September 15, 20159 yr Even if it were, who the f takes pleasure in seeing Beachwood and Mayfield Hts dying? What an ignorant comment. I'm sure the 1000 people let go from Bank of America last year are still smiling
September 15, 20159 yr ^^ and ^: It's the Bartimole mindset. We do have a few posters who seem to be doing their best to live up to the rhetoric we'll be seeing in some suburban elections this year.
September 15, 20159 yr ^ I think clvlndr's point was the suburban office markets are struggling. I can attest to that in Independence. Not sure with Beachwood. But all in all, I think office markets this day in age anywhere, suburban or urban can become saturated very quickly. My company is seeing revenue increases year over year for the past several, and we are contemplating downsizing our office space fairly significantly. The new philosophy is we can do more with less, and that pertains to people and space. I don't think that's an anomaly across the board.
September 15, 20159 yr Even if it were, who the f takes pleasure in seeing Beachwood and Mayfield Hts dying? What an ignorant comment. I'm sure the 1000 people let go from Bank of America last year are still smiling They didn't go downtown, either. But Eaton went to Beachwood. One of the great things about Steve LaTourette is he realized the importance of the whole region. Even though he never had a single constituent living in Cleveland proper, he was the city's go-to Congressman when the GOP was in charge.
September 15, 20159 yr ^ I think clvlndr's point was the suburban office markets are struggling. Exactly right. :-D
September 16, 20159 yr http://wvxu.org/post/study-points-more-millennials-driving#stream/0 OKI in Cincinnati is still finding that the Cincy region will see tremendous growth in terms of driving - even among millennials. I still haven't ever seen them explain why Cincinnati is an outlier in this regard.
September 16, 20159 yr Even if it were, who the f takes pleasure in seeing Beachwood and Mayfield Hts dying? What an ignorant comment. I'm sure the 1000 people let go from Bank of America last year are still smiling They didn't go downtown, either. But Eaton went to Beachwood. One of the great things about Steve LaTourette is he realized the importance of the whole region. Even though he never had a single constituent living in Cleveland proper, he was the city's go-to Congressman when the GOP was in charge. LaTourette's a good man. It was a shame he was forced to leave congress (both by his health and his frustration with the direction of the GOP). It was important to have a moderating, pro-urban voice like his against the increasingly shrill Tea Party/rural non-compromising hard Right. I wish him the best in his battle with pancreatic cancer.
September 21, 20159 yr I was just in Denver this past week. Their new transit center is incredible. Amtrak above ground, buses below ground. Very clean and orderly. $5 bus to Boulder that leaves every 10 minutes on time during rush hour. They have a great transit system. Something most cities could only dream of.
September 21, 20159 yr I was just in Denver this past week. Their new transit center is incredible. Amtrak above ground, buses below ground. Very clean and orderly. $5 bus to Boulder that leaves every 10 minutes on time during rush hour. They have a great transit system. Something most cities could only dream of. And the plan is to connect Bolder with commuter rail once additional funding is found.
September 21, 20159 yr They are currently building rail out to the airport to open 2016. 22 miles. They are very ambitious with public transportation. And they need to be. Their population is exploding.
September 22, 20159 yr They are currently building rail out to the airport to open 2016. 22 miles. They are very ambitious with public transportation. And they need to be. Their population is exploding. After a 7-mile LRT line was built with mostly local funds to get some kind of rail going and to silence the skeptics, it succeeded and kept expanding. With each incremental success, the public's interest in more rail expansion grew and the momentum because unstoppable. Shows how a toe-in-the-water rail line can evolve into a massive rail system investment, which the voters approved with a multi-billion-dollar bond issue. It never could have happened if not for that 7-mile dink rail line. This is why some of the organized, nationally connected rail opponents fight so hard against projects like the Cincinnati Streetcar. Because it can start momentum that changes a city. EDIT: here's a 2011 map of the planned FasTracks system, now mostly under construction if not completed: "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 23, 20169 yr Why are Millennials forgoing driving? Researchers at the University of Michigan have found that Millennials are delaying the urge to drive. By Christina Beck January 20, 2016 1:17 PM A study published on Tuesday by the Transportation Research Institute at the University of Michigan indicates that Millennials are increasingly choosing to give up cars. It was once a coming of age ritual: before eating cake and opening presents, newly-minted 16-year-olds would make a white-knuckled pilgrimage to the state Department of Motor Vehicles for a chance at the small plastic card that meant freedom. Today, researchers say, fewer teenagers and young people in general are obtaining drivers licenses. The University of Michigan report states that licensing has decreased from 91.8 percent to 76.7 percent for the 16-year-old to 44-year-old demographic. Only 60 percent of 18-year-olds had a drivers’ license in 2014, compared to 80 percent in 1983. The study also notes a decrease in those with driver's licenses across all age groups from 2011-2104. The Millennial generation, composed of young adults and adults born between 1983 and 2000, is even larger than the Baby Boomer generation. There are 92 million Millennials, compared to 77 million Baby Boomers. Is the decrease in driver’s licensing rates indicative of a larger societal trend? Why are Millennials so apathetic towards driving? CONTINUED http://news.yahoo.com/why-millennials-forgoing-driving-181723638.html
January 23, 20169 yr Gamers and other nerds don't care. They're the dominant young social archetype nowadays.
