I still have my 1986 AFC Championship sweater, as well division title jerseys from 1986 and 1987. I can't fit into them anymore, but I still have them and they're in good shape. After two consecutive heartbreaking defeats to the Broncos, I stopped buying jerseys, yet I still fondly remember that innocent era in my life.

 

A "Browns 1999 Return" t-shirt was given to me 11 years ago, with Tim Couch, Lomas Brown and Chris Spielman on it. I still have that an occasionally wear it, but it's getting a little ragged.

I wouldn't mind a Slaughter or a Mack jersey.

Clay Matthews jersey would be my first choice of old school jerseys

I'm sure a number 82 Jersey would sell like hotcakes!

 

I'm not so sure Ben Watson is a fan favorite yet.

I want a Lou Groza jersey.

I'm sure a number 82 Jersey would sell like hotcakes!

 

I'm not so sure Ben Watson is a fan favorite yet.

 

Ben Watson?  You cannot be serious!  There is only one no. 82 jersey worth buying! 

Ben Watson? You cannot be serious! There is only one no. 82 jersey worth buying!

 

Easy dude, I was joking. I was born in 1980, and am well aware of the real #82.

Ben Watson?  You cannot be serious!  There is only one no. 82 jersey worth buying! 

 

Easy dude, I was joking.  I was born in 1980, I am well aware of the real #82.

 

OK...'cause I was about to bitch slap some damn sense into you! :P

Ben Watson? You cannot be serious! There is only one no. 82 jersey worth buying!

 

Easy dude, I was joking. I was born in 1980, I am well aware of the real #82.

 

OK...'cause I was about to bitch slap some damn sense into you! :P

 

You forgot to call him a 'whippersnapper'

Ben Watson?  You cannot be serious!  There is only one no. 82 jersey worth buying! 

 

Easy dude, I was joking.  I was born in 1980, I am well aware of the real #82.

 

OK...'cause I was about to bitch slap some damn sense into you! :P

 

You forgot to call him a 'whippersnapper'

 

I usually of skip of the "year" of birth, of some of our junior forumers.  LOL

I usually of skip of the "year" of birth, of some of our junior forumers. LOL

 

Could you translate that?

I usually of skip of the "year" of birth, of some of our junior forumers.  LOL

 

Could you translate that?

Yeah, some of us don't speak geezer.

I usually of skip of the "year" of birth, of some of our junior forumers.  LOL

 

Could you translate that?

 

I don't bother to look at you whippersnappers birth dates.  If you were born after '79, you don't know how to live...and you haven't experienced LIFE!  If you wern't old enough to attend a Browns game in the 80's you dont know what FUN is!

 

 

 

Good thing I was born in '78 :)

 

Although I am a bit young to remember the Cardiac Kids, I did attend games in the 1980's when the "Dawgs" first came about.  Good times....

I remember one of my first Browns games was a Monday night game vs the LA Rams around 86 or so (looked it up it was Oct 26, 1987 Browns win 30-17) . I was 8, no idea what my dad was thinking. The whole stadium was taunting Eric Dickerson. It was awesome. The old stadium sold out for a MNF game, it doesn't get much better than that.

 

 

 

Damn I miss the old stadium. Even if I always got stuck behind the pole because I was a kid......

 

My last game in the Municipal was this snoozefest that I could have sworn in was in '95 but apparently it was in '94 I, Browns 13-6 over the Pats.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/199411060cle.htm

^I believe all the games were sold out in '86 and the surrounding years.

Several games in '86 weren't sold out because I had to listen to them on the radio when I was at Kent State.

 

My 1988 Browns media guide shows these games in 1986 and 1987 weren't sold out:

 

1986 - FOUR HOME GAMES WEREN'T SOLD OUT (AND POSSIBLY A FIFTH)

 

Sept. 28 - Detroit Lions defeated by Browns 24-21 -- attendance: 72,029

Oct. 12 - Kansas City Chiefs defeated by Browns 20-7 -- attendance: 71,278

Oct. 19 - Green Bay Packers win over Browns 14-17 -- attendance: 76,438 (I seem to remember the game didn't sell out in time to lift the TV blackout because I don't remember seeing this game on TV, but I sure do remember being pissed off at the loss!)

Nov. 30 - Houston Oilers defeated by Browns 13-10 in OT -- attendance: 62,309

Dec. 21 - San Diego Chargers defeated by Browns 47-17 -- attendance: 68,505

 

NOTES: I remember being very surprised that the last two home games didn't sell out. The week before the Nov. 30 game, the Browns beat the Steelers in a thrilling OT game 37-31. I still have this entire game on videotape (Beta!), in which Kosar passed for 414 yards with the final 36 yards on a touchdown pass to Slaughter because K Matt Bahr got hurt in the overtime kickoff. Then the final game of the season against Dan Fouts' Chargers followed the stunning 34-3 blowout victory by the Browns in Cincinnati when we won the Central Division. I would have thought those games would have generated home sellouts the week after, but I guess not.

