^ Ahh yes. "Demon rat." You sound rational.

 

Though I was not born yet at the time, from what I know about Voinovich, he was a good mayor. And the three mayors after him have been a little underwhelming (I still think Frank Jackson gets a worse rep than he deserves though). However, I don't think that's simply because they're Democrats. (Oh sorry, I mean demon rats). Michael Coleman is widely considered to be a great mayor and he's a Democrat.

 

And Northeast Ohio really isn't that far to the left. It's just that so many other parts of the country have become dramatically more conservative since the Reagan administration. Try going to any other developed Western nation and claim that the politics here are far left. They will laugh in your face.

I'd prefer Turner or Johnson or Ronayne over Frank Jackson.  I'd prefer Cimperman over anyone else on council, but a broader range of candidates would be nice.  I liked how Bill Patmon campaigned at Rapid stations, despite its questionable effectiveness as a tactic. 

 

In a city of this size, there ought to be several quality candidates each cycle.  Why doesn't that happen?

 

The reason there are "not many quality candidates" each cycle is because this city is so bent on only electing "demon rats" into office each cycle. I, and many other people I know who live in the Cleveland city limits would prefer a non-democrat, but that is not likely to happen with NE Ohio being so far left.

 

IMO the last great mayor the city of Cleveland had was George Voinovich.

 

 

Whether they be a "demon rat" or "repugnantcan", the next mayor of Cleveland needs to start making some tough decisions.  The city is still staffed like there are 500,000 residents, and yet services seem to be as weak as ever.    It's time to streamline city contracts and get our government working for residents again.

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

 

Empty factories do not create more work for basic services like snow clearing, for which someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties and not following procedure. 

 

 

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

 

Empty factories do not create more work for basic services like snow clearing, for which someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties and not following procedure.

 

I'm not so sure that someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties. If my memory serves me right, there was a news story that the person you say was sacked actually held two positions, and Mayor Jackson took one of the positions away from him, but he kept all of the salary that he was making. Good old politics.

 

Can anyone on this forum help us out here with what really happened?

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

 

Empty factories do not create more work for basic services like snow clearing, for which someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties and not following procedure. 

 

 

Snow plowing is not a good example for the purposes of your point. The roads are still just as heavily used, if not more so, despite any drop in population. And, wasn't it just the other week the city's road clearing abilities proved to be somewhat deficient?

The problem with Cleveland and all shrinking cities is that the population decline doesn't happen linearly like population growth as the city expanded.

 

After decades of decline you have a much smaller population spread out over those same corporate limits and serving the residents is a challenge.

 

For instance look at the schools. You have some schools that were built 100 years ago in a neighborhood of 20,000. Now the population that school serves is less than half that and the capacity is not needed.

 

The issue is the minute you discuss closing a building you have a public outcry from Council people and residents alike. That's where the hard choices come in. That's where the heads of government need to say we can't afford it and right size the city's infrastructure. This theory I believe is the same for other city services except for maybe streets.A street may have once had 100 occupied houses and even if now it only has 5 occupied houses you can't close the right of way and must still maintain the road.

 

 

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

 

Empty factories do not create more work for basic services like snow clearing, for which someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties and not following procedure.

 

I'm not so sure that someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties. If my memory serves me right, there was a news story that the person you say was sacked actually held two positions, and Mayor Jackson took one of the positions away from him, but he kept all of the salary that he was making. Good old politics.

 

Can anyone on this forum help us out here with what really happened?

 

Not sure but it seems like Darnell Brown is at the center of any Cleveland administration screwup.  Not sure how this guy has hung on so long but he keeps getting passed from agency to agency... mayor's office to water dept to NEORSD...

We're hardly alone in having snowplow controversies this winter, so I'm hesitant to judge anyone on that alone.  But man was it a mess downtown yesterday.  Notably worse than Lakewood streets, and Lakewood has been hit hard all month. 

 

Unfortunately it happened during the largest convention yet in our new facility, plus HS basketball playoffs, kind of an important weekend to get it right.  Downtown is not a very big area for "fleet of plow trucks" purposes.  It needs to be plowed for major conventions.  That is not optional, and it didn't get done.

Live stream of Jackson's address regarding history of police reforms under his admin.  Dictation of his speech is in the comment section.

