more life in it.  I can see that corner really making progress with the Terrace, and DunHumby building coming online.

I'm really excited about this new development.  It seemed to come out of nowhere.  I really hope they focus on restoring it rather than totally gutting it and starting over.  From pictures I've seen it looks like it was a really beautiful building inside.  I'm glad the question about what to do with the old department store isn't stopping them from their interest in the building.

I hope everyone caught this from the Business Courier article:

 

This isn’t the first time the property was brought to Friedberg’s attention. He visited the building in 2000. He wasn’t interested in buying it then because he didn’t think the city had momentum.

 

“Everything at that point was moving across the river,” he said. “I was not, at that time, enthusiastic about Cincinnati. I’ve been proven wrong.”

 

He said he was attracted by the “phenomenal job Cincinnati has done turning the city around.”

Yeah, that caught my attention... and it's a good example of how success builds on itself!

That windowless block of floors at the base of the building does present quite a challenge.  I'm at a loss to come up with any ideas for what might go in there. 

That windowless block of floors at the base of the building does present quite a challenge.  I'm at a loss to come up with any ideas for what might go in there. 

 

Easy, you punch holes in them and install windows, but I think this will prevent you from qualifying for historic tax credits.

 

The other idea that I love, but have no idea if it is feasible, is to gut the base floors and put in a multiple screen movie theater. 

^I'd love it if they reopened the bricked in section of windows on the eastern portion of the second floor, made that into the concessions area/ticket area for a theater, and used the rest as a series of small theaters. That could be a really unique draw to Downtown and amenity for hotel guests.

Most of the second floor used to have windows. I'd love to see those return. Would make a huge difference.

I know this is probably a pipe dream, but I think this building would be great as a W hotel.  It's got the modern elements that give it the refined but eclectic look that most W's have.  The restaurant spaces could be SO cool if they got the right operators in them.

I know this is probably a pipe dream, but I think this building would be great as a W hotel.  It's got the modern elements that give it the refined but eclectic look that most W's have.  The restaurant spaces could be SO cool if they got the right operators in them.

 

I have stayed in two Ws and I don't see what the big deal is.  They are nice, but not anything special.  21C is way nicer than either of the Ws I have stayed at.

I know this is probably a pipe dream, but I think this building would be great as a W hotel.  It's got the modern elements that give it the refined but eclectic look that most W's have.  The restaurant spaces could be SO cool if they got the right operators in them.

 

I have stayed in two Ws and I don't see what the big deal is.  They are nice, but not anything special.  21C is way nicer than either of the Ws I have stayed at.

 

The quality of design found in a W is much higher than most chain hotels.  Comparing a chain to a boutique hotel is like comparing apples to oranges.  Besides, I think 21C tries a little too hard.

I know this is probably a pipe dream, but I think this building would be great as a W hotel.  It's got the modern elements that give it the refined but eclectic look that most W's have.  The restaurant spaces could be SO cool if they got the right operators in them.

 

I have stayed in two Ws and I don't see what the big deal is.  They are nice, but not anything special.  21C is way nicer than either of the Ws I have stayed at.

 

The quality of design found in a W is much higher than most chain hotels.  Comparing a chain to a boutique hotel is like comparing apples to oranges.  Besides, I think 21C tries a little too hard.

 

21C tries to hard?  Here are some images of various Ws.

 

 

 

 

This is the type of crap that will look sad and ridiculous in 10 years, if it doesnt already.  I don't think that is the case with 21C.  21C is classy and understated compared to your typical W.

 

Also, 21C is not exactly a boutique.  It is a young chain, with three hotels and a few more in the works.

A friend of mine is raising funds to print his book (profits go toward the Cincinnati Preservation Association and Cincinnati Art Museum) about the Terrace Plaza Hotel. Please consider donating here.

 

Here is the description he places on the site about the project:

 

In June 2009, I completed my Master of Architecture thesis on Cincinnati's Terrace Plaza Hotel entitled [re]Marketing Modernism: the revision of an iconic mid-century, mixed-use hotel. The thesis included a history of the building, as well as adaptive use and rebranding proposals for the nearly abandoned building. Though currently threatened by neglect, the Terrace Plaza Hotel was the most technologically-advanced hotel in the world when it opened in 1948. Designed by Skidmore, Owings & Merrill, the senior designer was 24-year Natalie de Blois - one of the first women architects to design such a structure. The ambitious project, started just after WWII, included artworks commissioned by Joan Miró, Alexander Calder, Saul Steinberg, and Jim Davis, along with textiles by Marianne Strengell and lighting design by Abe Feder.

