That was a GREAT win by a young team.  The Browns are the 3rd least experienced team in the NFL, starting essentially 6 rookies, while the Colts still have 5 or 6 legitimate Pro Bowler's in Freeney, Mathis, Wayne, Saturday, & Clark, then there's Addai & Garcon..  Despite the obvious youth vs experience gap, the Browns were holding a double-digit lead on the road, with the ball, with 3 minutes left in the game.  That is impressive.

 

It's also been great watching big Phil Taylor continue to move the pile, playing up to his 1st round pick status, and not down to Gerard Warren's level that some were sure that he would.  Taylor has been the difference on Defense, freeing up Rubin & DQ, and probably also drawing some double's that could've been used on one of the DE's.

 

Now, will they perform at the same level this week?  Probably not, because all of this youth almost guarantees a roller coaster type season.  But, let's hope if they do put together a mediocre performance that it will be enough to beat the struggling Dolphins.

No Vickers = medicore Hillis    Colt = average to good QB      Heckert, Holmgren and Shurmer = Larry, Curly and Moe.  Browns 2011 season = 4-12

 

 

I just hope that 4-12 is enough to get us Andrew Luck. I'd really love to see Luck #1 overall and then use the Atlanta pick to take a top tier WR. But knowing these clowns we have we'll trade our two 1st round picks for some teams 5th round picks for the next 20 years. We'll have the highest ranked practice squad in all of football.

Hillis ran for the fourth-highest rushing total in the AFC week 2, against a pretty good defense with the help of three back-up offensive linemen. That's mediocre?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/weeklyleaders?week=2&season=2011&showCategory=Rushing

 

And Colt McCoy had a 97.3 passer rating. That's average to good?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/weeklyleaders?week=2&season=2011&showCategory=Passing

 

So what if this team goes 4-12? It's just football. Find some other kind of entertainment.

 

You don't look at yards, you look at the average yards per carry. And you look at the missed blocks that this RK fullback is responsible for and you just know that the best fullback in the league (Vickers) would have made those blocks. His average per carry is down a full yard since last year, 3.4 from 4.4.

 

As for McCoy, his season passer rating is 82.2 which ranks him something like 22nd in the league. That is mediocre. He lacks arm strength and struggles from passing within the pocket.

 

And I have many forms of entertainment, one of them is laughing at the people on this site.

"You just know"? Maybe it's true; maybe it's not. It's only two games into the season. Maybe Marecic will be better than Vickers. Maybe he will be worse. Let's see what happens. There's a lot of games left this season, and a lot of years left in both men's careers.

 

And I have many forms of entertainment, one of them is laughing at the people on this site.

 

Put a sock in it. If you can't think of a better way to communicate with people here, then perhaps you need some time off to think some more.

I do think losing Vickers will really hurt the running game. One really bad mistake by Heckert in my opinion. I think the line is not giving McCoy anything to work with. And Hillis didnt impress me last game. If it wasnt for the one run that everything lined up perfectly and he broke for a good gain, his performance would look worse in the stats. Watching his performance though was nothing special. Again the lack of Vickers and poor blocking doesnt help him either. Wasn't a pretty win in my opinion but hopefully these guys go into next week with a little more confidence!

If Pashos could somehow get and stay healthy, that would make a huge difference in the run game.  I would like to see Hicks in there instead of the rookie at LG, but we need him at RT until Pashos can man that spot.  From what I see, the line is not getting any push.  I was a huge Vickers fan, but I like Marecic too.  He did a much better as a lead blocker in week 2.  Vickers *probably* would have done a better job on some of those plays, but Vickers also would *probably* not have made that first down catch over the middle in the 4th.

You don't look at yards, you look at the average yards per carry. And you look at the missed blocks that this RK fullback is responsible for and you just know that the best fullback in the league (Vickers) would have made those blocks. His average per carry is down a full yard since last year, 3.4 from 4.4.

 

As for McCoy, his season passer rating is 82.2 which ranks him something like 22nd in the league. That is mediocre. He lacks arm strength and struggles from passing within the pocket.

 

And I have many forms of entertainment, one of them is laughing at the people on this site.

Vickers doesn't even start for the Texans, he's riding the pine behind James Casey, and Marecic already has one more catch than Vickers will have all season, to go along with his two key blocks for TD's against Indy.  So looks like Heckert's player assessment was correct once again.  McCoy's QB rating is higher than Sam Bradford's so far this year, and his quick release and elite level accuracy make up for any (if there is) lacking arm strength.

Homer alert, homer alert.