 

Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson to address reduction in police use of force cases (LIVE coverage)

http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2015/02/cleveland_mayor_frank_jackson_47.html#incart_river

^Sometimes a lack of residents can actually increase the need for manpower.  Empty houses, buildings, and factories create work more than they eliminate work.  Nevertheless, the City has seen downsizing, sometimes quite significant.  Jackson has maintained a balanced budget, despite the massive cuts to state aid.

 

But, regardless, when exactly was it when our government was working for residents?

 

Empty factories do not create more work for basic services like snow clearing, for which someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties and not following procedure.

 

I'm not so sure that someone was sacked last week for under performance of duties. If my memory serves me right, there was a news story that the person you say was sacked actually held two positions, and Mayor Jackson took one of the positions away from him, but he kept all of the salary that he was making. Good old politics.

 

Can anyone on this forum help us out here with what really happened?

 

Not sure but it seems like Darnell Brown is at the center of any Cleveland administration screwup.  Not sure how this guy has hung on so long but he keeps getting passed from agency to agency... mayor's office to water dept to NEORSD...

 

It could be that his wife is supposed to be hyper-competent, or that he knows some secrets.  Or a combination thereof.

I can't say I'm totally surprised, but I didn't think it'd be that many...

 

 

Election officials reject 98 percent of signatures on petitions to recall Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson

 

By Andrew J. Tobias, Northeast Ohio Media Group

Email the author | Follow on Twitter

on June 24, 2015 at 4:15 PM, updated June 24, 2015 at 4:25 PM

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- An already long-shot effort to recall Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson was dealt a major blow on Wednesday after elections officials rejected more than 98 percent of the 12,887 signatures submitted by the group.

 

Elections officials certified as valid only 260 signatures submitted by recall organizers on Saturday, the County Board of Elections said in a news release. The group needed 12,025 valid signatures from city residents who voted in the November 2013 election to force a recall election.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2015/06/election_officials_reject_98_p.html

I can't say I'm totally surprised, but I didn't think it'd be that many...

 

 

Election officials reject 98 percent of signatures on petitions to recall Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson

 

By Andrew J. Tobias, Northeast Ohio Media Group

Email the author | Follow on Twitter

on June 24, 2015 at 4:15 PM, updated June 24, 2015 at 4:25 PM

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- An already long-shot effort to recall Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson was dealt a major blow on Wednesday after elections officials rejected more than 98 percent of the 12,887 signatures submitted by the group.

 

Elections officials certified as valid only 260 signatures submitted by recall organizers on Saturday, the County Board of Elections said in a news release. The group needed 12,025 valid signatures from city residents who voted in the November 2013 election to force a recall election.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2015/06/election_officials_reject_98_p.html

 

This whole effort has been doomed from the start.  Nothing's really changed since the man won 67% of the vote. 

 

I'm not a big fan of his, to say the least.  But who's supposed to be better, that could win?

Oops...

 

Mayor Jackson’s grandson is among those riding dirt bikes illegally on city streets. TON @ 11! http://t.co/OG4SNmnw76 http://t.co/4nzBhHlnEV

Jeff Johnson going after hizzonor

 

Jeff Johnson ‏@Votejeffjohnson  1m1 minute ago

Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson leaves council meeting during introduction of 10-year-old gunshot victim (Video) http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2015/10/cleveland_mayor_frank_jackson_56.html …

The stakes are high as Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson contemplates a fourth term

 

By Brent Larkin, Northeast Ohio Media Group

on January 03, 2016 at 8:36 AM, updated January 03, 2016 at 6:43 PM

 

Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson isn't one to chase history for the simple sake of etching his name in some record book.

 

But now, at the 10-year mark of his tenure as Cleveland's mayor, and the halfway mark of his third term, Jackson is contemplating a fourth.

 

On the last day of 2017, Jackson will tie Michael R. White as Cleveland's longest-serving mayor. Another four years would take Jackson well beyond where any Cleveland mayor has gone before.

 

http://www.cleveland.com/opinion/index.ssf/2016/01/the_stakes_as_cleveland_mayor.html

 

 

^careful what you wish for

^Agreed. Though Jackson isn't the most outgoing mayor, he was pretty much the best person this town could have elected during the Recession.  If someone like Reed were to get elected... watch out.  And don't think it couldn't happen just because he has three drunk driving convictions.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Ronayne gives it another go.  I believe his contract with UCI is up this year, which would be perfect timing. 

