Lonely Planet - Cities You Really Hate

 

A couple of weeks ago, we published a list of your ‘least favourite’ destinations.

 

Reaction was swift and fierce. There was some agreement and a whole lot of disagreement. A number of you took issue with the criterion for selection (highly visited site destinations that you were unlikely to save as a favourite). And several of you suggested more worthy cities for inclusion.

 

So we are proud to present to you a revised list of cities that you actually hate, based on your feedback. What do you think - did we get it right this time?

 

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/ghana/travel-tips-and-articles/42/9782?affil=lpemailcontent

I wonder... Will the PD file a complaint about their omission of Cleveland?

Québec City?! Get the f$&k outta here...it's one of North America's most beautiful cities.

 

Anyway, Charlotte probably tops my list or anything in Georgia that's not Savannah or Athens. Actually, just throw the whole south in there save for Savannah, Athens, Charleston, New Orleans, Miami, and a couple little beach towns. I really hate sprawl, and some of the worst sprawl in America is in the southern reaches (not to say things are all that great in the north, just we have a lot more pre-WW2 urban stock to work with).

 

Culturally, the South embraces sprawl.That makes it very difficult to discuss city planning in a logical fashion.

Singapore--the ruling Lee family owns the judiciary.  They fined newspapers, including the Wall Street Journal Asia Edition, for writing critical material.  They took the entire $450,000 treasury of the opposition Singapore Democratic Party away with a "fine" in the kangaroo court.  Public protest is illegal.  A pound of pot will get you hanged.  Seriously.

another dumb ass list.  why was this posted?

 

Quebec City and Honolulu are on this list?  Please!  ::) ::)

I hate Honolulu.  Who would want to be in a city where it is 80 degrees every day with beautiful scenery.

Honolulu = Miami

Honolulu = Miami

 

Complete and utter BS!! 

Québec City?! Get the f$&k outta here...it's one of North America's most beautiful cities.

 

Anyway, Charlotte probably tops my list or anything in Georgia that's not Savannah or Athens. Actually, just throw the whole south in there save for Savannah, Athens, Charleston, New Orleans, Miami, and a couple little beach towns. I really hate sprawl, and some of the worst sprawl in America is in the southern reaches (not to say things are all that great in the north, just we have a lot more pre-WW2 urban stock to work with).

Personnally I hate Savannah. Other than the historic district, which isn't that large, the city is just a hot mess. I'm not a fan of the south at all, I don't think there's a chance I would ever choose to live there again. 

Québec City?! Get the f$&k outta here...it's one of North America's most beautiful cities.

 

Anyway, Charlotte probably tops my list or anything in Georgia that's not Savannah or Athens. Actually, just throw the whole south in there save for Savannah, Athens, Charleston, New Orleans, Miami, and a couple little beach towns. I really hate sprawl, and some of the worst sprawl in America is in the southern reaches (not to say things are all that great in the north, just we have a lot more pre-WW2 urban stock to work with).

 

Totally agreed!

I hate Honolulu. Who would want to be in a city where it is 80 degrees every day with beautiful scenery.

 

Yes, but the city is virtually void of any charming architecture. 80-  degrees every day actually does get old for some people. It has great entertainment, etc...but All the little cozy hotels that beacon back to the days when the place had a real island feel are gone; replaced by the imposing hotel towers. Don't get me wrong, I like it for what it is... Kauai is great, on the other hand...still kind of like 'old Hawaii'

I wonder... Will the PD file a complaint about their omission of Cleveland?

 

HA!!! Yeah, I wonder!

Honolulu = Miami

 

Complete and utter BS!!

 

Really?  Seriously, if I want to experience the uniqueness of Hawaii I am not going to Honolulu.  If it is nightlife...in that sense I can experience the same if not better in Miami.  Give me Kona or Lahaina before Honolulu.

I lived in Honolulu for 6 years.  While I would say that it doesn't belong in any hated city lists, it's definitely overrated by most who have never been there.  Major drawbacks are crime; had one car broken into (6 days after I moved there) and two others stolen and stripped, and racism; many, if not most natives have a genuine distaste haole's.

Geologically speaking... I like Kauai the best as it is the oldest island (above water) and most ornately sculpted by nature. The Waimea Canyon...  and the little towns that dot the perimeter of the island...  The Na Poli coast... etc..  I could live there with no problem.... But some development is beginning to spoil some places on it.

Singapore--the ruling Lee family owns the judiciary.  They fined newspapers, including the Wall Street Journal Asia Edition, for writing critical material.  They took the entire $450,000 treasury of the opposition Singapore Democratic Party away with a "fine" in the kangaroo court.  Public protest is illegal.  A pound of pot will get you hanged.  Seriously.