January 23, 20169 yr "The study also notes a decrease in those with driver's licenses across all age groups from 2011-2104." Who did this study, Nostradomus?
January 25, 20169 yr Why are Millennials forgoing driving? Researchers at the University of Michigan have found that Millennials are delaying the urge to drive. By Christina Beck January 20, 2016 1:17 PM A study published on Tuesday by the Transportation Research Institute at the University of Michigan indicates that Millennials are increasingly choosing to give up cars. It was once a coming of age ritual: before eating cake and opening presents, newly-minted 16-year-olds would make a white-knuckled pilgrimage to the state Department of Motor Vehicles for a chance at the small plastic card that meant freedom. Today, researchers say, fewer teenagers and young people in general are obtaining drivers licenses. The University of Michigan report states that licensing has decreased from 91.8 percent to 76.7 percent for the 16-year-old to 44-year-old demographic. Only 60 percent of 18-year-olds had a drivers’ license in 2014, compared to 80 percent in 1983. The study also notes a decrease in those with driver's licenses across all age groups from 2011-2104. The Millennial generation, composed of young adults and adults born between 1983 and 2000, is even larger than the Baby Boomer generation. There are 92 million Millennials, compared to 77 million Baby Boomers. Is the decrease in driver’s licensing rates indicative of a larger societal trend? Why are Millennials so apathetic towards driving? CONTINUED http://news.yahoo.com/why-millennials-forgoing-driving-181723638.html Driving meant a certain degree of freedom from parental control. That, or having a friend who drove. But being the driver was extra status. Now, there are other ways of getting around said control. Especially for the technologically adept.
February 11, 20169 yr I'm one of them. I rarely drive anymore.... Like Millennials, More Older Americans Steering Away From Driving Updated February 11, 20167:38 AM ET Published February 11, 20164:53 AM ET David Schaper 2010 DAVID SCHAPER A growing number of Americans are driving less and getting rid of their cars. The trend that used to be more prominent among younger adults — millennials — is now gaining traction in middle-aged adults as well, to the point where fewer of them are even bothering to get or renew their driver's licenses. "Honestly, at this point, it just doesn't really seem worth it," says 25-year-old Peter Rebecca, who doesn't own a car or have a driver's license. "I mean, I live in Chicago, there's really good access to, you know, public transits for pretty cheap." The student at Harold Washington College downtown lives just a couple of blocks from a rail stop on the Northwest side. In the warmer months, Rebecca says he uses a bike. MORE: http://www.npr.org/2016/02/11/466178523/like-millennials-more-older-americans-steering-away-from-driving "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 11, 20169 yr I'm one of them. I rarely drive anymore.... Like Millennials, More Older Americans Steering Away From Driving Updated February 11, 20167:38 AM ET Published February 11, 20164:53 AM ET David Schaper 2010 DAVID SCHAPER A growing number of Americans are driving less and getting rid of their cars. The trend that used to be more prominent among younger adults — millennials — is now gaining traction in middle-aged adults as well, to the point where fewer of them are even bothering to get or renew their driver's licenses. "Honestly, at this point, it just doesn't really seem worth it," says 25-year-old Peter Rebecca, who doesn't own a car or have a driver's license. "I mean, I live in Chicago, there's really good access to, you know, public transits for pretty cheap." The student at Harold Washington College downtown lives just a couple of blocks from a rail stop on the Northwest side. In the warmer months, Rebecca says he uses a bike. MORE: http://www.npr.org/2016/02/11/466178523/like-millennials-more-older-americans-steering-away-from-driving A 25 year old college student is "middle aged"?
