And they were protesting every year because they knew they media would be there to cover it. If the media would have ignored them, the protests would have ended.

15 minutes ago, skiwest said:

And they were protesting every year because they knew they media would be there to cover it. If the media would have ignored them, the protests would have ended.

Well, the point of a protest is to get your message out. Why would you not want media coverage. You're not really making a good point.

On 7/4/2020 at 11:07 AM, skiwest said:

The name was actually chosen to honor a Native American player, not to poke fun.  

 

https://clevelandmagazine.com/in-the-cle/articles/cle-myths-cleveland-indians-name-origins

 

 

On 7/4/2020 at 11:19 AM, freefourur said:

There's actually no proof of this.  Your link actually says that it is undecided but it is largely regarded as a myth.

Joe Posnanski has thoroughly researched and shot down any thought that the name was in “honor” of Louis Sockalexis.  To be fair, there is some nuance to the story, and the name isn’t entirely unrelated to him, but characterizing it as being in his honor is not remotely true. This whole article is a good read. 

 

https://joeposnanski.substack.com/p/cleveland-indians-the-name

“Well in 1914, the Naps were horrendous .. and Lajoie was sold. A new name was needed. But, contrary to the story told so often, there was no team-naming contest this time. Papers did solicit ideas from fans, but team owner Charles Somers put together a group of Cleveland sportswriters from the four papers and told them to come up with a name. They are the ones who chose the Cleveland Indians and there is no indication that they chose a name entered by a fan. No, they chose Indians for their own reasons.

 

“And what were those reasons? This was the cartoon that ran in the Cleveland Plain Dealer the next day.  

“Um, yeah. Here you can see pretty clearly why the Indians were named. One: A year earlier, the Boston Braves had a miraculous season -- coming from last place on July 4 to win the pennant -- and so Native American names were in. Two: It was a glorious opportunity for HI-larious Native American jokes and race-specific cliches and insults that fit well in headlines.”
 

 

 

Edited July 5, 20204 yr by Boomerang_Brian
Added last paragraph

Let's just put this behind us and change the name.  Cleveland Guardians is good enough for me. 

1 hour ago, freefourur said:

Well, the point of a protest is to get your message out. Why would you not want media coverage. You're not really making a good point.

The point of protests nowadays is to get on  the nightly news or front page of the newspaper.  Protests would stop if the media stopped covering them.  

8 minutes ago, skiwest said:

The point of protests nowadays is to get on  the nightly news or front page of the newspaper.  Protests would stop if the media stopped covering them.  

I mean, you are not making the point you think you are. the entire of a protest is to get a message out. You don't seem to understand why people protest.

All i want from this name change is it for it to be something unique and part of our identity as a city and franchise.  I can live with guardians or spiders.  I really like a nod to players in the franchise like the "Doby's", the "Feller's", the "Satchels". Hell, lets flip the whole racism conversation on its head and name it after Larry Doby who was the first African American player in the AL.  And lets go even further and have our logo signify solidarity between races. Always better to be proactive, than reactive. 

 

Whatever we do, dont do something generic and boring

I like the Cleveland Jackknives, or the Cleveland Collision. Tie it back to the river somehow. Hell, the Cleveland Fireballs could be fun and tongue-in-cheek. I've always thought the city needs to find a way to turn the fire narrative on its head.

How about the Cleveland Flames?  I don't think the folks in Calgary would mind.   

40 minutes ago, BigDipper 80 said:

 the Cleveland Collision.

 

I don't like team names that aren't plural or are inanimate objects, at least in this case. they sound very "90s expansion team" and so not for old teams with long legacies. It wouldn't go well with our retro block C, etc. Baseball in general feels more old-timey.

 

I vote something industrial themed, not necessarily river connected.

 

Something in the spirit of the Collinwood Railroaders, always a personal favorite due to the history of the railroad workers in the neighborhood. Or I guess it's also the spirit of the Pittsburgh Steelers, but we can go even more into industrial imagery than they do.

 

Like seriously if we had smoke stacks in our logo it be b**a**!

Edited July 6, 20204 yr by mu2010

1 hour ago, BelievelandD1 said:

Whatever we do, dont do something generic and boring

 

This is kind of the only beef with my alma mater going from Miami Redskins to RedHawks, I always thought it was a little bland (and I hate that dumb capital H in the middle) and I do hope the tribe can avoid that.

