Source: Shanahan leaves Browns

 

The Cleveland Browns tradition of change continues as a team source told ESPN.com on Thursday that offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan and quarterback coach Dowell Loggains will not be retained.

 

Both spent one year with the Browns, and both were under contract for 2015.

 

An announcement is expected later Thursday. The news was earlier reported by Fox Sports.

 

Sources familiar with the situation said the split was caused because the pair did not see eye to eye with the front office about quarterback Johnny Manziel. The front office wants Manziel to be the starter, and the source said the coaches do not believe they can win with him.

 

Cont

Loggins seemed like a tool.  Not sad to see him go.  Shanahan's system looked great at time and awful at times.  Kind of hard to judge based on the injuries to Mack and others, the suspension of Gordon, and the holes on the roster.  If reports are true, there was a major fracture in the relationship between Shanahan and the front office.

From what I know of Pettine, O'Niel and Farmer, I don't seem them as meddlers or whiners or immature. If anything, the word around the league is that the whiner and immature person is Shanahan. There is every reason to believe Shanahan or his agent gave stories to the media of the front office meddling in his play-calling, and that he did so give Haslam justification to allow Shanahan to make a lateral move if he couldn't get a head-coaching job. Lateral moves require permission from the current team. So the Browns were all too happy to give Shanahan permission to leave rather than keep a loud-mouth malcontent on the staff.

 

I think this reflects poorly on Shanahan, not the Browns.

Well.... we have a new OC.  John DeFillippo, most recently the QB coach for the Raiders.  Now the question is how many candidates declined to interview before they picked 'their guy'

Well.... we have a new OC.  John DeFillippo, most recently the QB coach for the Raiders.  Now the question is how many candidates declined to interview before they picked 'their guy'

 

Sounded like a lot of "thanks but no thanks" reactions. Hiring a young guy like JDF (36 yoa) is of course a big risk. But if he works out, he probably wouldn't jump ship right away into a head-coaching job.

He was a favorite for the job last year, but Shanahan was more experienced and preferred by GM/Owner, given that Pettine and O'Neill weren't that experienced.

 

It's an alright hire.

Well.... we have a new OC.  John DeFillippo, most recently the QB coach for the Raiders.  Now the question is how many candidates declined to interview before they picked 'their guy'

 

He was their top choice at least back to this past weekend.  He certainly did well with Carr.

A must-read. Looks like we're looking for a new QB in 2015.....

 

Inside Manziel's rocky rookie season

Browns sources reveal that celebrity quarterback was a turbulent presence in '14

Updated: January 23, 2015, 3:53 PM ET

By Jeremy Fowler and Pat McManamon | ESPN.com

 

BEREA, Ohio -- The name on the card that night in May seemed to draw as much anxiety as it did excitement.

 

Johnny Manziel, Quarterback, Texas A&M.

 

...As one player put it, Manziel throughout the entire 2014 season was a "100 percent joke."

 

Some said it should not have been a surprise, that the Browns were well aware what they were getting.

 

"During the draft process, not one person interviewed by the team said he was going to grow up," said one source directly involved in the drafting of Manziel. "You can't blame Johnny. This is who he is. The team knew that."

 

MORE:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12216266/cleveland-browns-quarterback-johnny-manziel-struggled-commitment-preparation-sources-said

geesh front page? thats how bad the giants/jets are i guess. plus it seems johnny football is always news. of a sort:

 

http://nypost.com/2015/01/23/100-percent-joke-manziel-confirmed-browns-worst-fears

 

Browns WR Josh Gordon flunked another drug test and now will be subject to a one-year banishment, per league sources. More on ESPN @ 6 pm.

 

Time to dump him and move on.

 

EDIT: More....

 

Browns WR Josh Gordon tested positive for alcohol, as @ProFootballTalk also reported.

 

Coming soon to a Car Dealership near you. #Browns

@JOSH_GORDONXII http://t.co/VfLDkF5RKz

I don't understand. Alcohol isn't a banned substance in the NFL.

I don't understand either.  Maybe it's part of his probation?  Either way, what a shame.

^ it must have been that --  here is the initial espn article, but it doesn't clarify much either:

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12226738/josh-gordon-cleveland-browns-facing-one-year-suspension-failing-another-drug-test

I don't understand either.  Maybe it's part of his probation?  Either way, what a shame.

 

It is, following his DUI arrest.

Ugh. Dumb. Just Dumb.

"@caplannfl: Missing pieces: How many players away from Super Bowl was each team? http://t.co/rOtpIWzaKP" Browns ranked 7th. Not too bad! But was this calculated before Gordon's latest screw up? Then again, the Browns were 6-4 without him in 2014.

How long was he required to stay off the booze?  There never really was much clarity about what happened in regards to his DUI arrest.

There's a certain irony to the NFL suspending a player for using a major sponsor's product.

Well.... it's the same league that fined Marshawn Lynch for his crotch grab and now is selling prints of the photo.

There's a certain irony to the NFL suspending a player for using a major sponsor's product.