May 24, 20196 yr "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 24, 20196 yr 28 minutes ago, KJP said: From that first dip on it that can be explained by gas prices and the 'net. People started looking for things and even buying them online. Less going out because they were bored, certainly less driving around just to see what was going on (remember what the Metroparks looked like during summers in the 80s?) , Around 201 destinations began to figure out how to use it to bring people out.
November 13, 20195 yr Average cost of a new car now exceeds $30,000.... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 13, 20195 yr On 5/24/2019 at 11:58 AM, E Rocc said: Around 201 destinations began to figure out how to use it to bring people out. Meanwhile, all destinations from #202 on down didn't figure it out, which is how they dropped to the bottom of the list ... (EDIT: And I see I'm actually responding to an old post and the only new post here is actually just the most recent one.) ? =============================== On that note, I'm not surprised the price of a new car has hit $30,000. This is one reason I've generally stayed fairly sanguine when people tell me that Tesla's cars are unaffordable at $40,000. They're actually not that much above the average anymore; people's conceptions of what is average just haven't caught up to reality yet. We just spent $30,000 for a used car last week (finally broke down and got the family minivan, so we'll be in ICE-land for another decade or so).
November 13, 20195 yr Cars still aren't all that bad; it's the trucks, SUVs and crossovers skewing the numbers.
November 13, 20195 yr 2 minutes ago, GCrites80s said: Cars still aren't all that bad; it's the trucks, SUVs and crossovers skewing the numbers. Which people buy because they can't get bigger cars due to CAFE.
November 13, 20195 yr While I agree that the wheelbase and overall size requirements in relation to MPG of CAFE is poorly-written policy, I can't help but speculate that provision was designed by the automakers as their input on the policy. Contrary to the beliefs of some, in the U.S., the automakers themselves are at the table during these discussions and have enormous influence. It's the same way with the aftermarket parts manufacturers (SEMA). They are all welcome at the table. It is not 1972 where the EPA just drops things from the sky.
November 13, 20195 yr 2 hours ago, Gramarye said: We just spent $30,000 for a used car last week (finally broke down and got the family minivan, so we'll be in ICE-land for another decade or so). I’m curious - what did you go with? We love our Town & Countries (yes, plural), but I know from your previous posts you were opposed to Chrysler. When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
November 13, 20195 yr Found a used 2017 Toyota Sienna. AWD was a big deal for us and the Sienna is the only model that even sometimes has it. Our house is down a hill on a one-way street and there were times when I/we couldn't get out last winter even when almost everyone else at the office was able to get to work. It wasn't as big a deal as it would have been ten years ago because we have much greater teleworking capabilities now, but it was still inconvenient and frankly embarrassing. I paid extra for the AWD version without a second thought when I configured my Tesla, too. The Sienna is a barge and its internal fuel efficiency meter says I got about 18MPG on the way home. (I should have filled it up over the weekend at $2.13, gas was $2.60 when I woke up today because of the snow.) But of course, if we're packing six people (or five people and a dog) in there, the fuel cost per passenger-mile is very different than when my wife drives it alone. And since my wife now works from home, the majority of the miles we put on that van will be family-loaded miles, not daily-commuter/single-driver miles. My oldest got to see Europe and Asia because it was much easier to travel with one; with three kids, we're in road-trip territory now. And I'm absolutely cool with that, because there is so much within driving distance that has been on my bucket list for a long time and constantly delayed, since we knew this day would come. I've lived in Ohio since 1990 and still never spent a night in Hocking Hills.
November 13, 20195 yr I was going to guess Toyota based on the combination of "over $30K" "minivan" and "used".
November 13, 20195 yr LOL Actually, the Honda Odyssey appears to be the most expensive, feature for feature and mileage for mileage, even without AWD. The Sienna was definitely a close second, though.
November 14, 20195 yr It still astounds me that Toyota is the only manufacturer of an AWD minivan. We were seriously considering an Odyssey last year, but the lack of AWD was a major deterrent. I understand that there are actually few manufacturers of minivans, just Honda, Toyota, Chrysler, and Kia I think. But it seems like a feature that would be beneficial to a wider set of users than it is currently marketed as. The AWD is desired because of our trips to western NY for ski trips, along with Cleveland's always fun winter weather. We ended up with a Honda Ridgeline because it has the AWD and can haul all our ski gear and overnight bags. Hopefully in a few years there will be another option for an AWD minivan, otherwise at least we can do doughnuts in parking lots.
