February 2, 201114 yr I thought you hated Needless Markups? I don't hate them, I just don't shop there because there isn't one near me, and all but one of my people are at Barney's or individual boutiques. Hell if FCE got Barney's to come back I would be ecstatic! Barney's never wanted to leave. There is an untapped market for us fashionistas here in Cleveland. That Mall was packed back in the day. Today there is a larger residential base in downtown and more residents with higher earning potential in adjacent neighborhood. That mall improving will vastly improve the quality of life downtown and the reputation of Cleveland and bring in more residents. Not to mention there are other ancillary businesses, mainly restaurants and hotels, that will benefit from increased [high dollar] shoppers. Someone may come down to shop, but stay to have lunch while downtown. Someone who comes down for a meal, may do some shopping. Hotels can create shopping packages, as they did when the mall first opened and this will increase the shopping tours that used to frequent the mall. The window shoppers alone, will be a boon to advertisers and promoters. This should be a win-win situation for FCE/The Avenue, Retailers and Customers/Consumers. FCE get to revamp a mediocre mall with outstanding bones and enormous potential. Retailers get to bring their brands to the heart of the region. Customers/Consumers have easier access to a broad mix of retail options. This must be done right!
February 2, 201114 yr Sorry for asking! :-D "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 2, 201114 yr Sorry for asking! ;D it's ok. I just want things to be done right, so we can be proud of our city and compete internationally. Making sure this and other projects, currently under construction are done property, is so important for our cities success on many levels. Not to mention our REGIONS psyche.
February 2, 201114 yr I walked through tower city today because I don't think I have been in there for about half a year and that time I was only coming from the RTA and walked straight outside. It is a really nice mall with a lot of potential but as we all know the retail options are lacking. I think FCE should have some kind of advertising campaign to get the word out that Tower city is back. I may be getting ahead of myself because none of this has happened yet but if the first stage of the casino goes into the higbee space soon Tower city can start to turn around sooner rather than later.
February 2, 201114 yr I walked through tower city today because I don't think I have been in there for about half a year and that time I was only coming from the RTA and walked straight outside. It is a really nice mall with a lot of potential but as we all know the retail options are lacking. I think FCE should have some kind of advertising campaign to get the word out that Tower city is back. I may be getting ahead of myself because none of this has happened yet but if the first stage of the casino goes into the higbee space soon Tower city can start to turn around sooner rather than later. That would be a lie, since the mall, currently, is not back. There are no plans for redevelopment as we speak. [PERHAPS THIS DISCUSSION SHOUDL BE MOVED TO THE AVENUE/TC THREAD?]
February 2, 201114 yr You all seem to be assuming that FCE is going to reinvest that money in Cleveland developments? Is there something to the agreement I am not aware of?
February 2, 201114 yr You all seem to be assuming that FCE is going to reinvest that money in Cleveland developments? Is there something to the agreement I am not aware of? I said there were no plans. this is all wishful thinking.
February 2, 201114 yr You all seem to be assuming that FCE is going to reinvest that money in Cleveland developments? Is there something to the agreement I am not aware of? Wouldn't that have been interesting... I don't know if there are any legal ways to insert language in a Contract to say "We pay $85M for this land, stipulating it is spent to the specifications and wishes of the UO forum on The Avenue" But that would be fun :wink2:
February 2, 201114 yr You all seem to be assuming that FCE is going to reinvest that money in Cleveland developments? Is there something to the agreement I am not aware of? [/quote You all seem to be assuming that FCE is going to reinvest that money in Cleveland developments? Is there something to the agreement I am not aware of? Isn't there another chunk of strategic land that FCE could buy and set on for 20-30 years? Maybe some really cool surface parking or new homes for some sand piles?
February 2, 201114 yr I personally don't blame FCE on this one. The location makes a heck of a lot more sense for a casino than it did for a convention center! While not a fan of casinos, I do wish the best for Dan Gilberts enterprise and hope it helps more development downtown. Sadly I cannot envision the casino as Tower City's savior though--they are by nature designed to keep their customers inside the casino and not in the mall next door.