 

In Fall 2012, one of my thesis chairs submitted the thesis to the Young Voices Publication Award and it was selected to be the 2013 publication.

 

I was thrilled at the honor and the opportunity to have attention paid to the Terrace Plaza and to Natalie de Blois.

 

I was fortunate enough to help bring Natalie to Cincinnati to visit the Terrace Plaza for the first time in November 2008 (she was never allowed to meet with the clients or visit the site at the time, because being a woman). I was even more fortunate to have Natalie's guidance and support during both the thesis and this book project. Unfortunately she passed away last month, just before the book will go to press, but this project will help tell her story and the story of this amazing Modern building that was so ahead of its time.

 

Though the book was funded by the Award, it will not include color images which I believe are critical to telling the stories of the Terrace Plaza and its artists and designers.

 

I must raise $1,000 in order to include color pages within the book. Please consider supporting this project and helping make history as this will be the first book on the Terrace Plaza Hotel and the first on Natalie de Blois.

 

Oh, and this is a non-profit book project. All proceeds will go toward the preservation of the building and its artwork through donations to the Cincinnati Preservation Association and the Cincinnati Art Museum.

 

Thank you so much for your consideration!

 

Shawn

ENQ INVESTIGATES: Lawsuits follow Terrace Plaza developer

Sep. 19, 2013

 

Written by Amber Hunt

 

 

A man who announced plans to resurrect the shuttered Terrace Plaza Hotel in downtown Cincinnati has left behind a trail of bankruptcies and lawsuits in New York and California, The Enquirer has learned.

 

Federal bankruptcy records indicate that Alan G. Friedberg, who became owner of the historic hotel in June, filed for bankruptcy twice in New York since 2006. He’s also been a defendant in multimillion-dollar lawsuits stemming from troubled projects in both New York and California.

 

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130919/NEWS/309190176?nclick_check=1

oh man, this quote makes him sound super shady in a hilarious way:

 

“You got the wrong person,” he said in a phone conversation Wednesday, adding: “I don’t want you digging up information on my previous projects.”

 

sure, telling a journalist that you don't want them digging into your background always makes journalists back off, because clearly there's nothing suspicious or of interest going on  :roll:

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RORm1z90-Bs  :-D

I am amazed the Enquirer actually dusted off some real investigative journalism, even if it was only a google search and a few phone calls!

 

OPINION: Terrace Hilton needs a vision for its future

Dec. 26, 2013 8:33 AM

Written by Shawn Patrick Tubb

 

 

The former Terrace Plaza at 15 W. Sixth St., Downtown, is now mostly vacant. When it opened in 1948, it was regarded nationally for its technological innovations and collection of modern art.

 

Built by the Emery family, which only 15 years before had built Carew Tower and the Netherland Plaza Hotel, it was once considered one of the nation’s most famous modernist hotels, and was known for its Gourmet Room restaurant and its 30-foot abstract mural by Spanish artist Joan Miro (now housed at the Cincinnati Art Museum).

 

“Cincinnati’s Terrace Plaza Hotel: An Icon of American Modernism” by University of Cincinnati graduate Shawn Patrick Tubb recounts the stories of the young designers, artists and builders who collaborated to produce what was then a radically new mixed-use complex.

 

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20131226/EDIT02/312260027/OPINION-Terrace-Hilton-needs-vision-its-future

Nothing concrete to report on here...but from my apartment window you can see the roof of terrace plaza and they have recently added scaffolding around the top as well as one of those yellow pipes often used in demolition that goes down the side of the building.

 

Also could see some people on the roof recently.

Interesting.

 

I really love this building, minus the base. A full scale renovation of the tower portion (with an epic rooftop bar please) and a more thorough redesign of the base to actually activate and interact with the street would do wonders for this building. And for connecting 5th to the new storefronts which will be in Dunnhumby.

 

I really hope that whenever something does actually happen with this building it's not hotel. Some modernist apartments would be a really welcome addition to Downtown and this building seems to be pretty nicely set up for just that.

Yeah the big hurdle with this building is what do you do with that massive windowless space in the lower half and still make the building a profitable investment?

 

Apartments would be awesome at this location.. would fill them up easily with 1,000+ people working right across the street. Then if you get some decent tenants on the Race/6th side and some new sidewalks then suddenly this corner goes from dead to a complete 180.