It's obvious that we could do worse than Jackson, but it's imperative that we do better.

Don't get me wrong, I do like Jackson overall, and I think he has done some good things, but it's time to move on. There needs to be a change of culture at city hall and we need someone who can help set a forward thinking vision. It wouldn't hurt to have a more inspiring orator too. The problem is that if he decides to run again, then some good candidates, like Ronayne, would not throw their hat into the ring.

Don't get me wrong, I do like Jackson overall, and I think he has done some good things, but it's time to move on. There needs to be a change of culture at city hall and we need someone who can help set a forward thinking vision. It wouldn't hurt to have a more inspiring orator too. The problem is that if he decides to run again, then some good candidates, like Ronayne, would not throw their hat into the ring.

 

Exactly.  It has been time for that change for some time now.

 

The concern is certainly whether or not a competent person is out there and would run (not that I would consider Jackson a competent mayor, but at this point he has learned how to go through the motions somewhat).  So the city certainly could end up in worse shape. 

 

There really needs to be a concerted effort to find a succesor at this very pivotal time, and yes the most capable one that I see and would be thrilled about is Ronayne, as my other choice, Andrew Samtoy has sadly decided to move to London to chase a girl (a huge loss to Cleveland btw..). 

 

It doesnt have to be too late, but I fear a 4th term with Jackson will really put the city even further behind every other city that has recovered beyond Cleveland.     

If Jackson decides not to run for this upcoming term and if you had to put odds on it - what are the chances we end up with a "better" candidate running and winning versus getting a "worse" mayor?

 

That's a hard question to quantify but I put it at 30/70%.

No way to know that without seeing any names, so one's answer at this stage would probably depend on one's assessment of Jackson.

No way to know that without seeing any names, so one's answer at this stage would probably depend on one's assessment of Jackson.

 

I would consider it one's current assessment of Jackson versus the universe of likely mayoral candidates.

I don't want a 4th term for Jackson, but I also don't want any current members of city council to become mayor. We really need someone from outside of City Hall as our next mayor.

Don't get me wrong, I do like Jackson overall, and I think he has done some good things, but it's time to move on. There needs to be a change of culture at city hall and we need someone who can help set a forward thinking vision. It wouldn't hurt to have a more inspiring orator too.

 

Jackson is the prototype "low energy candidate" haha. He's done okay, I like Jackson. I really like Chris Ronayne a lot but he was born with a pigmental disadvantage that unfortunately makes a successful run pretty unlikely.

No way to know that without seeing any names, so one's answer at this stage would probably depend on one's assessment of Jackson.

 

I would consider it one's current assessment of Jackson versus the universe of likely mayoral candidates.

 

This cannot be the best we can do.  I have to believe there is a better leader somewhere in this city.

No way to know that without seeing any names, so one's answer at this stage would probably depend on one's assessment of Jackson.

 

I would consider it one's current assessment of Jackson versus the universe of likely mayoral candidates.

 

This cannot be the best we can do.  I have to believe there is a better leader somewhere in this city.

 

Yes, there are probably many great and better leaders somewhere in this City.  But are they going to successfully run for mayor and are their leadership qualities going to translate to a successful and competent administration?  Maybe, but probably not (imo).

So good leaders can't become mayor here, or can't function in this system at all?  I'm not saying you're wrong.  But if that's true, it's a mighty big problem and we should probably deal with it post haste.

So good leaders can't become mayor here, or can't function in this system at all?  I'm not saying you're wrong.  But if that's true, it's a mighty big problem and we should probably deal with it post haste.

 

Of course they can.  But democratic politics is a game of odds.  I think the scenario you are hoping for is possible, but very unlikely.

I suspect Jeff Johnson runs at some point.  He's developed a tendency to pander, but I think he surprises a lot of people and does a good job.  Especially if his old mentor is there to advise from Newcomerstown.

I suspect Jeff Johnson runs at some point.  He's developed a tendency to pander, but I think he surprises a lot of people and does a good job.  Especially if his old mentor is there to advise from Newcomerstown.

 

I can already see the national media headlines, "Cleveland elects convicted felon as mayor."