 

And I could care less who gets more snaps in Houston, Vickers is widely known as a top 5 FB and considered by many to be the best. I realize that we got rid of him because of his role in the WCO would have to be more of a receiver option. But with a Jeff Garcia esq QB and a lack of talented WR's, we needed to focus on our running game for at least one more year.

 

It's the blind support the Browns have received for all these years that has caused us to suck for so long. A real fan stops buying their merch, stops going to the games and lashes out at the crap they put out year after year. Lerner only cares about his bank account, if that gets hurt then, and only then will he start to give a damn.

 

 

Homer alert, homer alert.

 

And I could care less who gets more snaps in Houston, Vickers is widely known as a top 5 FB and considered by many to be the best. I realize that we got rid of him because of his role in the WCO would have to be more of a receiver option. But with a Jeff Garcia esq QB and a lack of talented WR's, we needed to focus on our running game for at least one more year.

 

It's the blind support the Browns have received for all these years that has caused us to suck for so long. A real fan stops buying their merch, stops going to the games and lashes out at the crap they put out year after year. Lerner only cares about his bank account, if that gets hurt then, and only then will he start to give a damn.

 

 

Vickers has never been to a Pro Bowl, and the only people that thought he was a top 5 FB were in fact, homers.  It's also why former Texans FB Vontae Leach was given a 3-year, $11M contract, while Vickers was given a 2-year, $3M contract.

 

Lerner has done A LOT of stupid things over the years, no doubt, but he hasn't been cheap, just not very football smart, he's probably still paying for three coaches and two GM's this year.  I would also bet that Holmgren's salary at $10M/year as Team President is the highest, if not top 3 salaries in the NFL.

 

It does no good to hate on the current Front Office which has been in place for about 18 months (of which 4 month's being during the lockout).  Drafting Tim Couch, Courtney Brown & David Veikune, and signing busts like Corey Williams & Stallworth are not Heckert & Holmgren's fault because they were with their previous teams going to conference championship games; they're just trying to clean up 10 years worth of mistakes made by people like Policy, Butch, Savage, & Mangini.  They've done a great job so far, acquiring Peyton Hillis for essentially a bag of balls, and putting together two great draft classes, not to mention the fleecing of the Falcons.

 

Still, haters are going to hate, nothing you can do about it, especially in Cleveland; way too many people are only happy when their miserable, sad really..

Through his few interviews, I get a strong feeling that Mr. Lerner really does care.

 

I wasn't happy with the vickers deal at first... BUT... how many years has he been in the league?  I think it's been around six years and full back is a pretty brutal position with short careers.  I think drafting a young FB with great potential was probably the right thing to do for the long term.  I'm just a average guy, I have to give H&H some credit that they do know a thing or two about the NFL that I don't.

 

I also read an SI article about Marecic during his college years that was VERY flattering.... it at least helped me to accept him.  One thing though, the kid looks like he needs a bigger helmet!  Can we get someone on that?

If this place is only for people who think the Browns can do no wrong then let me know, I'll leave and won't let reality get in the way.

 

That's not the problem... you can question the browns.  It's the personal insults that you can drop.

Ha ha, "put a sock in it"

 

Post something factual at least then it won't look so bad for you. And I "just know" because of the track record Vickers has, you know, the one where he's been the best FB in the NFL.

 

If this place is only for people who think the Browns can do no wrong then let me know, I'll leave and won't let reality get in the way.

 

 

We can debate the Browns back and forth and cite whatever stats. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter because sports is a luxury entertainment distraction from raising a family, work, and other aspects of real life. Yes it's fun to debate it, except with you because you seem to take so seriously and emotionally that you lash out at anyone who disagrees with you.

 

Debate all you want. But what won't be tolerated is insulting people on this board. That's what earned you the "put a sock in it" comment, not your statistics or beliefs. Dial it down. That is not subject to debate.

One thing though, the kid looks like he needs a bigger helmet!  Can we get someone on that?

 

Hahahahhaaha I noticed that too.

It's the blind support the Browns have received for all these years that has caused us to suck for so long. A real fan stops buying their merch, stops going to the games and lashes out at the crap they put out year after year. Lerner only cares about his bank account, if that gets hurt then, and only then will he start to give a damn.

 

Would the next person who sees somebody throw a suggestion out like that, point him out and get him out of here!  You don't live in Cincinnati!  You live in Cleveland!

Oh ye great channeler of Sam "Psycho" Wyche!

 

If this place is only for people who think the Browns can do no wrong then let me know, I'll leave and won't let reality get in the way.

 

That's not the problem... you can question the browns.  It's the personal insults that you can drop.