February 2, 201114 yr The malls attached to Vegas casinos do well enough, although admittedly that's a different situation. I'm just hoping the casino's brief stay in the Higbee building makes it more attractive to a (near) future department store tenant.
February 2, 201114 yr I'm not sure the casino stay in the higbee building will be brief or temporary, it may well be "phase 1", but I agree that would be the ideal situation...
February 2, 201114 yr ^Tend to agree with that...in fact I could envision a scenario where, once the main casino on Huron is built, the "Higbee wing" is marketed as an upscale casino club for those who want to gamble but don't want to mingle with the little old ladies in tennis shoes and those hunting out the all you can eat $4.99 buffet.
February 2, 201114 yr I personally don't blame FCE on this one. The location makes a heck of a lot more sense for a casino than it did for a convention center! While not a fan of casinos, I do wish the best for Dan Gilberts enterprise and hope it helps more development downtown. Sadly I cannot envision the casino as Tower City's savior though--they are by nature designed to keep their customers inside the casino and not in the mall next door. Have you read anything about our Casino, the idea is to design the casino to become an intergrated part of the street scape/urban fabric, not suck life off the street.
February 2, 201114 yr I personally don't blame FCE on this one. The location makes a heck of a lot more sense for a casino than it did for a convention center! While not a fan of casinos, I do wish the best for Dan Gilberts enterprise and hope it helps more development downtown. Sadly I cannot envision the casino as Tower City's savior though--they are by nature designed to keep their customers inside the casino and not in the mall next door. Have you read anything about our Casino, the idea is to design the casino to become an intergrated part of the street scape/urban fabric, not suck life off the street. Yeah I remember reading that about the MGM and Motor City in Detroit as well. Have you been?
February 2, 201114 yr Author I'm sure it was still worth it for Gilbert to give FCE $85 million so that he could revive the mall they don't see fit to invest in themselves. I think it's kind of a slap to say Forest City isn't investing in their "mall". The 1990's saw downtown shopping malls close as massive malls were built and expanded upon in the suburbs, along with "lifestyle centers". When Tower City first opened, it had stores that didn't exist in the suburbs. Then those stores opened outside the city and there wasn't a compelling reason to shop downtown. That happened nationwide, not just in Cleveland. Many cities our size had malls like Tower City that completely shut down. But Forest City has managed to keep Tower City almost 100% leased. Sure, they might not have the greatest stores in the world, but what are they supposed to do? It's not a cash cow for them. They can't just give away space at pennies per square foot to get GAP or whatever in there... But to bring this back on topic (although Tower City and the casino are kind of intertwined now)... I'm glad I consistently hear about the benefits of an urban environment and connectivity from Rock Ventures: "But we thought it was the best site in the city to create the kind of environment that we've been talking about -- this very interactive, very well connected facility in the heart of the downtown," Cullen added. Cullen said that it's easier to develop a casino outside the city where you don't have as many problems dealing with existing infrastructure, tying into long established traffic patters, and creating parking for 8 million annual visitors. "We believe that if you create 2,000 casino jobs out in a corn field, then you've got 2,000 casino jobs," Cullen said. "If you create them in the heart of a downtown, then you can become much more of a district that allows growth and jobs for all the surrounding facilities.
February 2, 201114 yr Author Have you read anything about our Casino, the idea is to design the casino to become an intergrated part of the street scape/urban fabric, not suck life off the street. Yeah I remember reading that about the MGM and Motor City in Detroit as well. Have you been? Yes, and Dan Gilbert's been there, too. Those casinos, while downtown, are isolated from activity, especially when you considering walking - I know because I walked from Roast to the new MGM. Plus, the design of the MGM is definitely NOT to interact with the street. It's a massive hulk of a building with one entrance. Not pedestrian friendly at all. The preliminary designs for the Cleveland casino are completely opposite of that: street level access to restaurants and shops as well as connectivity to other venues such as Quicken Loans Arena and Tower City. Then if you're at Tower City, it's easy to get to the Flats/Warehouse District. If you're at Quicken Loans Arena, it's easy to get to East 4th. Some people seem to think Gilbert's talk about connecting the casino to its surroundings sounds to good to be true. But keep in mind that a more open casino will also have a better chance of bringing in non-gamblers to shows, restaurants or just to check the place out. So I think the design is going to help Gilbert as much as it's going to help the city. I know some people like to be leery of big business, but I think Dan Gilbert has a good plan. He's already a millionaire and yes this casino will make him richer, but I think he sees an opportunity here to really make a difference.