Edited July 6, 20204 yr by mu2010

Who consulted Akron on the "Aeros" name change? Akron Rubber Ducks is genius, fun, and super marketable.

Guardians - yes

Naps - yes

Buckeyes - maybe
Spiders - hell no

Anything else - probably no, because all the other ideas I’ve seen and heard are cornball plays on words that are plain embarrassing. 

4 minutes ago, roman totale XVII said:

Guardians - yes

Naps - yes

Buckeyes - maybe
Spiders - hell no

Anything else - probably no, because all the other ideas I’ve seen and heard are cornball plays on words that are plain embarrassing. 

out of curiosity why not Spiders?

2 minutes ago, freefourur said:

out of curiosity why not Spiders?

Fair question!

 

1. I hate spiders (and so do lots of people)

2. Let’s face it, other than it being a nick-name of a short-lived prior club (due to a number of skinny players, apparently) it’s got nothing to do with Cleveland whatsoever. 
3. I can’t see the merchandising not being ‘Spirit of Halloween’-level. 
4. I can’t see enough people wanting the merchandise anyway because of 1.

5. The upside is we might do well with the emo/ goth crowd. 

For as long as I can remember, born in 61, this baseball club has often been referred to as The Tribe. Why not just stick with The Cleveland Tribe? Does anyone have a reason why Tribe wouldn't work?

5 minutes ago, roman totale XVII said:

Fair question!

 

1. I hate spiders (and so do lots of people)

2. Let’s face it, other than it being a nick-name of a short-lived prior club (due to a number of skinny players, apparently) it’s got nothing to do with Cleveland whatsoever. 
3. I can’t see the merchandising not being ‘Spirit of Halloween’-level. 
4. I can’t see enough people wanting the merchandise anyway because of 1.

5. The upside is we might do well with the emo/ goth crowd. 

you must feel about spiders the same way I feel about snakes. LOL.

 

 

4 minutes ago, Clvlndr in LV said:

For as long as I can remember, born in 61, this baseball club has often been referred to as The Tribe. Why not just stick with The Cleveland Tribe? Does anyone have a reason why Tribe wouldn't work?

No reason it wouldn’t work, but IMO it’s too close to Indians and therefore, won’t break the connection enough and also won’t shift enough new merchandise. They won’t go for it. Just my opinion. 

What does everyone think of Cleveland Baseball Club (Cleveland BC)? 

21 minutes ago, freefourur said:

What does everyone think of Cleveland Baseball Club (Cleveland BC)? 

I see where your going with it. I’m a huge soccer fan and I like the uniqueness. Unfortunately it would be crushed by all the talking heads and baseball historians. Not sure if we care or not (I don’t),  it I imagine the cleveland Indians brass does

All political controversy aside, I think the chance to rename the team something that is tied to our region is exiting!  I like The Guardians, with the Guardians of Transportation as a logo.  Someone posted a really nice design here a few years back.

 

please nothing rock n roll or guitar related.  

1 hour ago, X said:

All political controversy aside, I think the chance to rename the team something that is tied to our region is exiting!  I like The Guardians, with the Guardians of Transportation as a logo.  Someone posted a really nice design here a few years back.

 

 

That's a great idea. Could see lots of transportation themed imagery. It'd be a UOer/Urban Planner's dream come true...

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by mu2010

The Guardians name sounds cool and the logo would be awesome, but the backstory is odd.

 

"Guardians of what?"

"Guardians... of traffic."

"Traffic?"

"Right."

 

Cleveland is the Forest City, so how about Lumberjacks? Yes, that was the name of a former Cleveland hockey team. IIRC, they had a logo which featured a beaver.

3 minutes ago, skiwest said:

Cleveland is the Forest City, so how about Lumberjacks? Yes, that was the name of a former Cleveland hockey team. IIRC, they had a logo which featured a beaver.

Wasn't the Forest City's an early name of a baseball club in Cleveland?

5 hours ago, BelievelandD1 said:

All i want from this name change is it for it to be something unique and part of our identity as a city and franchise.  I can live with guardians or spiders.  I really like a nod to players in the franchise like the "Doby's", the "Feller's", the "Satchels". Hell, lets flip the whole racism conversation on its head and name it after Larry Doby who was the first African American player in the AL.  And lets go even further and have our logo signify solidarity between races. Always better to be proactive, than reactive. 