 

Right. And everyone's saying how dumb Josh is. Fine. A lot of great athletes barely made it through high school. It's just simply amazing to me that violating this rule costs you your job....when that job entails catching a ball and then running with it.

 

These are NFL players, not surgeons or air traffic controllers.

I wonder if the positive test for alcohol violated any probation he was placed on by the court following his DUI arrest. 

I don't know if Josh is stupid or not. A lot of brilliant people destroyed their lives because they lost the power to moderate their alcohol and drug consumption. Think about this... If your employer makes you this offer: "I'll give you millions of dollars per year if you don't take another drink of booze/controlled substance again" and you choose the alcohol/controlled substance instead (several times), it is clear that imbibing alcohol/controlled substances is more important and powerful to him than anything else in his life. This tells me his very life is at stake unless he can admit he's powerless against controlled substances etc.

 

If the Browns want to save Josh from the toilet of self-destruction he's flushing himself into, they need to cut him. It might help him to realize he's near hit rock-bottom which is where many chemical abusers have to land before they can cut through the layers of self-induced deception that everything will be OK.

 

And BTW, the Browns also need to wake up. They've got Josh Gordon Part II on their roster -- Johnny Manziel. Both of these guys were wanted and protected by Jimmy Haslam.

 

That scares the living hell out of me when it comes to the team's future.

There's a certain irony to the NFL suspending a player for using a major sponsor's product.

 

Right. And everyone's saying how dumb Josh is. Fine. A lot of great athletes barely made it through high school. It's just simply amazing to me that violating this rule costs you your job....when that job entails catching a ball and then running with it.

 

These are NFL players, not surgeons or air traffic controllers.

 

I can see testing for performance enhancing drugs.  But all this focus on "recreational" drugs is ridiculous splatter from the "War on (some) Drugs", with alcohol thrown in just to be PC.

 

The NBA didn't even test for pot until the DEA types started giving them crap about "message" or some such thing.

talent-wise gordon is a major loss. true we never saw enough of it, but there is no doubt about that. luckily his position is one of the easier ones to fill. at least to an adequate level. manziel is a minor bump in the road. yes qb has been a big problem for the browns, but he was never going to be the answer. not sure even mariota or winston would be either. it looks like the browns will continue to be stuck with hoyer-type journeymen in that slot for awhile. so be it. there are plenty of other draft needs for the fo to focus on like getting highly ranked linemen like randy gregory & brandon scherff, etc. and good d like dante fowler, etc., so i wouldnt waste draft efforts on winston or mariota.

I still don't see the need to officially cut him.  All that gives him is the opportunity to latch on to the team of his choice once his suspension is up.  He is essentially cut for all intents and purposes for the next year.  Hold on to him and see what happens with his rehab.  At the very least, his trade value is higher when he is about to return to the field.  At best, he turns his life around and comes back better than ever.  There is no symbolism to cutting him within the locker room, although there may be to certain segments of the fanbase.

I still don't see the need to officially cut him.  All that gives him is the opportunity to latch on to the team of his choice once his suspension is up.  He is essentially cut for all intents and purposes for the next year.  Hold on to him and see what happens with his rehab.  At the very least, his trade value is higher when he is about to return to the field.  At best, he turns his life around and comes back better than ever.  There is no symbolism to cutting him within the locker room, although there may be to certain segments of the fanbase.

 

My take exactly.  Saying "cut him" is exactly the same stupid symbolism as suspending him for a substance which cannot impact his on-filed performance in any positive way.

And what has Josh done to tell you he's going to come back? He likes his chemicals more than playing football and making millions. It's up to Josh, not the Browns, to decide if he wants to be a football player again. Move on. What's even more remarkable is that the Browns win-loss record is better in the last two years without him on the active roster (6-6 without Gordon, 5-15 with). He doesn't make a positive difference on the Browns. So save Josh. Cut him.

I just don't understand how that will save him.  The NFL's wake up call is going to work or it is not.  The Browns cutting him at this point is not going to do anything for him personally.  He is not making any money from the Browns which will be taken away if he is cut.  In fact, he would likely make MORE money if he is cut once he is ready to return, as opposed to playing out his current contract, which will be tolled.  He doesn't count towards the roster and doesn't count towards the cap, so no benefit to the Browns.

I just don't understand how that will save him.  The NFL's wake up call is going to work or it is not.  The Browns cutting him at this point is not going to do anything for him personally.  He is not making any money from the Browns which will be taken away if he is cut.  In fact, he would likely make MORE money if he is cut once he is ready to return, as opposed to playing out his current contract, which will be tolled.  He doesn't count towards the roster and doesn't count towards the cap, so no benefit to the Browns.

 

Exactly. The Browns would gain nothing, and possibly lose a valuable future asset.

If he was out of compliance because he was caught DWI then you probably cut him, but he wasn't beating anyone, covering up a murder, or abusing animals. He's failed at the intervention process.