 

1987 - THREE HOME GAMES WEREN'T SOLD OUT

 

Oct. 11 - Houston Oilers win over Browns 15-10 -- attendance: 38,927 (strike game with replacement players)

Nov. 8 - Atlanta Falcons defeated by Browns 38-3 -- attendance: 71,135

Dec. 6 - Indianapolis Colts beat Browns 9-7 -- attendance: 70,661

 

The strike game not selling out isn't a surprise, but the other two were. Although the Atlanta game followed an overtime loss at San Diego and the Indianapolis game followed a Sunday night loss at San Francisco. Joe Montana and a young Jerry Rice were too much for the Browns on that nationally televised ESPN game.

How about a #17 Sipe jersey?  Or a Spielman or Bentley jersey?  The latter two never played a regular season down for the Browns, but they're local boys that came home to finish their respective careers here.

Sipe would sell well!  I have Sipe, Rucker, M. Pruitt, two G. Pruitt (one a tear away jersey - HA!), The wizard of OZ, Doug Dieken, Chip Banks, Clay Matthews, B Golic, Kosar, Slaughter.  Im sure I have some others in there.  I think I Sam Rutigliano coaching sweater.

Hey, I see on the Browns team roster that TE Ben Watson will wear #82. I thought #82 had been retired? And if it hasn't, why hasn't it?

Hey, I see on the Browns team roster that TE Ben Watson will wear #82. I thought #82 had been retired? And if it hasn't, why hasn't it?

 

I know.  If any number should be retired on the Browns Ozzie's should be retired!

Hey, I see on the Browns team roster that TE Ben Watson will wear #82. I thought #82 had been retired? And if it hasn't, why hasn't it?

 

I know. If any number should be retired on the Browns Ozzie's should be retired!

 

I think you mean Steve Heiden.

Was Heiden wearing #82?

 

EDIT:  Wow I totally forgot!  http://www.nfl.com/players/steveheiden/profile?id=HEI093965

And amidst all the Lebron BS, I also totally missed the signing of WR Bobby Engram: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/article-1/Browns-sign-WR-Bobby-Engram/afad95f8-373a-4edd-a818-128867de9568

 

While I realize Engram's best days are probably behind him, I feel a little bit better about who's going to be catching passes: Engram, Watson, Massaquoi and Cribbs plus Harrison out of the backfield as well as a bunch of guys with potential -- Robiskie, Stuckey, Mitchell, Haggerty and possibly Hardesty out of the backfield too.

 

I'll be interested to watch if Engram still has anything left in the tank. Even if he doesn't, he still has tremendous value as a player-coach to the young wideouts.

 

And while many of the quarterback comments in the media and on public comment boards are focused on either Delhomme or McCoy, I'm more interested in Seneca Wallace. Delhomme is getting up there in years and McCoy is unproven. I think Wallace proved himself in 2008 when he started eight games for the Seahawks and had a rating of 87. He career numbers aren't too bad. I'm hopeful the Browns will give him a shot and not overlook him too. With Holmgren bringing Wallace here, I hope that won't happen.

Agreed on Wallace.  In the right system, he has potential to be a very effective starter.

 

On Engram, I don't think his $$ is guaranteed, meaning the Browns might decide to just give him a look in camp and let him go if they don't feel he can contribute.  You might be right, though, on the idea of him sort of acting as a player-coach to the younger wideouts.  It will come down to how many wideouts they think they can keep - MM, Robiskie, Stuckey and Mitchell are probably all locks to make the team.  Add on Cribbs and that is 5 right there.  They will probably keep 6, so it might come down to Engram holding off any camp challenges from more unknown players.

Hey, I see on the Browns team roster that TE Ben Watson will wear #82. I thought #82 had been retired? And if it hasn't, why hasn't it?

 

I'm sure a number 82 Jersey would sell like hotcakes!

 

I'm not so sure Ben Watson is a fan favorite yet.

They will probably keep 6, so it might come down to Engram holding off any camp challenges from more unknown players.

 

Good point. Agreed.

 

I was reading Grossi's pre-training camp report (http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2010/07/its_another_season_of_change_a.html#incart_mce) and I didn't realize the Browns had 40 sacks last year for seventh place in the league. All the talk about the D-line being a weak spot isn't true. It's the secondary that's been the weak spot, and the fact that two or three rookies will likely start there speaks volumes. Those kids are really going to learn, er earn their money this year with quarterbacks making sight-adjustments with the wideouts plus lots of pump-fakes.

 

Maybe Delhomme and Engram will be more useful teaching our d-backs what to watch out for!

The NFL does not retire jersey numbers.  There are logistical problems associated with it (i.e., too many players, not enough numbers).