Cleveland mayor proposes increasing income tax to 2.5 percent

By Leila Atassi, cleveland.com

on February 01, 2016 at 3:30 PM, updated February 01, 2016 at 4:12 PM

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson wants city voters to increase the municipal income tax from 2 percent to 2.5 percent -- a move that, he says, would plug a multi-million shortfall in the city's budget next year, dramatically improve services to the public and help fund the implementation of a federal consent decree on police use of force.

 

During an interview Monday with cleveland.com reporters and editors, Jackson said that after this year, the city – ravaged by deep cuts to the state's local government fund and the loss of other revenue streams -- no longer will be able to sustain its current level of service. If voters do not approve the tax hike, Jackson said, it would mean mass layoffs of city workers and a devastating decline in the quality of life in Cleveland.

 

In short, more potholes, more blight, unplowed snow and slower police response.

 

MORE:

http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2016/02/cleveland_mayor_frank_jackson_58.html#incart_m-rpt-1

Cleveland mayor proposes increasing income tax to 2.5 percent

By Leila Atassi, cleveland.com

on February 01, 2016 at 3:30 PM, updated February 01, 2016 at 4:12 PM

 

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson wants city voters to increase the municipal income tax from 2 percent to 2.5 percent -- a move that, he says, would plug a multi-million shortfall in the city's budget next year, dramatically improve services to the public and help fund the implementation of a federal consent decree on police use of force.

 

During an interview Monday with cleveland.com reporters and editors, Jackson said that after this year, the city – ravaged by deep cuts to the state's local government fund and the loss of other revenue streams -- no longer will be able to sustain its current level of service. If voters do not approve the tax hike, Jackson said, it would mean mass layoffs of city workers and a devastating decline in the quality of life in Cleveland.

 

In short, more potholes, more blight, unplowed snow and slower police response.

 

MORE:

http://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/index.ssf/2016/02/cleveland_mayor_frank_jackson_58.html#incart_m-rpt-1

 

I don't possibly see how the city can't afford to maintain it's "current level of service."  It's already abysmal. 

 

Is there anywhere to get city of Cleveland employment stats?  I wonder just how many people are on payroll currently.

Kasich is able to claim a huge budget surplus at the state level--but its because of gigantic cuts to cities. Doesn't look like any city mayor wants to take the governor on. Failing that, a 2.5% income tax isn't unreasonable.

Kasich is able to claim a huge budget surplus at the state level--but its because of gigantic cuts to cities. Doesn't look like any city mayor wants to take the governor on. Failing that, a 2.5% income tax isn't unreasonable.

 

I wouldn't mind it if my street was plowed.  If my garbage men didn't leave trash everywhere.  If city owned property was actually mowed more than twice a summer. 

 

I have friends that work for the city of Cleveland and they say you wouldn't believe the amount of freeloading that goes on.    Sure there were budget cuts by Kasich, but how many City of Cleveland employees were cut?

My coworker went to go get a building permit last Friday, and the gentleman behind the desk was watching YouTube videos and completely ignoring the line at the counter. Once he realized, he went and got the paperwork from the first customer, went back to his desk, set it down, and continued to watch YouTube videos until it was over. This is the kinda crap that happens day in and out down there, and it's hard to back an income tax increase when you know this is happening. Why hire more incompetent people? How about get some quality people to begin with. Or hold individuals accountable.

 

Rant off.

I read this today and all I could think of was Roldo and his rants about Sports Team Welfare.

 

Combine this with all the tax credits and the cuts from CBUS, well here we are again.

 

I'd like to see Frank talk about how running the police department better could actually SAVE us money.

My coworker went to go get a building permit last Friday, and the gentleman behind the desk was watching YouTube videos and completely ignoring the line at the counter. Once he realized, he went and got the paperwork from the first customer, went back to his desk, set it down, and continued to watch YouTube videos until it was over. This is the kinda crap that happens day in and out down there, and it's hard to back an income tax increase when you know this is happening. Why hire more incompetent people? How about get some quality people to begin with. Or hold individuals accountable.

 

Rant off.

 

Building department is the worst.  They openly laugh in your face if you ask for an update on a plan review/building permit.  I have coworkers and clients ask all the time why Cleveland is like this.  Other cities do not operate like this.  Needs a total culture change.