 

Whatever we do, dont do something generic and boring

I like Dobys a lot. Also down with any of the previous/historical names. I think Naps, Blues, Spiders, and Forest Cities would all be great. Could also revive one of the Negro League names. Browns and Elites are two of my favs. They could also revive something from another sport like Pipers, or Barons. Just please please please nothing boring or corporate-y generic. 

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by bumsquare

Decent option

 

 

4 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Decent option

 

 

That Guardian def looks cross-eyed right?

3 hours ago, roman totale XVII said:

No reason it wouldn’t work, but IMO it’s too close to Indians and therefore, won’t break the connection enough and also won’t shift enough new merchandise. They won’t go for it. Just my opinion. 

That is the subjective break isn't it and a valid question. It seems to me that being a member of a team or supporter of that team fits well within the definition of tribe without any racial defamation. I guess I'm fully prepared to move on from Indians but would love to hang on to that thread of the past. Marketing, logo and the like would be a challenge. Anyway ... go tribe.

5 hours ago, freefourur said:

you must feel about spiders the same way I feel about snakes. LOL.

 

 

Like the Arizona Diamondbacks, or the Rattlers? Spiders would be a great mascot, no one else has it and there is a historical connection. Guardians seems too plain - if you're guarding something you really aren't part of the action, you're security. 

 

And let go of everything Indians-related, the "tribe" and so on. Pick a new section of the thesaurus and go to town.  

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by westerninterloper

1 minute ago, westerninterloper said:

Like the Arizona Diamondbacks, or the Rattlers? Spiders would be a great mascot, no one else has it and there is a historical connection. And the Halloween connection is too good to pass up; Ohio does Halloween like no place I've ever seen.

 

Guardians seems too plain - if you're guarding something you really aren't part of the action, you're security. 

 

And let go of everything Indians-related, the "tribe" and so on. Pick a new section of the thesaurus and go to town.  

 

I was playing around with a concept of Cleveland's geographical strength and thought of the freighters that navigate Lake Erie and The Cuyahoga River.  How about The Cleveland Freighters as another option.   Think of The William G Mather, that is docked at North Coast Harbor, as the inspiration.

 

Based on today's Terry Pluto column, there's going to be some awful names proposed. We all might need to get our resources together for a PR campaign to get something good.

 

https://www.cleveland.com/tribe/2020/07/why-are-the-cleveland-indians-changing-their-name-cleveland-colavitos-cleveland-buckeyes-hey-terry.html

I definitely like the industrial and or maritime direction, which is why the last time the rename came up I suggested the Cleveland Huletts. The mascots are just waiting to be put back together. Runs, you can play an animation of the huletts unloading on the screen with that haunting sound they made ?

On 7/5/2020 at 2:55 PM, skiwest said:

The point of protests nowadays is to get on  the nightly news or front page of the newspaper.  Protests would stop if the media stopped covering them.  

 

The media is already champing at the bit for this year's protest. 

 

https://www.wkyc.com/article/sports/mlb/indians/indians-home-opener-protest-planned-over-name-and-chief-wahoo/95-d1014241-9ee0-4c73-843b-a3e46e25e9f3

 

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by skiwest

1 hour ago, viscomi said:

I definitely like the industrial and or maritime direction, which is why the last time the rename came up I suggested the Cleveland Huletts. The mascots are just waiting to be put back together. Runs, you can play an animation of the huletts unloading on the screen with that haunting sound they made ?

 

Honestly this is an opportunity for us to get a team name that really represents the city and local culture. Something that isn't necessarily uncommon in pro sports, but it's not the norm, as most of the classic baseball team names were quite generic 100 years ago.

 

"Cubs" "Tigers" "Reds" "Indians" "Giants" etc. Though now iconic, they're originally generic.

 

Yankees is a good one, Brewers is a good one, Washington Senators was really cool and preferable to Nationals IMO. Off the top of my head.

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by mu2010

Have a certain insurance company purchase the Jake, give the team all sorts of cash to buy, er, win a World Series in return we become the Cleveland Progressives ?

I'll admit, I'm a St. Louis Cardinal fan.  I have no ill will, or dislike whatsoever with the Cleveland baseball team. Probably because the Indians are in the American League. I'm a little surprised at how some of the posters here are taking this name change in stride. If the Cardinals were forced into this, or willfully did it, it would rip a piece out of my heart.  

 

That said,  I think I've found a way to accomplish this and still hang on to the team's tradition.
You can't really name the team after a group of people, or anything you might anticipate a future group of people might identify as. It has to be an inanimate object, or an inanimate object that doesn't indirectly lead to an association with a minority group, or any group that was oppressed or has any way adopted victim hood, or could easily be used by white liberals who see an opportunity to turn such group into victims for political gain and power.