Ask Chris Carter. He was thankful that Buddy Ryan cut him. His football career was over. It woke him up and made him realize he needed to be clean if he was ever going to join a team again. Being thrown out with the trash is sometimes the best thing that can happen to you. Being kept by a team on its inactive roster, albeit unpaid, probably isn't harsh enough. Maybe it will be for Josh. If it is great. But my experience is you have to face the end of your life to realize where your life is headed before you can change course. But everybody is different.

So the real issue in all of this (since Josh has made himself a non-issue) is Jimmy Haslam. He didn't want Banner/Lombardi to trade Josh and he wanted Farmer to draft Manziel.

 

Haslam isn't exactly a good judge of character. That's what scares me more in all of this.

^^Carter's circumstances were different.  The league's penalties were not the same.  He was set to play for the Eagles and then they cut him.  Let's also keep in mind that Carter's problems were with the heavier drugs, including cocaine and ecstasy.  Cutting him DID send a message.  It took away his paycheck and shed light on a problem the league was all too willing to keep in the closet.  Cutting Josh at this point is probably exactly what Josh (and especially his agent) want.  It would allow him to negotiate a new deal with a team of his choosing.

^^Carter's circumstances were different.  The league's penalties were not the same.  He was set to play for the Eagles and then they cut him.  Let's also keep in mind that Carter's problems were with the heavier drugs, including cocaine and ecstasy.  Cutting him DID send a message.  It took away his paycheck and shed light on a problem the league was all too willing to keep in the closet.  Cutting Josh at this point is probably exactly what Josh (and especially his agent) want.  It would allow him to negotiate a new deal with a team of his choosing.

 

Keep him on the roster and maybe his agent can find him another car sales gig to keep food on the table and vodka in the fridge.

Ask Chris Carter. He was thankful that Buddy Ryan cut him. His football career was over. It woke him up and made him realize he needed to be clean if he was ever going to join a team again. Being thrown out with the trash is sometimes the best thing that can happen to you. Being kept by a team on its inactive roster, albeit unpaid, probably isn't harsh enough. Maybe it will be for Josh. If it is great. But my experience is you have to face the end of your life to realize where your life is headed before you can change course. But everybody is different.

 

What good does it do the Browns to just cut him?

What good does it do the Browns to just cut him?

 

This isn't about the Browns anymore.

 

EDIT: Josh Gordon's FATE at this point isn't about the Browns or NFL regs or football anymore. It's about a man, and he's piloting a plane that's on a trajectory into a mountain-side.

What good does it do the Browns to just cut him?

 

This isn't about the Browns anymore.

 

*Report to moderator - Off-topic* ;)

What good does it do the Browns to just cut him?

 

This isn't about the Browns anymore.

 

EDIT: Josh Gordon's FATE at this point isn't about the Browns or NFL regs or football anymore. It's about a man, and he's piloting a plane that's on a trajectory into a mountain-side.

 

Nobody in this league is that selfless.  Not him, not the Browns, no one. 

 

The thing is, he hasn't done anything objectively that self destructive, with the possible exception of the DUI.  He's just been recalcitrant.

yeah he can't be cut now. if they cut him he's just going to latch on with someone else next year, with our luck probably the steelers where he will come back to haunt us. or he'll screw up further. who knows? but he could also turn himself around or be nice trade bait at some point, so any way you look at it i don't see how cutting him helps him or the browns. hold him and see what happens.

Except that we're still talking about him. I'm sure the Browns just LOVE that.

Honestly, better for the Browns if the sports talks shows are talking about him and not so focused on the Johnny hysteria and apparently dysfunctional front office

rolling stones style media promotion by the browns? haslam is a genius after all. and at least its very real, unlike deflategate or that roboED-209 tom brady.

Manziel may not be the answer for the Browns, but it is unfair to compare his issues with Gordon's. He may be a lot of things, like young, immature, and a partier; but there have been a lot of successful partiers in the league that didn't necessarily have illegal substance problems. Not worth discussing without evidence that his poor habits are substance related.

Manziel may not be the answer for the Browns, but it is unfair to compare his issues with Gordon's. He may be a lot of things, like young, immature, and a partier; but there have been a lot of successful partiers in the league that didn't necessarily have illegal substance problems. Not worth discussing without evidence that his poor habits are substance related.

Maybe it's just easier to store large denominations if you roll them up.

 

I wish I still had these problems....

Maybe it's just easier to store large denominations if you roll them up.

 

But make sure to tuck your necklace into your shirt so it doesn't obstruct your view.  Rolling up dollar bills can be a bit tricky if you have something dangling from your neck....

Maybe it's just easier to store large denominations if you roll them up.

 

But make sure to tuck your necklace into your shirt so it doesn't obstruct your view.  Rolling up dollar bills can be a bit tricky if you have something dangling from your neck....

 

Or if you're leaning over to utilize said rolled-up dollar bill!

Joe Haden: EVERYTHING ABOUT JOHNNY IS OVERBLOWN: http://t.co/E265rdujFK... http://t.co/P2BlOIv2SC #Browns