February 2, 201114 yr I know similar information has been posted but its nice to see it in things like AOL Travel - it has 4 sites for travel ideas and interests and this was one of them <A Href="http://news.travel.aol.com/2011/02/02/land-for-cleveland-casino-site-sold-for-85m/">Land for Cleveland Casino Site Sold for $85M</A> The site that will someday become a casino in downtown Cleveland was sold to developers for a whopping $85 million. News just broke that the owner of Cleveland's landmark skyscraper, the Terminal Tower, sold the 16-acre site which overlooks the Cuyahoga River. By 2013, developers hope to open a $600 million casino just behind the Tower City Center shopping complex, which connects to the Terminal Tower and acts as the main hub for three of Cleveland's rapid transit lines
February 2, 201114 yr If the Higbee building is kept as part of the casino that will add good connectivity to East 4th and Euclid Avenue
February 2, 201114 yr ^From the above AOL article: "On Thursday, developers plan to announce exactly what part the historic cluster of buildings will play in their plans for the downtown casino." Is there a planned announcement. Does anyone know anymore about this?
February 2, 201114 yr ^From the above AOL article: "On Thursday, developers plan to announce exactly what part the historic cluster of buildings will play in their plans for the downtown casino." Is there a planned announcement. Does anyone know anymore about this? That is an aggregate/regurgitated article. I would not use it as a confirmed source of information.
February 2, 201114 yr I wonder how much redevelopment of Scranton peninsula would finance huh? That was supposed to say I wonder how much redevlopment of Scranton peninsula $85MM would finance. It was just speculation, just wondering if you could actually finance the whole area for that money. Again, I have no news, rumors or anything
February 2, 201114 yr I wonder how much redevelopment of Scranton peninsula would finance huh? That was supposed to say I wonder how much redevlopment of Scranton peninsula $85MM would finance. It was just speculation, just wondering if you could actually finance the whole area for that money. Again, I have no news, rumors or anything See, this is a prime example why I am going to sacrifice you. :angel: >:D
February 2, 201114 yr More on a Thursday presser. Dan Gilbert's gaming company and Caesars purchase property for Cleveland casino Published: Tuesday, February 01, 2011, 6:44 PM Updated: Wednesday, February 02, 2011, 8:41 AM By Dave Davis, The Plain Dealer And Thursday, developer Rock Ohio Caesars will announce what part the historic Higbee building will play in their plans for the downtown casino. According to invitations sent to local leaders, the developer will host a "celebratory lunch" at Bridges Restaurant inside Gilbert's Quicken Loans Arena following Thursday's 11 a.m. press conference in the Higbee building. Full Article >>>>>>> http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2011/02/post_421.html>
February 2, 201114 yr So this seems to be more an announcement regarding the temporary casino in the Higbee Building rather than any release of plans for the Huron Rd. development.
February 2, 201114 yr ^The above article makes it sound as if using the Higbee building as the first phase of the casino has not been determined. My source told me that was a done deal months ago and in fact informed me the management team for the Higbee phase was being assembled back then. The team should be arriving in April. The more interesting info passed on, IMO, was that early projections have the Cleveland casino becoming Caesars Entertainment's second biggest money maker in their entire portfolio of properties.