November 14, 20195 yr The manufacturers don't want you buying a minivan. They want you to buy an SUV.
November 14, 20195 yr 1 hour ago, GCrites80s said: The manufacturers don't want you buying a minivan. They want you to buy an SUV. They want you to finance it with a 7-year loan, meaning they get to collect interest for a few years, then repo the thing. Look at the financial statements from these companies. It's just like how department store credit cards are central to the profitability of Macy's, etc.
November 14, 20195 yr 2 hours ago, GCrites80s said: The manufacturers don't want you buying a minivan. They want you to buy an SUV. Maybe, but this only goes so far before you run up against the market reality that in order to sell vehicles, you have to make the vehicles people actually want to buy, not the ones you wish they'd buy from you. Of course, marketing efforts are directed towards making customers want the vehicles the companies want them to want. But there is only so far that even the best marketing campaign can move the needle from its starting point, or fight larger cultural trends. We need the minivan because we have three kids and might have a fourth. The large sliding doors and lower step-up from the ground for smaller humans are major advantages that an SUV can't offer. Meanwhile, we don't need off-road capability or towing capability, we need road-trip capability. Some SUVs do offer third-row seating but it's not going to be as convenient. I did look at a one (Highlander hybrid) just to confirm that I was right about the effects of smaller, outward-opening doors and the higher climb to get in. But if you only have two kids and will seldom actually use the third row for passengers, then that inconvenience is only occasional, and you might want the other features of the SUV more. In other words, my working theory is that the decline of the minivan largely tracks the decline of the family with 3+ minor children at home at the same time. As additional evidence, despite the decline of the minivan overall, my kids' daycare parking lot at pickup and dropoff times is chock full of them. People with reason to get them are still finding ways to get them. There just aren't as many such people as there used to be.
November 15, 20195 yr 16 hours ago, Gramarye said: Of course, marketing efforts are directed towards making customers want the vehicles the companies want them to want. But there is only so far that even the best marketing campaign can move the needle from its starting point, or fight larger cultural trends. That's where lobbying comes in. So you get things like safety ratings on vehicles determined solely based on safety of the occupants, ignoring the safety of anyone else involved in a potential collision. Therefore the heftier the car, the "safer," and you have a veritable arms race. Also things like @GCrites80s pointed out with CAFE standards. Ratings, standards, and regulations which manipulate the market toward more profitable vehicles that exacerbate the socially detrimental sides of automobile ownership.
November 18, 20195 yr On 11/14/2019 at 2:11 PM, GCrites80s said: The manufacturers don't want you buying a minivan. They want you to buy an SUV. Yes they do ... they even said exactly that. https://www.autonews.com/article/20170114/OEM03/301169996/why-honda-skipped-awd-on-odyssey If this meant giving up a few buyers who wanted both a van and awd, it was a risk Honda was willing to take. "For that customer we have the Pilot," John Mendel, executive vice president of Honda, told Automotive News
November 18, 20195 yr Any number of vehicles can get you that number of seats, not just the Pilot. Van people want those seats and VAN DOORS which crossovers and SUVs do not have.
December 24, 20195 yr "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 5, 20205 yr the human traffic jam — pretty funny: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/9393w7/this-man-created-traffic-jams-on-google-maps-using-a-red-wagon-full-of-phones
February 5, 20205 yr 2 hours ago, mrnyc said: the human traffic jam — pretty funny: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/9393w7/this-man-created-traffic-jams-on-google-maps-using-a-red-wagon-full-of-phones This is is my new favorite thing. “This Man Created Traffic Jams on Google Maps Using a Red Wagon Full of Phones By pulling 99 phones down empty streets, artist Simon Weckert made it look like they were gridlocked on Google Maps.” When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
May 27, 20205 yr "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 6, 20241 yr Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars That could have big political ramifications https://www.economist.com/international/2023/02/16/throughout-the-rich-world-the-young-are-falling-out-of-love-with-cars "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 6, 20241 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars That could have big political ramifications https://www.economist.com/international/2023/02/16/throughout-the-rich-world-the-young-are-falling-out-of-love-with-cars Paywalled, but the intro teaser paragraphs narrate the story and modern convictions of a 16-year-old. While 16-year-olds not rushing to get their driver's license at the first opportunity is definitely a cultural shift from 50-75 years ago, that doesn't necessarily imply changes among those age 25+ or 30+. On the flip side, I could credibly see that it would, and my real curiosity is whether that is cause, effect, or mere correlation with shrinking family sizes. We aren't exactly "in love" with our minivan the way my car-geek grandfather was clearly in love with whatever he was driving in 1950. It's a utility. A tool. But with our four kids, we do need it, or something like it. But if I'd never gotten married and started having kids, I would have been much more inclined to try to go car-free.