 

Yeah, but the city is one of the cleanest and most progressive in many other ways. Maybe we can learn from that. I loved it there. Instead, too often is the attitude here (USA) that we chose to sit on our laurels and never move on to the next step.

^So the next step is totalitarianism?

Singapore is the model the Chinese aspire to.  It could be the model for the future of capitalism.

^ yeah you aint kidding -- meanwhile the capitalists on our side of the world aspire to be rio/brazil.

A pound of pot will get you hanged. Seriously.

 

Have you seen the movie Return to Paradise? I don't think they had anything close to a pound and they were still hanged.

^So the next step is totalitarianism?

 

Newsflash: Any economic system left unwatched or held accountable to behave with some social responsibility can become just as corrupt and dictatorial as any other form we in this country have been conditioned to think is "evil" or "inferior" And before we go pushing Capitalism on the rest of the world and beyond, we may want to prove that it works sustainably within our own borders first. I wonder how many who are so critical of other nations have actually lived among the people and not visited as just a tourist. Our flag may as well have the Golden Arches donning it flanked by Shell and Exxon. That is how a dictatorship takes form here and what is sad is that most cannot see it because they're too brainwashed to think that the big machine is their benefactor and only life source. It is really utterly sad. I cannot have this discussion with 95% of the people here though because they're too brainwashed. In Italy, Australia, or France I have no problem conveying the idea. (Cousins in Italy/Good friends in France/Oz) There are things we can learn that are valuable from many parts of the world, that we can implement here. Its all about weeding out the good and what can be fruitful and leaving the rest; picking the best apples from trees around the world, so to speak, and Singapore has some good models of a cleaner city I'd like to see here. Basically just enforcing rules...But here we are so used to having rules/laws go unenforced---because we used to rely on common sense for people to respect---that when we finally DO enforce something, people see it as some sort of encroachment on their freedoms, when in reality, they were never entitled in the first place.

^Any chance you could present that message without the sanctimonious/preachy tone?

EC reminds me of the old phrase, "Cleanliness before Constitutionality."

"^Any chance you could present that message without the sanctimonious/preachy tone?"

 

Thank you for pointing that out. It is tiring to have to wade through all of the condescension to get to the point, if, indeed, there is one.

 

^Any chance you could present that message without the sanctimonious/preachy tone?

 

Doubtful, it would seem that the point is the preaching.

Nashville at #3 without any mention of Detroit?  Toledo?  Dayton?  Erie? 

 

Jesus.

Nashville at #3 without any mention of Detroit? Toledo? Dayton? Erie?

 

Jesus.

 

Well, the algorithm (such as it is) is based on a comparison of how many tourists a place receives versus how few "favorite" votes marked on lonelyplanet.com.  So, a place that gets few, if any tourists (such as Gary) won't even rank a mention.

New York City--the people are unfriendly and not helpful.  How is it for a tourist destination?  Better museums are in Chicago, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, and Washington.  (An aircraft carrier for a museum?)  The Native American museum got moved to Washington.

 

If you shop for fashion, the city is prime, but I don't.  I buy mail order from Eddie Bauer. 

 

You can get tickets to David Letterman, ha ha ha

 

The air is brown and all that my kin from the Hamptons can talk about at reunions is how bad the traffic was yesterday, so they got in at 2:00 A.M. 

^  I don't even know were to begin with that post.  The air in NY is not all brown (air quality here in LA is worse);  I lived on E 3rd and 2nd Ave for 3.5 years and found the people to be very friendly; to say other cities have better museums is seriously undervaluing the amazing museums NYC does have, which are some of the best in the world.  If you think the only reason to visit NYC is for Letterman tickets, I would suggest getting out from behind your computer, halting the Eddie Bauer online buying frenzy, and actually visiting the place. :wink:  There is a reason it is the capitol of the world, even if I'm not thrilled with everyone being priced out to Brooklyn.

There is a reason it is the capitol of the world, even if I'm not thrilled with everyone being priced out to Brooklyn.

 

Or priced OUT of Brooklyn.

Don't you love lists like this?  People defending their favorite places, and slamming others. It is all so subjective.  There are places I hate, but that doesn't mean they are soulless or horrid...it means I had a lousy time there. Living somewhere is certainly different than visiting as a tourist! People who live in a tourist town tend to forget that.  Tourists don't want to have to "dig" for the fun, nightlife or the "in" spot...they want them all handy because they are not going to be there for weeks or months.

 

Most of the places I hate are because they made me feel unsafe or were terminally boring.