 

Yep.

Back to football........

 

Three Keys to a Miami Dolphins Victory Over the Cleveland Browns: Fan’s Take

By Daniel Barber, Yahoo! Contributor Network

 

I don't think it's a stretch to say most fans of the Miami Dolphins—and in reality, most fans of football in general—realize the importance of the upcoming game on Sunday, Sept 25 against the Cleveland Browns. I'm sure they're well aware of how crucial the contest will be not just for the team, but for the futures of head coach Tony Sparano, general manager Jeff Ireland, and probably a number of players. It's basically make or break time, and the coach of Miami needs to find a way to win or else.

 

Greg Cote of the Miami Herald has noted in his latest article he believes Sparano could actually survive all the way through an 0-6 start before owner Stephen Ross pulls the plug and says adios to the 49-year-old Sparano. However, I'm of the belief if Tony doesn't lead the Dolphins to victory on Sunday he'll be sending out his resume the next day on Monday.

 

I'm not certain Sparano can actually accomplish the task; despite the fact the Dolphins seem to have more talent on paper than the Browns. They also have Cleveland's former offensive coordinator, so you would think they'd have a leg up on knowing a little about what the team from Ohio will be throwing at them on game day. However, considering how many problems the South Florida club has exhibited over their first two games having a leg up might not be nearly enough.

 

READ MORE AT:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ycn-9172757

Ha, I love that speech.  I played it for my wife and she got a good laugh out of it too.

Peyton Hillis has strep throat and won't play today. And Josh Cribbs is questionable with a groin injury.

 

OK, Montario Hardesty and Greg Little: this is your opportunity.

I assume this is a severe blow to our chance of winning....but who knows, maybe we will be rewarded with a surprise break out game. 

I expect Hardesty will do OK, but-- all year-- we'll win or lose based on passing.  We need big games from Watson/Moore and at least one receiver.

We need a Offensive line

Alright!

Yeah Brownies!

 

Love the poise shown by McCoy on that final drive to win it.  Nice experience for him to have under his belt.  Also love how some of the younger guys such as Hardesty, Massaquoi, Little, etc. stepped it up a bit.  Tight ends as usual were solid.

Can we trade Robo for Hartline???

That win was ugly.  I think the Dolphins beat the Dolphins with penalties, more than anything we did.

 

Still, I'll take it.

That win was ugly.  I think the Dolphins beat the Dolphins with penalties, more than anything we did.

 

Still, I'll take it.

 

Agreed!  But a "W" is a "W".  Browns have to step it up.  I've said this before, the Browns do not have a killer / we're a winning team respect us mentality.

Ha, I fell asleep before the end of the game! Good thing I was DVR-ing the game so I could see how we got to that surprising final score I saw on the NFL channel.

 

So -- isn't it funny how our biggest offensive weakness (wide receivers) accounted for most of the Brown's points? And this was a nice first pro start for Montario Hardesty. But as good as Henne was in the first half, he was as bad in the second.

 

Lastly, based on what I'm seeing so far from CB Dimitri Patterson, I think he deserves to start opposite of Joe Haden. I think it's time to move Sheldon Brown to safety in place of Mike Adams.

Agree on the ugly win.

 

Colt McCoy is pressured which leads to dumb decision making/bad throws. He still needs some work though.

Montario Hardesty did pretty good for poor blocking overall. Nice per carry average. Looked better than Hillis has this year.

Congratulations on Phil Dawson becoming the second highest scoring Cleveland Brown of all time today.

Whats going on with Joe Thomas?

Offensive Line? What offensive line?

Defensive Line? Not as strong as last game which was great. They had a lot of time to find open receivers.

Joe Haden had a nice performance as well as Dimitri Patterson as KJP mentioned.

Greg Little was quiet for most of the game(not his fault) but he sure looked good in the 4th quarter.

Overall, an ugly win against another bad team.

Hopefully these guys find some rhythm and get going. Things could get really ugly once we start playing actual teams lol.

I thought the D-Line played outstanding.  Each of our starting 4 had their moments.

 

The offense was painful to watch at times.  Colt did not play well, with the exception of the last drive.  Timing was off with the receivers and Miami's D had their ears back with Peyton out.

 

Bottom line is it is nice to be on the other side of a game where a team lets their opponent hang around all game and blows it at the end.

I thought the D-Line played outstanding.  Each of our starting 4 had their moments.

 

The offense was painful to watch at times.  Colt did not play well, with the exception of the last drive.  Timing was off with the receivers and Miami's D had their ears back with Peyton out.