January 6, 20241 yr 1 hour ago, Gramarye said: Paywalled, but the intro teaser paragraphs narrate the story and modern convictions of a 16-year-old. While 16-year-olds not rushing to get their driver's license at the first opportunity is definitely a cultural shift from 50-75 years ago, that doesn't necessarily imply changes among those age 25+ or 30+. On the flip side, I could credibly see that it would, and my real curiosity is whether that is cause, effect, or mere correlation with shrinking family sizes. We aren't exactly "in love" with our minivan the way my car-geek grandfather was clearly in love with whatever he was driving in 1950. It's a utility. A tool. But with our four kids, we do need it, or something like it. But if I'd never gotten married and started having kids, I would have been much more inclined to try to go car-free. It’s really quite simple with younger people. In the pre computer world going places, sometimes multiple places in a short period of time, was the key to an active social life. The kids with their own cars or regular access to such had a major advantage. At that higher social strata, the kids with “nice” cars had additional status. Especially boys, as for women the nature of their boyfriend’s car was at least as socially important. (Unfortunately for me lol this didn’t always work as well as it could have). These days, leaving the house isn’t nearly as important. When they do, social media gives them a clue as to what is going on where. No need to go multiple places, more often than not. With older people, kids are the key of course. Especially multiple kids.
January 6, 20241 yr ^LOL, wait until virtual reality gets to the point where people, from their homes, can put on glasses and ear pieces and feel as though they are together in a virtual bar, all without leaving the couch. Instead of just sharing a screen, they share a "reality." No need to drive anywhere. Who will buy.the first round?
January 6, 20241 yr I'm pretty bearish on AR/VR. Look at all the hype with the Apple Vision Pro, and now nothing. Google Glass died long ago with some retroactive babble about it just being a demo or prototype. Metaverse is dead or deadish. Oculus and other headsets are limited to gamers. Same with AI. All talk, limited corporate application, very limited long-term consumer usability, interest, or even understanding. Might as well file that under the NFTs of 2022. All that aside, the declining interest of teenage licenses is ultimately a good thing. 15 is way too young for kids to be operating death machines.
January 6, 20241 yr 50 minutes ago, TBideon said: I'm pretty bearish on AR/VR. Look at all the hype with the Apple Vision Pro, and now nothing. Google Glass died long ago with some retroactive babble about it just being a demo or prototype. Metaverse is dead or deadish. Oculus and other headsets are limited to gamers. The first automobiles were developed in the late 1800s. It was decades before mass production made them everyday items, and decades after that before they were ubiquitous. Even though the AR/VR products of today have the biggest corporate names in the world behind them, I still get the sense that they're like the European horseless carriages of the late 19th century--curious and interesting proofs of concept. And it wouldn't surprise me if it were 2055 before they went mainstream.
January 6, 20241 yr 41 minutes ago, Gramarye said: The first automobiles were developed in the late 1800s. It was decades before mass production made them everyday items, and decades after that before they were ubiquitous. Even though the AR/VR products of today have the biggest corporate names in the world behind them, I still get the sense that they're like the European horseless carriages of the late 19th century--curious and interesting proofs of concept. And it wouldn't surprise me if it were 2055 before they went mainstream. I haven't done vr yet, but from the "screenshots" I've seen, it looks like the "reality" is PS1 level in its graphical presentation still. When it gets to PS4 or 5 level I bet interest will skyrocket.
January 6, 20241 yr 2 hours ago, urb-a-saurus said: ^LOL, wait until virtual reality gets to the point where people, from their homes, can put on glasses and ear pieces and feel as though they are together in a virtual bar, all without leaving the couch. Instead of just sharing a screen, they share a "reality." No need to drive anywhere. Who will buy.the first round? Expect a backlash at some point, as there's no reason why Ludd's Law* would be less applicable to social contacts than economic/business activity. *Ludd's Law: When a new technology or other change makes a skill less relevant, it will be opposed and denigrated by those who possess that skill.
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