 

 

There is a reason it is the capitol of the world, even if I'm not thrilled with everyone being priced out to Brooklyn.

 

Or priced OUT of Brooklyn.

 

People are not priced out of Brooklyn or Manhattan.  It's that people don't want to move out of "hip" or "convenient" locations.  There are plenty of options.

^  I don't even know were to begin with that post.  The air in NY is not all brown (air quality here in LA is worse);  I lived on E 3rd and 2nd Ave for 3.5 years and found the people to be very friendly; to say other cities have better museums is seriously undervaluing the amazing museums NYC does have, which are some of the best in the world.  If you think the only reason to visit NYC is for Letterman tickets, I would suggest getting out from behind your computer, halting the Eddie Bauer online buying frenzy, and actually visiting the place. :wink:  There is a reason it is the capitol of the world, even if I'm not thrilled with everyone being priced out to Brooklyn.

That guy is a goof. :oops: That is so ignorant to just say that New Yorkers are not friendly. Maybe you are the one that isn't friendly or ever gets out. I have never had a problem there. My friend lived there for 5yrs and loved it. I stayed with him many times. The only reason he left was to go back to college again. He is moving back up soon. People are just drawn to NYC and to say other cities including Pittsburgh (my local city that I love) have better museums is degrading considering the city has some of the best in the world, but I am not going to just arbitrarily say who has the best. :roll:

I was pretty content hating Boston because of the Celtics, but I wasn't prepared to have to hate Toronto also. 

^  I don't even know were to begin with that post.  The air in NY is not all brown (air quality here in LA is worse);  I lived on E 3rd and 2nd Ave for 3.5 years and found the people to be very friendly; to say other cities have better museums is seriously undervaluing the amazing museums NYC does have, which are some of the best in the world.  If you think the only reason to visit NYC is for Letterman tickets, I would suggest getting out from behind your computer, halting the Eddie Bauer online buying frenzy, and actually visiting the place. ;)  There is a reason it is the capitol of the world, even if I'm not thrilled with everyone being priced out to Brooklyn.

That guy is a goof. :-[ That is so ignorant to just say that New Yorkers are not friendly. Maybe you are the one that isn't friendly or ever gets out. I have never had a problem there. My friend lived there for 5yrs and loved it. I stayed with him many times. The only reason he left was to go back to college again. He is moving back up soon. People are just drawn to NYC and to say other cities including Pittsburgh (my local city that I love) have better museums is degrading considering the city has some of the best in the world, but I am not going to just arbitrarily say who has the best. ::)

 

NYC has some of the best advertised and marketed museums, but not necessarily the best.  There is huge difference.

Somebody please list the worthy museums in NYC.  Seriously!  I would like to go.

I have found New Yorkers to be a lot like me - appearing aloof on the outside, but very friendly once you crack the exterior.  They keep to themselves and keep their heads down unless approached, but when engaged in conversation, I find most of them to be really nice.  I've had great conversations with locals in clubs, in line at restaurants, at small, off-off-off theaters, etc. Most are just very frank and up front type people, like I am.  I've always gotten along much better with New Yorkers than people from LA.  Everyone is really busy pretending to be perfect out there, it takes a lot of mental and physical energy.

I have found New Yorkers to be a lot like me - appearing aloof on the outside, but very friendly once you crack the exterior.  They keep to themselves and keep their heads down unless approached, but when engaged in conversation, I find most of them to be really nice.  I've had great conversations with locals in clubs, in line at restaurants, at small, off-off-off theaters, etc. Most are just very frank and up front type people, like I am.  I've always gotten along much better with New Yorkers than people from LA.  Everyone is really busy pretending to be perfect out there, it takes a lot of mental and physical energy.

 

LA folks are all "actors" in every sense of the word!  Even when they tell the truth, they're "acting". 

^I agree, depending where you are. Spending any length of time on Sunset or Beverly Hills makes me really uncomfortable and doubt that there is a single genuine person in LA.  Go out to Pasadena or Santa Monica and it's a totally different, more normal scene.  I think that is what makes LA kind of fun, though. For a couple hours you can be your alter ego, and be a pretentious ass hole scenester in Hollywood, and then go back to your shitty apartment and wear sweatpants and watch Family Guy.

^I agree, depending where you are. Spending any length of time on Sunset or Beverly Hills makes me really uncomfortable and doubt that there is a single genuine person in LA.  Go out to Pasadena or Santa Monica and it's a totally different, more normal scene.  I think that is what makes LA kind of fun, though. For a couple hours you can be your alter ego, and be a pretentious ass hole scenester in Hollywood, and then go back to your sh!tty apartment and wear sweatpants and watch Family Guy.