Sounds like a bunch of god*amned Republicans in here.  Did the RNC start early?  :evil:

My coworker went to go get a building permit last Friday, and the gentleman behind the desk was watching YouTube videos and completely ignoring the line at the counter. Once he realized, he went and got the paperwork from the first customer, went back to his desk, set it down, and continued to watch YouTube videos until it was over. This is the kinda crap that happens day in and out down there, and it's hard to back an income tax increase when you know this is happening. Why hire more incompetent people? How about get some quality people to begin with. Or hold individuals accountable.

 

Rant off.

 

Building department is the worst.  They openly laugh in your face if you ask for an update on a plan review/building permit.  I have coworkers and clients ask all the time why Cleveland is like this.  Other cities do not operate like this.  Needs a total culture change.

 

Couldn't agree more. The few times I've been on the 5th floor It's been a total mess. Might as well plan on wasting half your day up there for pretty much anything. I'd really like to see a culture change. It's the only way to fix it.

Sure there were budget cuts by Kasich, but how many City of Cleveland employees were cut?

 

I was curious so looked it up:

 

City headcount immediately before the recession was about 5,300 (see page 22 of http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/sites/default/files/forms_publications/2009budget.pdf?id=2878)

 

As of 2013, the last audited year reported in posted budget docs, headcount was down by 15%, to about 4,500 (see page 70 of http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/sites/default/files/forms_publications/2015Budget.pdf)

 

Looks like Jackson's proposed budget would bring it back up to about 4,800, with most of the increase since FY 2013 in public safety and municipal courts (based on the reporting here: http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2016/02/how_cleveland_spends_its_money.html#incart_story_package).

Sounds like a bunch of god*amned Republicans in here.  Did the RNC start early?  :evil:

 

I'm definitely not a Republican.  I don't mind paying a garbage man $75,000 a year, or a pot-hole filler $60,000.  But I do want them to show up to work and do what is expected of them, maybe even with a little pride.  Its really not too much to ask for.

But seriously, why are there so many counsel persons?

^why the constant obsession with council? There are only 17 members. For a city as big and diverse as ours, I think we should have MORE council districts, because a good council person can actually get things done for residents. Currently They make up 0.3% of all city workers and they, in general, work a lot harder than your typical city worker and are not paid that much more on average.

Comparisons between Cleveland and peer cities have shown that this council is not the norm. They have more members, make more and spend more than similar city councils (Columbus, Cinci, Pittsburgh, Detroit).

^So if the productivity output by a council member is 5.3 times that of a typical city worker, we should ignore that metric and do what Pittsburgh does? That makes no sense. If you want to cut 15 city employees (so we have 2 council people), you could probably cut such dead weight in any department or just wait for 15 to people to retire, rather than get rid of folks who actually do stuff for the city. Further, I wouldn't classify Pittsburgh or Columbus Ohio as peers of Cleveland.  Think small=Be small.

My coworker went to go get a building permit last Friday, and the gentleman behind the desk was watching YouTube videos and completely ignoring the line at the counter. Once he realized, he went and got the paperwork from the first customer, went back to his desk, set it down, and continued to watch YouTube videos until it was over. This is the kinda crap that happens day in and out down there, and it's hard to back an income tax increase when you know this is happening. Why hire more incompetent people? How about get some quality people to begin with. Or hold individuals accountable.

 

Rant off.

 

People should take videos of stuff like this.  It will go viral and embarrass the city.  That may be the only way.

^why the constant obsession with council? There are only 17 members. For a city as big and diverse as ours, I think we should have MORE council districts, because a good council person can actually get things done for residents. Currently They make up 0.3% of all city workers and they, in general, work a lot harder than your typical city worker and are not paid that much more on average.

 

Washington DC has about 650,000 people now and has 8 council members. It somehow still manages to represent everyone in the city.

 

Never understood why Cleveland still needs 17 members for a city of 395,000. I'm assuming the large council was a product of when Cleveland used to have 900k+ people.

My coworker went to go get a building permit last Friday, and the gentleman behind the desk was watching YouTube videos and completely ignoring the line at the counter. Once he realized, he went and got the paperwork from the first customer, went back to his desk, set it down, and continued to watch YouTube videos until it was over. This is the kinda crap that happens day in and out down there, and it's hard to back an income tax increase when you know this is happening. Why hire more incompetent people? How about get some quality people to begin with. Or hold individuals accountable.

 

Rant off.

 

People should take videos of stuff like this.  It will go viral and embarrass the city.  That may be the only way.

 

You can also drop an email to one of our many investigative television reporters in town.