Here is my suggestion. You car people should appreciate this:
How does The Cleveland Engines sound?

I pretty sure I speak for most of us tribe fans in saying that a small piece of us will die inside when the Indians are fully scrubbed, but this didn't just start last week it has been building for decades. Plus when the Chief went away that kind of desensitized me to a name change.  

I loved Chief Wahoo as a kid in the 90s. I didn't know anything about the negative aspects but to me he was just a really happy dude that Kenny Lofton and Omar Vizquel wore on their hats.

 

Then I learned a few things and realized his time was past, and I got over it. I understand all the happy memories people have and the need for a type of mourning, but it's sad that so many others can't let it go. Things change in life, they don't stay the same forever.

 

I do think people will probably be more desensitized to the name change since the Chief is already gone.

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by mu2010

4 hours ago, mu2010 said:

 

Honestly this is an opportunity for us to get a team name that really represents the city and local culture. Something that isn't necessarily uncommon in pro sports, but it's not the norm, as most of the classic baseball team names were quite generic 100 years ago.

 

"Cubs" "Tigers" "Reds" "Indians" "Giants" etc. Though now iconic, they're originally generic.

 

Yankees is a good one, Brewers is a good one, Washington Senators was really cool and preferable to Nationals IMO. Off the top of my head.

 

Can't beat the Brooklyn Trolley Dodgers as far as great team names go!

2 minutes ago, BigDipper 80 said:

 

Can't beat the Brooklyn Trolley Dodgers as far as great team names go!

 

That's great, I didn't know that was the origin. 

I don't want the name to change - but Spiders is the only way to honor our baseball heritage in NEO, in my opinion. 

 

I fear changing our name and going with something with no historical roots would be like the Green Bay Packers changing their name to the Wisconsin Motorcycles or something cheap like that. 

 

Moreover, we'd have a historical logo and jerseys to source from. 

4 minutes ago, YABO713 said:

I don't want the name to change - but Spiders is the only way to honor our baseball heritage in NEO, in my opinion. 

 

I fear changing our name and going with something with no historical roots would be like the Green Bay Packers changing their name to the Wisconsin Motorcycles or something cheap like that. 

 

Moreover, we'd have a historical logo and jerseys to source from. 

 

I am definitely a traditionalist for baseball so I get where you're coming from, but I think something that honored the history of Cleveland if not the history of Cleveland baseball, would be great. I definitely think the uniforms should be understated and retro-feeling as opposed to futuristic colors or that type of thing. Give me something that I could feasibly see being done in 1915 and it'd satisfy the traditionalist in me. Spiders, Naps etc were used so briefly, we shouldn't limit ourselves.

Edited July 7, 20204 yr by mu2010

3 minutes ago, mu2010 said:

 

I am definitely a traditionalist for baseball so I get where you're coming from, but I think something that honored the history of Cleveland if not the history of Cleveland baseball, would be great. I definitely think the uniforms should be understated and retro-feeling as opposed to futuristic colors or that type of thing. Give me something that I could feasibly see being done in 1915 and it'd satisfy the traditionalist in me. Spiders, Naps etc were used so briefly, we shouldn't limit ourselves.

 

The Spiders won the Temple Cup - the precursor to the World Series - I think we go for Spiders.

I'm also fine with something that eliminates a nickname, like Cleveland Athletic Club, or Cleveland Baseball Club

What about the Cleveland Wild Things??  

3 hours ago, YABO713 said:

Moreover, we'd have a historical logo and jerseys to source from. 

I’d be genuinely interested to see those. I was looking around the other day online for them. Jerseys seemed to be typical of that era, simply plain grey with the city’s name. Couldn’t find anything about a logo, just modern-day attempts at what people imagined it to have been, if it even existed at all. Again, not atypical for the era, as they were simply nicknames and nothing more. 

Pluto endorses walleye. That can’t happen, that’s a minor league name.  We have an opportunity to be very unique and very cleveland and also protect the identity of the franchise. The franchise (name or not) is a HUGE part of baseball history.  Baseball historians would respect a nod to some of the biggest names in our franchise history.  It’s hard to knock a name like the Satchels. 
 

im really warming up to the Doby’s and the logo can be a Doberman. You can make an old school dog a la the Cubs as the logo for your hat