 

Santa Monica is just as bad!  Pasadena?  I have no reason to go over there!

 

Granted, I love BH!  That Needless Markup is fabulous.  Empty but fabulous.

I have found New Yorkers to be a lot like me - appearing aloof on the outside, but very friendly once you crack the exterior.  They keep to themselves and keep their heads down unless approached, but when engaged in conversation, I find most of them to be really nice.  I've had great conversations with locals in clubs, in line at restaurants, at small, off-off-off theaters, etc. Most are just very frank and up front type people, like I am.  I've always gotten along much better with New Yorkers than people from LA.  Everyone is really busy pretending to be perfect out there, it takes a lot of mental and physical energy.

 

Yeah.  Many of us go up to New York regularly and do friendliness tests.  Our results and experiences have been very impressive and friendly.  It may be fast paced but I almost always experience common courtesy on the street, good and friendly service, and what really surprised me was how many offers of directions if you are looking at a map or on a corner trying to decide which way too go. 

It always really makes the people of DC seem downright nasty. 

 

 

^I agree, depending where you are. Spending any length of time on Sunset or Beverly Hills makes me really uncomfortable and doubt that there is a single genuine person in LA. Go out to Pasadena or Santa Monica and it's a totally different, more normal scene. I think that is what makes LA kind of fun, though. For a couple hours you can be your alter ego, and be a pretentious ass hole scenester in Hollywood, and then go back to your sh!tty apartment and wear sweatpants and watch Family Guy.

 

Santa Monica is just as bad! Pasadena? I have no reason to go over there!

 

Granted, I love BH! That Needless Markup is fabulous. Empty but fabulous.

 

ITA, Santa Monica is a bed of pretentiousness.  And yeah, no reason to go to Pasadena, you might as well say how nice the people are in Glendale or Woodland Hills.  They're not really LA people, for sure.

 

MTS will roll the eyes here, but the only place I've found genuine and nice people in LA is in Topanga. But I know he hates hippies so he probably just plugs his nose when he drives by Topanga Cyn Blvd going through Malibu. :)

Santa Monica is pretentious, yes, but it's a totally different vibe from WeHo, Bev Hills, Bel Air, and Brentwood.  From my experience, the people in SM tend to be wealthy, yes, but it's not a fake life style.  People in SM walk to their yoga studios, coffee shops, boutiques and cafes, and the farmers market, but generally seem to live a more genuine life.  The homes are nice, but not impossibly huge, the neighborhoods are pretty pedestrian friendly, and the stores/employees are approachable and friendly.

 

BH people create such an air about themselves.  Where as in SM you see people driving Prius's, BH favors the Rolls Royce. SM has nice and understated boutiques along its side streets, BH has completely over the top and obnoxious retail. And you know the people who hang out on the Sunset Strip....it's ALL about how you look, how you're dressed, who you're with, where you eat, etc. Many of the people that frequent these areas don't actually LIVE in these areas, they go there to see and be seen and then retreat back to their homes elsewhere in the city.

 

I have no reason to ever go into Topanga, just as you have no reason to go to Pasadena I suppose. Idk, I guess I find the Norton Simon, Gamble House, Hunnington Gardens/Library, and various events at the Rose Bowl worth going to...

 

 

Santa Monica is pretentious, yes, but it's a totally different vibe from WeHo, Bev Hills, Bel Air, and Brentwood.  From my experience, the people in SM tend to be wealthy, yes, but it's not a fake life style.  People in SM walk to their yoga studios, coffee shops, boutiques and cafes, and the farmers market, but generally seem to live a more genuine life.  The homes are nice, but not impossibly huge, the neighborhoods are pretty pedestrian friendly, and the stores/employees are approachable and friendly.

 

BH people create such an air about themselves.  Where as in SM you see people driving Prius's, BH favors the Rolls Royce. SM has nice and understated boutiques along its side streets, BH has completely over the top and obnoxious retail. And you know the people who hang out on the Sunset Strip....it's ALL about how you look, how you're dressed, who you're with, where you eat, etc. Many of the people that frequent these areas don't actually LIVE in these areas, they go there to see and be seen and then retreat back to their homes elsewhere in the city.

 

I have no reason to ever go into Topanga, just as you have no reason to go to Pasadena I suppose. Idk, I guess I find the Norton Simon, Gamble House, Hunnington Gardens/Library, and various events at the Rose Bowl worth going to...

 

 

 

One of our office is in SM and that is the office I prefer to work out of when in LA.  Those people are nut jobs!

 

I've been to some of those things in Pasadena, so I can say I've done them, but the drive there and back is exhausting.  That is the thing I hate the most about LA, you're completely warn out from driving.  You cant even enjoy an event because you're so stressed out from driving.