My vision for this building is to convert the first several windowless floors into a movie theater.  A huge video board facing Vine St. would be hung on the outside wall to advertise movies and showtimes. 

 

The top floors would be some combination of hotel/apartments/condos. And of course a great rooftop bar/restaurant.

 

This may be completely unrealistic, but it would be awesome. 

Yeah the big hurdle with this building is what do you do with that massive windowless space in the lower half and still make the building a profitable investment?

 

Apartments would be awesome at this location.. would fill them up easily with 1,000+ people working right across the street. Then if you get some decent tenants on the Race/6th side and some new sidewalks then suddenly this corner goes from dead to a complete 180.

 

Grocery store, ideally, see also: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.88157,-87.647348,3a,49.3y,26.85h,110.99t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sXGghxOwtH4btJ1NzyExTHw!2e0

I know this has probably be discussed before on this thread. But can't they cut holes out like they are doing @580?

^Although I'm not personally a fan, it's a historic facade, one of the few of that style (modern?) in the city.  Cutting windows into it or turning it into a billboard would be similar to removing the ornamentation from a 19th century facade.  Your best bet is to push for reuse with a business that doesn't want/need windows, such as a movie theater, bowling alley, supermarket, scientific lab, or bank/vaults.  Actually, I wonder if this could house a self storage operation (those units with locking garage doors) for the urban area.

I would disagree with all of that actually. Historic? Yeah sure. Awful? Absolutely? Terrible street presence? Absolutely. Deterrent to people walking along street? Yep. Being old isn't enough for me to want to see it saved. Not only that but it's also not in the same design as it was once without the second floor glass on the east end.

 

I'd so much rather see the actually interesting portion of the building which is a far better representation of modernism, the tower, restored, and for the base to be completely changed. A giant four or five story brick wall, no matter what you do with it, is going to kill street life. That was its intention. The street was 'dirty' and therefore separating people from it was the goal. We've learned that's a bad idea, especially in our city centers. Cutting holes in it seems like a good idea at undoing the huge problems that it brought to that block.

I don't mind preserving its modernist character for the foreseeable future. It's not like contemporary feelings about historic tastes have a good track record. Let's not be so hasty to destroy the past.

The original version was almost all glass storefront on the first floor (think window displays like Bloomingdale's in NYC) and must have had an interesting street presence. The valet area needs to be removed and the storefront should be restored there to create a hotel lobby (on-street valet like 21C has should be fine here as well). The huge expanse of brick is classy, and people calling for it to be removed, punctured for windows, etc. will be our generation's version of the people who tore down Italianate buildings all over the city because they looked dated.

 

I think there's some nuance being missed here though. I personally love modernism and wish most of it was in a better state than it currently is. But I also understand that certain aspects of modernism don't mesh at all with urbanism. Like the idea that the street if dirty and that people don't want a connection to street life. The base of this building falls squarely in this idea which is why I view it as a problem. The tower, on the other hand, is definitely classy and would be a great asset to downtown restored.

 

Massive swaths of brick might be classy in theory, but in practice they're just uncomfortable. The dislike for this base isn't because it's "old" it's because it doesn't, nor has it ever worked with an urbanist fabric which is a problem for being in the center of a city. That being said, a ground floor modification COULD potentially be enough to bring life back to that portion of the building and would allow the brick to remain. I'm just skeptical that would ever be enough.

 

But that's all just my opinion, for whatever that's worth.

I seem to recall that some of the store fronts were filled a few years ago, wasn't the hat shop on the corner in this building and maybe a small convenience store? If the store fronts are active, someone on the sidewalk wouldn't really notice the blank brick wall above and it wouldn't kill the street IMO. Get a cash cow telecom/server farm in there to help pay for the upper stories as condos, and residents also get great internet speeds. win/win. It's a wonderful modernist building, the first hotel designed by SOM, and one of the first modernist hotels in the US, and most of the interior design was by a woman (rare for the time).

 

http://www.som.com/projects/terrace_plaza_hotel

 

"SOM’s design team included Louis Skidmore (from nearby Lawrenceburg, Indiana and a graduate of the University of Cincinnati) with William Hartman as project manager; because SOM’s key designer, Gordon Bunshaft, was away in WW II, much of the building’s design fell to Nathalie DeBlois, a rare woman Modernist architect, trained at Columbia University while so many men were at war."

 

http://cincinnatipreservation.org/advocacy/modernism/the-terrace-plaza-hotel/