February 3, 201114 yr Big announcement planned about Cleveland casino Rock Gaming CEO Dan Gilbert and Caesar’s Entertainment CEO Gary Loveman will be joined by local and state leaders at 11 a.m. to share “exciting new information” according to a release. The news conference will take place inside the Higbee Building, where Gilbert has said Phase 1 of the casino could open sometime later this year if they found the project was feasible. In the past, Gilbert has said that part of gaming hall could be open by the end of 2011. http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/local_news/cleveland_metro/big-announcement-planned-about-cleveland-casino
February 3, 201114 yr It would be nice if they were able to find a way to incorporate the Higbee name. Like if they had a high stakes area in there they could call it something like "Higbees High Stakes Room", and on the expensive slot machines call it "Millionaires Row"
February 3, 201114 yr Caesars and Dan Gilbert's gaming company to open first phase of Cleveland casino in Higbee building http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2011/02/caesars_and_dan_gilberts_gamin.html CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Developers of Cleveland's downtown casino say they will open a first phase of the operation in the historic Higbee building within a year, possibly less. At a news conference at 11 a.m. today, Cavaliers majority owner Dan Gilbert and Caesars Entertainment Corp. Chief Executive Officer Gary Loveman are expected to announce that the casino will carry the Caesar's Horseshoe brand, with a bit of a twist. They'll pass up the Old West image familiar to gamblers at the five existing Horseshoe casinos in favor of a more contemporary look. They expect that the Higbee casino will draw roughly 5 million visitors a year and employ between 1,500 and 1,600 people. Hundreds more construction jobs will be created, the developers say. "The majority of people hired for the casino, 90 to 95 percent of them, will be from the Cleveland area," said Marcus Glover, who will be introduced today as the first general manager for the Cleveland Horseshoe Casino.
February 3, 201114 yr WOW, that's a ton of info before the press conference! Glad to see it's still on schedule. "There will be two ways to enter the casino -- the building's existing entrances off Public Square and Prospect Road." How about that for potential spin-off, especially along Prospect and E.4th.
February 3, 201114 yr The Horseshoe brand? UGH! That is their middle tier brand. ::) ::) ::) I hope since they're going to ditch the horseshoe they are reevaluating the brand all together. I assumed this would be a Harrah's or Ceasar's property.
February 3, 201114 yr The comments on Cleveland.com always get me. Most of the time I don't read them, but today I got sucked in. The constant complaining and whining about the dumbest stuff.
February 3, 201114 yr Well, my sudden fears of a cheesy Sizzler-esque Wild West Theme have been quelled. Now, I'm hoping the press conference can allay my fears of a tired and cheesy Julius Caesar/Roman theme. Please please please no tacky Roman columns inside or outside the place. If the inside of Higbees looks anything like the Coliseum, set of Caligula or the Roman Senate I'm going to be pissed.
February 3, 201114 yr There are Roman columns all over downtown. If I had to pick a standard casino theme for this, Roman columns is probably it. Western? Not so much.
February 3, 201114 yr There are Roman columns all over downtown. If I had to pick a standard casino theme for this, Roman columns is probably it. Western? Not so much. Roman columns that echo when you knock on them are never ever acceptable. 327 if you've been to Caesars in Atlantic City you'll see just how awfully tacky that theme is.
February 3, 201114 yr With that level of investment ("hundreds of millions of dollars"), it seems the Higbee building is a lock to become part of the permanent plans, no?
February 3, 201114 yr Im in NOLA, and I was hoping it would be a Harrah's, it fits in nicely with the city, it does not dominate, but it is first class. Horseshoe? That is just a dumb name to begin with. I hope this does not wind up like a innerbelt project, starting off like a visionary way to do something spectacular, then wind up being sub-mediocre by the time it's finished with one let down after another. MTS!!! Lead us to the path of complaint that lets Mr. Gilbert know that second rate is not good enough for Cleveland. We want it to be a Harrah's!
February 3, 201114 yr With that level of investment ("hundreds of millions of dollars"), it seems the Higbee building is a lock to become part of the permanent plans, no? A Higbee's Phase 1 casino would not only be open during, but after construction of the $600 million permanent casino, which will open in 2013 across from Tower City Center. http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/local_news/cleveland_metro/big-announcement-planned-about-cleveland-casino
February 3, 201114 yr Will that brand translate to the Huron Road facility as well, or will that be separate?
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