 

Bottom line is it is nice to be on the other side of a game where a team lets their opponent hang around all game and blows it at the end.

 

I was scared we were about to blow it with that ridiculous 2 man celebration penalty. And then the holding call on the next play. Glad we won! 2-1 for the first time in awhile!

A win is a win, they all count, especially in the NFL.  The Offense is certainly still a work in progress, but when it mattered most, they came through.

 

This young team needs to learn how to win, and really needs to start winning at home, so doubly-good today.  Now, let's see if they can take it to 3-1 next week, by beating a team that beat the Ravens.

Well, the Steelers beat the Colts 23-20.... So are the Colts better than we thought or are the Steelers worse than we expect?  I don't think Miami is a bad as their record.

Probably a little bit of both.  Pittsburgh nearly ran out of OL in that game last night.  They actually had to put an injured tackle back out on the field in the 4th because they had no backups left.

Probably a little bit of both.  Pittsburgh nearly ran out of OL in that game last night.  They actually had to put an injured tackle back out on the field in the 4th because they had no backups left.

 

That's not an excuse for Indy giving them a game.  Good teams stay healthy, bad teams get hurt.  That's football, or sports at that matter, and that's why the Browns have been bad for so long.  I hate when people use injuries as an excuse. 

No, good teams get hurt and then they become bad teams.  There are many injuries that don't descriminate.  In all sports.

Probably a little bit of both.  Pittsburgh nearly ran out of OL in that game last night.  They actually had to put an injured tackle back out on the field in the 4th because they had no backups left.

 

That's not an excuse for Indy giving them a game.  Good teams stay healthy, bad teams get hurt.  That's football, or sports at that matter, and that's why the Browns have been bad for so long.  I hate when people use injuries as an excuse. 

 

It's not an excuse.  It's an explanation.  When you have banged up and back up tackles tryung to contain Indy's pass rush DE's, you are not going to have an easy go of it.  Pittsburgh made other mistakes too, but they are uncharacteristically weak up front this year, and that has always been their strength and why they have maintained dominance for so long..... they win the battles down in the trenches and wear teams down..... kind of like the Browns used to do when they were good.

I thought the D-Line played outstanding.  Each of our starting 4 had their moments.

 

The offense was painful to watch at times.  Colt did not play well, with the exception of the last drive.  Timing was off with the receivers and Miami's D had their ears back with Peyton out.

 

Bottom line is it is nice to be on the other side of a game where a team lets their opponent hang around all game and blows it at the end.

I think the investment in the line with this year's draft has paid off big already.  I can't remember the last time it was actually fun to watch a Browns' pass rush.  Sheard is an exciting playmaker. The linebacking corps has been weak, and the secondary is inconsistent outside of the excellent play of Haden and the tackling of TJ Ward.  It seems like Sheldon Brown is on the ass end of every big pass play.  I think the Browns could have an elite defense with two more successful drafts.  I think Hillis has actually been pretty strong this year.  I thought he was going to be a big let down this season but is proving that he's a legitimate halfback with good receiving skills.  Hardesty runs well but goes down too easy and doesn't have the "fall forward" instincts that Hillis has.  McCoy will definitely be a solid second-tier QB with another year or two of experience.  I think it would be hard to argue that the Holmgren-Heckert duo don't have a great eye for college talent.  I'm cautiously optimistic for the future (although I don't see more than six wins this year).

I'm also pleasantly surprised by what I'm seeing out of the Browns defensive line so far. Did I see correctly that the Browns are leading the AFC in sacks?

Yep.  And only Philly has more in the entire league.... one more to be exact.  What's even more impressive is that a lot of that pressure is coming with only a four man rush.  It sure doesn't look like there is one player in our starting four man front that can be blocked one on one.

It seems like everything that there's a touchdown scored S.brown is on the receiving end. This guy just can't cut it anymore. O's not playing bad just making costly penalties nd a few poor play calls just can't do nothing with it once they get inside the 30 that MUST change.

Not looking good on defense. And im glad we kept Phil Dawson around. I think most other kickers would have missed those in our stadium with this wind. Some nice distance as well. 49 and a 51 yarder.

No Pressure on Hassleback + no coverage by Sheldon brown = 24 yards per pass.

Is it me or can they not tackle a non moving target :\ this is getting rediculous.

Wow just sad lol no pressure at all even if they blitz three players doesn't make not one difference. McCoy needs to step up and do something or this game is over in the 3rd quater we can't keep getting effing fg's smh.

Way to step up McCoy, you bum  :|

NOBODY CAN CATCH! JESUS!

Like Hardesty...