The NFL does not retire jersey numbers.  There are logistical problems associated with it (i.e., too many players, not enough numbers).

 

That is incorrect.

 

Browns retired numbers that I can think of off the top of my head

14 - Otto Gram

32 - Jim Brown

76 - Lou Groza

Ernie Davis' #45 is also retired.

 

Could you imagine Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly and a healthy Ernie Davis on the same team? The 60s could have been the decade of the Browns, not the Packers, and be the first two-decade NFL dynasty. I submit the Browns were the most dominant team of the 50s.

No doubt the Browns were THE team of the 1950's.

 

On the sack total discussion above, it seemed like our pass rush drastically improved when Roth signed and Bernard started getting consistent PT.  Those two brought the heat from the edge the last half of the season and probably led to the team's willingness to let Wimbley go via trade.  Bowens also really shined (especially getting into the backfield) when he was forced to play on the inside due to injuries.  I hope they keep him there because he was pretty much a non-factor on the outside but was a real bright spot while playing inside.

The NFL does not retire jersey numbers.  There are logistical problems associated with it (i.e., too many players, not enough numbers).

 

That is incorrect.

 

Browns retired numbers that I can think of off the top of my head

14 - Otto Gram

32 - Jim Brown

76 - Lou Groza

 

"retired" meaning the number cannot be worn again?

The NFL does not retire jersey numbers.  There are logistical problems associated with it (i.e., too many players, not enough numbers).

 

That is incorrect.

 

Browns retired numbers that I can think of off the top of my head

14 - Otto Gram

32 - Jim Brown

76 - Lou Groza

 

Correct.

 

"retired" meaning the number cannot be worn again?

 

Yes.

Also retired is #46 - Don Fleming.  The Browns have a total of 5 numbers retired.

 

Yes, shs96, NFL teams do retire numbers in the sense that no player can wear that number again for that team.

 

"retired" meaning the number cannot be worn again?

 

Yes, but only by someone on that team. I don't think the NFL has retired any numbers, only individual teams.

 

 

On the sack total discussion above, it seemed like our pass rush drastically improved when Roth signed and Bernard started getting consistent PT. Those two brought the heat from the edge the last half of the season and probably led to the team's willingness to let Wimbley go via trade. Bowens also really shined (especially getting into the backfield) when he was forced to play on the inside due to injuries. I hope they keep him there because he was pretty much a non-factor on the outside but was a real bright spot while playing inside.

 

Yes, when I say D-line, I tend to oversimplify and refer to any guys lined up on the front and whose assignment is to rush the QB. We can say the Browns D-line is three guys in the 3-4, and maybe four when we line up in a 4-3. But anytime we've got guys lined up in five, six, seven, eight or even nine-man fronts, I count them all as serving on the D-line for that play. So then I'm counting linebackers, and even safeties or a cornerback if he's blitzing. No doubt are numbers last year were helped when we brought in Roth and the other linebackers who can rush the passer. I only hope Roth doesn't let his head get too big for himself and become a cancer. Bernard is still a diamond in the rough, but if he can do over an entire season what he did in those last four games he started, then he'll be something special. As for Bowens, I wonder how many more years he has left in him? Maybe they might limit his play to passing downs to get more miles out of him. I'd rather seem him running straight ahead at quarterbacks dropping back than side-to-side to plug a hole in a running play. Let the kids do that stuff.

 

Of course, having a competent secondary can do wonders for your pass rush. The Browns pass rush was mediocre in the 80s, but having Minnefield and Dixon (plus decent linebackers like Banks, Matthews and the two Johnsons, Mike and Eddie) helped them win a lot of games. But they sure struggled against mobile quarterbacks like Elway.

Retired numbers by team

 

http://www.nflteamhistory.com/retired_numbers.html

Also retired is #46 - Don Fleming. The Browns have a total of 5 numbers retired.

 

Yes, shs96, NFL teams do retire numbers in the sense that no player can wear that number again for that team.

 

Learn something new each day...I had thought they "honor" numbers but didn't "retire" them.

Stat of the day:

 

In the 44 years before 1990, the Browns had only seven losing seasons.

 

Since 1990 to the present (17 seasons), the Browns have had 14 losing seasons.

__________

 

So, in the 44 years between 1946-1989, the Browns had 34 winning seasons, seven losing seasons and three .500 seasons (34-7-3). In the 17 seasons since, they are 3-14.

 

SOURCE: http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/history/year-by-year-results.html

Boy aren't you the bearer of good news at the end of the work day!  ;)

But it's the start of a new decade, and it's time to turn this shit around. There are lots of kids on this site who have no idea what this town is like when the Browns are consistently really good from year to year. You've seen some good Indians and Cavs teams, but this city bleeds brown and orange. The excitement around the Indians and Cavs hasn't compared with what I've seen around the Browns.