 

BH - it is what it is! You know it's high end retail and food.  Pretentious people don't bother me.

 

 

Next time you encounter one, and they engage you, just say the following:

 

If that doesn't work, just say, "you're fat!".  That should send them right into therapy!  It's LA for heavens sake!

Somebody please list the worthy museums in NYC.  Seriously!  I would like to go.

Is this a trick question? The Metropolitan Museum in New York is unquestionably the premier art museum in the United States, and one of the very largest in the world. I think the Louvre is bigger. The Museum of Modern Art (MoMA) has probably the best collection of late 19th and early to mid-20th century art anywhere--textbook, iconic examples of Van Gogh, Monet, Picasso, Gauguin, Matisse, Pollock, etc...The Guggenheim (now celebrating its 50th anniv.) currently has an outstanding show dedicated to Kandinsky, The Whitney is known for contemporary American art with an outstanding Georgia O'Keefe retrospective now showing; the Frick Museum on 5th a couple of years ago had an exhibit of master paintings on loan from the Cleve. Museum while they were closed; The Cooper-Hewitt (also on 5th, in the old Andrew Carnegie mansion) is the design museum of the Smithsonian; and the Morgan Library on Madison is known for historic books and manuscripts; the Neue Galerie on 5th (opened a few years ago with money from the Lauder fortune) specializes in Austrian and German art of the early 20th century with an emphasis on Klimt. There are hundreds, if not thousands of art galleries (although far fewer than there were prior to the economic collapse)--mainly in SoHo, Chelsea, with older ones on the Upper E. Side & 57th St, but all throughout the city. The Brooklyn Museum is a major instititution, and if it were not located in NYC--would easily be the largest museum in any other city in the nation. There's also The New Museum on the Bowery featuring the newest of new art; the newly re-opened El Museo del Barrio dedicated to Latino :wink: art; the Studio Museum in Harlem; and for Spanish art, the little known yet culturally significant Hispanic Society of America in Washington Heights featuring works by Velazquez and Goya. Also the Museum of the City of New York on 5th Av. and the New York Historical Society on Central Park West; the American Folk Art Museum (next door to MoMA on 53rd St.) and the Museum of Arts & Design on Columbus Circle.  I don't really believe you were serious asking this question. In any case, I took the bait!

In any case, I took the bait!

 

But surely they don't have any good restaurants!

They do, and stop calling me Shirley!

^Any chance you could present that message without the sanctimonious/preachy tone?

 

Doubtful, it would seem that the point is the preaching.

 

I agree with MayDay, but Ram23, agree with it or not, you must have missed the point.

I'm with edale..Topanga???? I go to the Palisades each time I'm in LA and enjoy that; mostly to visit friends.  BH is okay for shopping, but kind of boring and I can barely keep my composure with all the snotty brats thowing their money around.  I worked for years at the Beverly Wilshire Hotel and had quite enough of that set.  Guess West Hollywood and Melrose are much more to my liking (I REFUSE to call it WeHo!!)

 

Don't know how anyone could be bored in New York.  There is everything there, at arms reach.  Plus the food is so wonderful.  And the people are nice, once you give them a chance.  They are proud of their city and rightly so.

I'm with edale..Topanga? :? I go to the Palisades each time I'm in LA and enjoy that; mostly to visit friends.  BH is okay for shopping, but kind of boring and I can barely keep my composure with all the snotty brats thowing their money around.  I worked for years at the Beverly Wilshire Hotel and had quite enough of that set.  Guess West Hollywood and Melrose are much more to my liking (I REFUSE to call it WeHo!!)

 

Don't know how anyone could be bored in New York.  There is everything there, at arms reach.  Plus the food is so wonderful.  And the people are nice, once you give them a chance.  They are proud of their city and rightly so.

 

Yea the term "WeHo" is lame.  Why is BH boring?  I don't find it boring and why let another persons actions dictate your mood?  Most of the people that are shopping in BH don't live in the immediate area.  You can spot them at the Cheesecake factory  ::) ::) ::)

 

When we were younger we would stay at the Beverly Wilshire or the Century Plaza when visiting LA.  I love the Abbey.

 

I like Melrose, but it feels to spread out.  My nephews and niece like Melrose more then BH, as it's definitely more youth oriented.  The walk between Fred Segal and Paul Smith is so weird.  Then Betsey Johnson.

 

Trying to find parking (btwn La Cienega or Fairfax) or a place for the car to wait is a pain.  Then if they go to Melrose, they want to pop down to the grove.  All that driving around makes me cranky.