 

Young Clevelanders (35 and younger) don't know what it's like to see damn near every statue downtown dressed in brown and orange (or damn near every Clevelander!), or to hear a half-dozen different Browns songs on the radio in a single day, or see the streets/malls completely empty on Sunday afternoons but the bars jammed, or huge crowds jamming the airport to welcome the team home after a big regular season victory (let alone during the playoffs!).

 

I feel sorry for the youngin's. These are all great things to do in your 20s and maybe into your 30s with your friends and some adult beverages. But by the time you get much older and start settling down with a family and a career, you just can't go crazy like that anymore and let yourself go and that's OK. People our age (40s and older) have been there and done that. We had some good, fun Browns teams to go crazy about. But there's whole generation of Clevelanders who are missing that chance.

But it's the start of a new decade, and it's time to turn this sh!t around. There are lots of kids on this site who have no idea what this town is like when the Browns are consistently really good from year to year. You've seen some good Indians and Cavs teams, but this city bleeds brown and orange. The excitement around the Indians and Cavs hasn't compared with what I've seen around the Browns.

 

Young Clevelanders (35 30 and younger) don't know what it's like to see damn near every statue downtown dressed in brown and orange (or damn near every Clevelander!), or to hear a half-dozen different Browns songs on the radio in a single day, or see the streets/malls completely empty on Sunday afternoons but the bars jammed, or huge crowds jamming the airport to welcome the team home after a big regular season victory (let alone during the playoffs!).

 

I feel sorry for the youngin's. These are all great things to do in your 20s and maybe into your 30s with your friends and some adult beverages. But by the time you get much older and start settling down with a family and a career, you just can't go crazy like that anymore and let yourself go and that's OK. People our age (40s and older) have been there and done that. We had some good, fun Browns teams to go crazy about. But there's whole generation of Clevelanders who are missing that chance.

 

I'm 32 and those memories from the Bernie, Bernie days are well stored in my bank.

Glad you remember it. It's even better when you're living on your own for the first time and able to go out to a bar and hoist a few while watching the Browns make the playoffs every year. They were some of the best times of my life with my friends and family.

Glad you remember it. It's even better when you're living on your own for the first time and able to go out to a bar and hoist a few while watching the Browns make the playoffs every year. They were some of the best times of my life with my friends and family.

 

Well I'm in my late 20s, so it's not too late for them to give me a few good years of fun fall Sundays! :)

BTW, I'm sure most of you don't need to be told of the beast that lurks deep inside many Clevelanders -- it's the Browns fan that's just aching to come out. But I was reminded of that after I woke up on the sofa Monday night to that Chuck Gilletti post-game Indians call-in show on TV. The Indians had just won their fifth in a row but half the callers were Browns fans excited about the upcoming training camp and season....

BTW, I deleted the old poll "Will Mangini keep his job" and added a new poll for predictions on the upcoming season....

BTW, I'm sure most of you don't need to be told of the beast that lurks deep inside many Clevelanders -- it's the Browns fan that's just aching to come out. But I was reminded of that after I woke up on the sofa Monday night to that Chuck Gilletti post-game Indians call-in show on TV. The Indians had just won their fifth in a row but half the callers were Browns fans excited about the upcoming training camp and season....

 

KJP, from your recent posts it sound like you are letting your inner Browns fan out of his cage a little bit....

I certainly want to. But....

BTW, I deleted the old poll "Will Mangini keep his job" and added a new poll for predictions on the upcoming season....

 

Thats my job!  I'm the Browns poll creater  :whip:  You...you... Mod!  lol

7-9

 

This team is better, but to expect more than 7 wins would be insane IMO.  This is based on the shaky secondary, young receivers, and veteran (but not that good) QB.  If they can find their running game before week 14 this year then it could be a different story.  But the secondary still scares me.

My expectations are tempered, but expecting more than 7 wins is not "insane" IMO.  It is optimistic for sure, but hardly out of the realm of possibility.  They certainly have momentum going into the season.

 

Now, they do have to play a rather tough schedule.  Our Division will be as tough as ever.  We also have to play the teams from the NFC South (Saints, Falcons, Panthers, Bucs) and the AFC East (Pats, Jets, Dolphins, Bills).  Our schedule is rounded out by playing the last place teams from the other two AFC divisions (Chiefs and Jags).  In order to finish .500 or above, I would say we have to win AT LEAST two division games, but more likely three.

 

I think we are going to see gigantic leaps in our secondary.  The safeties will be much better against the run and never were great against the pass anyways.  The corners should be greatly improved in both areas though.  If Brown or Haden can take on the other teams' #1 recievers that will allow Wright to be the #2 cornerback and take a lot of pressure off him.  Getting McDonald off the field for running plays is an improvement by leaps and bounds all by itself.